Coombe Ferrers - 80s / 90s South Devon

[DomDulley]

Hi all,

 

I've reached the stage in my garage layout where I have completed a lower level fiddle yard and a run up to the scenic level, and I'm trying to decide on a track plan.

 

The problem I have is that I want to be able to run pretty much everything from late crest steam/green diesel through to modern image. To solve this I thought about having a long set of platforms at the rear to run 70s to present day, and a heritage depot at the front as a thinly veiled excuse for the older stuff.

 

I would welcome any comments or advice on the latest iteration of my plan.

 

 

   

Edited December 9, 2018 by DomDulley

[DomDulley]

So, after some head-scratching I've decided that I can't have everything, so I'm going to focus on the BR blue period through to Sectorisation.

 

Consequently the heritage line is gone, and I've reworked the track plan to model an old steam depot converted into a small TMD. That way I can at least keep a turntable for the odd steam loco I may run.

 

I'll post some photos of the layout as it stands, which is a low level fiddle yard leading to a single road incline running around four walls to reach the top board, which is what I'm keen to get started on.

 

At the moment I've completed the outer track on the upper loop, which will need adjusting once I've finalised the track plan.

 

I'm Dom by the way. I've previously worked on a layout in the attic, but found that space was too limited so relocated to the garage.

 

I'd welcome any comments or suggestions on improving this before I start laying track, particularly about the station throat and design of the TMD.

 

Thanks!

 

[Stubby47]

Hi Dom,

There are many people on here who are better qualified to give advice. But a couple of things have caught my eye.

 

Why is there a leading crossover at the left end of the platform ?

Why is there not a trailing crossover on the right side of the plan below the point into the MPD?

Why is there a 2nd leading crossover through the diamond at the right end of the platform ?

 

Basically, how do you plan to use the layout, are the planned movements prototypical and does the track plan help or hinder ?

 

Hope that helps

 

Stu

[DomDulley]

Hi Dom,

There are many people on here who are better qualified to give advice. But a couple of things have caught my eye.

 

Why is there a leading crossover at the left end of the platform ?

Why is there not a trailing crossover on the right side of the plan below the point into the MPD?

Why is there a 2nd leading crossover through the diamond at the right end of the platform ?

 

Basically, how do you plan to use the layout, are the planned movements prototypical and does the track plan help or hinder ?

 

Hope that helps

 

Stu

Hi Stu,

 

In terms of operations I'm not planning on running a prototypical timetable, but I would like a degree of realism. I like to watch the trains go by, so I was planning on running long trains up from the fiddle yard and round the upper loop (outer track initially).

 

In order to get trains moving in the opposite direction I'll need to uncouple and run all the way round the loop to the other end of the train. For really long trains I don't mind doing this, but for shorter passenger services I thought I could use a run around in the station, which is why the leading crossover at the left end of the platforms is there. Not sure how prototypical this is (probably not at all as my knowledge is pretty basic).

 

In fact, I think that crossover to the left of the platforms is trailing not leading, as movements will generally be from right to left at the top of the outer loop, if that makes sense. Perhaps I should designate Up and Down lines to make things easier to explain.

 

I'd also like to do some basic shunting in the TMD with my 08--maybe fuel deliveries and some freight wagons. Before I got rid of the goods yard I was planning on a fair amount of shunting, but you can't have everything

 

The trailing point below the entrance to the TMD is a good idea. I'll add one.

 

With my limited knowledge I can't figure out what you mean about the second crossover through the diamond. Any chance you could clarify?

 

Many thanks!

[Stubby47]

Ahhh, I understand a bit better now.

 

However, how about these ideas...

