Wright writes.....

[zr2498]

2 hours ago, Chamby said:

 

Another difference is that the Bachmann flangeless wheels actually sit and roll on the rail head, rather than just hang limply in the air.  Whilst this looks much better, it can cause shorting issues when the trailing wheels swing out of gauge when running over some RTR turnouts.  Which is probably why Hornby do it the way they do...

 

 

 

Agree Bachmann V2 flangeless wheels look better but will probably change to flanged as min radius I have on layout is 31".

The green colour / finish on the Bachmann V2's look superb.

Hornby could lower the trailing wheels if they were insulated?

 

[Chamby]

29 minutes ago, zr2498 said:

Agree Bachmann V2 flangeless wheels look better but will probably change to flanged as min radius I have on layout is 31".

The green colour / finish on the Bachmann V2's look superb.

Hornby could lower the trailing wheels if they were insulated?

 

 

I have fitted the V2's flanged wheels and they handle a 24" radius with ease.  Take care when swopping them over though, the brass boxes supporting the axle are lightly sprung and the springs are tiny!

[Jol Wilkinson]

2 hours ago, Northmoor said:

Agreed, although whether that 1960s HD Duchess was the "cutting edge of mass production" at the time, I don't know.

 

What is certainly a factor now, quite apart from recovering the costs of the time taken to apply the additional detail and better finish, is the much smaller volumes produced.  In the 60s, Tri-ang might have had not much more than half a dozen locos in their range at a time and probably expected to sell 10,000 Britannias (there are still comedians on eBay who advertise their Tri-ang Princesses as "RARE"!).  Hornby are not going to sell 10,000 of no.10000, so they are writing off the (substantial) moulding and jig costs over perhaps only 500 units.

 

Today, it's only when the manufacturers produce something common to a high proportion of British layouts, like a GWR Pannier tank or a Class 08 diesel shunter, that they can really take advantage of the economies of scale.

 As development and tooling are the greatest costs for any new model the usual way of dealing with it seems to be offering different liveries and names/numbers. That works well for something like the NRM/Rails of Sheffield Precedent 2-4-0 with four "versions" available  when introduced, especially as some people are willing to buy more than one version at RRP. The W1 however seems a less potentially profitable case as the was only one. However as collectors/modellers seem enthusiastic about buying almost anything that is new and different, the sales volume could well be much higher than would otherwise seem logical.

[Tony Wright]

Just three new books this time...........

 

 

As a Cestrian, a great interest in this one.

 

 

Some stunning photography, but the grammar is 'questionable'.

 

 

An impressive tome. 

 

I'm just off now to run the W1s. I'll report accordingly...............

 

 

 

 

[Headstock]

5 hours ago, t-b-g said:

 

That looks so much better. If you can manage it, why can't Hornby?

 

Good afternoon Tony,

 

 I quite agree. You would have thought that it would be simple to slice vertically through a part of the cylinder block, so that it is joined to and lifts off with the body.

[MJI]

15 hours ago, Jamiel said:

Having seen a few DMUs on here over the last few months. I thought I would post work in progress of a build I have been doing of a Class124 Transpennine.

 

Worsley Works etches sides, DC Kits Class 303 EMU ends (with a lot of work), Replica Railways MK1 coach bodies, roofs and back ends, Comet chassis, MTK bogie frames, Trix bogie outsides, brass strip.

 

Craftsman DMU detailing kits for the buffer beam details, they are a bit thick, or oversize, but can be soldered on so are quite solid, so I can live with that.
 

Detailing from Comet, A1, MTK, Extreme Etches, Dapol spares (mostly cast off in resin), Evergreen strip, plasticard, a host of plastic and brass sprue/offcuts and whatever is in the box of bits.

 

I think that means it is a mongrel, and not a thoroughbred.

 

I have painted the front ends as I plan to fit the cab windows before adding the cab roofs (cast from a Trix kit, now sold on). The curved cab glass has been cut from Barbie doll packaging (courtesy of my daughter). I feel that the cabs are the ‘face’ of the model and are the most important part to get looking at their best. There will obviously be repainting of the cab when the body is done, but the window edges masked off. The join on the headcode glass needs filling too.

