Edinburgh Junction Posted October 21, 2009 Share Posted October 21, 2009 Hello! A week ago, I ordered 2 paints from Railmatch directly from their website via paypal. The money has been taken out, but no sign of the paints. I have emailed them, and no reply. Does anyone know what has happened to them? Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mike Bellamy Posted October 21, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2009 Hello! A week ago, I ordered 2 paints from Railmatch directly from their website via paypal. The money has been taken out, but no sign of the paints. I have emailed them, and no reply. Does anyone know what has happened to them? Cheers A similar question from a few days ago is here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php/topic/797-railmatch-models/ Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Depot Posted October 21, 2009 Share Posted October 21, 2009 As Mike says this question came up last week. However I would suggest filing a claim with paypal for non recept of items as a starting point. If ever there was a 'black list' pf shops to avoid this one would be a good starting point. No address or contact phone number advertised is a bad start... good luck Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted October 21, 2009 Share Posted October 21, 2009 I think we should be careful to point out that the difference between Railmatch Paints and Railmatch Models. Railmatch Paints can be obtained through many model shops the vast majority are very reliable. As it says on the can "Made by H.Marcel Guest Ltd exclusively for Howes Models Ltd., 12 Banbury RoadKidington, Oxon OX5 2BT T:01865848000" ... but I got mine through a reputable model shop. It might be worth letting the real Railmatch know (though they may do already) and then they may take the matter up with ebay or if a genuine retailer then they may revise their supplier/customer relationship. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edinburgh Junction Posted October 21, 2009 Author Share Posted October 21, 2009 Oh hell.... right, going to get the complaint to Paypal done soon, then order the paints from the more reliable Gaugemaster.... why do people do this! ITS SO ANNOYING!!!!!!!!!! And it means I can't continue with my 20 until they arrive Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trains4U Posted October 21, 2009 Share Posted October 21, 2009 Having had a look around the site, they would appear to be linked to, if not the same company as a company called Model Depot. Model Depot, 51 Copperfield View, Leeds, West Yorkshire, LS9 0BJ, England Telephone 0113 3685756 The websites are very similar and the Railmatch DCC fitting service is linked to purchases from Model Junction. The mere fact that there are several statents saying "We are not howes of Oxford" means that there is obviously a lot of confusion, and Howes have a very strong case to get them to stop trading using that name. Having looked at the address on Multimap, it appears they are based at a residential address. Avoid. BTW, we stock Railmatch paint... I hope this helps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted October 21, 2009 Share Posted October 21, 2009 Howes have a very strong case to get them to stop trading using that name. Unfortunately not so. Unless the term Railmatch is a registered trademark any sole trader can set up a business with that identity. However, a third party such as ebay could be selective in who it has as its customers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_t Posted October 21, 2009 Share Posted October 21, 2009 A similar question from a few days ago is here http://www.rmweb.co....ilmatch-models/ Mike Yes that's the trouble I had with them, and I've been waiting for the rmweb to come back to life before posting. On Thursday I filed a complaint with Paypal, and in the post on Saturday came some of the paint I'd ordered but not all. I also received a full refund via Paypal, from the seller. Now I'd be happy to forward on the difference, if the seller had replied to either of my emails or voice mail, but they haven't. I've since ordered the paint from Howes, on Sunday, and received paint on Tuesday.? I'll update that thread with this as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edinburgh Junction Posted October 21, 2009 Author Share Posted October 21, 2009 Having had a look around the site, they would appear to be linked to, if not the same company as a company called Model Depot Yea, I looked at the PayPal status, and it sayed that it was thru Model Depot, and I have phoned them, and they aren't in atm. So I left a message. Its all strange. Model Depot have the same website layout, makes me think that they are both the same, take the money, leave the products. Im really annoyed now. Oh well! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Clanger Posted October 21, 2009 Share Posted October 21, 2009 Having looked at the address on Multimap, it appears they are based at a residential address. Avoid. If those two sentences are linked, then that's the majority of small model railway traders you've just slagged off. And I thought the real villains hid behind PO Box numbers, like I do Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_t Posted October 21, 2009 Share Posted October 21, 2009 Yea, I looked at the PayPal status, and it sayed that it was thru Model Depot, and I have phoned them, and they aren't in atm. So I left a message. Its all strange. Model Depot have the same website layout, makes me think that they are both the same, take the money, leave the products. Im really annoyed now. Oh well! I wouldn't hold you breath waiting for a reply. As others have said, file a complaint. I did, and it worked.? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trains4U Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 If those two sentences are linked, then that's the majority of small model railway traders you've just slagged off. And I thought the real villains hid behind PO Box numbers, like I do It depends really on what are doing. Small cottage industries and specialist suppliers - no problem. but trading as, or appearing to trade as a model shop, from a residential address, is a bit off. You have to ask yourself if they are trading legally in terms of VAT and rates and all the other overheads associated with such a business. