A rare day out by train

[Joseph_Pestell]

It's not often that I get to travel by train these days. And even then, it's usually only a trip to London on an SWT 159. So I was really looking forward to my trip to Newton-le-Willows last week to collect a car. I nearly ended up coming home by train as well but that is the subject of another thread.

 

Having an appointment for a breakfast business meeting (don't you just hate those?), I could not get a train from Gillingham until after 9. First lesson is to read the timetable properly. Since I usually take the 08.12 train to London, I thought that my train would be at 09.12 and it looked as though I would miss it. But my luck was in as the train does not in fact leave until 09.18. 

 

An uneventful ride to Basingstoke apart from the on-train ticket collector wanting to know if I planned to travel via Clapham Jct. Why would I when there is a good connection at Basingstoke onto a direct Manchester train? But perhaps it could be quicker to go with changes at Basingstoke, Clapham Jct, Watford Jct/Milton Keynes? Seems unlikely and it certainly was not offered by the timetable on internet. Anyway, although it would have been more interesting in many ways, I stuck with my original plan.

 

About 20 minutes wait at Basingstoke for the XC service which gave me some time to compare Class 444 and Class 450 units. Confirmed my thoughts (another thread here) that the units have a lot in common and it should be possible to build a 444 using components from cheap (£99) Bachmann 350. A 450 arrives at Platform 4 only shortly before the XC service is due. A lady rushes onto the platform and asks if it is going to Manchester!!!

 

Carefully choose to get in fourth carriage of Class 221 as I want to be closer to footbridge at Piccadilly. What a muppet! Despite years of using Reading station, do not give thought to reversal there.

 

My first long journey on a Voyager. I know that they get a lot of criticism but I find it OK apart from when the engine is idling. So much shaking that one wonders when the engine raft is going to drop off from the body.

 

Quite a long turnround at Reading. I could have got off and had a closer look at all the work. Leaving over the new viaduct westwards, one realises just how much work has gone into all the new chords, roadways, etc.

 

Plenty of progress with electrification along the stretch to Didcot. One thing that surprises me here and at other points during the journey is the number of worksites that we pass. Plenty of personnel at trackside and yet no apparent speed restrictions.

 

As always plenty to interest as one passes Didcot GWS. Interesting too to stop at Banbury and compare with Ian's model.

 

Another lady with little knowledge of train services gets on at Leamington. As we get to Coventry, she tells her travelling companions that we will be stopping at Lea Hall!

 

They may be spending a lot of money rebuilding New St. Not much sign of it at platform level. Still the dreary dark place that it has always been since electrification. Quite a crowd of trainspotters there. Probably the same ones who were there 50+ years ago in their shorts. And we worry that we do not have enough newcomers to railway  modelling.

 

It's a mighty long time since I last travelled to Wolverhampton by train. Rather grim around the railway with much derelict property. Just north of the station, a start has been made on demolishing the lovely M&B (Springfield?) Brewery. But they seem to have stopped halfway through leaving a very dangerous looking structure. What's going on there?

 

Stafford uninteresting but they seem to be putting in an extra platform using the old GPO line.

 

I was interested to see the new chord at Norton Bridge. Only having seen sketches in Modern Railways, I had not realised what a massive project this is with the new lines going a long way west of the WCML so that they can get round the village.

 

Past the lovely North Staffordshire buildings at Stone and Stoke, this stretch of line is definitely in need of the tree clearance teams seen elsewhere on Network Rail. Many of the catenary gantries are well into the jungle.

 

Finally into Manchester Piccadilly and a trek across to Platform 14. Still not that many of the newly-electrified services using this platform. My connection to Newton-le-Willows turns out to be a well-worn and rather crowded Arriva Wales Class 150 on its way to Llandudno.

