PeterR

Hi,

Those look good, Thank you for the photos which give a very good impression of the coaches and another 'Thank you' for the comment right at the end for the saloon that you mention, as I have a liking for saloons!.

These I think - so maybe quite wrong are 7mm scale are the 4mm scale versions going to be the same?

Another topic has anyone seen the website for 'D3Diagram models'?  here is a link      http://www.diagram3d.com/index.php?route=common/home, and they have a section for the NBR.

Does anybody have any models from them at all, and/or opinions?

Yours Peter. 

Hi Mark & Ian,

Thank you for the photo of the 4mm scale NBR coach etch, it looks very nice.

I will be interested in some when they are ready, certainly: I knew they were 'around' and was waiting for some confirmation.

Could I suggest possibly a NBR 6 wheel saloon as well please? From the NBRSG site there is a saloon first (1908 dia 12) that seems to be downrated to a third class one?  And there is the saloon 3 to 1908 Dia 42 in the 3rd class list.

Finally will it be reasonable easy to bend the roof  to the 2 radii of it - sharper at the edges please?

Thank you for all the time that you have evidently put in on the drawings for the etches.

Yours Peter.

Hi, Scott -

Thank you for the photo of the NBR all 1st, I know that there were to be some etched kits from Ian with the NBRSG, but did not know at what stage they were.

The coach looks very good and I look forward to the kits when they are available.

Meanwhile I will get the paint brushes out for some NBR and Highland wagons that I am building, in 4mm scale to keep me busy.

Yours Peter.

Hi,

Early(ish) this morning I wen to Lidl an bought one of these  - here is a photo of the contents of the box .

The guarantee is for 3 years; don't forget also they have a selection in the 'Specials' at the moment of a large box and other smaller ones of modellers 'bits and pieces' that are quite good.

Yours Peter.

Hi,

Andy G asked 247 developments to make an etch for his 4mm scale ex Highland Railway coaches, and possibly other railway coaches,  for the fiddly bits - this has been done and it is now available at £7.50 each + a post charge for any number of frets of £1.10

No connection with 247, I will be buying a couple.

Yours Peter.

your link to the photos is missing...  ;(

Ooops -

Here you are            https://www.flickr.com/photos/bogog/page1/

that is page 1 there are 13 at the moment covering all railways; the 0 gauge layout is housed at Bowness (or Bo'ness) in a railway coach.

Yours Peter :-( :-(

Hi,

The CR NPCS colour can be replicated with Vauxhall RIOJA colour:  ref. numbers are 90443684, and then Rioja 69 L.  This information from John Boyle.

Not found one for the coach colour which is lighter.

Finally there is a very good selection of O gauge photos at     which are of the Bowness O gauge layout.

Yours Peter

Hi,

Here are a couple of photos , the first is my first scratchbuilt loco - number 69 and coach at the depot, and the second is the village with snow cover,  Brrr!

Yours peter.

My 1/4 litre ( not the larger one - this is a trial), arrived yesterday - well packed being a plastic clear bottle just over 2.25 inches diameter with a height of 4".

The e-bay seller has their own website (www.magnacol.co.uk) and takes orders direct.

A quick check of the cement in use, shows that it works reasonably fast.

Hi Mike,

Thanks for the reply - quite right re the price the first page shows 250 ml for £7.50: and then 1 litre for just over double - the same sort of thing applies top post charge as well.

Thanks again. Yours Peter.

Dave Woodward wrote this up in one of the magazines (probably RM or MRJ) many years ago. Sorry I don't have a issue/date/page reference but it might jog someone else's memory or provide some info for a search in an index.

Hi, There is a topic on producing a teak finish at              http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=86&t=49560     that may help.

And another one is at   http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/75178-reproducing-varnished-teak-improving-latest-Hornby-thompsons/ which is making the Hornby Coaches better.

Finally Martyn Welch has an article in MRJ 176 that is 9 pages + 2 long of a LNE coach & a GNR one (in black & white) leaving St Pancras on a LMS train

There is also a couple of photos of a LNER Pigeon Van done using Martin/s method (one prototype, 1 model) at       http://www.scalefour.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=757

Yours Peter.

Hi Andy,

Those sides for the full brake look good - congratulations - you mention 'Lemonene', where did you buy it from please?

Yours Peter.

Hi,

You are correct in thinking that the tarpaulin roof sections in the big L&Y vans were for loading purposes, mainly for  for cotton bales. They actually had wooden slats in them with multi layer tarpaulins on each side' not forgetting a clean layer before the sticky, and possibly smelly cover was fitted; the had a horizontal bar at the bottom of them that secured them in position (being fixed on the centreline). The first ones had just a single pair of hatches; I made a 4mm version of them a long time ago.

