"Caleta" semi-fictional Costa Brava in N

[Fat Controller]

It was the roundy airstream type back then, matching diesel loco on front.

This type:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalan_Talgo#/media/File:Bww_M._Las_Rosas,_353_005_%C2%BBVirgen_bien_Aparecida%C2%AB.jpg

 

I was quite impressed but also a little bewildered seeing a sleek, fast train racing along a single track along a beach!

 

Nice Youtube of a set running through France with a SNCF electric loco:

 

The full articulation of the complete set on single axles really stands out as something unusual.

 

Keith

They're up to a Mark Heaven-Knows-What by now. The early ones could only run at speed in one direction, so had to be turned on triangles before making their return journey; I think the more recent ones work equally well in both directions. Most recently, the Russians have bought some sleeping cars from them for services from Berlin. The company is now Finnish-owned, I think.

[Guest]

I was quite impressed but also a little bewildered seeing a sleek, fast train racing along a single track along a beach!

 

The full articulation of the complete set on single axles really stands out as something unusual.

 

That pretty much sums up what I want to recreate. If I can get the boards built (hopefully sooner, rather than later), the track laid and wired and maybe at least a couple of items of stock bought, the whole package can be shipped over to Spain and then it will be easier to maybe make a trip back to Calella for some photographic research. Admittedly, Calella is 600km further up the coast from where we're planning to move to but that's still a lot closer than Norfolk!

Scenically, things can be added at a later date. For example, what looks good as beach sand in N? Can I kit-bash some of those Kibri/Vollmer/Pola/Faller kits into something representative of the shops and apartment blocks that line the route? Etc etc etc...

With just a bi-directional single line and 4 storage loops at the back, a Talgo set, some kind of freight combo and maybe an EMU and a DMU should be ample. If I can get the points to switch and the trains to run alternately using some kind of shuttle module, it will be the sort of automated diorama that I'm after. I've noted that the articulated Talgo sets by Arnold are easy to come by but not so the loco. I think it may be out of production. Need to keep my ebay eyes peeled.

 

 

Pete, Dominik on ER's knows quite a bit about Spanish stuff, and has an H0 collection.

 

Ed, I may send Dom a PM at a later date but he's probably got enough on his plate with the new job. I shall teach myself some "Renfe" on Google for the moment.

[Bruce Depot]

I´m in the process of building a layout although mine will be UK stock with DCC on oo. Without doudt the temp difference is the main thing

to bear in mind when laying track, Lowest I have recorded is 10c, max 48c. So good gaps required!

 

cheers

Keith

[br2975]

Pete,

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If you are looking to move out to Spain lock, stock and barrel then building your boards in advance, and then shipping them out with the rest of your goods and furnishings is a pretty good idea.

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Decent timber suitable for building baseboards isn't readily accessible in Spain - at least not of the type, quality and sizes we would normally use e.g. ply.

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There was once a reasonable source close to us, "Don Bricolage" but they went through the hoop.

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The local ferreteria doesn't stock timber.

 

However, there is the "Leroy Merlin" chain with warehouses across Spain - the nearest to us is near La Condomina Nueva, Murcia; a 40-50mins drive. 

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As we travel back and forth several times a year, I drew up plans for the baseboards for a  small minimum space shunting plank using ply and 1" x 1" glueblocks - the cutting list allowed the parts to fit inside hand luggage, so the components coud be prepared here in the U.K. and taken out by plane. Of course larger components could be fitted inside check-in luggage.

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There's little freight now in/around Alicante, and the Costa's Calida, Almeria and Del Sol as you head south.

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I caught an intermodal train at Alicante Maritime several years ago, and several LNG workings heading to and from Escombreras (Cartagena) - apart from that it's all passenger, and predominantly units.

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There may be some freight in Valencia.

 

In the mid 80s we took the children to Calella, staying in a hotel overlooking the line and the beach-  and my boy woke me excitedly "dad, dad, a Beyer Garratt just went past !"

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I had to apologise later for doubting his sanity, when we found the black and red Babcock & Wilcox beast simmering under the overall roof at Barcelona Termino/La Francia.

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Brian R

[McGomez]

Hi Pete.

 

Good to hear you are still going to make the move. Make sure you bring a jumper as it´s a bit nippy at the moment.

 

Brian R sums up the Spanish ply situation well. I bought some of mine from Leroy Merlin and it aint cheap.

Bring it over in the van.

 

The freight situation is still pretty poor in these parts. The Butano trains still run 3 times a week in winter and twice a week in summer usually. There is Bioetanol from Escombreras ocasionally and a once or sometimes twice a week Frutero from Murcia Cargas (the small yard just to the west of Murcia) to the port of Bilbao. This conveys reefers that are ferried to the north of europe (don´t know where?).

The high speed line extension to Murcia and beyond is ramping up. I went to Alicante last week and the catenary posts are up and the sleepers have been deposited on site although still on pallets. The class 58s had been moved once again but still within the maintenance site at Monforte so should be taking the stockpiled rail out soon.

