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Hi,

 

I have been building Höchstädt for a few months. It's difficult taking photographs in a cramped garage, but I have a specific question.

 

I an incorporating a beer garden on the layout and have purchased a model of a picnic table (German = Picknicktisch). But when did they appear? Would they be appropriate for a layout set in 1960?

 

Bill

 

post-11383-0-61587300-1376300425.jpg

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I don't think they're particularly appropriate even for a present day setting.  The typical biergarten has long tables and benches, rather than anything we'd recognise from a beer garden at a UK pub.

 

Examples on Google.

Edited by Alastair-I

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I've just had a look and Preiser do a biergarten set in O, 65345 "Im Biergarten" with four figures and a table (Amazon.de).  It looks better than a modern picnic table.

Edited by Alastair-I

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Alistair,

 

Do you mean something like this?

 

post-11383-0-95323600-1376304994.jpg

 

Bill

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That's better.  With the right setting that will be fine.  The next thing to try and get right will be the size and shape of the glasses, which can be very regional in Germany.  Koelsch would be served in a 2-cl Stange, whilst in Bayern you might get your Helles in a 1l Maß.  Every type of beer has it's own size and shape of glass.

 

The first example, the picnic bench, is just too modern and doesn't look at all German.

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Höchstädt is set in the Fränkische Schweiz! I have made glasses by superglueing glass beads. Two for ½ litre. three for 1 litre. I've made about fifty but they don't photograph.

 

Bill

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Starting to look good, Bill!

Excellent and rapid progress.

Cheers,

John E.

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Thanks, John.

 

We had an interesting day. Set up was relatively easy and we gently started the timetable before the show opened. This was a good thing, because one of the three way points had to be attacked with files to get anything like reasonable running. We have decided to change the three way points to the Lenz product when they are available, operated by digital Cobalts. Meanwhile, the three way points have sliding switches and the Lenz points are digital - confusing!

 

Then the timetable had three trains in the station at once, causing near complete lock up. Timetable now changed.

 

The milk platform was deliberately located in an inconvenient position. The timetable said milk van arrives, and naturally it was shunted to the milk platform, blocking access to the freight platform. It now says shunt to carriage siding!

 

The big change will happen over the next few months. We were concerned that the loco coaling siding curves about an inch from the front of the baseboard. Also Joe Public can easily get to the stock in the fiddle yard. Not a problem at Sutton Coldfield, but there are some shows where someone wants to check just how free running the stock is..... So we will build some light weight boards along the front of the layout - scenicked for 16' and providing layout information in front of the fiddle yard.

 

I'll publish photos once I've understood the "how to" thread!

 

Bill

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O gauge bier benches and tables are available from Luetke-modellbahn.de - the picture will show you the correct form and if you are feeling rich they will sell tell them to you. A more serious issue is getting the correct livery on the bier crates and bottles .... German biers being so very local ...

Edited by Herr Dienstleiter

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A fortnight later ......

 

The Lenz three way points have arrived! They are manual, so there will be a trip to Kent Garden Railway to purchase four Cobalt point motors.

 

However Höchstädt is attending the Segog exhibition in three weeks' time, so we will keep the temporary points in the short term. The new points will be installed after Segog and before the Erith show in the New Year. I can install the passenger platform and maybe begin ballasting.

 

Meanwhile I have purchased the wood and ply for the front boards, which will also be finished before Erith.

 

Bill

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There is an active thread on "what makes one stay in front of a layout". One contributor has said he doesn't do Continental, another that he doesn't like DCC sound, a third that he abhors layouts operated from the rear. Fair enough, that's three people who will just walk on by but how do we hold the attention of the rest of the punters?

 

Some things are given - Höchstädt is an O gauge, German, steam era, branch line terminus, so that will limit the viewers. Other factors are pretty well fixed - it is 22' long, so exhibition managers will be prepared to budget for two cars and four operators staying overnight. This immediately imposes constraints because there will be times when there are only two operators, especially over the lunch break. And with two operating positions, we have a decision to make between running the layout or chatting to the punters. I think there is an issue here that the average punter is unaware of, because the exhibition manager has a limited budget and won't be prepared to book a layout requiring a plethora of operators requiring transportation and accommodation. An option could be to request two more badges from the exhibition manager and hire in local talent, with a quick training session after set up or before opening.

 

More thoughts later, Bill.

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Bill

 

I concur your points..

 

We have the same issues with 'Roundhouse' - its not British, its got sound although one operator does work from the front but then we use tech to do that bit so that falls foul of some!

 

We like chatting iwth viewers but then our operating sometimes goes down the pan if the relief operators are relieving themselves (i.e. not aorund the layout to help out ).

 

So whilst 'Roundhouse' , like yours may not have ticks in all the boxes, plenty of people do like foreign stuff and plenty more do like sound.

 

I enjoyed watching Hochstadt at the Sutton Coldfield do last month and look forward to seeing the layouts progress on here.

