RMweb Gold 57xx Posted October 16, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 16, 2019 On 15/10/2019 at 12:04, chris p bacon said: I was also under the impression that although Germany is reducing its use of Lignite it isn't appreciated just how much production was increased just a few years ago. Fukushima? (bless you!) A nuclear accident in a country in the vicinity of 4 tectonic plates causes a knee jerk in Germany (well know for it's massive earthquake activity) to shut down their nuclear power and back fill with coal... Make perfect sense for an allegedly green country. 1 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, 57xx said: Fukushima? (bless you!) A nuclear accident in a country in the vicinity of 4 tectonic plates causes a knee jerk in Germany (well know for it's massive earthquake activity) to shut down their nuclear power and back fill with coal... Make perfect sense for an allegedly green country. I am not qualified to comment on the situation in Germany re nuclear. However I do have some experience of lignite. When the wall came down the in laws were living to the south west of Leipzig. The edge of the local lignite mine was about 1.5km away. Their house was expected to be gobbled up in around 18 months time. Fortunately expansion of the mine stopped. It was an open cast mine around 120-150m deep and stretched for at least 6km. There was a railway system in the bottom fed by a giant drag line crane. From the top it looked like a model. The air was a greenish brown colour. You did not notice it but it was evident when you took a photograph and could not print what you thought should be the correct colours. Not far away was the Leuna chemical plant that used a vast amount of the stuff plus sending all manner of dodgy chemicals into the air. The area has now been landscaped and provides facilities for water sports after flooding the pit. Things are much improved in environmental terms. I have not been to one of the new mines but I am pretty sure that the extraction process is much cleaner. As for burning the stuff I don't know. However can it be worse than the domestic wood fires that seem to be so popular, even if probably illegal. Just as popular here in the UK it would seem before I get jumped on. German industry does in general seem to be making a bigger effort than we do in the UK to clean up its act. I could be cynical and say by exporting some of it. Bernard 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted October 17, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 17, 2019 (edited) I'm in a meeting this week which is focused on reducing GHG emissions from shipping and sums up so much of this debate. The meeting is in Tokyo, now this is one of the foreign trips I won't complain about as Japan is one of my favourite country's in the world and any excuse to come here is fine by me. And despite the obvious criticism, most of the people here are from Korea, Japan or China (because that's where the shipbuilding expertise is) and travel emissions are far from the worst of the sort of meetings I attend (very far from it). However, the water at the venue is small (300ml?) plastic bottles of Volvic water imported from France. Call me a cynic or a grumpy old so and so, but what's the point of worrying about emissions from ships so they can carry plastic bottles of water from France to Japan? Edited October 17, 2019 by jjb1970 1 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatB Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 49 minutes ago, jjb1970 said: I'm in a meeting this week which is focused on reducing GHG emissions from shipping and sums up so much of this debate. The meeting is in Tokyo, now this is one of the foreign trips I won't complain about as Japan is one of my favourite country's in the world and any excuse to come here is fine by me. And despite the obvious criticism, most of the people here are from Korea, Japan or China (because that's where the shipbuilding expertise is) and travel emissions are far from the worst of the sort of meetings I attend (very far from it). However, the water at the venue is small (300ml?) plastic bottles of Volvic water imported from France. Call me a cynic or a grumpy old so and so, but what's the point of worrying about emissions from ships so they can carry plastic bottles of water from France to Japan? Yes, the whole bottled water thing is rather ridiculous. The majority of the population of Europe, the US, Canada and Aus?NZ have ready access to safe, mostly palatable drinking water from the tap, at a cost so low as to be indistinguishable from zero for the individual. Yes, there are exceptions, but in terms of overall numbers they're very small. And yet we insist on the freedom to buy pretty much the same substance in little non-biodegradeable packages, transported hundreds or thousands of miles, and several orders of magnitude more expensive. It makes so little sense that it makes my frontal lobes throb to contemplate it. Now, I have to confess that I have been known to buy the odd bottle, primarily for the bottle, because it's a cheap way of getting a convenient, robust, pop-top bottle that I can then refill indefinitely from the nearly free supply that appears magically in my kitchen. However, I don't think similar usage accounts for the sales from the half an entire aisle of watery products in each of my three local supermarkets. 1 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Hi Chaps, Here is a bit about Extinction Rebellion with a smattering of 5G Gibbo. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 Hi Folks, Here is a good one for you all to chew your way through with the bonus that its from an extremely disreputable source, The Bank of England. The first line gives the clue to the direction of what is happening through policy, "A new, sustainable financial system is being built.". What is the reason for this new system, is the present financial system broken and that they need new ways to acquire your capital to sustain it ? https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/-/media/boe/files/speech/2019/remarks-given-during-the-un-secretary-generals-climate-actions-summit-2019-mark-carney.pdf?la=en&hash=C0D3A9F2C86647B04D88E7C0DC23264639D03BE2 Gibbo. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 On 17/10/2019 at 08:20, PatB said: Yes, the whole bottled water thing is rather ridiculous. The majority of the population of Europe, the US, Canada and Aus?NZ have ready access to safe, mostly palatable drinking water from the tap, at a cost so low as to be indistinguishable from zero for the individual. Yes, there are exceptions, but in terms of overall numbers they're very small. And yet we insist on the freedom to buy pretty much the same substance in little non-biodegradeable packages, transported hundreds or thousands of miles, and several orders of magnitude more expensive. It makes so little sense that it makes my frontal lobes throb to contemplate it. Now, I have to confess that I have been known to buy the odd bottle, primarily for the bottle, because it's a cheap way of getting a convenient, robust, pop-top bottle that I can then refill indefinitely from the nearly free supply that appears magically in my kitchen. However, I don't think similar usage accounts for the sales from the half an entire aisle of watery products in each of my three local supermarkets. Hi Pat, The whole bottled water thing is about making corporate claim over water extraction rights. For instance, there may be a hose pipe ban due to drought conditions but the corporations have their right to their water and are more than happy to pump the water table dry for profit. Making sense to you and making sense to the corporations are not necessarily the same thing. Gibbo. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted October 21, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2019 On 17/10/2019 at 08:20, PatB said: However, I don't think similar usage accounts for the sales from the half an entire aisle of watery products in each of my three local supermarkets. Think it's bad here, try France. An entire aisle full of bottled water, and I saw people filling supermarket trolleys up with it and nothing else. It's not as if the tap water wasn't perfectly fine to drink. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatB Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 Oh, I'm perfectly well aware of why companies sell bottled water. I'm just puzzled as to why apparently otherwise sensible people have bought into the scam so enthusiastically and in such numbers. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted October 21, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2019 5 minutes ago, PatB said: Oh, I'm perfectly well aware of why companies sell bottled water. I'm just puzzled as to why apparently otherwise sensible people have bought into the scam so enthusiastically and in such numbers. Beats me. Fizzy water fair enough if you want that, and occasionally when I've been out and about and thirsty a small bottle has been the only convenient water (and I resent that a bit, with the stupid price), but lots of large bottles of the stuff? 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caradoc Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 I occasionally buy bottled water, but like Reorte only when out and about, and as a healthier option as part of a meal deal. It has never occurred to me to buy bottled water for use at home, I'm paying for the tap water anyway and it's perfectly drinkable ! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Metr0Land Posted October 21, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2019 BTW has Greta got home yet? I don't recall seeing a media frenzy about her return voyage. 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium TheQ Posted October 21, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2019 27 minutes ago, Metr0Land said: BTW has Greta got home yet? I don't recall seeing a media frenzy about her return voyage. She's on a tour of the USA producing much CO2 in the process, there was some talk of her going home the long way round possibly via the transsiberian Railway.. Good luck on her talking much in the USSR Putins Russia. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Metr0Land Posted October 21, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2019 8 minutes ago, TheQ said: She's on a tour of the USA producing much CO2 in the process Have these Millenials not heard of tele-conferencing? I thought they were always on their mobile/cell/handi phones around the world. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium TheQ Posted October 21, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2019 all those rare earths dug up in Africa and China are destroying the Earth.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ron Ron Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 The little angel ( AAAAwwww how sweet) is touring the USA , Canada and then on to Mexico, before heading south to Chile for the UN climate change conference in December. Her little boat trip across the N Atlantic involved support teams coming up to Plymouth for the departure, from Italy and the South of France in a small fleet of diesel vans. Press officers and other parts of her organising entourage flew out to New York ahead of her and the outbound crew returned to Europe by air. A relief yacht crew are said to have flown over to take over from the outbound crew of the multi-million £ boat. . 1 3 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ron Ron Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 7 minutes ago, Metr0Land said: Have these Millenials not heard of tele-conferencing? I thought they were always on their mobile/cell/handi phones around the world. On a side note to that, I see they are now saying that internet usage is now responsible for 2% of the world's total CO2 emissions and growing. Puts into perspective the 2.4% attributed to commercial aviation. Bring back Jungle Drums. 2 2 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cactustrain Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 If an alcoholic tells me that drinking alcohol to excess is bad, does that invalidate the message? No, it just means they are a hypocrite. With regard to climate change, we are all culpable for the problem, and therefore hypocrites, to a certain extent, but that doesn't affect the validity of the message. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Kingzance Posted October 21, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2019 Whilst we are all in part responsible for the rise in global temperatures and the generation of more CO2, I refuse to be cowed into the latest conn by some smart-arse who has the ear of government (frequently as a result of indirect brown envelopes of filthy lucre) when those conns are clearly NOT going to solve the problem. It is impossible to get away from the absolute correlation between CO2 levels, global average temperatures and the expansion of the global population. Increasing infant survival and longevity are the prime causes of that. Sadly, we may not be able to continue to expand life expectancy and (I am sure some will attack me for this) just maybe we should stop trying to push those boundaries or treat people who, despite warnings, refuse to act and eat in a healthy way. No doubt the vested interests would love to be able to make me disappear as part of their solution but eventually the "bright young things" will realise that they are being led by the nose for the benefit of a few global companies / extremely rich individuals. No amount of destroying our economy will save the world when the UK's population amounts to less than 1% of that of the planet, just as importing so much electricity only moves the generation of pollution somewhere else. As for the government supporting wood-burning in the form of pelleted fuel for large power stations yet pushing to ban domestic fires, what planet do they think we are on? What could help is if we all forego the insatiable desire to have every seasonal foodstuff always available (flying asparagus from Peru or green beans and flowers from Kenya for example), the latest fashion (produced in Asian sweat-shops then shipped here to be sold at a huge mark-up) or to holiday in the latest exotic resort (resulting in massive aviation-generated pollution). And yes, we all know that conference calling has been used for years but clearly it is beneath the "climate change" lobby to deign to do that because they wouldn't get their free holidays. After all, we have to have some real hypocrites to get us fuming. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted October 21, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2019 I'll stick to having no kids as my contribution. 1 3 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 6 hours ago, Reorte said: Beats me. Fizzy water fair enough if you want that, and occasionally when I've been out and about and thirsty a small bottle has been the only convenient water (and I resent that a bit, with the stupid price), but lots of large bottles of the stuff? But....But......But.......But...... the fizz is Carbon Dioxide !!!!!! How could you ? What would Jesus, I mean Saint Greta say? More seriously find out what all that chlorine does for you health and also why did the Soviets put sodium fluoride into the drinking water. Gibbo. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caradoc Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Ron Ron Ron said: The little angel ( AAAAwwww how sweet) is touring the USA , Canada and then on to Mexico, before heading south to Chile for the UN climate change conference in December. Her little boat trip across the N Atlantic involved support teams coming up to Plymouth for the departure, from Italy and the South of France in a small fleet of diesel vans. Press officers and other parts of her organising entourage flew out to New York ahead of her and the outbound crew returned to Europe by air. A relief yacht crew are said to have flown over to take over from the outbound crew of the multi-million £ boat. . For someone whose 'future has been destroyed', she's already travelled more widely, and seen more varied and exotic parts of the planet, than I have, or ever will ! 2 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted October 21, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2019 6 minutes ago, Gibbo675 said: But....But......But.......But...... the fizz is Carbon Dioxide !!!!!! How could you ? What would Jesus, I mean Saint Greta say? I did find it amusing, was it last year? when there was a carbon dioxide shortage. Quote More seriously find out what all that chlorine does for you health and also why did the Soviets put sodium fluoride into the drinking water. Need to consider how that compares with not putting it in. Growing up in an area with fluoridated water I put that down to part of the reason I've got no fillings (not having been to the dentist for 20-odd years may have something to do with it of course!) 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classsix T Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Reorte said: Need to consider how that compares with not putting it in. Growing up in an area with fluoridated water I put that down to part of the reason I've got no fillings (not having been to the dentist for 20-odd years may have something to do with it of course!) Indeed, and given the choice, I'm sure the residents of Flint would have taken fluoridation of their water any day of the week rather than the 'additives' they ended up with. "is the present financial system broken"? F**k yes! C6T. Edited October 21, 2019 by Classsix T Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
APOLLO Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 Talking about water ---------- Todays Guardian The Colorado River serves over 35 million Americans before reaching Mexico – but it is dammed at the border, leaving locals on the other side with a dry delta https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/oct/21/the-lost-river-mexicans-fight-for-mighty-waterway-taken-by-the-us And over in the far east ------- Yesterday's Bangkok Post NAKHON PHANOM: The level of water in the Mekong river in this northeastern border province is dropping rapidly, exhibiting the most unnatural phenomenon in 50 years, according to local media reports The reports said water in the Mekong river is dropping by 10-20 centimetres per day. The water level is currently about 1.50 metres, about 11 metres below the top of the river bank. https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1776319/mekong-water-level-in-nakhon-phanom-drops-amid-drought-fears So America is pinching Mexico's water and China is pinching Thailand's water. Bad in other places too. The mighty River Douglas is still flowing through Wigan at least !!!!!!!!! Brit15 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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