The expense of removing disused railway infrastructure

[Foden]

Out of curiosity, where a piece of disused railway infrastructure (in my example a bridge) is to be removed, is it Network Rail that cover the cost of this, or the relevant council, or highways agency?

 

There's a bridge in Nuneaton over the A47 Old Hinckley road, that is disused, having once carried the B'Ham to P'Bro freight avoiding line around Nuneaton. It's a common occurrence that this bridge is hit by oversized lorries trying to enter the nearby industrial estate, causing traffic chaos entering and exiting Nuneaton from the Hinckley direction, and the resulting traffic congestion on all other routes.

 

I'm not sure when the last train passed over this bridge, or when the track was lifted (maybe someone could shed some light?) but my guess is it's been 40+ years. Also the other bridge over Weddington road was removed some time ago, and ofcourse the bridge that took the freight avoiding line over the WCML has been replaced to accommodate the BTPL flyover into Nuneaton station, and associated re-development of the station and new platforms. Given all this, it's fair to say you'd put all your money on the fact it's never going to have a purpose again.

 

Given it's a common candidate to get hit by oversized vehicles, and is serving no purpose with no real historic value either, you'd think it'd be on the radar to be removed.

 

Who would pay for this? Because I'm guessing that cost is the only real reason it hasn't happened in the previous few decades as road traffic has increased, and incidents increased.

[keefer]

There's an old road bridge in NE Scotland in the news at the moment

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-45746690

 

Would seem to be the council's responsibility, with extra financial penalty should the railway need to be closed before demolition. So it'll cost them to do it, but potentially cost them even more if they don't.

 

It's on the ECML just north of Laurencekirk

https://goo.gl/maps/aoZnFcq7bP42

[St. Simon]

Hi,

 

If it is been redundent for 40+ years, it depends on whether the ownership transferred to Network Rail or was kept with BRB (so it might be owned by whoever controlled the sell off).

 

I would suspect that it might be sold to the council for them to knock it down possibly.

 

Simon

[iands]

Given the length of time this bridge has been out of use, it might not now be in "railway" ownership. It does depend if the route that this bridge once served is still available intact, whereby it could be opened once again if there was a business case for it. If the former land that the trackbed once used has been sold off for "redevelopment" thus making a reopening of the route highly unlikely, the bridge might now be the responsibility of the local council. Either way, neither the council or NR will want to spend money on removing it if it is cheaper to leave it in situ incurring minimal "maintenance" costs for the foreseeable future.

[brack]

If it frequently gets hit by HGV drivers unable to judge the relative dimensions of the vehicle they're driving and their surroundings (one might have considered this an important skill for such a profession) then I'd suggest you just wait until the next observant, highly competent chap drives into it, get a tame expert to assess that its now so damaged it needs dismantling, and claim it off said drivers insurance.

[Glorious NSE]

Given all this, it's fair to say you'd put all your money on the fact it's never going to have a purpose again.

 

 

I wouldn't put any money on that - given the location, the changes of the last few years and the potential for further change in the future....

[newbryford]

Some bridges are kept in place to maintain a right of way should the line ever be re-opened.

 

One disused bridge near where I live was damaged by a digger jib on a low loader a bout 10 years ago.

It had to be replaced despite the line being a quarry access that hadn't seen a train in over 50 years or more...…

 

https://goo.gl/maps/S9zqnkMQUi92

 

(The disjointed girder is a google image thing)

 

Cheers,

Mick

Edited December 2, 2018 by newbryford

[Butler Henderson]

It certainly was not closed 40+ years ago as I travelled along a few times in the 1980s i.e.on 6 Oct 1984 on  a Alfreton-Plymouth "Merrymaker". A number of Summer Saturday services used it as well running non-stop (allegedly) between Leicester and Birmingham New Street.

[Foden]

Thanks for the replies guys, I'm quite surprised that it was used in the 80s, I'd been told from family who'd lived in the area it was late 70s that it would have last been used.

 

Ofcourse you'd never say never, But I'd be amazed if it was ever to be used again. One bridge has already been removed, and even with the higher usage of intermodal freight on the line, I'd struggle to see any merit to the short section being reinstated.

 

I'd like to add, I have no axe to grind over whether this particular bridge is, or is not in existence, should the post have come across that way.

[david.hill64]

IIRC one of the last bits of BR to remain - if not the last part - was the group that managed out of use assets such as still extant bridges. I don't know who retains ownership now.

[Zomboid]

BRB Residual went to Highways England, I believe. Even the stuff in Scotland.

[Foden]

Would it be safe to assume that if it had a NR bridge identification plate on, it was still under NR ownership?

[dagrizz]

I was walking the MR Rugby-Leicester route in 2011 and noticed that several old bridges had a painted ID on them, This one was just south of the M6.

 

 

The bridge carried a farm track.

 

 

The trackbed had been almost completely filled in the years since closure (the line closed in the early 1960's).

 

 

So, in 2011 at least, it seemed that BRB was still responsible for old bridges that were basically just sitting in fields.

 

Graham 

 

 

 

[Rugd1022]

Nice photos Graham, thanks for sharing those - is there anything left of the stations on the line...? It's one of the lesser covered branches from Rugby, at least photographically, not surprising as it closed in 1962. If it had been left in place as a diversionary / freight only route it would be very useful today. When my great uncle Harry wrote his book 'Country Station Life' he included just one photo taken at Ullesthorpe, it's the only one I've ever seen.

Edited December 3, 2018 by Rugd1022

[Glorious NSE]

Ofcourse you'd never say never, But I'd be amazed if it was ever to be used again. One bridge has already been removed, and even with the higher usage of intermodal freight on the line, I'd struggle to see any merit to the short section being reinstated.