 

1. Add a trailing crossover just after the point from the hidden tracks, so trains can cross to the inner (anti-clockwise)  line. This way your trains will run round each circuit passing each other on their right hand side 

2. Change the leading cross over to a trailing crossover

3. There are are two crossovers through this diamond (single slip ? ) - replace with a single point.  This still leaves you with a run-round loop in the platforms, but both sets of points are trailing, so will both be less prone to derailments and look more prototypical

 

[DomDulley]

I'm doing my usual rubbish job of explaining myself

 

I envisaged a train coming up from the fiddle yard and onto the outer (anticlockwise) track, coming into the station in the direction indicated by the blue arrow at the top. When I wanted to change direction it would stop at blue point 1, the loco would run around on my original point configuration (which I think would be trailing unless I've grasped it wrong - which is entirely possible!), come back out onto the outer loop at blue point 2 and reverse to recouple with the other end of the carriages at blue point 3.

 

What I now realise (having had to explain it) is that the train would then still be on the outer loop and have to travel all the way round in a clockwise direction  to get back to the station and use the (now leading) points or the diamond at the other end of the platform to cross to the inner loop. Unless the loco recoupled at blue point 4 and used the diamond to immediately cross to the inner loop, but this would mean losing a couple of carriages off the length of trains that I could run.

 

The diamond is a double slip, by the way. I suppose my reasoning was that at some point every train will have to run clockwise on the outer loop (opposite to normal direction of travel) to get back to the track down to the fiddle yard. Your crossover at red point 1 would prevent this though. The only problem is that there is a lifting flap over a door there, but I could probably fit something in.

 

I hope this isn't all too confusing. Just explaining it is really helping

 

 

 

 

 

[Stubby47]

I only put the crossover at red 1 near the point to limit the distance of running 'on the wrong track' - if it makes more physical sense it could be moved further anti-clockwise.

 

Thus trains would arrive in the the inner platform, and could use the red 2 cross over (now trailing) and red 3 cross over to change ends, then leave via red 3 to the outer track (clockwise).

 

If the crossovers at red 3 were removed completely, the loco would need to run down to the new crossover near the MPD entrance to re-cross to the inner line. This would enable longer trains to be run. The train would need to leave the station on the inner line going clockwise until it reached this crossover. 

 

This would also mean that locos could be swapped.

 

1. Train leaves fiddle yard, crosses to inner line and stops at platform

2. Loco is detached, runs forwards, then reverses over red 2, through platform to MPD cross over.

3. Loco goes on shed

4. Replacement loco leaves shed on to inner line, then reverses to coaches. 

5. Train leaves inner platform to MPD cross over, then crosses to outer circuit and continues to station / hidden sidings.

 

Stu

[Jason T]

Trains run on the left and not the right (same as roads) in the UK. That's where the confusion is coming from

[DomDulley]

Thanks very much Stu, that makes a lot of sense. I particularly like the loco switching--much more scope for operational fun.

 

With the inner loop running anticlockwise I can also remove the points at the end of the bay platform, making the inner platform longer.

 

I might keep something at red 3 as well as adding the crossover below the MPD entrance, unless there are any particular reasons not too. Then I can use one or the other depending on train length.

 

I'll try to rejig the MPD entrance so that the old and new points are both in the scenic area as well.

 

I'll have a play this evening and post something.

 

How prototypical is this arrangement? I don't mind a bit of divergence from real life but I don't want to commit too many howlers.

[DomDulley]

Trains run on the left and not the right (same as roads) in the UK. That's where the confusion is coming from

 

That helps a lot. Never occurred to me!

 

Thanks Jason

[DomDulley]

I've modified the plan.

 

The only potential issue I can see now is that by removing the diamond to the right of the platforms there is no leading crossover for trains on the outer loop to join the inner loop. 

 

I'm not sure whether they would ever need to do this, and I guess they could always reverse onto it if necessary.

 

Am I right in thinking it's normal practice not to use leading crossovers in any case, to minimise the danger of accidentally running onto the 'wrong' line?

 

 

 

[Stubby47]

Re the trailing crossover question - Yes, I think you're right.

[DomDulley]

I completed a few jobs on the layout today, and took some pictures. Sorry if the quality isn't great.

 

First of all, an overview of the layout as it stands.

 

This is the lower level fiddle yard.

 

 

The yard exits here...

 

 

It travels across the door on the lower level...

 

 

Then along the wall behind the shelves on an incline...

 

 

Round the rear wall still on an incline (lower track)...