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 You have to ask yourself if they are trading legally in terms of VAT and rates and all the other overheads associated with such a business. I do not understand, why. Just because a business "trades" from a residential address does not mean that it is any less legitimate. I have dealt with many such businesses and indeed have run a number of my own businesses over the years from home, I have also had offices. They were all legitimate and were VAT registered. When I was a tax consultant I came across plenty of businesses that operated from a shop/offices that were not VAT registered some were not legitimate, some were (there is a registration requirement based on turnover, but it can be voluntary below that limit). The same was also true for businesses trading from home. Just because you operate from commercial premises does not make your business any more legitimate or bigger or credible than any other. Which is what makes such remarks offensive... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trains4U Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Just because a business "trades" from a residential address does not mean that it is any less legitimate. I never said that, and I feel that you are putting words in my mouth. I am referring specifically to the Model Railway trade. Most suppliers will only provide accounts to retail businesses which has a bricks-and-mortar prescence, the reasons being that they often cannot offer the same support as a genuine shop and that they run without the overheads, therefore gaining an unfair advantage over the those shops, which provide the suppliers with their support network. and they do not want to see it go to the wall. In this particular case, the lack of contact details on the website, and the fact you have to make assumptions and perform a degree of investigation in order to get some form of contact detail makes me question their legitimacy, even though they may be perfectly fine, the comments raised on here, plus the content of the site raises those questions. I do not disagree that there are many thousands of perfectly legitimate businesses (Connected to model railways or not) that operate from home and I have dealings with many of them, However, If I were a consumer, based on this evidence, I, in my own opinion would choose not to use this particular business. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I never said that, and I feel that you are putting words in my mouth. I'm sorry, but that was the way that i read the two sentences in your previous post. I am referring specifically to the Model Railway trade. Most suppliers will only provide accounts to retail businesses which has a bricks-and-mortar prescence, the reasons being that they often cannot offer the same support as a genuine shop and that they run without the overheads, therefore gaining an unfair advantage over the those shops, which provide the suppliers with their support network. and they do not want to see it go to the wall In the case of the larger suppliers (RTR models) it may may well be true - though I would also question their real motives. There is absolutely no reason why a high level of customer support cannot be provided by a business operated from home. It is certain that the supplier cannot make use of, and influence of, the "retailers" shop window to advertise their products. But that is not especially of benefit to the customer. You could argue that any retailer should be located in the high street and not in a business park, or must be located only in a large shopping center and not on a back street. None of that makes them any more credible as a retailer. Just because a business chooses to spend more of its turnover on "overheads" does not make it any more viable and certainly should not influence the decision of a customer to trade with that retailer. Any business should look long and hard at making such expenditure and the real reasons for doing so. If that is the only way they can trade certain items, because the big bully RTR suppliers only sell that way, or if the expenditure and hassle is more than covered by increased profit, then fine that's good business. But if it is just ego and the myth that they are one better than the guy working from home ... In this particular case, the lack of contact details on the website, caveat emptor as they say. though 2 unsatisfied customers (one of whom seems to have just had another one of those small supplier delays) does not make my mind up. But I still would not want the real Railmatch paints brought into disrepute by anything said here and the potential for confusion is considerable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_t Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 though 2 unsatisfied customers (one of whom seems to have just had another one of those small supplier delays) does not make my mind up. If that's me you're referring to, then I don't think it's just a "small supplier delays" - I tried repeatedly to get into contact with the supplier but they never responded, and they only sent my goods, incomplete, after I filed a complaint with Paypal. How long does it take to send a "sorry to delay your order, but I'm really busy with x y z" - that would have suited me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PhilH Posted October 22, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 22, 2009 If those two sentences are linked, then that's the majority of small model railway traders you've just slagged off. And I thought the real villains hid behind PO Box numbers, like I do But we know what you look like...