Why are the J94/WD austerity 0-6-0's Unloved?

[Jenny Emily]

The Austerities were/are great. My only chance of seeing working steam were the last remaining Austerities, and as a child I used to beg my Grandfather to take me to climb all over the Cefn Coed gate guardian, which I believe is still there looking sorry for itself in the carpark.

[glenng]

I like them here are my 4 N gauge J94's on shed.

 

[Torn-on-the-platform]

For any non believers, here's some I prepared earlier:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8oNkIWyw1A

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDhrUL9YBTY

 

Blazing saddles was a great event! I don't remember it being particularly busy, but a gala in March on one of the less well publicised lines probably won't be.

 

The quadruple header was a particular highlight. I'd also wanted to see Wilbert for a very long time!

 

 

http://chrisrailwayphotos.weebly.com/201213.html - more photos halfway down this page

 

Lakeside and Haverthwaite:

 

Isle of Wight (I recently saw someone say that the railway will be running without austerities this year):

 

Gwili:

[numpty]

In terms of using the engines as possible chassis and parts donors for replica projects, I think it is a great idea. Ok so we aren't building them anymore! but there are an awful lot of them knocking about.

 

I like them, short wheelbase and lots of grunt and power too them!

Personally I don't think any original steam locomotives should be used as donors for any new builds and the ones that have should be replaced with whatever original parts are left! Edited April 20, 2016 by numpty

[numpty]

Earlier this year I came across a black Austerity on the interenet that had just been overhauled for sale,priced at £175,000.So I went out and bought a lottery ticket however I didn't win!

I've looked for it since and haven't found it but it may have been removed.

 

With the quantity purchased by the LNER as J94s is there's no evidence that one was ever used on a passenger train or workman's train?

Did the the Chemins de Fer Tunisiens or any continental railway that had Austerities used them for hauling passengers/workmen? 

[avonside1563]

Earlier this year I came across a black Austerity on the interenet that had just been overhauled for sale,priced at £175,000.So I went out and bought a lottery ticket however I didn't win!

I've looked for it since and haven't found it but it may have been removed.

 

With the quantity purchased by the LNER as J94s is there's no evidence that one was ever used on a passenger train or workman's train?

Did the the Chemins de Fer Tunisiens or any continental railway that had Austerities used them for hauling passengers/workmen? 

The black austerity will be No.72 - Vulcan Foundry 5308, returned to steam at Llangollen three years ago, not sure where it is based at present.

[APOLLO]

Mucky aussies at Bickershaw here

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/67100-apollos-grand-days-out/page-3&do=findComment&comment=2212496

 

I love 'em !!

 

Brit15

[avonside1563]

Here's one that definitely isn't unloved, RSH7169/1944 'Mech Navvies' 71515 on the Pontypool and Blaenavon Railway and kept in top condition.

 

[Paul.Uni]

The black austerity will be No.72 - Vulcan Foundry 5308, returned to steam at Llangollen three years ago, not sure where it is based at present.

Currently at Spa Valley Railway

[Andy Kirkham]

I suspect this comment was 'tongue in cheek' .

.

Otherwise, every preserved / heritage railway in the UK is "inauthentic"

.

I mean, a Deltic or an "8F" at Arley, a Western at Watchet, 42xx at Kingswear or even a 'JA' at Barry Island ?.

.

Of course, if there was a strategic reserve somewhere that contained 'Hecate' and/or a Fordson railcar then the volunteers (and punters) at say the K.&.E.S.R. would be ecstatic.

I wasn't being tongue-in-cheek. To me, one of the chief pleasures of visiting a heritage railway is to sit on a station bench and contemplate the scene before me, imagining that I have been miraculously transported back to 1959, 1935 or 1910. Anything that doesn't fit the place or the era diminishes the illusion and my pleasure. I find the sight of a class 8 pacific on a branch line every bit as jarring as an austerity tank on a train of Mk 1s. If I had my way, preserved ex-GWR branch lines would be operated exclusively by panniers, prairies, auto-tanks and 2251's , plus any standards and LMS types (e.g. Ivatt 2-6-2s) that might be plausible, and perhaps a Hymek and (when it has been recreated) a D63XX.

 

I well recognise that this isn't practical, and I don't boycott railways that have a flexible motive power policy - but subjectively speaking the experience falls short of my ideal.

