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14xx Finescale Replacement Chassis

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As there's nothing better than jumping off the deep end, I thought my first brass kit building effort should be the 14xx replacement chassis having won the loco on Ebay. I'll hopefully take a few photographs to show how things go, but I've a couple of questions before I start as there don't seem to be any specific instructions for this loco type.

 

1 - I'm assuming the 'right way up' for the fret is to have the writing upwards.

2 - Having cut out the chassis jig, correct folding is upwards [i.e. lifting edges off the table].

3 - How do the etches for the trailing wheel fold and fix?

4 - Having solved the trailing wheel problem and not having as yet stripped the body from the existing chassis, do I need to get cast axle box/springs as there's nothing apparent on the etch?

5 - If the answer to 4 is yes, what part number do I need to order.

 

Apologies for possibly being extremely dense, and advance thanks for answers.

 

Cheers,

 

Paul

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What chassis kit are you talking about and in what scale?

 

Gordon A

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What chassis kit are you talking about and in what scale?

 

Gordon A

N gauge...since it's in the 2mm finescale sub-forum. Edited by MGR Hooper!

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As there's nothing better than jumping off the deep end, I thought my first brass kit building effort should be the 14xx replacement chassis having won the loco on Ebay. I'll hopefully take a few photographs to show how things go, but I've a couple of questions before I start as there don't seem to be any specific instructions for this loco type.

 

1 - I'm assuming the 'right way up' for the fret is to have the writing upwards.

2 - Having cut out the chassis jig, correct folding is upwards [i.e. lifting edges off the table].

3 - How do the etches for the trailing wheel fold and fix?

4 - Having solved the trailing wheel problem and not having as yet stripped the body from the existing chassis, do I need to get cast axle box/springs as there's nothing apparent on the etch?

5 - If the answer to 4 is yes, what part number do I need to order.

 

Apologies for possibly being extremely dense, and advance thanks for answers.

 

Cheers,

 

Paul

Hi Paul,

 

If you click on the heading in the Shop listing for these etched chassis (in blue) you'll get up a list of instructions covering the 14XX, and including drawings and assembly instructions. These will hopefully answer many of your queries.

 

Nig H

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N gauge...since it's in the 2mm finescale sub-forum.

 

Fair comment.

 

Gordon A

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N gauge...since it's in the 2mm finescale sub-forum.

Is the chassis made to 2mm finescale standards i.e.2mm/ft scale 1:152 or N scale I.e. 2.0625mm/ft 1:148?

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The scale of the chassis is 1/148 to match the locomotive body and is to 2mm fine scale wheel standards to run on 2mm fine scale track.

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Ooooh, didn't mean to cause ructions!

 

Nig H - I did look briefly at these and have looked again. Together with Chris's blog hopefully the light is at the end of the tunnel!

Chris - Will read your blog with interest.

 

Crossing fingers a start might be made next week - watch this space.....

 

Paul

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I don't think you caused any ructions. I suspect that what was meant is the chassis wheelbase is to N gauge to suit the body but construction is to 2mm timescale standards, ie split frame construction, each side of chassis electrically isolated from the other.

Ian

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........ what was meant is the chassis wheelbase is to N gauge to suit the body but construction is to 2mm timescale standards, ........

Is there not a conflict here in terminology, the gauge is 'N', 9mm, the wheelbase will be whatever it is, but the same, assuming 'N gauge' and 1:148 scale are one and the same (2mm : 1ft), it's the gauge that varies 9mm - 9.42mm, not the scale ratio - agreed the wheelbase will be slightly less at 1:152 scale.

However all E.& O.E. 

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Is the chassis made to 2mm finescale standards i.e.2mm/ft scale 1:152 or N scale I.e. 2.0625mm/ft 1:148?

You'd have to ask the person who started this thread. I was only replying to a fellow forum member who was confused about the scale, so was I to begin with.

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2 - Having cut out the chassis jig, correct folding is upwards [i.e. lifting edges off the table].

 

 

 

In etched kit construction, the fold line will be on the inside of the fold, provided the fold is of the normal 90 degree sort.

 

In the case of a 180 degree fold where an item folds completely back on itself, for example the coupling rods in this kit, then the fold line will be on the outside of the fold.

 

Once you have folded parts up, it often becomes more obvious how they fit. For example on those parts for the trailing axle.

