Should Asterix Hang Up His Sword?

[Claude_Dreyfus]

Really this is not a new debate; it has been raging ever since the death of the author Ren?© Goscinny in 1977, after which Albert Uderzo took responsibility for the words as well as illustrations.

 

There is the school of thought which suggests that whilst good, subsequent works following on from Asterix in Belgium (the final book the pair worked on) lacked the sophistication and wit that had gone before. Even more so some of the most recent offerings, which to me have migrated further away from the base in reality that gave the originals their character and charm ??“ some hardened fans refuse to accept the latest ???Asterix and the Falling Sky??™ as part of the true cannon of works.

 

Recently Uderzo has announced a deal that will allow the Asterix books to continue after his death, to much controversy.

 

The full BBC article is here http://news.bbc.co.u...ope/8319196.stm

 

I am interested, not just in this situation, but the point of longevity in general. The Russian composer Igor Stravinsky was quoted thus: ???Too many pieces of music finish too long after the end??™. One of the great truisms in modern art, the sentiment of which can be equally applied to literature and film.

 

Even in popular culture we have plenty of cases where something either hangs on for years on end (Last of the Summer Wine is the oft cited example here); change, evolve and deteriorate (example here could be Thomas the Tank Engine) or can evolve to remain as fresh and relevant today as it did when first released (pick your own example here ??“ success seems to be much harder to quantify that failure; we more often agree on what is rubbish than on what is good).

 

Some stuff, of course, only has a limited run, sometimes only a single series to keep it ???pure??™ ??“ Fawlty Towers.

 

Where does this leave much later additions to a cannon ??“ The new Wind in the Willows book, the constant additions to the Bond series, Carry on Columbus!

 

Good, bad, Indifferent?

 

Interested to know what people think on here; do we know when to leave something alone? ??¦and when does an idea that starts off strongly begin to date, become irrelevant, or silly?

[John_Hughes]

It's an interesting question, isn't it. Some things really do go on past their sell-by date, but I shall certainly get the new Hitch-hiker's book (Part 6 or 3!) sometime soon.

 

Or how about someone 'updating' the Madder Valley using current techniques / technology; would it be seen as homage or as sacrilege?

[smudgeloco]

I'm not current with Asterix stories. In fact, I only ever saw a video of it, and loved it. I bought a follow up video, only to find different voices used - I couldn't watch it, and didn't. It was ruined by changing the voices. So, it probably follows, that changing the writer would do the same thing.

As for outliving it's effectiveness - I love Red Dwarf, and have the entire collection, but I have to say the last two series were very sub standard (Cr@p)

I do admire series that stop production at a point where you still want more! It's a very brave (or suicidal) step to take. It's a little like a boxer quitting while he is on top - a champion.

I guess I'm in the camp of "It went on too long".

[shortliner]

All things have their time - some become classed by the "intelligensia" as being Classics, and are then hammered into the floor by the BeeBeeCee, as it is very successfully doing with Charles Dickens novels on Radio and TV - personally if I never saw another "highly rated"(by the critics) period drama, (to misquote the line from GWTW)" Frankly m'dears, I couldn't give a damn". Otheres undergo changes of writer, who really don't seem to have ever read/watched/ discussed previous plotlines (Dalziel and Pascoe) is a prime example, together with certain "soaps" on both media, and the plotlines verge on the silly. Others get sold overseas, and rewritten/recast (the appaling US versions of "Fitz" or "Prime suspect" leap into prominence here) - along with the continuing series of films eg "Star Trek" and spin-offs, and "Star Wars", only existing because the "money-men" have decreed that the last was a financial whizz, so the next one must be. And don't get me started about "CSI-Miami" with the carrot-headed wooden-top, or "Doctor Who" and the spin-offs from that!

.............Dons fireproof coat and disappears rapidly out of the door

[Guest stuartp]

Dare I add a small blue tank engine to this list of things that should have stopped after the first 52 books ?

[Tim H]

Sadly continuing a series once the spark has gone will continue to make money.

 

That's why Hollywood does so many second-rate sequels and pointless remakes of classics - it's far less of a financial risk than something new and original. It's a sad-but-true fact that enough fans of the original will see a sequel or remake that it's likely to make a profit even if it's complete rubbish.