 

Although DMUs are basically coaches with cabs, they do have what I find one of the most fun things to build, DMU underframe and engine details. Some of this is a best guess, but I have put together a lot of photos as reference. Still some bits are always too shadowed to be sure.

 

 

I have posted lots of details of the build on my Ellerby thread, which I think started four almost four years ago with the cabs, then shelved for several years until I got the Worsley etches. I hope the remainder of the build will be a bit faster, but I am not the fastest modeller and do get side-tracked by work and my university studies at times (lecturer and research study, no spring chicken).

 

Hopefully more to post on this as it progresses, five more cars to do. I am absolutely sure that once I finally finish it, a RTR one will appear within a few months.

 

Jamie

 

 

Don't worry still no RTR GRCW 119 nor Swindon 120.

 

Tempted by a 123 now I have my printer. (for the cab)

 

I like the radiators, they good good.

 

I have a few Swindon resin castings, but mainly for pre Trans Pennine.

[MJI]

25 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Just three new books this time...........

 

 

As a Cestrian, a great interest in this one.

 

 

Some stunning photography, but the grammar is 'questionable'.

 

 

An impressive tome. 

 

I'm just off now to run the W1s. I'll report accordingly...............

 

 

 

 

 

All 3 completely different but I expect all 3 are interesting.

 

Scary to think that HSTs have been in service for 45 or so years, and still nothing really to rival them.

[31A]

15 hours ago, Headstock said:

 

Thanks

 

it's not a loco that is high on my build before you die list, or should that be die before you buy list? Its pre BR performance on the P2 diagrams in Scotland was quite a watershed moment but the loco would indicate that the proposed reboilering of the A4's would have dulled their sparkle. I was given a large print of 60700 in BR green with early crest, the valve spindle guide is the later type in the photograph. I wonder when it was changed? As you can probably tell, I'm too lazy to look in the green book.

 

Been looking at pictures of the W1 again; in most of them it is difficult to make out details of the valve spindle guides but is it possible that the real loco had the 'old' type at the front and the later type at the rear?  The model doesn't depict this but some of the pictures of the real loco give that impression; I don't know whether that combination could exist or did exist with any other LNER engines with similar cylinders.

[Headstock]

5 minutes ago, 31A said:

 

Been looking at pictures of the W1 again; in most of them it is difficult to make out details of the valve spindle guides but is it possible that the real loco had the 'old' type at the front and the later type at the rear?  The model doesn't depict this but some of the pictures of the real loco give that impression; I don't know whether that combination could exist or did exist with any other LNER engines with similar cylinders.

 

Good afternoon,

 

yep, new style at the back and old style at the front in my photo, though the front guide is for the two to one leavers. I notice the artwork for the later crest 60700 has the old style valve spindle guide, it's only artwork but definitely not correct.

[PupCam]

4 hours ago, Northmoor said:

What is certainly a factor now, quite apart from recovering the costs of the time taken to apply the additional detail and better finish, is the much smaller volumes produced.  In the 60s, Tri-ang might have had not much more than half a dozen locos in their range at a time and probably expected to sell 10,000 Britannias (there are still comedians on eBay who advertise their Tri-ang Princesses as "RARE"!).  Hornby are not going to sell 10,000 of no.10000, so they are writing off the (substantial) moulding and jig costs over perhaps only 500 units.

 

Which came first; the "high" price or the restricted volume?     I believe it's a bit of a chicken and egg situation.

 

Whilst manufactures may not sell anywhere near the volumes of individual models they used to is that because the market isn't there or, as I suspect, the desire to create a demand for "Rare" models to pander to today's ageing but relatively rich collectors?     The reason the manufacturers don't sell as many of one particular model these days must be because they simply didn't make them in the first place so they are unavailable to buy.   It seems strange to me that so much time and effort is put into developing each model and then to so heavily restrict their manufacture that 75% (or whatever the figure is) appears as "Sold out" on the manufacturers and dealers websites.

 

It seems a very strange business model to me but, it's their business not mine so, one must conclude that it is the most profitable way of doing business in the current climate.

 

Alan

[Headstock]

33 minutes ago, 31A said:

 

Been looking at pictures of the W1 again; in most of them it is difficult to make out details of the valve spindle guides but is it possible that the real loco had the 'old' type at the front and the later type at the rear?  The model doesn't depict this but some of the pictures of the real loco give that impression; I don't know whether that combination could exist or did exist with any other LNER engines with similar cylinders.