 

All-in-all, a good trip. I was amazed at how busy the railway was everywhere and yet, as ever, I am still mystified that the railway can have that many passengers, sky-high fares and still be losing shedloads of taxpayers' money. If I had not been collecting a car, it would have been cheaper for me to have hired a car for the day and paid for fuel than the rail ticket cost (£112). And the road journey (about 3.5 hours) would have been far quicker than rail (6 hours).

 

 

 

 

[Grovenor]

 

And the road journey (about 3.5 hours) would have been far quicker than rail (6 hours).

Gillingham to Newton-le-Willows in 3.5 hours, you'd be driving very fast!

Keith

[Fat Controller]

Gillingham to Newton-le-Willows in 3.5 hours, you'd be driving very fast!

Keith

And if it was on one of the days when the M6 shut after an accident (twice last week, I think), it would have taken a heck of a lot longer.

[lmsforever]

Motorway food ,motorway lorries ,motorway idiot drivers you are welcome give me the train every time chance to relax also chat to some interesting people last time I went to Glasgow met a very interesting engineer .

[cunningduck]

a very interesting engineer .

Are you sure?

[stewartingram]

Motorway food...

The 21st century equivalent of the infamous BR sandwich?

Stewart

[DavidLong]

In a couple of weeks I will be going for the day to Larkrail at Bath and I will be going by train from Manchester. I would not relish a 365 mile round trip drive especially using M6/M5 on a Saturday in July! The cost of £49.50 return, with a Senior Railcard it is true, compares favourably with the cost of diesel for my C-Max especially considering the time standing with the engine idling on a motorway. I do have to throw myself on the mercy of a Cross-Country Trains Voyager and my 'window seat' will probably be next to a blank panel but all-in-all I wouldn't do the journey otherwise.

I usually go to the Wells show in August but can't make it this year but when I do go I have to factor in the cost of a night away. I'd use the train but B.R. were thoughtless enough to withdraw all services to Wells back in the '60s and I don't fancy rattling across Somerset in a bus.

For many long journeys, especially of the day sort, I will always consider the use of rail. Getting to London from Manchester these days is a doddle, my only regret is the high cost of fares on weekdays if you want to leave early in the morning.

 

David

[Mike Storey]

Nice description Joseph! I very rarely get to travel on British trains, living in France, but I spent a month recently in Hebden Bridge, for family reasons, but used the train many times, once to Burton for DEMU, and many times to Leeds, Manchester and elsewhere. Not one journey was late, not one connection missed, all staff were very helpful (my wife uses a wheelchair) and the service frequencies were incredible, even on Sundays. (Very different from when I was commuting from Malton some 20 years ago). Most trains were really busy.

 

When I compare that to our local services here, I weep. You just don't know how well off you are in the UK for trains, despite the costs.

[Joseph_Pestell]

Nice description Joseph! I very rarely get to travel on British trains, living in France, but I spent a month recently in Hebden Bridge, for family reasons, but used the train many times, once to Burton for DEMU, and many times to Leeds, Manchester and elsewhere. Not one journey was late, not one connection missed, all staff were very helpful (my wife uses a wheelchair) and the service frequencies were incredible, even on Sundays. (Very different from when I was commuting from Malton some 20 years ago). Most trains were really busy.

 

When I compare that to our local services here, I weep. You just don't know how well off you are in the UK for trains, despite the costs.

 

Very fair comment, Mike, about the service frequencies these days. Very few rail networks in the world come close to offering what we have here in that respect.

 

Others have remarked on catering. As dreadful as most motorway services are (I usually pull off in search of a traditional pub), the catering on trains is also still atrocious. Warm lager anyone? And at 4 times the price it is at my local shop where they keep it in a fridge.

[roundhouse]

I often break up the rail fares into separate parts of the journey. as it can be cheaper.

 

We used to be able to get very cheap advance tickets ot Manchester direct form Redhill but when those services were withdrawn the price shot up. However it can some times it can work out quite cheap booking to Reading and then from there on an XC Advance ticket.