[Welly]

It's not just the BBC which keeps classics going too long, some may recall "Frasier" that was made in the US and shown on Channel 4 some years ago. I loved it but it went on for 10 or 11 seasons when it should have stopped at the end of season 7 when Niles and Daphne ran off together! So I stopped watching Frasier halfway through season 8 when I could not laugh at Daphne's appallingly dysfunctional family!

 

I agree good things should come to an end, M*A*S*H was brought to an end after 11 or 12 seasons and it was still funny all the way along ( helped by changes of cast along the way )

 

Now "Fawlty Towers" only ever made 12 episodes altogether 30 odd years ago but people STILL talk of it today!

 

Just push the OFF button on your TV or DVD and get back to your bench, layout, PC, piano, wife/husband, girlfriend/boyfriend or family pet....

[LH&JC]

Generally films or TV shows that are regarded as classics are only a one off or have another series/film made. The Nightmare Before Christmas is more or less the perfect example IMHO.

[JZ]

You have to add Only fools and horses to this list. Ok, it was getting a little stale towards the end, but the Christmas specials that ended with them walking off into the sunset were some of the best of the lot. But that is where it should have been left.

[JohnDMJ]

You have to add Only fools and horses to this list. Ok, it was getting a little stale towards the end, but the Christmas specials that ended with them walking off into the sunset were some of the best of the lot. But that is where it should have been left.

 

And to add insult to injury, a prequel has now been made!

[Robert]

Unfortunately, this is a very common occurrence, but one that I don't expect we will see an end to. If someone comes up with a cash-cow then they will end up milking it for all it's worth. Thomas the Tank Engine has already been mentioned, and this is a classic example. My Son loves the original books and the early episodes - but dismisses most of the later stuff as boring - and he is the target market!

 

It has gone (in my opinion) from very good, original, fairly technically accurate stories to "let's introduce a new character in every episode". Of course, this ties in very well with the associated merchandising.

 

Edited to add Minder to the list. The original series with George Cole and Dennis Waterman were classics - even the later ones with Gary Webster were fair, but the new series they made recently...

[Horsetan]

Dare I add a small blue tank engine to this list of things that should have stopped after the first 52 books ?

 

I still have the original 26 books. That's where it should have stopped.

 

The Asterix series is still a great laugh (particularly appreciated the Latin puns and general playing with words) but for me the last two good ones were "Land of Black Gold" and the one about Caesar's son which were published in the mid 1980s.

[JohnDMJ]

I still have the original 26 books. That's where it should have stopped.

I'm inclined to agree! I have the compilation volume of all 26 books by the Rev. W. and have recently come into possession of the additional compilation of the 15 written by his son, Christopher, although I have not made good progress with the latter yet! Total, what I would call 'proper' Railway Engine books, i.e. by an Awdry, - 41!

The Asterix series is still a great laugh (particularly appreciated the Latin puns and general playing with words) but for me the last two good ones were "Land of Black Gold" and the one about Caesar's son which were published in the mid 1980s.

La Galere d'Obelix (translated to Asterix and Obelix all at Sea) was, I believe, the last official tome, being written solely by Albert Uderzo in 1996. Its press release was the main headline on French TV news that day!

[Guest Max Stafford]

For my money, they got it right with 'Life on Mars'which quit while it was ahead.

Although entertaining, 'Ashes to Ashes' was really just a spin-off '80s nostalgia show that lacked the grit and irony of the original two part series.

 

Dave.

[Colin]

My prize for "several series too many" has to go to Last Of The Summer Wine - Gawd did it drag on! Another case of the BBC milking a formula for all it's worth.

 

From the USA it has to be Friends - I know lots of people liked it but I just never understood why it was so popular - tedious and unfunny with that annoying canned laughter.

My daughter loved it and has the boxed DVD set........

[Russ (mines a pint)]

My prize for "several series too many" has to go to Last Of The Summer Wine - Gawd did it drag on! Another case of the BBC milking a formula for all it's worth.

Thats even worse isn't it because it's bad enough over-doing something with an original and funny line up, but the best characters (and the ones that made it funny) have long gone- also they've dumbed it down so much if you read the book you'll now what I mean!