There were also open wagons, and flat single plank wagons as well as the L&Y Vans. The flat and open wagons naturally all had to be sheeted up after loading (thus need lots and lots of wagon sheets.

There was a huge traffic of cotton bales from Liverpool (which came by sea from the southern USA) to the Manchester area, thus the large wagons, which were the capacity of 3 'normal' wagons..

The tarpaulin centre section was used with the large lucams (hoist towers) on the big warehouses - it allowed easier loading. There were also solid sliding hatches as well on a lot of railway vans  -also for the same reason.

Cotton bale sizes are mentioned at the following link http://www.cotton.org/tech/bale/bale-description.cfm

It was worked out that a large mill could deal with a bogie wagonload of cotton per day. The L&Y were said to have the largest fleet of bogie wagons in the early 1900's when there was a lot of them built, generally the genre were too large for the trade intended - lack of infrastructure generally being the reason for their failure to proliferate.

Finally don't forget that the L&Y were also in the Yorkshire Woollen district, which used wool bales shipped from Australia - and they were both solid (being compressed by steam powered compressors), and big. 

Yours Peter.

Hi,

The original rolling  stock on the Killin railway was possibly old Scottish & North Eastern Railway (which was incorporated into the CR). Even the Caledonian replacement was virtually unique insofar as a standard CR coach was modified for them by having one of the central 1st class compartments made as a 3rd class one.

The 'ex SNER' suggestion is from John Boyle, who is a long time friend, makes an etched brass 7mm scale kit of the 3 compartment first.

.   

The Oakwood Press book on the Scottish Central Railway has some drawings in of locos and carriages iof interested.

Re the forthcoming Highland Railway coach & wagon book, if NOT a HR Soc member  - check out Amazon for it - release date is end of Feb by the way.

Yours Peter R

So composites with a central brake compartment had ducket ends in vermilion but the coach ends not? and only full brakes or composites with duckes built into the ends of the coaches had full vermilion ends or did I misunderstand it. Sorry to be a pain

Hi,

Brake compt. end vermillion (not the other end!)   Central brake;  ends not known (not enough photos - they are very rare, and naturally in black & white) : ducket sides (with glass in them) vermillion red (from different shade of grey).

Full brakes - if any duckets, (early ones had a ducket - later (elliptical roof) ones did not), in the centre so possibly chocolate (the same as normal coaches)  ends, sides of duckets vermillion I would think (from the centre brake compos).  Info from CR liveries; also nothing in the waist panels of guards compt. or luggage doors; the duckets had a number in the waist panel.

However the 1923 brake compo re-painted by BR in c.1958 has no duckets and no vermillion end - that could be due to painting ends a different colour = extra cost, after WW1.

There are gaps in the details; Scottish railways seem to be less well documented than English ones.

Yours Peter

Hello Peter, thanks for the help and advice its very much appreciated please keep it coming, could you help me with a question I have. Do you know if the brake composites have the full vermilion ends too like the full brakes or were they the same colours as the "normal" none brake coaches? Steve

Hi,

When the brake compt.. was on the end (some were in the middle) it is thought that the end of that compt. was as you say vermillion. - from p259 CR Liveries; however when the brake was in the middle with a ducket the ends of the ducket were also though to be vermillion. and C R appeared on the ducket in the middle of the upper panels. (one letter in each panel)

There is also a photo (p 259) of  a 50ft brake compo (end brake compt but the end is not shown (rats!) at Oxenhome LNW with no CR on that ducket!

Yours Peter.

Hi,

The Family saloon is a special sort of vehicle and they bear no resemblance to normal coaches. These vehicles especially; as they have a double window system, that also applied to a shorter 6 wheel version of these vehicle, which themselves were built in two styles - the other ones had a couple of extra windows, one each side of the entrance door. Generally they were for first class passengers and their servants, having both classes in one vehicle, with a luggage compartment as well.

The two window style was also used by the Midland Railway and eventually by the LMS for general service coaches, which they called 'vestibule' stock - which means open (non compartment) coaches.

The Caledonian Railway also used the same window style for a couple of equally superb, if not better then the LNWR/WCJS vehicles, being a bit longer at 50ft long and having a two window coupe in a bow end. They were the only clerestory vehicles the Caledonian Railway ever built. Incidentally there is a very good book on CR livery and the CRA published by Lightmoor that show this vehicle, recently added to this is one on the CR wagons - no connection with Lightmoor Press; hopefully there will be (in 2015) a book on CR Carriages: no connection with Lightmoor Press by the way.

Next year, about Feb or so there will be a book on Highland Railway carriages.