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 How long does it take to send a "sorry to delay your order, but I'm really busy with x y z" - that would have suited me. In my case it took over 3 months of emails this year and another 2 months before the parts arrived. Last year another supplier took over 9 months to resolve an issue of non-delivery claiming even to have used recorded delivery, again not answering emails. But in both cases I did not feel the need to go public (though discussed with some by PM) and certainly not in a way that could be misinterpreted as a different supplier. This thread's title still suggests that the makers of Railmatch Paint are at fault. I maintain that is grossly unfair on that business. I'm really not comfortable at all with the whole concept of naming and shaming in any case on a public forum, especially where the problem is only poor standard of service and especially if they are in no position to defend the accusations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trains4U Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 This thread's title still suggests that the makers of Railmatch Paint are at fault. I maintain that is grossly unfair on that business. Indeed. Which is why, if I were running Howes, I would have them stop under "Passing Off" regulations, which can apply even if the use of the name is not intentionally used in order to confuse. I'll suggest to the mods that it is renamed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mod5 Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 Gentlemen there is some confusion here about which company we are talking about. I would suggest ALL comments are now left until the OP returns to tell us exactly which one it is as it is unfair to all at the moment to carry on like this. I have stated much the same in the second thread. Until the OP returns perhaps we can refrain from possibly barking up the wrong tree. I will not lock this at the moment and if anyone has anything constructive to add please do but other than that perhaps we could wait until we know who we are talking about. Regards Mod5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edinburgh Junction Posted October 25, 2009 Author Share Posted October 25, 2009 Its Railmatch Models that are the problem, rather than Railmatch paints themselves. Very sorry for the confusion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
great central Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 Model Depot are shown on the list of traders for the LYDCC show at Rawtenstall next weekend................. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoingUnderground Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 For what it's worth, recently I visited two quite well known model railway retailers to collect items. One when I got there was a house in a residential area. From what I saw it wasn't clear whether it was all offices or partly still lived in. The other was the traders home, and they took me into their office area whilst they got the goods for me. I got excellent service from both. I can think of two very well known parts suppliers who used to be on the exhibition circuit but now only do mail order/internet selling. Given the high level of rent and rates for retail premises in towns it is entirely understandable that some traders will trade from home by mail order/internet and may also take stands at swapmeets and shows. I agree that mail order/internet robs us of the opportuity to see the models in the "flesh" before we buy, and that the folks who do trade from home without a showroom do in part live off the traders who do have showrooms - we see it at X's shop don't like the price and then buy from Y's web site where it's cheaper. Incidentally the same accusations of living off your competitors were levelled at Comet electrical when it first started selling domestic appliances direct from its warehouses in the 1970s. So I don't think it's fair to criticise traders who choose to work from their own home. But I do agree that we would be the losers if all traders were to go that way as it is good to see items for real before you buy, as well as the seeing the items that you want but just can't quite afford at the time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 For what it's worth, recently I visited two quite well known model railway retailers to collect items. One when I got there was a house in a residential area. From what I saw it wasn't clear whether it was all offices or partly still lived in. The other was the traders home, and they took me into their office area whilst they got the goods for me. I am in the insurance industry and this post got me going. I just sincerely hope that these home traders realise that any business run from your home involving visitors, cash and stock is invalidating your home insurance. I also hope they are registered with the Council as traders at home and are liable for business rates. Better for everyone if you stick to trading in person with your local shop and use the Internet as a tool for supplies that the shop does not stock or can obtain easily or, more pertinently, for second hand goods only. As in most businesses, cutting corners increases margins and encourages price cutting. Caveat emptor still applies. Even more so with unregistered traders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoingUnderground Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I am in the insurance industry and this post got me going. I just sincerely hope that these home traders realise that any business run from your home involving visitors, cash and stock is invalidating your home insurance. I also hope they are registered with the Council as traders at home and are liable for business rates. Better for everyone if you stick to trading in person with your local shop and use the Internet as a tool for supplies that the shop does not stock or can obtain easily or, more pertinently, for second hand goods only. As in most businesses, cutting corners increases margins and encourages price cutting. Caveat emptor still applies. Even more so with unregistered traders. Dave, Aren't you jumping to conclusions. I have no idea what they have done about insurance, rates, nor VAT, and as I didn't mention the traders, neither have you. I note that you said nothing about them correctly declaring their profits on their income tax returns. I get the impression that many traders at swapmeets are just doing the same, they must store their stock somewhere and they plainly don't have shop premises. So are you saying that traders who only sell at exhibitions and store their stock at home are equally in the wrong? Trading from home is the only way that many new businesses can get started. Others find it is the only way they can survive. I think that you are putting your head in the sand if you think that only secondhand goods can be picked up of the internet without any moral or ethical or legal problems. I can think of one individual, or possibly two, who from my experience seem to be running a secondhand business through ebay from their own homes, having collected goods from their homes after working hours. Again I have no idea of their status from a tax, trading standards, legal or insurance purpose. EDIT: I agree with Kenton on this subject. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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