gr.king Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Are we talking about P1s or P2s? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gr.king Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 1 hour ago, Jesse Sim said: As promised Tony a photo of the Jidenco 6ton fish van. An absolute pain to build! But I am haply with it, despite the set backs. I’ll post a photo next week of it weathered, hopefully it will hide the blemishes. I would weather it this weekend but picking up my new Harley..... Doesn't look like it was too much of a struggle. Is it known for certain whether the slats were single layer, with see-through openings like that, or was there an inner layer too, offset to close the obvious gaps but still allowing air flow? Based on photographs of fairly poor quality I suspected the latter when I built my two GN fish vans by a different method. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodcock29 Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) Graeme is correct there is another layer behind the framing behind the open slats which prevents them being see through. This is clear in the photo in Tatlow's original volume on LNER wagons and in a slightly better reproduction of the same photo in his Vol 1 of the expanded series. I've made the same mistake as Jessie in the Jidenco kit I built back in the 80s which I've not realised until now when I had a closer look at the photo. As I have two of the D&S version to build I'll fix the Jidenco version when I get around to building those. We learn something new every day! Andrew Edited March 5, 2021 by Woodcock29 Added comment 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Some beautiful loco's there Tony. The Loveless loco's are stunning, but then RTR has come a long way also. Spent another 2 hours fiddling this morning with the J50 chassis and taking it very slowly kept opening up the holes in the rods and re assembling. Eventually I did get it turning over, but still not 100%. I was getting concerned about the amount of meat left around the ends of the rods, so decided loco building was not for me and put it away in the box. Had a rummage around upstairs and out popped a packet of 6 plain crankpins and washers, so back down again to see if they changed anything. Amazed to find they ran perfectly with not the slightest sign of sticking whatsoever..... Of course now I'm not 100% happy with the size of the holes in the rods, but it does run really well. I have sent a spares part request to DJH to see if I can get a couple of new rods or the etched sheet, or will look at soldering small washers back into the rod holes and perhaps start the process again with the plain crankpins. Does it matter if the holes in the rods are oversize, other than cosmetically? Looking at this pic, they look terrible, so I can't leave them like that even if it does rotate perfectly. 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barclay Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 I had this issue when I first started using Gibson wheels - the bushes require so much meat to be removed from the rods that they become quite fragile. I now don't use them at all and keep the hole in the rod as small as possible. As someone else has said above, if you can find something to bush the rods then they should be OK. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted March 5, 2021 Author Share Posted March 5, 2021 1 hour ago, gr.king said: Are we talking about P1s or P2s? P1s Graeme, I know you've made a very nice one indeed. Which sees service on Grantham......... And, has run on Little Bytham, of course. I'm sure you've told me how you built it, but my memory crumbles! To the extent that I can't remember for the life of me who made and brought this example; assuming the class lasted into BR days. I've an idea it's tender drive, but who knows? I can't ever see a P1 being available in OO. There is a commonality of parts with a Hornby Gresley A1 and A3, but too much would have to be new. Regards, Tony. 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted March 5, 2021 Author Share Posted March 5, 2021 10 minutes ago, gordon s said: Some beautiful loco's there Tony. The Loveless loco's are stunning, but then RTR has come a long way also. Spent another 2 hours fiddling this morning with the J50 chassis and taking it very slowly kept opening up the holes in the rods and re assembling. Eventually I did get it turning over, but still not 100%. I was getting concerned about the amount of meat left around the ends of the rods, so decided loco building was not for me and put it away in the box. Had a rummage around upstairs and out popped a packet of 6 plain crankpins and washers, so back down again to see if they changed anything. Amazed to find they ran perfectly with not the slightest sign of sticking whatsoever..... Of course now I'm not 100% happy with the size of the holes in the rods, but it does run really well. I have sent a spares part request to DJH to see if I can get a couple of new rods or the etched sheet, or will look at soldering small washers back into the rod holes and perhaps start the process again with the plain crankpins. Does it matter if the holes in the rods are oversize, other than cosmetically? Looking at this pic, they look terrible, so I can't leave them like that even if it does rotate perfectly. Good morning Gordon, 'Does it matter if the holes in the rods are oversize, other than cosmetically?' Not in the slightest, if it works perfectly. Anyone who's watched an 'Austerity' clank by will testify to that. By the time you've weathered the rods, nobody will notice. Anyway, full marks for your perseverance. The first locos I built were rubbish! Regards, Tony. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium thegreenhowards Posted March 5, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 5, 2021 3 hours ago, Tony Wright said: I'm sure they were. However, as far as I know, none has ever been available RTR. Might one ever be? The options are becoming more and more limited for the RTR manufacturers. Does anyone have any ideas as to what would be popular next? Regards, Tony. Surely 60113 must be a candidate? If they can do one offs like the W1 (and arguably all the A2/2s as you keep reminding us that they were all different) and Thompson Pacifics have been proven to sell well then why not? There must be a fair bit of commonality with their A3s and / or Tornado. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Barry Ten Posted March 5, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 5, 2021 Following Tony's post earlier I looked at the Hattons' A3s and I was surprised at the price reductions across the range. I know a few people who dabble in 7mm (including me) but not one has a layout where you could do justice to an A3. I wonder if there was a perceived market gap which didn't really exist. 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted March 5, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Barry Ten said: Following Tony's post earlier I looked at the Hattons' A3s and I was surprised at the price reductions across the range. I know a few people who dabble in 7mm (including me) but not one has a layout where you could do justice to an A3. I wonder if there was a perceived market gap which didn't really exist. I think that sums up the problem in a nutshell; production has clearly exceeded demand from established O Gauge users with the real estate needed to employ such big locos. Many/most who have begun to dabble seem to have been seduced by the availability of cute little 0-6-0 tanks that cost about the same as OO Pacifics, and who can just about find room for ten feet or so of shunting plank. That's how long Tony's OO expresses are, so an A3 or A4 in O Gauge needs a train significantly longer than that to look even half serious. The only Pacifics that regularly worked short trains were the Southern Lightweights, and most of those were only short at the beginning or end of their journeys anyway. John Edited March 5, 2021 by Dunsignalling 3 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted March 5, 2021 Author Share Posted March 5, 2021 3 hours ago, thegreenhowards said: Surely 60113 must be a candidate? If they can do one offs like the W1 (and arguably all the A2/2s as you keep reminding us that they were all different) and Thompson Pacifics have been proven to sell well then why not? There must be a fair bit of commonality with their A3s and / or Tornado. Andy Why not indeed Andy? It could be popular, but, from a personal point of view, I'm all right Jack! I built this from a Crownline kit (complete with resin boiler), and Ian Rathbone painted it. I must have had it now for over a quarter of a century. It replaced one I scratch-built in 1976. John Houlden created GREAT NORTHERN for his Gamston Bank, from scratch and DJH bits. It was one of his locos which I sold when he graduated to O Gauge, and Gamston went up in smoke. I can't remember to whom I sold it. Not you? David West brought his along a few years ago now, converted (I think) with help from Morgan Gilbert using a Graeme King conversion kit and a Hornby donor. The A4 and L1 are also David's. There's a similar A1/1 on Retford. There might be a market for the A1/1 RTR, though most I know who needed one, have got it. Still, I certainly don't know everyone! 12 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted March 5, 2021 Author Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) More progress on the Gibson 'County' tank today......................... By reducing the width of the frames (by a mil' each side), it's given more sideplay on the rear pony. Initial road tests suggest 3' radius is a minimum for it to negotiate. Edited March 5, 2021 by Tony Wright typo error 4 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted March 5, 2021 Author Share Posted March 5, 2021 The best of both worlds? About 13 years ago, I built an EM Gauge A2 loco/tender chassis to go underneath my model of BRONZINO, so that the loco/tender body could be swopped for it to run on Retford as well as Little Bytham (the EM chassis is the nearer one in this shot, should anyone be unable to tell). It ran just fine, but I rather got the impression from the late 'master' that it was not fully 'up to standard'. I left it, but the next time I visited it was off the layout, back in its box. 'Not really needed'. 'Fair enough', so I took BRONZINO back, refitted her OO sets of frames for service on LB and that was that. Until a friend said he'd like an EM loco/tender set of frames. So, I sold the now-surplus ones to him. A couple of days ago, my friend got in touch to say he's aborted the idea of building an A2 to go on my frames. 'Do you know anyone who'd be interested?' 'I am', so I've bought them back from him. Not to go underneath BRONZINO again (Sandra has now built 60539 for Retford), but to go underneath SUGAR PALM (York's A2, regularly seen at Retford). Here's 60526 on her OO frames. I built it from a DJH kit, and Geoff Haynes painted it. Now on her EM frames. Apart from the better driving wheels, can anyone notice the difference? Sandra is very happy for me to build EM frames to go underneath some of my locos. Covid permitting, the next time you'll see 60526, she'll be romping round Retford. 