I did, a long time ago now, drawings of the above - I have an interest in saloons and the associated vehicles that would travel with them; hopefully some etches or etched kits may soon appear.

The full brake in the CR photo is a Pickersgill one - earlier ones, by Drummond and Lambie had a lower roof, and there were also some 4 wheel end ducket vehicles as well. Etched brass kits of these (not the Pickersgill one) used to be made by John Boyle under the 'decent kits' banner - these may be available again soon.

The CR used for its suburban, and second line coach stock (4 and 6 wheel)a chocolate colour, (more dark chocolate than (GWR) milk) - with no white upper panels - those started in about 1897, and were originally for coaches for Manchester and Liverpool expresses. Fox make some transfers for the CR coaches.

Incidentally the vehicle behind the 060 loco are a WCJS fish or fruit van a LNW horsebox, a WCJS fish van, and the last NPCS horsebox is too indistinct to say. I think the 060 is in the black livery, there is a book by Lightmoor & the CRA on the precursor to this engine, which were generally known as Jumbo's (Book title is 'Caledonian Railway 'Jumbos')

Finally remove the GWR style of commode handles (by the side of the door), the CR used a different style, for those a Bill Bedford (now Mousa kits) make a very useful jig - now sold by Eileen's Emporium, at £5.00 plus post. Again the early, 4 wheel, suburban stock the commode handle was like the LNWR style.

Yours Peter.

Hi,

Nice work; you could simplify thinks by making the strapping from strips of .010 plasticard and then when in position. If doing the inside knees (that are fitted to central side door wagons, with the horizontal part hidden under the floor planks) those are twice thickness and tapered.

Back to the exterior strapping, the nuts on the outside were square (bolt heads are inside so as not to damage the load) and can be cut from very fine strips of .010 plasticard with a curved scalpel blade, NOT a straight blade; do the cutting carefully and the can per persuaded to stay on the small sheet (vinyl tile is OK) instead , as some will inevitably do go for a flying lesson never to be seen again!  Don't use too much effort and they stay on the sheet. 

Add them using the tip of a liquid cement charged small cheapish brush; made from hair not bristles. The cement by the way is best kept in a small holder to stop it being tipped over etc and the holder can have some holes in a side fitting for your brushes. They will drop down neatly using the transferring cement that holds them when dry.

Here is a grabbed photo (on my stairs at 1700hrs today hence, with apologies, the slight fuzziness!) of my glue holder. That is made from a base of hardboard, and piece of ply with a hole cut in it first, to the size of your plastic cement bottle to be a tight fit) then glued onto the hardboard, the (3 hole) brush holder can be some scrap. Ensure it is not in the way of your arms crossing over it and knocking it sideways when (of course) there is no lid on the glue!

The little squares are about 20 thou on each side from the .010 strip; it is best about 1.5 inches long, for handling; I cut about 10 - 15 at one time then transfer them (to stock or the wagon) keep the squares in a closed container till ready for use - I use an old 35mm film container that is translucent.

Yours Peter.

Hi,

You ask about the Midland Railway singles;  The Wild Swan book 'Midland Locomotives' Vol 2 (ISBN0 906867 59 2) by Essery & Jenkinson, has a whole chapter (P146 - 179) on them, with lots of photos and some drawings as well.

There are others as well (the Irwell press (I think) series) but I do not know those as I do not have them.

For general and detailed information the whole set of the Wild Swan books (4 vols -  V1 general V2 passenger V3 goods, V4 Tank Engines ) are good, and a more general ones on MR Locos is by Jack Braithwaite - titled S W Johnson Midland Railway Locomotive Engineer Artist  (Wyvern Publications) ISBN 0 907941.17.6 I find it good - it covers all S W Johnson's locos with photos though no drawings.

Yours Peter.

Hi,

I see the the 'advert' for HS2 ( by HMG) has the Siemens design for the trains - what has happened top the twin deck british design? Too costly in the amount of (extra) earth to be meoved around perhaps?

HMG is is usual failing to push home grown designs -- alas!

Why do such things in the UK take so looong to produce?

Its insteresting that the 'start' date is after the next General election (as has been mentioned before).

Modern construction equipment can work quite fast.

Hi Ian,

Are you talking about the original bogies of 6ft 6inches wheelbase or the later 8 footers wheelbase? That does not include the diners which were longer! IF the latter Roxey do a LSWR 8ft American bogie which is virtually the same as them: I don't know of a 6ft 6inch one.

Link to Roxey though there is no view of them

http://www.roxeymoul...2510e02e9b2770#

I have sent you a small drawing of the LSWR American bogies, which I think is the Roxey style.