 

With regards the locos used to pull the Talgo stock, here are the 3 liveries that they wore and still on sale at a shop I use quite often although it is in Santander. Next day service via courier and up to date stock levels make them my preferred shop at the mo.. (No connection to them, just good service.)

 

http://www.eltallerdelmodelista.com/locomotora-%C3%A2%C2%80%C2%9Cvirgen-fatima%C3%A2%C2%80%C2%9D-renfe-arnold-hn2165-p-9719.html

These ran with the red/silver stock that is known as Talgo III. There were previous versions that have recently been released in HO by Electrotren.

 

http://www.eltallerdelmodelista.com/locomotora-%C3%A2%C2%80%C2%9Cvirgen-aranzazu%C3%A2%C2%80%C2%9D-renfe-arnold-hn2166-p-16005.html

This is the class 354 and ran with the Talgo IV coaches also known as the Talgo Pendular.

 

http://www.eltallerdelmodelista.com/locomotora-%C3%A2%C2%80%C2%9Cvirgen-guadalupe%C3%A2%C2%80%C2%9D-renfe-arnold-hn2072-p-10648.html

This is the last colour scheme these locos had and is known as Grandes Lineas. These locos were phased out in 2009/10 IIRC.

 

The latest version of the Talgo coaches is version VI I believe.

 

There is a shop in Murcia (Hobby) that sells train stuff. Quite a good stock of ballast, flocks, paints etc.

Cartagena has a couple of shops, Stuka (mainly planes unsurprisingly) and Tiempo Libre which is a bit of an aladins cave although the guy tends to sell more boats than trains.

 

Hope that helps a bit.

 

Andy.

[Bruce Depot]

Marine ply seems the best if you can get it, I used 2cm thick and the wood yard cut it to size no problem.

cheers

Keith

[Guest]

Lowest I have recorded is 10c, max 48c. So good gaps required!

 

Thanks for the reminder! I confess I hadn't given any thought to temperature variation.

 

If you are looking to move out to Spain lock, stock and barrel then building your boards in advance, and then shipping them out with the rest of your goods and furnishings is a pretty good idea.

 

Decent timber suitable for building baseboards isn't readily accessible in Spain - at least not of the type, quality and sizes we would normally use e.g. ply.

 

The local ferreteria doesn't stock timber.

 

Thanks Brian. When living in Fuerteventura, we struggled to find the kind of timber supplies I was used to back in the UK. Ferreterias didn't stock it in any great quantity. For example, I needed to build a large mutli-tier deck at a rental property and ended up on some industrial estate in Puerto del Rosario where I managed to source some decent tongue and groove - not ideal though and horrendously expensive, but the best I could do and nothing like what I was used to. The framework will definitely be built here and shipped.

[Guest]

Hi Pete.

 

Good to hear you are still going to make the move. Make sure you bring a jumper as it´s a bit nippy at the moment.

 

Brian R sums up the Spanish ply situation well. I bought some of mine from Leroy Merlin and it aint cheap.

Bring it over in the van.

 

Hi Andy. Good to hear from you! Nippy? In July? You are kidding??? Move's off...

Yup, the move is still going ahead. Thanks for all the info, that's really useful. Cheers, Pete.

[melmerby]

 Most recently, the Russians have bought some sleeping cars from them for services from Berlin. The company is now Finnish-owned, I think.

Useful having movable wheelsets.

I assume they can make them lock to Russian gauge as well as Iberian & Standard?

 

Keith

[Fat Controller]

Useful having movable wheelsets.

I assume they can make them lock to Russian gauge as well as Iberian & Standard?

 

Keith

I think they can make them move to whatever gauge they need to- my understanding is that there is no axle joining the wheels, the individual wheels being at the bottom of the legs of a horizontal A-shaped structure. Here's a link to their web-site:-

http://www.talgo.com/index.php/en/home.php

[br2975]

A few photos to whet your appetite Pete..............

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RENFE 333.354 approaches Balsicas with a trainload of 'butano' tanks from Excombreras, 16th. March 2007.

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RENFE 333.342 awaits departure from the now demolished gas facility at Alicante Altet with empties for Escombreras, January 2006.

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RENFE 333.407 departs Balsicas on the last leg of its journey to Cartagena

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RENFE 333.101 arrives at Lorca with the ECS for a 'talgo' service to either Valencia or Barca (I can't remember !!) August 2005.

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A Talgo 'Altaria' set stabled alongside the station at Cartagena.

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My 1980s shots would need scanning, if I could find them !

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Brian R

[Guest]

Brilliant stuff Brian... thanks very much for that. Inspirational indeed, even little details like the concrete culvert in the second shot. This is probably a daft question but as someone who knows little about the Spanish prototype... is there any particular reason that the Talgo sets are rather short? I don't mean in length, but height.