 

60700 had the new type valve spindle guide when the locomotive was derailed in September 55. See the one off educational purposed image below.

 

[New Haven Neil]

7 hours ago, Chamby said:

Snip<

 

I do wonder why Bachmann bothered with the flangeless V2 wheels?  There can’t be many folk who will be forking out £200 for a V2, but are restricted to using R2 trainset curves.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

As a dealer until fairly recently, I'm afraid you are rather misguided in this statement.  Many, many locos are bought as presents for younger enthusiasts or less well informed modellers that are run on R2, regardless of cost.  In fact, we used to get complaints they wouldn't go around R1.....we certainly got to the point of discussing the matter quite often for telephone buyers, who demonstrated a lack of knowledge of such things.

[Tony Wright]

An interesting session running those latest W1s..............

 

 

I fitted the flanged rear wheels to the LNER version. It'll (just) negotiate 3' radius curves, but one can hear the flange 'squeal'. They also caused considerable drag, though 11 Pullman cars (some with metal sides and cast metal bogies) proved an easy job.

 

 

I left the flangeless set on the BR version, and boy what a mighty-powerful thing this is. Though it won't quite start this 14-car, all metal, kit-built rake with the same sure feet of my kit-built W1, once it had it on the go there were no problems. No Hornby A3 or A4 will shift this set.

 

I've taken video footage of both these locos romping round Little Bytham. 

 

[Tony Wright]

Yesterday, Geoff Haynes delivered two locos he's weathered for me..........

 

Weathering's brought this C12 to life.

 

 

As it's done to this J50.

 

 

 

 

[Headstock]

23 hours ago, 31A said:

 

The picture in RCTS 6C of it in BR livery in 1955 shows that it had the 'early' type of valve spindle guide at that date.  There is also a picture of it on "Death Row" in 1959 which possibly shows that it had acquired the later pattern by then - it isn't clear in that picture.  There are probably clearer pictures in other books!

 

 

Good evening 31A,

 

I had a little time to have a look at some photographs this evening. The rebuilt W1 is a little trickier to pin down from a good side view than some other one off locomotives. I finally got a good early view of the loco in garter blue, with skirts removed and carrying the 60700 number and British Railways on the tender. The valve spindle guide is definitely the later pattern as fitted to the A4's. I couldn't find any views showing the earlier pattern of valve spindle guide at all, though I confess to having misplaced the relevant green book. I still think that Hornby have got it wrong to be honest.

 

The full res image that I am referencing is availed from the RCTS.

 

 

 

[31A]

15 minutes ago, Headstock said:

 

Good evening 31A,

 

I had a little time to have a look at some photographs this evening. The rebuilt W1 is a little trickier to pin down from a good side view than some other one off locomotives. I finally got a good early view of the loco in garter blue, with skirts removed and carrying the 60700 number and British Railways on the tender. The valve spindle guide is definitely the later pattern as fitted to the A4's. I couldn't find any views showing the earlier pattern of valve spindle guide at all, though I confess to having misplaced the relevant green book. I still think that Hornby have got it wrong to be honest.

 

The full res image that I am referencing is availed from the RCTS.

 

 

 

 

Thank you Andrew, I am coming to the same conclusion myself!  As you say, it is not easy to be conclusive.  I suppose being a 'one off', inevitably there are fewer photographs to look at.

 

[Ian Smeeton]

There was some controversy over the thickness of lining on verticals compared to horizontals some pages back.

 

I have just come across this post:

 

 

which may solve the argument, or fan the flames again.

 

Regards

 

Ian

[Ian Rathbone]

31 minutes ago, Ian Smeeton said:

There was some controversy over the thickness of lining on verticals compared to horizontals some pages back.

 

I have just come across this post:

 

 

which may solve the argument, or fan the flames again.

 

Regards

 

Ian

Which page was it?

 

Ian R

[Ian Smeeton]

2 minutes ago, Ian Rathbone said:

Which page was it?

 

Ian R

 

Not a clue, this thread moves so fast it might be 5, 10 or 50 pages back, but it was only in the last few weeks.

