“ROUTE OF THE SHORTYS”

[NickBrad]

I confess, I wasn't aware of it so I wasn't involved. I am only requiring 2 more items of rolling stock now anyway so ebay is safe from me for a little while

[mikjd]

Alright, hands up everybody who got involved in the "davestoys88" sale on eBay last Saturday night? It wasn't just me, surely? How did you get on?

 

.... and I thought I had a few unmade kits stashed away.    I noticed the CLW chassis and parts, they still seem to be in demand.

 

 

Mick.

[Northroader]

Yes, there was a fantastic collection of old freight car kits, I really like putting the old Walthers ones together, but they're very hard to come across. I picked a reefer out, and put in a bid, but as you say, the CLW stuff was what caught my eye. I know, I've got one, but I've been running the chassis up and down through Englefield, and it's bedded down nicely, drive quieter, moving on lower controller settings, and I'm really fond of it, so....There was a completed chassis, two A bodies, and a B body on offer. I tried a bid on the chassis and an A body. Following Mrs. Robotron's fine example, I ended up on Saturday night 23:15 glued to the iPad. Sizing up the bids, I thought I'd go on the other A body, just in case. Bidding on the chassis had got to $114, with less than a minute to go, there's me going "allow another two bids, $2 plus $2 plus..., ,confirm bid, quick, now"...,then this millionaire appeared, going "let's stop dicking about, gentlemen.." and Bang, less than twenty seconds, and a $200bid appears! So, bye bye, chassis. I thought I might as well go for a coach which would be useful, so put in a reasonable bid on this. It didn't close for another couple of hours, so I went to bed. Breakfast time, there's me looking at the pieces. Reefer gone, coach gone, chassis gone, first A body gone, but, I'm the proud owner of the second A body. Why? you ask, well, I can do up it up for another line I'm interested in, and by undoing eight screws, swap the bodies on the same chassis. Not the most perfect solution, not a BOGOF offer, but I can run a PA for two different lines. I'm starting to understand why people hang round betting shops...

[F-UnitMad]

Some people don't like them, but there's a lot to be said for the use of 'snipe' programs, such as Gixen, which put in your bid for you in the final seconds.

It means you 1) don't have to be up at silly o'clock/auction end time, & 2) think about and enter your absolute maximum bid, rather than get caught with bidding fever. If yours is the highest bid, you win; if not - even if someone beat you by just £1 or $1 (remember their max bid may have been much more) - well so be it.

Also saves actually putting in your bid too early so others just have to keep bidding until they beat you.

[Northroader]

Well, it's got here, a day early, CLW PA body kit, just like the man said. I felt I had to post a picture of the packaging, to to demonstrate to eBay sellers, you know who I'm talking about, how to do the job properly. There's even some foam beads inside the kit box to stop rattling. Dave Miller, Haven, Kansas, excellent job.

[Northroader]

The PA is now ready for the paint shop, with the body fixed on to the chassis. I suppose I was too optimistic the first time they came together, since then I've spent some time shuttling it up and down repetitively, backwards and forwards, on the layout. It's bedded down nicely, no more wheelslip, quieter running, and lower controller setting. It has also gained my last pair of kadee 805s, so I can couple up. I needed to get something definitive on the current draw, and had another look at my multimeter. Normally I use this in the resistance setting to check continuity, although I have trouble with my hearing picking up the high pitched beep. Sometimes I use the voltage setting to see if a feed is coming through, and with both these settings use the leads in the same sockets, but to use it as an ammeter I have to place a lead in another socket, which I'd forgot to do. (Yes, I know) so have another go. Generally it starts rolling at about 1.4 amps, and can run light at slow speeds about the same. Putting it on four freight cars, one more than permitted length, only increases up a few tenths of an amp. If I give it a "hurry along" jolt with the controller, it will peak at around 1.9 amps. For a loco this size I suppose Englefield is a small line, but I love running it. The other figure I wanted to check is the weight. I thought my Weaver FA was heavy, 2 lb., 910 grams, but the PA comes in at 5 lb. 2 oz., 2300 grams!

I've added partitions inside the cab, so I can have a detachable floor with engine men on it, otherwise there's quite a hole behind the Windows, and I've added an extra dummy headlight. An interesting thing in contrasting it with the new body kit which arrived today, is they differ with the marker light/ number boxes on the nose. The new kit has the old style small streamlined type lying flat on the side, the other has the later pattern large size box mounted diagonally. More research to do.

Of course, there's a sequel to all this. Once I was into measuring current, I got the Weaver FA out, as I've also convinced myself that diesels with drive shafts running stem to stern are really a Good Thing, and so I dug out the bits I stripped off last November from where I'd hid them following Jasond's good advice, and put them back on, rather fiddly. Then plenty of up and down running in, which was needed after my reassembly, followed by a blast on my running in cradle. Running it on the layout and looking at the ammeter, it was in the range 0.7 to 0.9 amps. starting light to pulling trains. Those of you who were jumping up and down shouting "it's your controller!" can sit back with a satisfied smile, nodding sagely to themselves.

Edited June 14, 2016 by Northroader

[F-UnitMad]

Careful you don't choke on all the clag Alcos can chuck out...

