AJ427

Yeah I had the exact same problem - I wanted to do my N1 as a primegray sprued kit of parts with as many surfaces facing up to maximise the smooth surfaces (which, along with the cost, is the best bit about primegray). I got the same response and they wanted me to do the parts as seperate files - 15 parts with a €5 handling fee each! Instead I changed the model to a single piece body and went to Shapeways. I-materialise really need to think about this policy as it's probably losing them custom.

Spurred on by Simon's build I've done a little more work on my earlier unsaturated boiler N1 prototype over the Easter break. As my initial attempts at creating the steps from plasticard were a bit naff and flimsy I did in the end decide to go down the etched brass route and recently had a test etch done. Very much a work in progress, the etch includes steps, guard irons and rear spectacle grilles. The steps include a fold at the top that allows the them to sit under and behind the base of the model providing a good adhesive area. The guard irons replace the chunky plastic ones on the Hornby chassis which need to be cut off. Once all was folded, soldered and glued in place, time for a final prime ready for the final paintwork and transfers...

Looking good there Simon and nice "repair" on the faulty splasher. I think the big rivets around the buffers (which are on the prototype but are not on the Alan Gibson brass ones) help with the look.

Hi folks, The superheated boiler version of the N1 has now been successfully (well almost - see below) test printed and is now available to buy on Shapeways (signature link below or PM me). As before this is based on a West Riding loco no 69478 which has no condensing equipment. The detail differences are mainly on the smokebox; chimney forward, snifter valves, rivets as well as the lubricator on the right side running plate. The small handwheel on this part is below Shapeways recommended minimum size for FUD but has actually come out quite well. What didn't come out well and you will notice on the images is that the front face of the rear splasher on the right side only is missing. This was due to a missing part, a school boy error that has now been fixed. The non-working buffers come on a seperate sprue inside the bunker. You can use them as is or replace them with Alan Gibson brass ones as the locating holes have been designed to accommodate these. This test prototype is on its way to SAC Martin and will feature soon on the Copley Hill blog.

Wow - magna-traction in action. Sorry, couldn't resist.

Hi Simon, 69478 is one of the superheated versions so not quite the same as the model I currently have available (chimney to the front of the smokebox, snifter valves behind the chimney). 69478 is however, the exact loco I'm basing my superheated model on. It's ready to print now but I didn't really want to release it for public consumption until I've done a test print when I have a bit of spare cash. I've put together some info on the West Riding locos and I'll PM this to you in a bit.

Over the Christmas break I've managed to prepare the body and do a bit of detailing work on the N1. To get the body to this stage has required an initial sanding with wet and dry followed by two coats of primer, sanded between each coat. No scraping was required and I found best smoothness was achieved sanding across the grain on the boiler and along the grain on the sides. As expected, some areas proved difficult to sand such as the splashers so these were attacked with a fibre glass pencil which helped but didn't fully smooth them out. I'm, now quite happy with the general smoothness of the model. On test fitting the body to the chassis I noticed that it was very tight compared to the previous print and some more material needed to be removed to get it to fit. On investigation it was discovered that this model has printed a touch smaller. Further investigation proved that actually both prints are smaller than they should be. This shrinkage is more than Shapeways tollerances and the cad file has been scaled up slightly to compensate. With this done detail parts could be added as shown. During the sanding process I managed to break off one of the condenser vent pipes, hence it's unpainted appearance. Handrails are done in the usual way with thinner and thicker brass rod used for the ejector pipes and for the vacuum and steam heat pipes. The cocks on the smokebox sides are representitive and made from brass rod and a small bead. Lamp irons are from staples as the base plate is part of the printed body. The three helper prongs I had on the top of the bunker proved to be of no use in forming the coal rails and so I have removed them from the .stl. Instead I made a simple bending jig from styrene sheet and formed them on this. The small steps on the left side and tank fronts are formed from 0.010" styrene strip and simply slide into the pre-formed slots. The destination board holders on the back work in the same manner. These are purposely left off the print to facilitate easier sanding of the bunker back. Finally the smokebox dart was added and the sprung buffers - you will note one is missing, currently residing somewhere on the shed floor and awaiting a replacement. The safety valves and coupling hooks are not yet fixed and will be removed for painting. I've begun creating steps in styrene although I may yet investigate creating these as an etch along with spectacle plates and guard irons.

Looks very good and thanks for the hackerspace link - I never knew such places existed and I've found one near me so might give it a try.