 

One reasonably likely future scenario is that all of the steadily increasing number of trains from Felixstowe headed to the Midlands and North West have to travel via the Leicester route, rather than many running via London as at present - due to pressure on paths in London both from passenger traffic growth and freight traffic from London Gateway and other Thamesside locations pushing it out - that would drastically increase the number of intermodals having to use the route.

 

One scenario might be - At present, freight coming southbound on the WCML heading towards Leicester would seem to have to cross the Leicester-Birmingham track on the level, but there is no place to hold that train other than the slow line if it can't cross over immediately.

 

A chord from the WCML to the old avoiding line would allow a place for a freight to stand clear of the WCML awaiting a path, and two points would allow it to also be used as an Eastbound goods loop (or even avoiding line, as the line speed may well be capable of faster running than the current rather tight S-curve and grade down to the platforms.

 

If you added a third track over the WCML then that would allow you to get rid of all the wrong line running needed to access the connection to the WCML northbound.

 

Yes, you'd need to build at least one new bridge, and yes that is a major investment, but I'd argue that level of capacity upgrade is not completely out of line with works already completed / underway / planned elsewhere on this axis.

 

 

 

 

[Mike Storey]

One reasonably likely future scenario is that all of the steadily increasing number of trains from Felixstowe headed to the Midlands and North West have to travel via the Leicester route, rather than many running via London as at present - due to pressure on paths in London both from passenger traffic growth and freight traffic from London Gateway and other Thamesside locations pushing it out - that would drastically increase the number of intermodals having to use the route.

 

One scenario might be - At present, freight coming southbound on the WCML heading towards Leicester would seem to have to cross the Leicester-Birmingham track on the level, but there is no place to hold that train other than the slow line if it can't cross over immediately.

 

A chord from the WCML to the old avoiding line would allow a place for a freight to stand clear of the WCML awaiting a path, and two points would allow it to also be used as an Eastbound goods loop (or even avoiding line, as the line speed may well be capable of faster running than the current rather tight S-curve and grade down to the platforms.

 

If you added a third track over the WCML then that would allow you to get rid of all the wrong line running needed to access the connection to the WCML northbound.

 

Yes, you'd need to build at least one new bridge, and yes that is a major investment, but I'd argue that level of capacity upgrade is not completely out of line with works already completed / underway / planned elsewhere on this axis.

 

 

 

 

 

Some truth in that, but way, way off into the future. With the F2N programme having been slowed right down, the increase in capacity (and consequent demand) that might create that conflict on a regular basis, has to await (at the very least):

 

Ely-Soham doubling and re-signalling

Werrington junction underpass (now in progress)

Leicester re-signalling and capacity scheme

W12 re-gauging Syston - Nuneaton

 

These schemes (apart from Werrington) are slated for CP6, but do not yet have finally confirmed funding or programmes (unlike the next phase of Felixstowe branch doubling), although there is a major assumption that they will go ahead (at substantially revised prices). Until they are done, there is little opportunity for extra freights to be diverted away from the NLL, certainly not a step change, as yet.

 

The forward plan (over 15 years) from the FNPO Strategic Plan (which has replaced the Freight RUS), identifies many more capacity upgrades needed to cater for demand, including more loops and junction improvements, especially for the new Hinckley development, but I cannot see a provision for that which you suggest. But that is not to suggest it might not be needed one day.

 

https://cdn.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/FNPO-Route-Strategic-Plan.pdf

[dagrizz]

Nice photos Graham, thanks for sharing those - is there anything left of the stations on the line...? It's one of the lesser covered branches from Rugby, at least photographically, not surprising as it closed in 1962. If it had been left in place as a diversionary / freight only route it would be very useful today. When my great uncle Harry wrote his book 'Country Station Life' he included just one photo taken at Ullesthorpe, it's the only one I've ever seen.

 

Nige, to avoid going too far OT, I've started a new topic in the disused railways section with a couple of Ullesthorpe photos from 2011.

 

Graham 

[Caledonian]

I was walking the MR Rugby-Leicester route in 2011 and noticed that several old bridges had a painted ID on them, This one was just south of the M6.

 

rugM6 024.jpg

 

The bridge carried a farm track.

 

 

 

So, in 2011 at least, it seemed that BRB was still responsible for old bridges that were basically just sitting in fields.

 

Graham 

 

Interesting. I came across one of these the other day in Tynemouth - also looking relatively freshly painted. The bridge carries a road over a former line connecting the station with a quite separate coal yard [the local railway history is complicated] which was lifted at least 40 years ago.

[Davexoc]

BRB Residual went to Highways England, I believe. Even the stuff in Scotland.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/brb-residuary-ltd-has-been-abolished

 

This explains what went to where in 2013, the Burdensome Estate became the Highways Agency Historical Railways Estate.

 

Dave

[Butler Henderson]

I understand that the closure is given as 1992 by  H M Cobb in The Railways of Great Britain : a Historical Atlas (Ian Allan 2003) which is supported by this photo inside  Abbey Junction signal box which is stated as closing in Feb 1992

https://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/mrna1098.htm

[Glorious NSE]

Some truth in that, but way, way off into the future.

 

Agreed - my point is solely that this is a bit of alignment that does have some future potential for use, unlike many other closed routes.

[Foden]

Done a little research on this, and it transpires that the bridge is earmarked for demolition as part of the A47 improvement scheme, although a date not set.

 

Link is from October last year, beware of the usual 'Telegraph Spam' if opening https://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/local-news/lorry-battered-bridge-finally-bulldozed-13783806

 

It mentions that the DfT will put up £2.8m for the scheme, but doesn't mention if this covers the cost of removal of the aforementioned bridge.