RMweb Premium Crepello Posted July 24, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 24, 2015 Which grease do you use Paul? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MR PJ Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 Which grease do you use Paul? Its called Labelle 106 plastic compatible lubricating grease (with PTFE). I obtained it from John Dutfield's in Chelmsford (who recommended its okay for 2mm scale models). Regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Crepello Posted November 14, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 14, 2015 Has anyone come to the same conclusion as me--that the current 47s are more sensitive to uneven track than other N locos? I've had 2x 47096 so far and both had issues of poor current collection and derailments. I wonder if this is as a result of the re-design of the chassis after the introduction of this model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonas Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Same here, mine derails on the slightest bump, not a problem I've had wth my Farish 37s or bo-bo's. By far the worst runner in my small fleet (and the least used!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MR PJ Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Hello, I think the models are a little bit sensitive, I ran in a model of 096 - it ran fine for two hours (after a tiny bit of tweaking) on my test layout which has tight radii and quite a few bumps. However, after taking the model apart (to remove some chassis material for fitting a speaker in the fuel tank) and putting it back together again, although still on DC has poor current collection, and has begun to de-rail. I think this may be due to excess oil, and a tendency for the brass current collectors on the bogies not to contact the wheels properly. This can be cured with cleaning and perhaps removing the axles to make sure the current collectors are bent out enough to make contact with the wheels. Also there is very little clearance between the buffer beam cowling and the bogies themselves. I suspect that any bumps in the track may cause the bogies to come into contact with this cowling with inevitable results. Hopefully this will not be a problem on my main layout, which I have spent quite a bit of time making sure the track is accurately laid. Regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerr Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 I am at the other end of the spectrum, I use my DCC version Class 47 models to make sure my track is laid correctly If they will run over a section of track, then anything will! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MR PJ Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Yes - its odd that a loco with co-co wheel arrangement seems to be so sensitive - seemingly more so than most other diesel loco's (steam is yet another kettle of fish - sorry for the pun...) but with a bit of TLC they will run well. I just cleaned the wheels of this particular model and given the track a quick clean, and it seems to be running fine, with no derailments either. Perhaps the derailments are caused by juddering when electrical contact is momentarily lost? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Crepello Posted November 16, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 16, 2015 Hi Jonas, I think it's the plastic gear covers on the underside of the bogies. I've checked and adjusted my back-to-backs several times and they seem ok now. How about giving the underside of the bogies a quick coat of white paint to see it they're marked after a run? That's my next stage. I remember the first batch of 'new' 47s had 'grounding' issues as well as the big gap between body and bogies and I wonder if the bogie mouldings are the same. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruff Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 They did modify them with a flat bottom on newer releases but they still seem low to me.. Cheers Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonas Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Just had a look at mine and the gear covers are flat. It also looks like I've had a go with a file at some point too to reduce it further! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Al Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 However, after taking the model apart (to remove some chassis material for fitting a speaker in the fuel tank) and putting it back together again, although still on DC has poor current collection, and has begun to de-rail. Surely if it ran fine prior to dismantling then dismantling is/has caused the problem? Therefore this should be the first port of call rather than decrying the design. The original batch 47s had gear guards that could foul, but the newer batches have had this and the ride height corrected. Cheers, Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Al Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 I wonder if the bogie mouldings are the same. No, they are all revised - bogies, gear guards all changed to drop the ride height and raise the bogie frame as well af flats on the gear guards. Clearance is now the same on the revised models as the class 57s before them (heard no complaints about those). Cheers, Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benn Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Gently bending out the phosphor bronze pick up strips where the cut-out is for the centre axle, so that it actually contacts the back of the centre axle, will make a world of difference. I've done this on my 37s and 47s, and they are now firmly in the 'hard-as-nails-elete-runner fleet'. I also gave the bogie a full overhaul whilst I was at it, cleaning all wheel backs and the phosphor bronze parts, including the lugs on the top of the bogie and contact strip in the chassis, and lubricating the gears with daywatt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MR PJ Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Surely if it ran fine prior to dismantling then dismantling is/has caused the problem? Therefore this should be the first port of call rather than decrying the design. The original batch 47s had gear guards that could foul, but the newer batches have had this and the ride height corrected. Cheers, Alan I have dismantled enough loco's over time, they are simple to put back together, so incorrect re-assembly is not an issue here. As stated in my next post simply cleaning the wheels resolved the problems. I think the light lubricant oil that Farish apply excessively (so much so that on some locos that it coats the outside of the chassis block!) does not help. I was wondering if disassembly might move the oil around - but thinking about it this can't be the case, as the bogies are a simple "pull out" design. Its funny I have had no major problems with my Grafar 37, so I do suspect that the 47s are a bit more "sensitive" to any dirt on wheels or track. Not to say that there are perhaps some other aspects of the design that could be improved - such as (as others have suggested) the lack of proper picks-up on the centre axle. I will probably follow Benn's advice to improve the pick-ups - hopefully this will resolve the problems - but it would surely be better if Grafar improved this area in the first place? I may give them some feedback if no-one from Grafar is reading this forum... Regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Crepello Posted November 21, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 21, 2015 A further development with my 47096:-- It was the leading wheelset that always derailed but I've found that the centre one was to blame--B2B far too tight. In its stripped-down form, the loco runs as smoothly as any other now and current collection is not a problem. Just shows you never stop learning in this hobby. The bogie frame is awaiting a coat of weathering before re-assembly. I recommend a check of ALL B2Bs, removing and replacing each wheelset one at a time and cleaning as you go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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