 

 

Still going up (inner track with HST is a storage siding)...

 

 

And round onto the level upper loop...

 

 

After that the upper loop just repeats the incline loop but on the level.

 

This is the upper scenic level, which will feature the station and TMD. Just a temporary board at the moment.

 

 

I'll show what I did today in the next post.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DomDulley]

With all the helpful discussion around the track plan for the upper level, I realised that I needed to complete the lower fiddle yard before the upper baseboard made it difficult to access.

 

I've never got to the stage on a layout where I actually wired up a point motor before, so this was an exciting prospect!

 

I'm planning on constructing a simple mimic panel for the yard, with toggle switches and green leds for route indication as it will be tricky to see how the points are thrown when the upper board is fixed in place.

 

The first stage was to wire up the 16V accessory output from an old Hornby controller to a CDU, and then through a temporary switch I had hanging around to a Peco surface-mounted point motor.

 

 

I threw the switch and..it worked! Amazing

 

The next stage was to solder some wires to a test Seep motor, which is the type I'm planning to use on the yard.

 

I was quite impressed with the results. I even used heatshrink for the first time

 

 

I wired this to the switch and, hey presto, it also worked! I was on a roll.

 

So now I need to order a few switches and Seeps, and LEDs and resistors. I'm getting confused about how to wire the LEDs into the circuit, so any guidance would be welcome. I've read so much my head is gong round!

 

Anyway, all that was left to do today was fix the surface-mounted Peco to the points leading into the non-scenic siding shown in my last post (holding the HST). I had to drill out the mounting holes with a pin vice to fit Hornby track pins, then I drilled a hole in the MDF for the wires. As I suspected it was too awkward to reach them underneath, so I attached them to a choc block with longer wires. Not so neat but it will be hidden by a backboard eventually.

 

Before:

 

 

After:

 

 

The last thing I did was to oil an old Fowler 4P that's been sitting in a drawer for years and run it round the upper loop for a while. This seemed to improve its jerkiness.

 

It's not in keeping with my new BR Blue/Sectorisation theme, but I like it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DomDulley]

Work is progressing well on the lower level, with a number of jobs in progress at once, as usual!

 

First is the control panel for the fiddle yard. Because I've never done this before I started by building a simple box from some scrap chipboard and offcuts to hold the switches and LEDs.

 

 

I pencilled in the yard diagram...

 

 

...and fitted the first switch and two LEDs. After some fun and games with the wiring, and not a little confusion about where the power for the LEDs came from (connection F on the Seep point motor) I managed to get one point motor working correctly with the LEDs. I was absurdly pleased by this

 

 

With my confidence bolstered I decided if I was going to build a panel, I should do it properly, so I ordered a 3mm sheet of glossy white perspex. When this arrives I can install all the switches and LEDs. 

 

I made this to help me with the point motor wiring.

 

Edited October 5, 2015 by DomDulley

[DomDulley]

After the arrival of some brass tube, rod and strip, I was able to sort out the lower lift-up section that spans the door.

 

Because the door is in the corner I ended up with the break in the track at the end of the lift-up flap that was on both and incline and a curve. As you can imagine, this caused no end of derailments.

 

My solution was to use plasticard to steepen the incline a little to that it approached the corner level, and to fix a second radius curve in position across the end of the flap.

 

This worked like a dream and solved the derailment problems, but meant that I could no longer lift the flap.

 

I needed a way to be able to remove and replace the curve, and came up with this. Excuse the execrable soldering - my first time working with brass.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DomDulley]

I've also been playing with Kadee couplers.

 

I made a simple base for the height gauge. I should have taken a photo of a loco or wagon on it.

 

 

Some N52 magnets arrived today so I can test the uncoupling. If it works as expected I will need to order more and dot them around the fiddle yard before fixing the track down.

 

I'll put some images of some of my stock up later, but for now here are a couple of the fiddle yard now that part of my temporary upper level board has been removed for access.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 5, 2015 by DomDulley

[DomDulley]

The yard control panel is finished and working well. I replaced the thin ply I was using with an A5 sheet of glossy white acetate purchased for a fiver.