 

Chris

Edited by Chris Higgs

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You'd have to ask the person who started this thread. I was only replying to a fellow forum member who was confused about the scale, so was I to begin with.

 

Apologies, my excuse is that I was only ever dragged up knowing "N" gauge and it's a bit like a (H)hoover or (S)Sellotape the name sticks. Bad Dobbie will try to call it 2mm in future!

 

Cheers,

 

Paul

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In etched kit construction, the fold line will be on the inside of the fold, provided the fold is of the normal 90 degree sort.

 

In the case of a 180 degree fold where an item folds completely back on itself, for example the coupling rods in this kit, then the fold line will be on the outside of the fold.

 

Once you have folded parts up, it often becomes more obvious how they fit. For example on those parts for the trailing axle.

 

Chris

 

Chris,

 

Many thanks for the information, will save me the embarrassment of failure opening the box! Hoping to cut metal and get the big hammer out this week and will post my efforts.

 

Cheers,

 

Paul

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Well, I had a spare hour this morning and so a start has been made!

 

First up was the chassis jig, which was removed from fret and cleaned with file. I then surprised myself that the sides were easily folded to shape by finger rather than tool, and then fingers used to hold the joints whilst soldering. Lesson one now under belt - heat does like to travel and ends of fingers did get a little warm  :senile:I must admit though for a first serious soldering effort that all went well (one small step forward!)

 

post-21323-0-58948100-1541341739_thumb.jpg

 

Second up the frames (apologies for the frames being a little fuzzy in the photograph. Again, duly released from fret and cleaned up. Discovered 0.3mm drills are very small and the pin drill I bought is too big to hold! Fingers to the rescue once again to twiddle the drill and check the holes for brakes and Simpson springs. Logical next step to fix the wheel & gear bushes, and discovered a new game - bush tiddlywinks! Oh my days! It was easy to get the bushes to sit in the frame holes but go near them with the soldering iron (even when holding with tweezers!) and p-yoing off to the carpet monster it would go!

 

End result is three bushes attached with enough solder to sink the Bismark I fear (my excuse is that I've tinned the frame ready for a spacer - no, I didn't think so  :banghead:

As a result my soldering skills have taken the obligatory two steps back and I may have to ponder how to stop tiddlywinks from becoming popular.

 

More as and when it happens

 

Paul

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Rather than try fitting the bearing into the frame, with the frame flat on the work surface, fit the frame over the bearing with the latter sitting wide side down on the surface. That way the frame will hold the bearing secure while you apply the soldering iron to the front surface.

 

Jim

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Rather than try fitting the bearing into the frame, with the frame flat on the work surface, fit the frame over the bearing with the latter sitting wide side down on the surface. That way the frame will hold the bearing secure while you apply the soldering iron to the front surface.

 

Jim

 

With many thanks to Jim for spotting the obvious solution (really must think harder!!!), managed to grab an hour today to get bushed! Not sure on building etiquette but with use of pliers and pointy objects to hold in place got gearbox folded and soldered.

 

post-21323-0-72847200-1541694736_thumb.jpg

 

As expected, the bushes needed attention from a broach to ensure clearance for axles. This was fun as it proved my fallable soldering when two bushes detached themselves on the broach (whoops!). Quick re-soldering and then off to the sink for a wash and rub down. Back in the box to steal myself for joining frames together - trepidation awaits!

 

Paul

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Paul,

When fitting the PCB spacers, try not to linger too long with the iron.  I did and the copper de-laminated itself resulting in my having to strip down the chassis and rebuild it (after I had actually got a nicely running chassis!)

 

In actual fact I rebuilt my 57xx chassis 3 times in all, but the first of those rebuilds was down to the fact that despite using the chassis assembly jig I'd managed to assemble the chassis too wide so I couldn't actually close the wheel sets together to get the correct back-to-back!

 

Ian

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Paul,

When fitting the PCB spacers, try not to linger too long with the iron.  I did and the copper de-laminated itself resulting in my having to strip down the chassis and rebuild it (after I had actually got a nicely running chassis!)

 

In actual fact I rebuilt my 57xx chassis 3 times in all, but the first of those rebuilds was down to the fact that despite using the chassis assembly jig I'd managed to assemble the chassis too wide so I couldn't actually close the wheel sets together to get the correct back-to-back!

 

Ian

 

I have some PCB spacer strip both from from many years ago, and the currently supplied stuff. Sad to say, the latest stock is not a patch on the original, which was very difficult to get it to delaminate.