 

The only down side is if you miss the connection on the first bit of the journey, you may have to pay again but luckily for us we often end up with a 30  minute wait at Reading and of late having a monthly travel card its cheaper to go on Virgin out of Euston.

 

Much prefer to go via Banbury though!!

[The Stationmaster]

I did a bit of a delve on the price of a ticket from Gillingham (one of 'my' stations several decades ago) to Manchester and was very surprised to find that by far the cheapest fares were 'via London' - struck me as rather odd for this day & age.

[roundhouse]

I did a bit of a delve on the price of a ticket from Gillingham (one of 'my' stations several decades ago) to Manchester and was very surprised to find that by far the cheapest fares were 'via London' - struck me as rather odd for this day & age.

 

 

Our upcoming trips up North  this summer on a Friday night are first class Advance tickets on both Virgin West Coast and East Coast from London which are still cheaper than using XC standard Advance tickets for a similar length of journey!!

[Lady_Ava_Hay]

I did a bit of a delve on the price of a ticket from Gillingham (one of 'my' stations several decades ago) to Manchester and was very surprised to find that by far the cheapest fares were 'via London' - struck me as rather odd for this day & age.

 

Where did you do the delving Mike? Anything to do with XC on TheTrainline is expensive but if you look at Virgin Trains it is light years cheaper for advance bookings.

 

I thought that Virgin had relinquished/lost the XC franchise so didn't look there until after I had booked Bournemouth to Manchester by air.

[roundhouse]

XC and Virgin have been two separate entities for some years now.

 

I tend ot use www.nationalrail.co.uk then when you select the fare you want, you can then choose who to book it through.

 

Normally no commisionon tickets from the Train Operating Companies.

[Joseph_Pestell]

I did a bit of a delve on the price of a ticket from Gillingham (one of 'my' stations several decades ago) to Manchester and was very surprised to find that by far the cheapest fares were 'via London' - struck me as rather odd for this day & age.

 

Computer quoted me about £14 more for via London. Journey time would have been about 30 minutes quicker.

[DavidLong]

Rule number 1 - never use the Trainline as you'll be charged for the privilege of using their service (see Barry Doe in about every other issue of RAIL!). As above I usually check times and tickets on National Rail Enquiries (http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/) and then book with a train company, usually in my case Virgin. That's how I booked my tickets to Bath which uses two TOCs, Cross Country and FGW, neither of whom are Virgin!

I try to avoid Cross Country where possible as they are expensive, the trains are usually crowded and they use Voyagers. On a couple of occasions I've needed to travel from Manchester to Southampton and I've used Virgin to Euston and SWT to Southampton. There isn't much difference in time and in both cases was much cheaper than using Cross Country.

Incidentally, I've noticed that if you have an Advance ticket it is no longer a requirement to sit in the seat that has been allocated to you. I never bothered anyway as the Virgin reservation system always seemed to interpret my requirement for a window seat as a desire to sit next to a melamine panel. I am one of the few remaining people who likes to get on a train and simply look out of the window. I've been travelling the WCML for almost fifty years now and I still love the view from the train.

 

David

[Talltim]

Where did you do the delving Mike? Anything to do with XC on TheTrainline is expensive but if you look at Virgin Trains it is light years cheaper for advance bookings.

 

I thought that Virgin had relinquished/lost the XC franchise so didn't look there until after I had booked Bournemouth to Manchester by air.

The Trainline is probably the most expensive way to buy tickets because they charge commission.

The all tickets should be available to all retailers* and should be the same price before commission/other charges. XC Advances will be available on the Virgin site and Virgin Advances on XC's, for example

*Excepting some TOC only tickets

[Talltim]

I often break up the rail fares into separate parts of the journey. as it can be cheaper.

 

We used to be able to get very cheap advance tickets ot Manchester direct form Redhill but when those services were withdrawn the price shot up. However it can some times it can work out quite cheap booking to Reading and then from there on an XC Advance ticket.