 

I used 3mm whiteboard gridding tape on the front and bought a cheap label printer. It's very useful for labelling the under board wiring too.

 

 

 

I used a 37 pin connector so that I can easily disconnect it from the layout for repairs. It made for a bit of a tangle.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DomDulley]

Next job was to fit uncoupling magnets for the kadees at strategic points in the lower fiddle yard, before fitting the top boards.

 

I dug out the Sundeala (which I've decided I don't like) with a snap-off knife and a chisel.

 

 

 

I used cut up kitchen skewers with printed labels to indicate which road they're on to mark the position of each uncoupling point, as I will be viewing them from the side.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DomDulley]

I bought a cheap miniature video camera and wired it up to an old monitor for occupancy detection. 

 

Unfortunately it can't see all 7 storage roads at once but I can just peep in the side to check road 8, which is nearest the operating area.

 

 

 

 

 

[DomDulley]

So, in the past few weeks I've completed the following jobs on the lower level fiddle yard, necessary before fitting the top boards.

• Fitted a 12v dc/16v ac PSU for a lighting circuit and point motors (the latter through a Gaugemaster CDU).
• Fitted 8 Seep point motors, wired to the control panel.
• Installed decoupling magnets and marker flags.
• Fitted a wall-mounted monitor and mini camera for occupancy detection.
• Added self-adhesive LED strips to illuminate the yard.
• Wired up a reverse loop module.
• Added droppers to each of the yard roads, to avoid relying on the points.

After doing all this I could finally fit the top boards. I decided to make them hinged to retain access to the lower yard, and to make fitting point motors and wiring easier (or indeed, possible at all.)

 

I opted for 9mm ply and had it cut into three sections.

 

 

Each is attached with two hinges, which I rebated into the benchwork at the rear for a flush fit.

 

I had to chop away a bit of the MDF shelf behind it (which supports the incline from the yard to the top boards) as the hinges were binding on it. This means I will have to lose a storage siding but it's not a big deal.

 

(I won't use MDF again. It's too hard to cut and produces piles of nasty powdery dust.)

 

 

 

 

The right hand board posed the most problems, and I had to move a shelf up by a couple of centimetres for clearance, which was mildly annoying.

 

 

I spent some time on this inclined curve too, building it up with plasticard and canting it with inch-long strips of 1.5mm card. Fiddly but it seems to work.

 

 

I fitted catches to keep the boards in place.

 

 

So now I just need to fit another few strips of LEDs and connect up some droppers, and all the lower level work is complete. 

 

That means I should be laying track this week. Finally!

 

 

 

[DomDulley]

This is the latest iteration of my track plan. I'm concerned the diesel depot is a bit busy. Should thin out the trackwork a bit?

 

I'd also like some signalling advice. I'm planning on using two- or three-aspect light signals (although it would be nice to have at least one semaphore in there somewhere).

 

I was thinking about connecting these to the main control panel to be set manually.

 

I've marked the positions of what I think are all the signals required for the main line, but I need to add the ground signals for the depot. I assume these should be positioned according to the same rules, i.e. a set for each turnout. Is this right? I'm guessing there's no need for starter signals in a depot?

 

[ilovetrains6]

Nice progress

 

 

Johan

[DomDulley]

Nice progress

 

 

Johan

 

Thanks. Feels like I'm actually getting somewhere at last

[dhjgreen]

Dom,

 

I'm a little surprised that you have not had more posts on this thread.  There is some really interesting work here, and ideas to copy.  

 

A very neat bit of soldering on the mimic diagram; and heatshrink, Wow.  I am particularly impressed by the wiring on the 37 way connector.  I have seen work much less neat than this from professional wiremen (you aren't one are you?).  

 

More practice will help with your soldering of brass, plus a little liquid flux.

 

I would suggest you get some much smaller choc block as there is a risk of the wires not being gripped by the screw and them randomly falling out (thought the layout was n gauge when I saw the size of it in post 14!)

 

Loving the Kadee flags and camera too.

 

Edit to say added you as a friend.

Edited November 16, 2015 by dhjgreen