It's been a while since an update and things have moved on. This project is all about small targets and deadlines - sometimes moving if it helps with motivation! My last target was to have all of the trackwork complete by Christmas. This would mean building the five turnouts for the goods yard starting in October. Considering my limited modelling time, generally glacial workrate and the fact I've only previously built a couple of C&L turnouts, this would be no mean feat. Whilst, I'm happy to report that work is well underway with the first four complete, it looks like I'll miss this self imposed deadline as other non-modelling matters have colluded against me. Still I'm pleased with the work so far and as the image shows there is just one turnout to place along with a small section of plain track. All of these turnouts are slightly curved, following the track plan. The turnouts are just loosely placed the the moment awaiting final tweaking once the last one is ready. The pieces of scrap timber show roughly where the bridge and cutting will be at the Queensbury-end of the layout. I will only briefly summarise the build as there are already many good right-ups on RMWEB. The turnouts have been built to 00-SF standards using Brian Tulley guages. I've mainly used C&L components, augmented by copperclad with some etched brass chairs (sourced from Pete Harvey). Vees were created using the almost idiot proof Brian Harrap method and common crossings were built in-situ - I initially tried building them as a unit on the workbench but this didn't work well for me. My dropper system also doubles up as a support for the common crossing - a small hoop of brass wire with a tail at 90 degress is soldered onto the copperclad under the vee/wing rails with the tail dropping through the baseboard. Any excess solder is filed off and the vee/wing rails are then soldered to the resulting support platform. The same method is used to supply power to the stock and switch rails. The tie bars are made from a gapped copper clad sleeper cut in half so it ends up about 1mm wide. Onto this is soldered an 'L' bracket made from spare etch. The long horizontal of the bracket (about 4-5mm) is soldered onto the copper clad and sits under the switch blade and adjacent stock rail and the short upright is soldered to the inside of the blade. The smooth plates prevent the switches from rising up. A small loop of wire will be soldered in the centre to receive the actuating bar. I will take a small break from the layout build in order to complete my 3d printed N1 prototype.

Nice model and an interesting prototype. Looks like you managed to get a good print from FUD first time around. I see you are also maybe looking at prime gray - I think it will work quite well for the sides - on my experiments with it I got quite a bit of rivet detail that shouldn't have come out at all based on the stated minimum resolution. You will get stepping on the roof though but as it's a fairly shallow curve it should be easier to smooth out than a boiler. Have a look at Red Devil's tram models on here as many are done in prime gray.

Hi Pete, I suspect there shouldn't be too much effort required - probably just an undercoat then a going over with wet n dry, followed by another undercoat. There was quite a lot of wax on the reprinted model when it arrived (which smells curiously of almonds) which is easily removed with luke warm soapy water and an old toothbrush. The model is much smoother than my previous prototypes which I'd managed to get to a smoothish state with admittedly quite a bit of work with a flat scraper and some wet n dry. My first primegray prototype was a lower resolution and also needed some filler but that will not be necessary with this FUD model. With this type of technology there will always be a few areas that are hard to get to or have detail that you don't want to disturb too much though. I think the semi-transparent nature of the material makes it look rougher than it is as you can see both surfaces at once.

Hello everyone, I'm happy to report that the reprinted model has arrived back from Shapeways and all is well. The detail is nice and crisp and the sides and boiler are well defined with no sign of the banding that was on the earlier test. Andy Y has given permission for this and I am therefore now able to make the saturated boiler version available to purchase on Shapeways. There will initially be two versions available to purchase based on no 9554/69434 modelled in the BR era and in the LNER era. The LNER version differs only in that the smokebox has no number plate and has a lower lamp bracket, it has no condenser vent pipes and it has builder's plates on the bunker sides rather than the back. Note that the BR version will have a blank number plate to allow folks to put their own on. Buffers come on a seperate sprue built inside the bunker so that you can use them as supplied or can easily replace them with brass ones (Alan Gibson ones should fit). The models can be purchased here: http://www.shapeways.../shops/AJModels For those not familiar with Shapeways items are printed to order with lead times usually around 2 weeks. Simply add the items to your basket (along with any other items you might want from any of the other RMWEB designers who also sell on Shapeways) and you can pay with paypal or a bank transfer. At some point soon I'll also come up with a set of instructions based on the one I did in my blog. Next I will be developing the superheated version and a condensed version. I may do the condenser equipment as an add-on sprue rather than complete models. I'd appreciate feedback on this. Regards Andrew

So as per Bill's suggestion a complaint was made yesterday which was responded to pretty much immediately and investigated. They've now decided that they can do better and have arranged a reprint. I think this is excellent customer service although their quality control procedures when models have been printed obviously need improving.

It did seem a bit excessive but I've no direct experience of this print process so I assumed it was the norm. A complaint will be made.