 

The only down side is if you miss the connection on the first bit of the journey, you may have to pay again but luckily for us we often end up with a 30  minute wait at Reading and of late having a monthly travel card its cheaper to go on Virgin out of Euston.

 

Much prefer to go via Banbury though!!

You shouldn't have to pay again as it counts as one journey, even if it spread over multiple tickets

[roundhouse]

Rule number 1 - never use the Trainline

 

'Good at adverts,..............................'

[The Stationmaster]

Where did you do the delving Mike? Anything to do with XC on TheTrainline is expensive but if you look at Virgin Trains it is light years cheaper for advance bookings.

 

I thought that Virgin had relinquished/lost the XC franchise so didn't look there until after I had booked Bournemouth to Manchester by air.

Not that I need to of course but I wouldn't touch The Trainline with a bargepole - well known for rip-offs.  

 

I just did another check and again got an Apex fare (for tomorrow) via London on the 09.18 from Gillingham (yes, Dorset) and a nominated train from Euston for £55.50; £112.80 via Reading & Cross Country.  Those are fares quoted on National Rail Enquiries but you might find cheaper via a train operators website.

'Good at adverts,..............................'

 

Rip off for train tickets ...

[The Stationmaster]

You shouldn't have to pay again as it counts as one journey, even if it spread over multiple tickets

Unless it's a ticket valid only on a particular train of course  And even with multiple tickets the train actually has to stop at those stations or they are a place where you will be changing trains.

[Talltim]

  And even with multiple tickets the train actually has to stop at those stations or they are a place where you will be changing trains.

Unless one of the tickets is a season.

[Joseph_Pestell]

Not that I need to of course but I wouldn't touch The Trainline with a bargepole - well known for rip-offs.  

 

I just did another check and again got an Apex fare (for tomorrow) via London on the 09.18 from Gillingham (yes, Dorset) and a nominated train from Euston for £55.50; £112.80 via Reading & Cross Country.  Those are fares quoted on National Rail Enquiries but you might find cheaper via a train operators website.

 

Rip off for train tickets ...

 

Thanks for that info, Mike. I was not looking on trainline.com but that cheaper fare was not offered to me as it should have been. I think that an angry letter may be sent in the direction of SouthWest Trains.

 

This complete shambles of a fare system on the balkanised railway is a strong disincentive to travelling by train. Nobody likes to be ripped off.

[roundhouse]

I often spend many a luinch time looking for the cheapest tickets. some times we have ended up at a different destination because he fares where really high on that first planned destination. also the route to get there can be more convoluted. There doesn't seem to be any pattern either.

 

In a few weeks we go to Lancaster. It was cheaper than Preston even on the same train yet Carnforth was a lot dearer but the return journey is much cheaper from Carnforth than from Lancaster even though we will join exactly the same train at Lancaster!!!

 

Works out fine for us as we can have a few lunchtime beers in the Snug at Carnforth station.

 

A few years ago we always went to Exeter via Salisbury but these days it's now cheaper to go via FGW and you get reserved seats on those which you can no longer do on SWT.

[The Stationmaster]

Thanks for that info, Mike. I was not looking on trainline.com but that cheaper fare was not offered to me as it should have been. I think that an angry letter may be sent in the direction of SouthWest Trains.

 

This complete shambles of a fare system on the balkanised railway is a strong disincentive to travelling by train. Nobody likes to be ripped off.

It always pays (says he who doesn't pay) to check a variety of sources.  In my view I think the logical starting place is National Rail Enquiries before going to operator websites although others more practiced in the art might know better.  Roundhouse has also proffered some good advice about looking at close atlternatives and another tip which sometimes work is to not necessarily just look at the sites of the obvious operators - sounds daft but I understand that it sometimes works.

 

My son does the same with the continental administrations and can sometimes conjure some amazing fares out of them - such as finding cheaper fares for a Eurostar journey on the DB website if it happens to be a trip to Germany; it would seem that balkanisation works on mainland Europe as well.