 

Chris 

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Me again! Had a little time spare this morning and thought about tackling the frame spacers and (hopefully) successfully joining said frames together. Got the remaining sections of frame folded to required shape and sat the two halves into the jig and have become slightly baffled, which isn't too difficult!

 

post-21323-0-15202000-1542280214_thumb.jpg

 

According to the instructions, the correct PCB frame spacer material should be 6.4mm, but this size seems to pull the ends of the frame together. I've measured the internal gap between frames and it's 7mm and 7mm PCB material fits comfortably and doesn't appear to bulge the frames.

 

On the basis that I'd really like to assemble the chassis in one go (am I mad!) could I ask the assembled throng for their opinion on which is the correct size PCB material

 

Ta in advance.

 

Paul

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Me again! Had a little time spare this morning and thought about tackling the frame spacers and (hopefully) successfully joining said frames together. Got the remaining sections of frame folded to required shape and sat the two halves into the jig and have become slightly baffled, which isn't too difficult!

 

attachicon.gif14xx_3.jpg

 

According to the instructions, the correct PCB frame spacer material should be 6.4mm, but this size seems to pull the ends of the frame together. I've measured the internal gap between frames and it's 7mm and 7mm PCB material fits comfortably and doesn't appear to bulge the frames.

 

On the basis that I'd really like to assemble the chassis in one go (am I mad!) could I ask the assembled throng for their opinion on which is the correct size PCB material

 

Ta in advance.

 

Paul

 

For single layer etched frames, 7mm PCB is the usual choice. I think some of Chris's later chassis etches use double thickness frames (basically an extra 0.25mm later on the inside of each frame), and this is perhaps why 6.4mm PCB is mentioned in the instructions.

 

Andy

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For single layer etched frames, 7mm PCB is the usual choice. I think some of Chris's later chassis etches use double thickness frames (basically an extra 0.25mm later on the inside of each frame), and this is perhaps why 6.4mm PCB is mentioned in the instructions.

 

Andy

 

Ah, then might I risk the wrath of Chris by suggesting an error in section 6 of the generic instructions!

 

Just read it again to be certain and it says if building a loco with strengthening frames added 6mm PCB is required otherwise the 6.4mm PCB is used.

 

Many thanks for pointing out what is probably obvious to those with more experience than I. Roll on the next free time to see how easily I can melt PCB!

 

Cheers,

 

Paul

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Ah, then might I risk the wrath of Chris by suggesting an error in section 6 of the generic instructions!

 

Just read it again to be certain and it says if building a loco with strengthening frames added 6mm PCB is required otherwise the 6.4mm PCB is used.

 

Many thanks for pointing out what is probably obvious to those with more experience than I. Roll on the next free time to see how easily I can melt PCB!

 

Cheers,

 

Paul

Hi Paul

 

I'm in a similar situation to yourself - part way through building this chassis kit.

 

I've progressed a bit further and have got the chassis rolling quite nicely with the coupling rods temporarily held in place - next I need to add the motor.

 

I'm also a bit of a beginner as far as loco chassis are concerned and I remember a couple of weeks ago I had the same problem as you with the width of the pcb.  I got round it by adding small pieces of spare etch to the inside of the frames where the spacers go - a bit fiddly but it seemed to work - it saved having to order a different width of pcb and wait for it to be mailed to Australia.

 

If you want to exchange emails directly as we progress with this kit, please feel free to email me directly (or via this topic).

 

Best wishes

 

John

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Hi Everyone

 

I hope Paul won't mind me high jacking his thread but since we are both building this chassis kit it seems to make sense to share questions and problems.

 

When I wrote the last post, I thought everything was going smoothly but after this morning I'm seriously beginning to doubt my sanity.

 

I fitted the worm and motor but when adding power the running was really noisy and the worm seemed to be vibrating badly, sort of moving backwards and forwards.

 

I looked at the skew cut gear and eventually compared it to the ones I had used on a couple of David Eveleigh 45xx chassis.  Looking at it edge on, the teeth angle down from top left to bottom right (whichever way round or whichever way up you look at the chassis, it will always be the same).  Looking at the other gears I  had used, they are all angled down from top right to bottom left.

 

The gear came from set 3-364.  Is it possible that a batch has been received that are cut sort of back to front - or as I mentioned earlier, am I going insane?

 

Thanks

 

John

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