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Hey ho, I'm off to Bill's tomorrow to get some instruction on how to operate Hochstadt..... :scared:  :senile:  :locomotive:

 

Keith

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Which involves a 120 mile round trip. Which is taking responsibility to the viewing public very seriously.

 

Bill

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One of the strands on "what keeps one in front of a layout" is the veracity of the stock.  Like many others, I'm not a fan of the "anything goes"  layout, mixing stock from any corner of the relevant country.  And being a stickler for correct train formations, I'm disinclined to linger in front of a SR or BR(SR) layout if the operators don't understand that coaches ran in fixed sets.

 

So I hope to operate Höchstädt with the correct stock.  Because Höchstädt is 7mm, the stock is very visible, which is a good thing.  That is, unless I get it wrong, in which case it is definitely a very bad thing!  Höchstädt is set in the Fränkische Schweiz area of Bavaria during the summer of 1960. 

 

Some Bavarian stock was still extant, but the majority of trains comprised Thunderbox four wheeled coaches hauled by class 64 (2-6-2) or class 86 (2-8-2) tank locomotives.  Fortunately Lenz produce the coaches and the 64s. 

 

Some trains had post war 6 wheel stock known as Umbauwagen.  These were more typical providing the stopping services on secondary through lines but they are valid on branch lines and on Höchstädt are used on the through trains to Nurnberg.  Motive power is provided by a Prussian class 78 (4-6-4) tank - yes a few found their way to Bavaria.  Again Lenz make the coaches, whilst the locomotive is a Kiss product.

 

The early 1960s is an interesting time for enthusiasts of German freight stock.  The pre WW1 stock was still around, although being seriously culled, whist the 1950 developments were appearing in significant numbers.  The products of Lenz, Brawa, Schnellenkamp and MBW allow me to present a representative selection.  There are no cute beer wagons, almost everything is brown and as anonymous as possible.  The most recent acquisition is a brake van, which in German practice ran immediately behind the locomotive, which again will be a class 64 (2-6-2) or class 86 (2-8-2).

 

The locomotives all have sound and lights; the coaches also have lights.  Used correctly, these add an extra dimension to the operation of Höchstädt.  But the question is, will it hold the attention of the average punter?

 

Bill

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Bill has asked me to post a couple of photos of his layout at the SEGOG show at Petts Wood.

 

I will leave it to Bill to provide the full description.

 

Tony

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post-11270-0-25939400-1382909893_thumb.jpg

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Thanks, Tony.  To start with the photography.  I've had the same problem with black locos with red frames - they are very difficult to photograph, and the black painted cork, in lieu of ballast, is no help either.

 

The first photo shows the 06:30 arrival from Blindheim, comprising a BR 64 locomotive and three Thunderbox carriages.  The white semicircle is the end of the van collecting the milk churns. 

 

The second photo, with my ugly mug looming over the layout, has the loco in the head shunt, about to shunt the milk van on the rear of the train. It will then run round the train using the nearest track before departing.  The red brick building is the station toilet.  The station building was built by Peter Smith of Kirtley Models, and is about two foot long.  The track nearest the station is actually the freight line, the middle track is the passenger line (there will be a platform soon), and the nearest track is the run round. 

 

Bill

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A couple more photos of Höchstädt at Petts Wood.

 

Tony

 

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post-11270-0-48618400-1383403225_thumb.jpg

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......and in first pic can see my yellow shirt.......think at that stage I was trying to remember how to operate the Lenz handset......

 

Bill, saw that HobbyShop at Faversham had a Lenz V36 Diesel Shunter on offer.....will be collecting it on my next visit to the shop. Maybe another visitor for Hochstadt at Erith.

 

Keith

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Thanks again Tony.

 

The third photo shows the station throat. Very disorganised at the moment with the temporary trackwork awaiting the installation of the Lenz three way point. The furthest track will end up in the fiddle yard. It is a freight siding, servicing the half relief industrial buildings. These are made from plaster kits; lovely to work with, but boy are they fragile. So they are attached to the layout with "Velcro" and are transported separately. Beyond the buildings is the beer garden - a bit bare at the moment, needing a couple more trees and a population of beer drinking Bavarians.

 

The fourth photo is another half relief building, with my Opel Blitz parked in front.

 

And to Keith, sure, bring the V36 along. There should be refuelling facilities for your diesel locomotives before the Erith show on 25 & 26 January 2016.

 

Bill

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The Lenz three way points have been installed and Nick came over today to fit the four Cobalt point motors.  These are the digital version and Nick had already programmed them with the relevant numbers.

 

I have spent several mornings adjusting the trackwork to suit the different geometry from the temporary Markway points.  Also one of the points had to be moved about four inches so the Cobalts cleared a trestle.

 

This evening is being spent painting one of the points.  The rails are now "rusty" and the sleepers are being weathered; however it's bl**dy freezing in the garage so I've popped back into the house to warm up.

 

Bill

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Great news Bill,

 

.....no more derailing problems leaving the fiddle yard then :imsohappy: .

 

I've now got the V36.....could you program address "36" on your Lenz stuff. Thanks.

 

Looking forward to Erith :locomotive: .

 

Keith

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