RMweb Gold 81C Posted February 5, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2014 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy M Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 The DD4's were always plain matt black. Lettering was white with a few examples adorned with cream in later BR days. Regards, Andy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel newling Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I believe the knowledgable of the GW Study Group have concluded that service stock in GW days was painted dark grey, like all other swindon wagons. Black was only adopted in BR days. It would be very difficult to determine from B&W photos. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy M Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 All I can add is that I have a colour print of a Cordon taken at Totnes in 1941 and it is black. I can't post due to copyright restrictions but it is close to the photographer and no doubting the colour. Regards, Andy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gee Vee Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 What are you intending to do re transfers for the number. I have built the David Geen kit and have not numbered cos I have been unable to find suitable transfers Suggestions welcome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidbr Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 There are pictures of DD4 and DD5 Cordons in 7mm here on the GWR Modelling site modelled in BR(W) days. Half way down the page. I know it is not safe to rely on modelling based on other models, but these are at least worth looking at. On this page of Warwickshire Raiways there is a colour picture taken in 1939. The Cordon looks grey, but black would do with a bit of fading and dirt, just as dark grey could look more like black. It's tricky. My understanding was that the Cordons were dark grey in GW days at least up to WW2. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castle Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 Hi 81C, I would like to see pictures of this particular kit as a friend wants a CORDON please! All the best, Castle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Hi 81C, I would like to see pictures of this particular kit as a friend wants a CORDON please! All the best, Castle DD4 from Wild Boar Models http://i.materialise.com/gallery/f9caeb77-e3a5-4ccb-930e-0101bad11f21 Mike Wiltshire Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium OnTheBranchline Posted February 9, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 9, 2014 After the coaches stopped be heated/lit by gas, what would the Cordons been used for? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 After the coaches stopped be heated/lit by gas, what would the Cordons been used for? Gas supply for Restuarant cars Mike Wiltshire Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 And remote station lighting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium figworthy Posted February 9, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 9, 2014 And remote station lighting. Did the stations have gas tanks (links to pictures appreciated), or did they use the wagons as tanks? Adrian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidbr Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I have asked around and it seems the Cordons were dark grey in GWR times which could be a very dark grey, weathering lighter. It was apparently not a standard colour, usually being made up in the paint shop so there was noticeable variation between vehicles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium OnTheBranchline Posted February 11, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 11, 2014 DD4 from Wild Boar Models http://i.materialise.com/gallery/f9caeb77-e3a5-4ccb-930e-0101bad11f21 Mike Wiltshire Just out of curiosity, what is needed to make it a real model? (other than transfers, couplings and paint obviously). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Just out of curiosity, what is needed to make it a real model? (other than transfers, couplings and paint obviously). Wheels!. I have only seen a completed model that was brought over to my line, but I was told it did not have too many parts. Having built the Jidenco/Falcon, it looks alot easier with assembled tanks etc. It is very light and will need some ballast weight wherever you can hide it. Mike Wiltshire Wild Boar have a thread on RMWeb http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/50852-3d-printed-warwell-now-includes-other-wagons-military-industrial/page-10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 I would have thought a fair bit of additional external piping too ? Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulldog Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Has anyone built this cordon kit?.At the bottom of the page. http://cspmodels.com/4mm_CoachKits.php Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Has anyone built this cordon kit?.At the bottom of the page. http://cspmodels.com/4mm_CoachKits.php It is a much improved revamp of the Falcon BRASS/jidenco kit. Under the previous owners, Roger Slade of CSP was the fronting and marketing Falcon brass and this included a major update of the original kit. Much of the pipework and fittings, as discussed above, were not supplied in the original Falcon brass kit. This newer version supplies all the extra unions and fittings required to produce a serious model of the DD4. Price wise it is more expensive but you do get a lot of improvements and extras for your money, certainly worth the extra money. Mike Wiltshire Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy M Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Has anyone built this cordon kit?.At the bottom of the page. http://cspmodels.com/4mm_CoachKits.php For anyone who is curious to know what is in the box of the CSP Models DD4 Kit. Like Mike has said it is a much improved version of the Falcon Brass offering (which from bitter experience was a bit of a challenge to say the least). As you can see I have not touched mine as yet, other than adding 14mm Maunsell wheels to the box. It currently sits at about No.37 on the to do list! Regards, Andy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulldog Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Certainly much improved ! been there before with Falcon Brass kits. Many Thanks for showing contents. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 Like Mike has said it is a much improved version of the Falcon Brass offering."Improved" you mean completely reworked? So the parts actually come off the fret and align in such a way as they can be soldered together. Should certainly be heavy enough with all that brass tube and casting. It would be nice to see one of these actually being built. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy M Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 I too would like to see one built if any member has made one. Here is my attempt at the original Falcon Brass kit, which I fought to cobble together in the early 90's. It was awful to build for the reasons Kenton has eluded to above and I have never been happy with it. I only show it to you now to prove one could be built! She will be sent to Swindon for scrapping once I construct the CSP kit shown earlier. Regards, Andy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 I have never been happy with it. I only show it to you now to prove one could be built! Bravo! That is good enough - though it is side on = perhaps its more photogenic side? One thing that can be said for the Falcon Brass kits was that the castings were generally the best parts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidbr Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 I made a start on my CSP kit yesterday. Little to report as yet but it is going to be an interesting build. I will be making some alterations as I will use Bill Bedford's W irons for P4. I started with the tanks to get the tedious bits out of the way. The white metal ends are the right diameter on the outside but smaller where they go in to the tube (you can see one in the first photo) so much care was needed to get them centred. To do this I used a small bench hook so that two edges, bottom and side, were flush before tacking the end on. Once happy I completed the soldering using C&L's 100 degree solder which I find very useful indeed. The red lump in the photos is moulding rubber which is very usefully insulates fingers against the heat of the soldering iron. Here it is just supporting the white metal end. I weighed the kit first which, with wheels, came to about 150g. I like mine to be heavy so I am also going to add weight in the bottom row which should bump it up to around 200g. I can get 9 or 10g of lead inside each tube. In the last photo, I put the tube on the right into a chuck and gently applied some wet and dry. Don't expect rapid progress here. I will put more up as I get it done. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidbr Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I have been preparing bits before getting to the proper assembly stage: All the tanks (receivers in GWR jargon) have been finished and the bottom row packed with lead, a very useful way of losing all the small off-cuts and scraps. I have made sure they are well wedged and don't rattle. The space available between the inside of the ends is 17mm long. The buffer beams and solebars are an improvement on the former Jidenco / Falcon method. The solebars use [ channel with an overlay inside; the buffer beams have overlays laminated on to the back of the channel - a plain piece, the main beam with full depth at the coupling hook and buffers, then further overlays for the buffers and coupling hook plate. The result is quite meaty. The buffer holes don't quite match so I have drilled them out 2mm to take the MJT sprung buffers that come with the kit. They will cover the hole so the discrepancy won't show. To fit the buffer beams to the solebars, the sides of the latter are cut back by about 1.5mm. The brake handles are from Model Railway Developments - £1.50 for a fret of 8 handles and so much better than white metal. These did not come with the kit. The vacuum cylinder and bits, supplied with the kit, come from the Frogmore Confederacy. A fret can be bought separately from Dart Castings (£1.95). The parts are building up. The suspension units are Bill Bedford's coach W irons (Eileen's Emporium, £8 for a fret of 6). The kit comes with cast white metal clasp brakes which I might yet use but in the meantime I have made up others from the BB etch. The floor has been marked out to take the suspension units which have centre lines considerately etched in to them so lining up should be straightforward. The valves in the top of the tanks were quite fiddly. I felt it better to fit the valves before making the wagon up so that it will be easier to line them up for the plumbing. I have drilled them out with a 0.4mm bit. I soldered them in to the ends by drilling a slightly oversized hole, tinning the prong on the valve with 100o solder and using my RSU to finish the job. I was careful to start on the minimum setting and work up to 1.5v but it worked and I am pleased with the result. The instructions that come with the kit cover several pages and although there are diagrams, I managed to get hold of a set for the 7mm WEP kit. The diagrams on these are very much better and make under frame detail and the plumbing that will connect the tanks much clearer and easier to construct. I am sorry I cannot reproduce them here but if you know a friendly 7mm modeller, get hold of a set. More anon. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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