 

The one thing that did leave me wanting more was Father Ted, but I guess that had more to the tragic death of the lead actor than a television company decision!

 

I only ever had the 'old' asterix books, still have 'em and my kids love em so cant compare to the new!

[Michael Delamar]

Dare I add a small blue tank engine to this list of things that should have stopped after the first 52 books ?

 

 

you beat me to it, however I was going to say the first 2 tv series, the rest where total rubbish

.

 

 

I also think The Simpsons has well run past its best. tried to watch the recent ones and they are garbage.

 

 

Mike

[Colin]

My favourite TV comedies have to be:

 

Monty Python (well, most of it anyway, it was VERY patchy, especially the programmes without Cleese)

Father Ted

Drop The Dead Donkey

Fawlty Towers

BlackAdder

The Office

 

 

...all of which only lasted a few series.

 

Dad's Army was OK when it started (I liked the spiv - Walker?) After the actor who played him died (James Beck?) I think it definitely lost something.

[Diesel Dayz]

How about that cheery soap Eastenders. Defo been going on far toooooooo long!

[Guest Dutch_Master]

Well, nobody yet mentioned the Disney stuff: Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck are also going on for ages. The US specifically extended copyright-protection time for their benefit (Walt has been dead for a while now, so his artwork would have become public domain years ago. Expect another extension sometime soon, when the current copyrights run out in a few years) Should they quit? Lettin'go of Snowwhite, Bambi, Mary Poppins, and other famous (and not so famous) classics?

 

Other comics I remember from growing up: Buck Danny (WWII and later Korea, USAF), Lucky Luke (Western 1880's), Suske & Wiske (Dutch names, dunno what their Anglo-Saxon names would be) and of course TinTin (or Kuifje in Dutch). More recent: Yoko Tsuno (present time, some SF in the shape of blue people from the planet of Vinea). I still read those though, occasionally (except for Buck Danny, they were at my Gran's. She moved last year into an elderly home)

 

PS: Disney made 2 versions of animations on classical music: Fantasia (ca 1940) and Fantasia 2000. Great introduction of classical music to youngsters! Both are out on DVD, released in 2000.

[Russ (mines a pint)]

Well, nobody yet mentioned the Disney stuff

 

Not sure if its Disney, but Tom & Jerry is timeless, as is Garfield!

[JohnDMJ]

Well, nobody yet mentioned the Disney stuff: Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck are also going on for ages. The US specifically extended copyright-protection time for their benefit (Walt has been dead for a while now, so his artwork would have become public domain years ago. Expect another extension sometime soon, when the current copyrights run out in a few years) Should they quit? Lettin'go of Snowwhite, Bambi, Mary Poppins, and other famous (and not so famous) classics?

 

AFAIK, they have not yet released Thumper - the sequel, Mary Poppins' Daughter or Dwarves and Sons and so are merely repeating for the next generation the same original works whereas works like the Railway Series (to give Thomas its proper name!), Last of the Summer Wine, Asterix, James Bond, etc. have been perpetuated beyond the original author's or cast's demise by secondary (or even tretiary) 'authors' seeking to milk the format whilst making up new stories / situations for the sake of commercial gain.

 

IMHO, Disney does not fall into this category and I am surprised that he has even been mentioned.

 

What also surprises me is thet, I believe, James Bond is only mentioned on this thread for the first time in this post and Dr Who has not yet been referenced.

[S.A.C Martin]

Dare I add a small blue tank engine to this list of things that should have stopped after the first 52 books ?

 

52 books?

 

41 sir! Christopher Awdry's "Thomas & Victoria", published in 2005 was the last (currently) title in The Railway Series.

 

Christopher has developed the ideas behind the books greatly from the good reverend's last title, "Tramway Engines". The realism contained within is certainly in the spirit of his father. I think the question is not when the books should stop, but when should the TV series stop.

 

There are, reputedly, around twenty unpublished volumes for The Railway Series, and, given they are written by an author who, like his father, is diligent in his research for storylines, and humorous when needs be, then we can safely say the books are still in good hands. But after Chistopher Awdry...would you want them to carry on then, if they were in the hands of someone other than a family member?