[McGomez]

Brilliant stuff Brian... thanks very much for that. Inspirational indeed, even little details like the concrete culvert in the second shot. This is probably a daft question but as someone who knows little about the Spanish prototype... is there any particular reason that the Talgo sets are rather short? I don't mean in length, but height.

The Spanish aren´t very tall?

[Guest]

 

...I hadn't thought of that!

[br2975]

Talgo sets in and around Barcelona Termino circa 1984.

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Coming up, Callela circa 1984.

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Brian R

[McGomez]

...I hadn't thought of that!

I think it is to do with the fact that just having 1 axle (ie. not a bogie) reduces the height. The low centre of gravity was what Mr Goicoechea of talGo fame was trying to acheive to produce a smoother ride.

 

Sombody mentioned he fact that the 1st generation Talgos had to be turned on a triangle. That I can´t confirm. But the Talgo 3 sets had seats that were turned to face the direction of travel. Don´t know if the newer sets do that?

[McGomez]

Talgo sets in and around Barcelona Termino circa 1984.

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Coming up, Callela circa 1984.

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Brian R

Nice images Brian.

Put more up if you´ve got them.

[br2975]

Sant Pol de Mar - circa 1984.

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Shades of the former LNWR line into Swansea Victoria - not !

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Brian R

[Northroader]

You could do worse than send your little yellow bloke to have a sniff around Sant Pol de Mar, just down the line. there's an old station building, nice church and river crossing to the west, tunnel with ruins of a castle to the east, and fishing boats drawn up on the beach bang in front of the station. With a bit of what the yanks call selective compression, you've got a nice setting to look at in the front of your oval. What's not to like? On the subject of trains, this line is a coastal loop with the main line running parallel inland, but the occasional mainline train was routed round the coast, so you could run what you like,besides emus. One evening I was out at Arenys sipping my brandy- oh, the cost of brandy in Spain, that's why you're going ain't it? And an overnight Barcelona France heavyweight express complete with wagon lits sleeper came through.

[br2975]

One evening I was out at Arenys sipping my brandy- oh, the cost of brandy in Spain, that's why you're going ain't it? And an overnight Barcelona France heavyweight express complete with wagon lits sleeper came through.

Probably the same evening I was 'socialising' in Calella when the same working passed - perhaps it was a common diversion ?

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Brian R

[br2975]

I´m in the process of building a layout although mine will be UK stock with DCC on oo. Without doudt the temp difference is the main thing

to bear in mind when laying track, Lowest I have recorded is 10c, max 48c. So good gaps required!

 

My ex-pat neighbours from the Costa Calida are home in the U.K. this week, and tell me the temperatures at the moment are 40'C daily, last week mid-afternoon one day it reached 46'C and mid-week this week, it is anticipated that at 02:00hrs. it will reach 91% humidity. 

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Good quality ply required ?

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Brian R

[Stubby47]

I'm guessing you can buy internal doors in Spain ? They should be acclimatised and warp free.

 

Following this thread as my parents lived for a few years in Campello; we had to cross the line to get to the beach.

[Guest]

Thanks Stubby. Was about to reply when I accidentally deleted my post above yours about the Talgos and the bi-fold doors warping! Duh... Need to see if I can retrieve the post or I'll type it out again. Gonna be one of those days...

[Guest]

"A moderator deleted a post of yours" says my notifications tab... No he didn't, I did 'cos I'm daft.

Here we go again... this post should have appeared just above Stubby's until I stupidly deleted it...

 

Thanks to all for the pics, advice and info... truly appreciated especially in light of the fact that my knowledge of the prototype is a little limited!

Particularly fascinated by the Talgos. The low height of the stock is explained by the fact that the carriage floor sits within the wheelsets and the ride comfort being improved by the low centre of gravity certainly makes sense. Pic below shows the corridor connection between carriages... fascinating stuff!

 

http://railfaneurope.net/pix/es/car/Talgo-200/white-blue/281-Talgo_200.jpg

 

I took another look at the bi-fold doors that inspired the idea of having a baseboard hinged along the length. These weren't cheap doors and have remained in their shrink wrap since purchase (about 4 years). One of them has bowed slightly. The two panels are joined by three hinges are are folded in the packaging. There's a tiny gap between panels at the top and bottom hinges, just enough to slide a couple of sheets of paper into the gap. The gap at the centre hinge, however, has opened up to about 0.5cm and has slightly deformed the hinge. With that in mind and the temperature/humidity variations in Spain, I'm now acutely aware of the need to build the boards to the absolute best of my ability using quality materials. I even wonder if ply is the best thing to use as it will still expand and shrink slightly.

[Guest]

I'm guessing you can buy internal doors in Spain ? They should be acclimatised and warp free.

 

I was never actually planning to use a bi-fold door for the baseboard... I just got that "lightbulb" flash of inspiration when looking at them one day... 6'6" x 2'6" is bang on for the kind of baseboard size I had in mind though.