The model has now been primed and an initial scraping undertaken. It's starting to feel pretty smooth now but I'll probably need to do this again. The main issue is the unwanted banding that has appeared on each side of the model. It's slightly worse on the left side. The top and the front/rear of the model are quite smooth. The cosmetic buffers have just been placed into their holes for the photos and sit there nicely without any glue. After spraying but before scraping: After an initial scrape last night:

I too will miss it but looking forward to the interesting new layout as well as the future incarnation of Copley Hill. Good luck.

Thanks for the tip Graeme. It wasn't a request as such, rather I'd orientated the model one way and they'd printed it another. Of course, as Bill says, this wouldn't have eliminated the stepping, just altered its orientation which in some cases makes it less noticeable or easier to deal with.

The single part (well almost) N1 arrived from Shapeways earlier. The images show the FUD printed model straight from the box with still quite a lot of the support wax residue in various nooks and crannies. It's quite hard to make out and I'll upload some better shots once it's been sanded and primed - this weekend time permitting. Shapeways appear to have ignored the orientation in my CAD file (boiler up) and printed it from the bottom up. However the smoothness is still pretty good, especially on the smaller curved parts which have come out rather well. The smokebox door and cosmetic buffers are on a sprue that sits under the bunker area. The idea of having the door seperate like this was to avoid stepping issues when printing with it facing up (which unfortunately is the way it's ended up anyway). Had the model been printed as intended the door would have been side on. Nevertheless, it's still quite smooth and so for future prints I'll re-integrate it to the rest of the model as the orientation doesn't seem a particular issue. The cosmetic buffers have come out rather well and can be glued and dropped into the recesses on the buffer beams and used as is. Alternatively the recesses should also accept Alan Gibson GNR type sprung-buffers. One downside is that there is some quite strong banding, especially on the boiler and tank sides. It looks a lot worse in the photos due to the transparancy of the model and I suspect they'll easily scrape or sand out. They are certainly a lot less prominent than the very obvious stepping on the earlier primegray prototype which also required filling as well as sanding. I now have my CAD model set up to easily change between a variety of detail differences with BR & LNER smokebox doors, saturated or superheated boiler types and some or all of the condensing apparatus. This one modelled is 69434 which seems to have flit about between the south and the West Riding before working the Queensbury lines from Bradford Hammerton Street in the early 50s and ending her days at Copley Hill. I have several photos of this loco from that time where she's shown retaining the tank vents but no other condensing gear.

That is interesting, certainly worth further investigation.

Well the argument has now been well and trully swayed by i-materialise. Basically they won't entertain a sprued model of any sort so each part would need to be printed seperately, each with it's own set-up cost on top of the print cost. The policy is designed to prevent people duplicating complete models in a single file to circumvent the set-up charge so I don't really feel that a sprued multi-part single model falls into that category. Nevertheless they are sticking to the letter of the law (if not the spirit IMHO) and will not deviate. Of course it can still be done this way but costs will be prohibitive - the additional set-up costs will add in the region of euro 20 to 40 to the cost of the model depending on quantity! On top of all that they wouldn't guarantee 100% that the parts would be printed the correct way up! I think this option is dead in the water for anything other than a master prototype for creating moulds. So I am plowing ahead as a single part model which will be offered via Shapeways FUD. I'm on track to have all permutations (as indicated in post 36) ready this week and I'll then be uploading to Shapeways for a prototype.

Hi Graeme, Yep, work had got in the way somewhat (I can only really work on it when i'm in the office). However, this week I've managed to get a fair bit done and I have the model just about ready to print in two possible forms: 1) simple kit option which will have most of the large flat(ish) body parts and the boiler done in prime gray. There will be just 9 seperate prime gray parts. The kit will come with a choice of smokeboxes for the saturated and superheated versions of the loco. The following detail parts will be done in FUD: smokebox door, chimney, dome and cosmetic buffers. The smokebox door will be offered as a BR version with a blank number plate and as an LNER version. I'm currently in discussion with i-materialise about print orientation for this model before I can get it printed. For this version I will buy in the parts in small runs for resale. 2) full 1-part body in FUD. This will be offered as a direct end-user print from Shapeways in several variants: BR/LNER, saturated/superheated, with/without condensing equipment, with/without cosmetic buffers. Most of this is essentially done and ready to roll-out. The part I still need to work on is the condensing equipment - possibly this could be an additional add-on kit but maybe better included in the main kit. Pros and cons are: Option 1: Pros: lower cost, takes advantage of prime gray's shiny flat high detail top surfaces, less cleaning up. Cons: it's a kit. Consolidation of parts and onward postage by me. Option 2: Pros: One piece, higher resolution general detail. Cons: more expensive, cleaning up of all surfaces. So there we are. I'd be interested to know folk's preferences.