Edited March 30, 2016 by Andy Kirkham

[Torn-on-the-platform]

I wasn't being tongue-in-cheek. To me, one of the chief pleasures of visiting a heritage railway is to sit on a station bench and contemplate the scene before me, imagining that I have been miraculously transported back to 1959, 1935 or 1910. Anything that doesn't fit the place or the era diminishes the illusion and my pleasure. I find the sight of a class 8 pacific on a branch line every bit as jarring as an austerity tank on a train of Mk 1s. If I had my way, preserved ex-GWR branch lines would be operated exclusively by panniers, prairies, auto-tanks and 2251's , plus any standards and LMS types (e.g. Ivatt 2-6-2s) that might be plausible, and perhaps a Hymek and (when it has been recreated) a D63XX.

 

I well recognise that this isn't practical, and I don't boycott railways that have a flexible motive power policy - but subjectively speaking the experience falls short of my ideal.

 

I think that this is totally fair enough Andy. There is something special about the SDR and how it does just as you say. However, there are very few preserved lines that can historically justify the use of the larger locomotives and so many of these magnificent machines would be homeless and not at all viable! We'd have far fewer heavy freight types too. Surely its better to see a 28xx on a rake of Mk1s than not running at all?

 

On a different note, most preserved railways have been going long enough that early preservation is very much part of their history. Many railways owe so much to austerities and other industrial locos that held the fort in the 80s and 90s whilst the lines developed enough to buy and restore more appropriate motive power. I always think that it is a shame when such a loco moves on, no longer fitting into the picture, despite having been such economical servants, without which many railways might not have survived.

[Mark Saunders]

I think that this is totally fair enough Andy. There is something special about the SDR and how it does just as you say. However, there are very few preserved lines that can historically justify the use of the larger locomotives and so many of these magnificent machines would be homeless and not at all viable! We'd have far fewer heavy freight types too. Surely its better to see a 28xx on a rake of Mk1s than not running at all?

 

On a different note, most preserved railways have been going long enough that early preservation is very much part of their history. Many railways owe so much to austerities and other industrial locos that held the fort in the 80s and 90s whilst the lines developed enough to buy and restore more appropriate motive power. I always think that it is a shame when such a loco moves on, no longer fitting into the picture, despite having been such economical servants, without which many railways might not have survived.

 

The same can be applied to the 14X series of Pacers and Pay Trains!

 

Mark Saunders

[avonside1563]

I wasn't being tongue-in-cheek. To me, one of the chief pleasures of visiting a heritage railway is to sit on a station bench and contemplate the scene before me, imagining that I have been miraculously transported back to 1959, 1935 or 1910. Anything that doesn't fit the place or the era diminishes the illusion and my pleasure. I find the sight of a class 8 pacific on a branch line every bit as jarring as an austerity tank on a train of Mk 1s. If I had my way, preserved ex-GWR branch lines would be operated exclusively by panniers, prairies, auto-tanks and 2251's , plus any standards and LMS types (e.g. Ivatt 2-6-2s) that might be plausible, and perhaps a Hymek and (when it has been recreated) a D63XX.

 

I well recognise that this isn't practical, and I don't boycott railways that have a flexible motive power policy - but subjectively speaking the experience falls short of my ideal.

So how does an Austerity in its correct environment, as at Foxfield Colliery on a rake of 16T minerals, sit with that?

[avonside1563]

[Andy Kirkham]

So how does an Austerity in its correct environment, as at Foxfield Colliery on a rake of 16T minerals, sit with that?

Nothing wrong with that at all 

[numpty]

I would rather sit and ride in a BR mk 1 or 2!

[numpty]

I know they're a bit like a hens tooth but would anyone have an  unbuilt Airfix J94/ Austerity kit that they might sell?

 

The real blue one at Foxfield looks as if its been on a diet now the boiler has been removed and the saddle tank is resting on the frame.

 

What are the two locomotives in the yard? One's a 0-6-0 saddle tank (Bagnall?) that has a seroius case of tin work especially the saddle tank and the other is possibly 0-4-0 in fresh shiny black?

[avonside1563]

The ones you are referring to are Peckett 1567/1920 'Ackton Hall No3' and Manning Wardle 1207/1890 'The Welshman'. Both are 0-6-0 ST, The Welshman is lacking it's crank axle due to flaws found in the cranks whilst it was being restored at Chatterley Whitfield Mining Museum. There are definite plans for Ackton Hall to be overhauled in the next five years and then look at The Welshman.

[numpty]

Why does it take so long to overhaul a steam loco?