 

 

 

Regards

 

Ian

[t-b-g]

33 minutes ago, Ian Rathbone said:

Which page was it?

 

Ian R

 

I think that was me that instigated that discussion Ian, recounting the tale from an old Doncaster paint shop man when he recounted making shorter lines slightly narrower than longer ones as a trick to preserve proportions and daring to suggest that some photos may indicate that it was the case.

 

Nobody else had ever heard of it and everybody just told me I was wrong, so I ended up wishing I had never mentioned it.

 

Tony Gee

 

[Iain.d]

A few weeks back I started building some Peco Parkside container wagons; they are now finished. They were a straightforward build, I have only added brake safety loops, Gibson sprung buffers, Roxey screw couplings and my own concocted container fasteners. These comprise Roxey shackles and hooks, some cheap chain and dampers made from brass tube. They’re a bit overscale but I think they look okay.

 

From L-R: Conflat A with BD Container, LNER Conflat S with DX Container and Conflat A with FM Container.

 

The Conflat S has no room under the floor for weight so I wrapped some lead sheet (40g) in tinfoil, painted it a gungy dark green to represent a tarpaulin and stuck it in the bottom of the container and then, over that, fabricated some thin strips of plastic card in a mesh shape to look like some wooden formwork. The container lettering transfers provided with the BD kit are white, I'm not sure they should be - all other lettering on containers I've seen in colour images suggests yellow. They have been reasonably heavily weathered and dirtied using dry brushed acrylic and washes of Citadel Nuln Oil and Agrax Earthshade. I seem to get on better with these washes than some of the others I have.

 

 

I also started these two Slaters MR cattle wagons, bought here on RMWeb a few months or more back. I have decided to vary them slightly, the RH one with internal rails will be finished in MR colours and numbering and brake gear on one side only. The LH one will be BR bauxite with externally attached rails and brake gear on both sides. Both have Hornby 8 spoke wheels and will have Gibson sprung buffers and screw couplings fitted.

 

 

And I dug out this ancient WSM etched brass 7 plank PO wagon which I bought off eBay, still sealed in the box, a while back. I’ll also look to put it together in the near future. Not sure about using the wheels though.

 

Kind regards,

 

Iain

Edited April 1, 2022 by Iain.d
Add a bit. Reload photos.

[jwealleans]

I remember seeing that WSM kit and being briefly tempted.... then I remembered how awful their C1 kit was.   I'll be interested to see how it turns out.

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, jwealleans said:

I remember seeing that WSM kit and being briefly tempted.... then I remembered how awful their C1 kit was.   I'll be interested to see how it turns out.

I tried to build the WSM C1, Jonathan.

 

But gave up and used some of the bits for something else; the tender, I believe.

 

I made better progress with the same firm's J6..............

 

 

But not much! 

 

At least the scratch-built chassis still runs really well.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

[jwealleans]

We do have a WSM C1 on Grantham, Tony.   I can't take the credit for it, it was built by the late Phil Giffen, a lovely man who was President of Ely Club when I joined.   It was showing its age when used on the layout in the early days:

 

I repainted and detailed it and put a modern mechanism into it.   It's also been weathered (I must get round to weathering the others).   It seems to be camera shy too: I have well over 500 pictures of Grantham and this is the best I can manage of it, behind the B17 on shed.

 

 

Phil made an excellent job of building it, within the limitations of what is a very poor kit.  I was impressed to find, when checking details, that he'd correctly removed the smokebox saddle for 4411 as it was one of those which was never fitted with one when the valves were changed.

[gr.king]

12 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

An interesting session running those latest W1s..............

 

I fitted the flanged rear wheels to the LNER version. It'll (just) negotiate 3' radius curves, but one can hear the flange 'squeal'. They also caused considerable drag, though 11 Pullman cars (some with metal sides and cast metal bogies) proved an easy job.

 

Is it not almost inevitable that there will be squeal and drag on most model railway curves when wheels towards the end of a loco of that length are provided only with side-play and are thus compelled to "crab" around bends with flanges grinding against the rail heads? The decent manufacturer would at least provide clear scope for their mounting in a bogie,  a pony / bissel truck, or radial axle boxes so that the axles remain reasonably square to the rails and the flanges in line with the rails.