JimC

I think much in this thread demonstrates precisely why it was more sensible of Hattons to produce a generic coach rather than to attempt specific prototypes and deliver them in liveries of different companies they would never have carried.

A far safer option in these days...

This is from Russell, its supposed to be a GWR drawing.

There was more than one chimney, just to complicate things...

Do you know if they were GWR built or private siding? I understand that welsh coal tends to be friable so one can imagine end tipping being more favoured, hence the Felix Cole wagons having end doors, not bottom doors. The other thing that occurs to me is that if you have coal drops the wagons get emptied quickly, and into local storage until needed for delivery, whereas otherwise the wagons would tend to be the local storage and emptied straight to delivery. That makes me speculate that the investment in coal drops would be made when there was a need to turn wagons about swiftly. It also occurs to me that the bottom doors must have required the last of the coal to be shoveled down the hole. Not a job I would fancy, pretty dangerous i should think unless they closed the bottom doors and shovelled the last out of the side door.

AIUI there were large scale coal handling systems at Swindon (gas works) and Park Royal (power station) which the specialised coal hopper wagons supplied. Apart from that I don't think any GWR mineral wagons had bottom doors, which presumably would preclude conventional coal drops. Facilities at docks for private owner wagons maybe? The Felix pole wagons were fitted up for end tipping: I don't know what the matching facilities for handling that were.

Cook certainly tells the story that Sir James Milne said "words to the effect that in this year of grace you cannot build a locomotive with a steam dome" To my mind though this has to be more of a good story for the book than anything else. I expect Milne did say something of the sort lightheartedly, but apart from anything else contemporary with the 94s were over 100 8750s, 16s and 74s, all with steam domes.

No guarantees that this list is free from transcription errors. gwtenderbarelist.xlsx

In "Swindon Steam" Cook says the LMS had a rule that boilers needed to be taken off the frames for full examination every 5 years, or 8 years in Scotland. I'm sure I've seen some boiler change records online for some of the preserved GWR locos, but can't find it right now.

I'm had a quick look and had trouble locating the firebox and ashpan relative to the axles. Given a std 10 boiler the front of the firebox must be between wheels. If its between 2nd and 3rd I reckon too much of the weight of the loco is on the first two pairs of wheels, but if its between 3rd and 4th then the back will be heavy.

There was a real proposal for that in 1905. I think it was abandoned at a fairly early stage, but there's an outline drawing surviving and reproduced in RCTS. 45xx boiler. My interpretation goes like this. My imagination pictures a Hawksworth era 0-8-0 pannier in the 15xx style, but looking at my 15xx drawing it would be a difficult thing to do well or even at all. Maybe with even closer spaced 4'1in wheels than the above and drive to the third pair, but then I think it might be too heavy at the back.

It possibly might even need to be a 2-8-4. King boiler, basically 4700 chassis, bits from 42 and 72.

There aren't many left... New wheel arrangements seem to have got the next available hundred that wasn't likely to be used for another class. 75 or 82 would be my guess. I fear the King boiler and the trailing wheels would be interfering in your photo. You'd probably need to go all Stanier Pacific and have a combustion chamber and a full on wide firebox.

We'll be here all day if we discuss large prairie permutations in too much detail! Yes, with outside steampipes and new curved front ends the later 3100s looked more like 5101s, but the man might want his kitbash to look slightly different [grin]. I see all sorts of variations in the rearward bunker overhangs of the 10 wheel tanks, its definitely photo territory. The 3100s were of course 3150 renewals.

City of Truro's Std 4 boiler on the Prairie tank chassis/tanks/bunker would give you a 3150 class. Technically there ought to be a fair few other detail changes, but its not a mile away... The cab and bunker are a bit different and the Churchward loco doesn't have the Holcroft radius at the front end.

Yes, the GWR had very few locomotives that were single purpose, as the early DM shunters undoubtedly were with their limited speed. Even Castles were expected to do fast vacuum freight turns. I agree completely, the 94s were a cheaper alternative to more 56xx, not an alternative to 57s.

Interesting that in the second photo she's already lost GWR cab plate, safety valves and whistles. Intresting too the different paint colour under the number plate.

Yes, she's beautifully kept, and a credit to her owners, but that's arguably very much a special occasion level of presentation, and back in the day, as a working shunter in the docks, I suspect its most likely that all the polished metalwork above footplate level would have been painted, and possibly none too many layers of paint either. But maybe we can imagine a royal visit to the docks?

Interesting to know if the wagon owners charged demurrage though. After all if 75% of your fleet is idle being used as temporary coal storage you need a much bigger wagon fleet. On the other hand I suppose it could have just been absorbed in the base price of the coal.

I do believe I see a thinning of the central large diameter rods in their middle, which suggests wear and that they are guides for the chain. The rest might just be fancy bracing.

Minituarised Stephenson's link in a oilbath between the frames... now there's a thought to conjure with.

Haven't we got enough on our plate with imaginary locos without diverting into imaginary currency manipulations?

I suspect all that would have been needed for the railways to be revitalised would be for the government to pay them everything that was owed from the wars. But the money simply wasn't there to do it. Britain was wholly engaged in paying back the yanks, and without all the overseas trade which had been lost to the Americans during the war.

Nope, you can turn up and look at pretty much anything for free. I should think Reference:RAIL 651/1 Description: Black Book of cautions and commendations to enginemen would be an excellent place to start. https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C1928496 652/2 is "Over the Points." Quarterly magazine containing many interesting articles, facts and photographs concerning Southern Railway, but they haven't got a complete run.

In the 30s Uffa Fox, the boat builder and yacht designer, used to send his exceedingly expensive and delicate (and very pretty) dinghies uncrated. It was his theory that a crate would be bashed about any old how, but the unprotected varnished wooden craft would be admired and handled with great care. It has to be said that Mr Fox had a lot of unusual theories, such that tales are still told nearly 50 years after his death.