 

Is it money/man power or lack of skills that results in a long time envelope?

 

It seems to me with most heritage railways that  by the time one locomotive gets overhauled there seems two  or more waiting.
 

I'll be worm food by the time some of these locomoives get back into steam.

[Gordon A]

Why does it take so long to overhaul a steam loco?

 

Is it money/man power or lack of skills that results in a long time envelope?

 

It seems to me with most heritage railways that  by the time one locomotive gets overhauled there seems two  or more waiting.

 

I'll be worm food by the time some of these locomoives get back into steam.

 

What has become worm food can be easily replaced.

 

Last year we took RSH 7151, a 6 wheeled industrial, out of service. The cost of the overhaul is said to be in six figures.

 

There are other major projects that need funding such as a restoration shed and extending the line with all the costs involved in that.

 

Gordon A

[avonside1563]

Why does it take so long to overhaul a steam loco?

 

Is it money/man power or lack of skills that results in a long time envelope?

 

It seems to me with most heritage railways that by the time one locomotive gets overhauled there seems two or more waiting.

 

I'll be worm food by the time some of these locomoives get back into steam.

With unlimited money to throw at a project and full time workers with no other commitments the timescale can be very short (6-12 months) but as most restorations involve individuals or groups raising funds as they go this can dictate the timescale. At Foxfield we have a team of four, plus others as available, maintaining the running fleet and managing overhauls. At present there are two locos under overhaul and four under long term restoration. What is needed is more money and more manpower and that doesn't just go for Foxfield. All preserved railways are struggling from an aging volunteer base and not enough people coming forward to replace them.

[numpty]

Unfortunately I'm irreplaceable!

 

Luckily the Foxfield has two very fine Austerities.

 

For such a small team they are doing a grand job!

 

Even if heritage railways managed to extend their facilities they still seem to need more and

everything (in terms of rolling stock) really needs to be under cover to give it some protection

from the elements.

 

I'm not sure how revenue is gained for heritage railways other than donation,sponsorship,

grants and walk on / walk off freight(which only probably covers the electricity bill) or how the left overs

get divided up.

 

It's unfortunate the Foxfield has competition close by and until recent years I was unaware that they

both existed.I went to Foxfield the other day but due to their sad loss nothing was running which

was understandable.I ended up at the other where I met an American steam buff that was travelling

around the UK visiting heritage railways and he didn't know that both the railways existed either!

 

If I lived five minutes down the road I'd become a volunteer!

 

On another note is Bellerophon strictly an Industrial loco with its past history of the annual trek to the seaside? I would have thought that would make it a mainline express loco,well out of place on an industrial line.

I must admit it's a gem!

Edited April 20, 2016 by numpty

[Poggy1165]

Funnily enough, one of my first railway memories is being taken by my granddad to see 'the saddle tank' shunting Gorton yard. I didn't know at the time, but that saddle tank was a J94 Austerity.

 

I think some enthusiasts have a bit of a 'snob' attitude (for want of a better term) towards industrial engines, and Austerities are perceived as such. 'Not Quite Our Class Dear'. However, I can't but think that they're ideal for many Preservation line duties, such as working short trains over fairly short distances. Sadly, small, main line locos that would have been equally ideal were mostly scrapped, not preserved. 

[Reorte]

I wasn't being tongue-in-cheek. To me, one of the chief pleasures of visiting a heritage railway is to sit on a station bench and contemplate the scene before me, imagining that I have been miraculously transported back to 1959, 1935 or 1910. Anything that doesn't fit the place or the era diminishes the illusion and my pleasure. I find the sight of a class 8 pacific on a branch line every bit as jarring as an austerity tank on a train of Mk 1s.

I agree with that, and always like things to look as "genuine" as possible (although there's plenty I wouldn't spot). That said I'd rather any motive power over no motive power, and I'd rather an out of place locomotive running than it never having anywhere to run and hence no future. They're still wonderful machines in their own right that I like to see working.

[russ p]

There isn't anything wrong with a J94 and few coaches on fairly big railways in the low season they are very cheap to run.

The North Norfolk used to be like that but now seems happy running either a WD or 9F 2-10-0 with a a dozen or so passengers, probably why its always having appeals for everything it wants t do!

There are plenty of other loco's which look odd with passenger trains other than industrials.

Fine loco's they may be but J27s,Q6s to name two were never fitted with train brakes so couldn't haul passenger trains