I have a fuzzy pic of an A4 there in 1962 from somewhere on t'internet (can't remember where) that shows 4 lines of flatbottom rail. Not much help though : ) The stock of Copley Hill will look rather graceful zipping through here. How long will the boards be?

Where does all the time go? I'm now six months into this project and I'd have to say the summer has not been as productive as I'd have liked. Still, progress, whilst not being spectacular, has at least been steady and fairly continuous. First off, I'd always intended to change the name and I felt it was about time to come up with something more in keeping with the Great Horton/Queensbury Lines concept. I didn't want to just use Great Horton as it's not a slavish recreation and to my mind there are too many compromises and alterations from reality to call it that. So from now on the project will be known as GREAT HOTTON - it sounds like Great Horton and it's also a little nod to the ficticious town in Emmerdale (spelt differently). So with the new name in place and marked by some tongue-in-cheek photo editing, it's time for a brief update: Track: Most of the plain track is now laid including the goods loop and the sidings. Magnets have been embedded at appropriate points to facilitate delayed uncoupling - I will be using the spratt & winkle type as I find them easy to assemble and to adjust and they look reasonably unobtrusive. Cosmetic fish plates have been added at plain track panel intervals. Ballast shoulders have been formed with decorators caulk. One area that I've not looked at yet is the siding at the front. This will be a coal drops and still needs some thought. Electrics: All track laid so far has droppers and is wired to the main bus and fully tested. The main bus is connected between board 1 and 2 by means of a couple of phono plugs and sockets. This system will be extended to provide several points along the front of the layout where the controller can be plugged in. Much of the above work has taken place outside and it's given me a chance to see how things look from the other side. Actually it's quite interesting and will show off some detail that would otherwise have been wasted such as the station front. Thought will be given to a double backscene approach so that the layout can be worked from either side (not at the same time obviously). Fiddle Yards: Although work has continued on these I remain unconvinced as to the long term reliability and alignment of the traversers that I've built. I've decided that ultimately I will replace them with a cassette system which I hope will be simple and robust. The cassettes will be constructed from 6mm MDF and will be trapezoidal 2-road units that will simply sit on a frame at the correct height. I'm not yet sure which method I'll use to connect power and hold them in place but I'll probably stay with the brass tube & bolt system that I've already done for the traverser. Each cassette will be around 1100mm long. There will be 5 at each end which are mirrors of each other. In due course I'll construct a couple of longer ones that will enable longer trains to be run when the layout is set up outside in good weather. The image below shows progress so far. The J39 hauled freight is just about the longest train that can fit in the fiddle yard. More would have been nicer but it's not too untypical of the sort of train lengths to be found on the branch in it's later days.

Hmnn....buffers. I notice you've said N2s there Simon rather than N1s? I can't find any pics of N1s with anything other than the GN round style. However, looking into this has led to another problem. I'd anticipated re-using the N2 buffers to fit into the GN style base but I could only make the hole quite small due to the wall thickness limitations of the prime gray material (see buffer on the left below). I've attempted to ream out one of the buffers to the correct size (see buffer on right) but I'm at the point where the material is starting to split and it's still not quite big enough to take the Hornby buffer. On the finished kit these parts will be printed with a different orientation so the hole will be through the layers rather than across them which may give a little more tolerence but I suspect not. So, the solution will be to have holes in the buffer beams and fully modelled non-working buffers as seperate parts that can be glued in place. This leaves the option for anyone who wishes to fit 3rd party brass sprung buffers to easily do so.

Thanks for the comments guys. It's nice to see something which just started out for my own use/pleasure escalate into something other modellers will be interested in. My current thinking on the small parts sprue and the doors is that the number plate will be a seperate part and several will be offered including a flat one (although it would be very easy to file the numbers flat anyway). The kit will include just one door, numberplate, chimney and dome - I will be printing them in multiples to save money. I may also create a sprue for the condensing gear for those who want it - however, the ones from the donor N2 may be appropriate. As mentioned above I will also probably seperate the smokebox from the boiler and offer both saturated and superheated variants. There are just too many variations in the class to cover everything but I think this provides a good range of options. As for future projects, initially at least I will be looking to create ex-GNR locos appropriate for use in the West Riding and the Queensbury Lines in particular. So that means a J50 and J6. The problem here is the lack of a donor chassis so that will require some thought. However, these would be a long way off and I still live in hope that a manufacturer will do a J50.