11 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post 60526 Posted March 5, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted March 5, 2021 Tony, following our conversation yesterday here are some of the old photos taken with a Kodak Brownie by my brother, probably May 61. We lived next to Bethune Park just north of New Southgate and our next-door neighbour who was a secondman at Hornsey used to take us down to either New Southgate or Wood Green and drop us off to spot, banana sandwiches and a flask of Heinz soup it was in those days!!! We also got the occasional cab ride down to Hornsey and if it was a Sunday a trip around the shed. A magic place to spot on the southern end of the down Wood Green platform opposite the up signal box. You could tell by the bells from the box that something was approaching and the line indicators off the end of the platform by the barrow crossing gave you an idea of which line the train was approaching from. Oh for a better camera at the time? 60526 Sugar Palm on an up express, my brother seems to think that this was quite rare at WG, a 50A York engine. 60054 Prince of Wales on home turf 60513 Dante on the up side at New Southgate. 61393 down side at Wood Green, such a shame that the focus is not there. WD 2-8-0 on the down side at Wood Green, same frustration again. Baby Deltic on the down main at Wood Green Baby Deltic D5905 on the up main and on a stopper at Wood Green. Deltic on the down main at Wood Green EE type 3 on IL59 down main at Wood Green. To Cleethorpes? D208 on the down slow at Wood Green D0280 with no yellow ends on 1G60 the down Sheffield Pullman at New Southgate. You can't go back and takes these photos again like you can't change the camera or who processed the film, but they have been kept for a bit of nostalgia. Some could be improved because I still have the negatives but they are a larger size than 35mm and don't fit in my scanner. I do have a few other photos of non-eastern locos, I'll scan them and post later perhaps. Regards Charlie 29 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) Thanks for posting those pics, Charlie. My favourite place as well. End of Wood Green platform opposite the signal box. I was part of the furniture from the late 50’s through to ‘64 when girls and scooters came along...... Just one stop down from Palmers Green and access to the best that the LNER could offer. Happy days... Edited March 5, 2021 by gordon s 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60526 Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Missed this one 60031 Golden Plover on an up express at Wood Green. Pity about the loco but some of the ballast is in focus? Always thought it strange the down main being a colour light signal. 12 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60526 Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 4 minutes ago, gordon s said: Thanks for posting those pics, Charlie. My favourite place as well. End of Wood Green platform opposite the signal box. I was part of the furniture from the late 50’s through to ‘64 when girls and scooters came along...... Just two stops down from Palmers Green and access to the best that the LNER could offer. Happy days... Can you remember the goods shed at Palmers Green and travelling face to face in the Quad sets? I can just recall it though more the dirty Mk1 suburbans and Cravens. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Tony Wright said: Why not indeed Andy? It could be popular, but, from a personal point of view, I'm all right Jack! I built this from a Crownline kit (complete with resin boiler), and Ian Rathbone painted it. I must have had it now for over a quarter of a century. It replaced one I scratch-built in 1976. John Houlden created GREAT NORTHERN for his Gamston Bank, from scratch and DJH bits. It was one of his locos which I sold when he graduated to O Gauge, and Gamston went up in smoke. I can't remember to whom I sold it. Not you? David West brought his along a few years ago now, converted (I think) with help from Morgan Gilbert using a Graeme King conversion kit and a Hornby donor. The A4 and L1 are also David's. There's a similar A1/1 on Retford. There might be a market for the A1/1 RTR, though most I know who needed one, have got it. Still, I certainly don't know everyone! I remember that visit well. Morgan Gilbert converted the A3 to the A1/1 using Graeme King's ingenious resin conversion parts and his (Morgan's) etched valve gear. These were also suitable for the Thompson A2s. Once converted, I weathered it. Edited March 5, 2021 by davidw Add photo 11 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, 60526 said: Can you remember the goods shed at Palmers Green and travelling face to face in the Quad sets? I can just recall it though more the dirty Mk1 suburbans and Cravens. That was my favourite playground..... There was always a gap in the large cream coloured gates and we could play for hours in there. Of course you had to keep a fairly low profile with the signal box next door. More often or not there was a J15 shunting a few coal wagons about in the yard the other side of the running lines. All long gone now with flats and Morrison’s supermarket. As a young lad the abiding memories were stepping into the booking hall with the wooden floors that had a smell of their own and waiting for the home signal mounted on the elevated station building to rise. I was at Southgate County in Fox Lane, so it was school finished at 15.40, run down the hill and the station footpath to get the N2 or L1 plus Quad Art set to Wood Green for another couple of hours before dinner time. Thanks for the pics. Edit: Took a while, but found a plan with the yard and goods shed. Edited March 5, 2021 by gordon s 5 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 6 hours ago, thegreenhowards said: Surely 60113 must be a candidate? If they can do one offs like the W1 (and arguably all the A2/2s as you keep reminding us that they were all different) and Thompson Pacifics have been proven to sell well then why not? There must be a fair bit of commonality with their A3s and / or Tornado. Andy The A1/1 has more livery potential than some other one-offs that Hornby has done. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johndon Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) 10 hours ago, Barry Ten said: Following Tony's post earlier I looked at the Hattons' A3s and I was surprised at the price reductions across the range. I know a few people who dabble in 7mm (including me) but not one has a layout where you could do justice to an A3. I wonder if there was a perceived market gap which didn't really exist. I suspect a few people have been put off by reports of the valve gear falling apart as well. I have a friend who has a 70' long O gauge layout and was seriously contemplating getting one of their A4s but, as there have been reports of issues with that as well, I wasn't going to pay the asking price for something that might fall apart after a couple of laps... Edited March 5, 2021 by johndon 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted March 5, 2021 Author Share Posted March 5, 2021 2 hours ago, 60526 said: Tony, following our conversation yesterday here are some of the old photos taken with a Kodak Brownie by my brother, probably May 61. We lived next to Bethune Park just north of New Southgate and our next-door neighbour who was a secondman at Hornsey used to take us down to either New Southgate or Wood Green and drop us off to spot, banana sandwiches and a flask of Heinz soup it was in those days!!! We also got the occasional cab ride down to Hornsey and if it was a Sunday a trip around the shed. A magic place to spot on the southern end of the down Wood Green platform opposite the up signal box. You could tell by the bells from the box that something was approaching and the line indicators off the end of the platform by the barrow crossing gave you an idea of which line the train was approaching from. Oh for a better camera at the time? 60526 Sugar Palm on an up express, my brother seems to think that this was quite rare at WG, a 50A York engine. 60054 Prince of Wales on home turf 60513 Dante on the up side at New Southgate. 61393 down side at Wood Green, such a shame that the focus is not there. WD 2-8-0 on the down side at Wood Green, same frustration again. Baby Deltic on the down main at Wood Green Baby Deltic D5905 on the up main and on a stopper at Wood Green. Deltic on the down main at Wood Green EE type 3 on IL59 down main at Wood Green. To Cleethorpes? D208 on the down slow at Wood Green D0280 with no yellow ends on 1G60 the down Sheffield Pullman at New Southgate. You can't go back and takes these photos again like you can't change the camera or who processed the film, but they have been kept for a bit of nostalgia. Some could be improved because I still have the negatives but they are a larger size than 35mm and don't fit in my scanner. I do have a few other photos of non-eastern locos, I'll scan them and post later perhaps. Regards Charlie Evocative shots Charlie, Thanks for posting them. From a decade before at Wood Green......................................... WILD SWAN, still with non-corridor tender. ABBOTSFORD. N2 going from Down fast to Down slow to stop. Piling it on! Yet another filthy V2. What's left at Wood Green today? No longer Wood Green, of course; now Alexandra Palace. Certainly no photographers. Regards, Tony. 17 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium thegreenhowards Posted March 5, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 5, 2021 Tony, No, I didn’t take the exGamston bank A1/1. I came to you to buy the ex silver jubilee triplet (I think it was the first time we met) and went away with an ex West Riding twin and 60508 as well costing me much more than I’d intended....but well worth it. I now have examples of all the ex LNER RA9 power except for Great Northern, so I’m very much in the market for one. I may well build one but I have a lot of things higher in the queue. If the W1 sells then why not the A1/1? Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60526 Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 5 minutes ago, Tony Wright said: What's left at Wood Green today? No longer Wood Green, of course; now Alexandra Palace. Certainly no photographers. Regards, Tony. There are still photographers, last time I was down there they were over on the up side catching the yard shunter coming out and the empty stock moving up towards Hornsey. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium thegreenhowards Posted March 5, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 5, 2021 7 hours ago, Barry Ten said: Following Tony's post earlier I looked at the Hattons' A3s and I was surprised at the price reductions across the range. I know a few people who dabble in 7mm (including me) but not one has a layout where you could do justice to an A3. I wonder if there was a perceived market gap which didn't really exist. I’m not convinced that is the issue. Most O gauge stuff gets reduced after a while. The (relatively) cheap ‘cute’ tanks started at a higher price and came down. I think that some alleged build quality issues have dented the potential market but it was probably always going to reduce in price at some stage. I’ve just started dabbling in O gauge. We’re building a Minories type layout at my club (https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/160690-minories-inspired-layout-in-0-gauge/) , and I did consider one when the price reduced but was put off by a Combination of the reliability issues and a preference for a coal rails tender which they say they will produce next. I’m working on the basis that an A3 could work an evening peak commuter special of 4-5 corridor coaches for which we have space. Andy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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