[Northroader]

3:40 am??, I'm a bit worried about you! It's funny, isn't it, how we as modellers regard Alcos as fabulous legendary machines of great beauty, but if you were actually trying to run a train service with the real thing, they must have been a real pain in the a**e!

[Zomboid]

3:40 am??, I'm a bit worried about you! It's funny, isn't it, how we as modellers regard Alcos as fabulous legendary machines of great beauty, but if you were actually trying to run a train service with the real thing, they must have been a real pain in the a**e!

I suspect that the things we as fans/ modellers like about them are some of the same things that made them such a nuisance.

Except the styling. All those streamlined diesels were pretty good, but the PA, FA and EMD E & F units are pretty much the pinnacle of diesel loco styling. IMO, of course.

[shortliner]

3:40 am??, I'm a bit worried about you! It's funny, isn't it, how we as modellers regard Alcos as fabulous legendary machines of great beauty, but if you were actually trying to run a train service with the real thing, they must have been a real pain in the a**e!

My guess is Jordan is just in from work and is winding down before going to bed.

[Tove]

 All those streamlined diesels were pretty good, but the PA, FA and EMD E & F units are pretty much the pinnacle of diesel loco styling. IMO, of course.

 

Oooh, i think that EMD hit the styling for a diesel just right with the BL2`s..............

 

 

Brian.

[F-UnitMad]

My guess is Jordan is just in from work and is winding down before going to bed.

Was on a break, still at work, as it happened

[Northroader]

Besides working on my one and a half CLW Alco PAs, hacking and soldering brass, the big job this week has been sorting out the fiddle yard size. If you come into the loft, on the left there's a space to open the storage cupboard door, and then there's a continental BLT. Beyond this there's a fiddle yard, shared between this line and the Englefield baseboard, which is on past the fiddle yard. Since I took the decision at the start of this thread to run shorter trains, I can reduce the length of the fiddle yard, as both layouts are now using 48" cassettes. The fiddle yard is essentially a large tray, formed by a smooth panelled door, which I've trimmed down. I cut across one end, and glued in a wood batten to fill in the gap between the ply faces left at this end. There are ply strips front and back to keep stock from falling off, and I've added extra strips at the rear half of each end, as the yard is only entered nearer the front by both layouts. The new size is 50" x 27.5", 1270 x 700mm. The yard is just laid flat on a dexion trestle, the full length of the combined layouts, made from bits scrounged from all over. Nothing is bolted down, the cassettes are just laid on top and register with the outgoing tracks on the cassettes. Whichever line is in operation has the cassettes to the front. You'll see in the picture that there is plenty of room for four cassettes in use for Englefield, then a row of Chinese takeaway tubs with bits in, then two cassettes with continental shennanigans. The front road is empty but for a plug 4 1/4" x 3 1/4", 108 x 82mm, which I'm using to set up the cassette handles. At the front on the left hand side you can see my "running in" cradle. I took the picture with the yard clear of both layouts. Now it gets moved to the left, and the Englefield board also moved left to close the gap. This will give me space to start constructing the short extension at the far right hand end to complete the layout. It also allows better access to the right hand end of the layout, which at present is "shaded" by the end of the next layout, Washbourne, which lies at right angles across the end of the loft.

 

Edited July 3, 2023 by Northroader

[Northroader]

Hi! Northroader,

I was totally devastated when I realised how the dollar rate going up would affect you getting another PA kit on eBay. Promise I'll try and make it up.. All Dave wants to do these days is go off and get shafted by that fat German!! Can you believe???

Luv, Sam. xxxX

Edited July 3, 2023 by Northroader

[F-UnitMad]

£££ versus $$$ collapse..?? C'mon, if we couldn't laugh, we'd cry....

[NickBrad]

The issue at hand is that some investors, confidently bet that we would remain, pushing the value of the pound up, through their trading, (expecting to make a huge profit in the process). When the result was released, these same investors panicked and dropped that stock, sending the pound into freefall. In real terms though, it recovered remarkably quickly and we are no worse off than what we were 3 months ago. It does show how fickle the markets are though and how the few, control the many.

[Northroader]

 

Ohhh! They don't make 'em like they used to! Making slow progress with the PA body kit, here I'm clutching my trusty Weller 120 watter, which comes into its own on a job like this. Progress slowed down recently, as I took Mrs. NR on a much needed week's break. (3nights in Bournemouth and 2nights in Chester), so I thought I'd go over scratch building boxcars, as JAMO was interested some way back.

 

Exhibit A is one I made from a drawing in the 1947 model railroader Cyclopaedia, and it was pretty ancient then, being all wood typifying a 19th century job. The prototype body is a wooden framework supported by ferrous gussets and brackets. This is sandwiched by a layer of planking nailed on both sides, giving a strong unit, referred to as double sheathed, or 'inside braced'. Roof, ends, and doors are also timber. The underframe is wood longitudinals, which need bracing rods to spread the load from the middle of the car to the bogies. It was quite possible for a person to clamber underneath and perch on this framework, and in the Great Depression of the 1930s 'riding the rods' was used by people desperate to travel across America searching for work. I was lucky enough to run down some decals of the period for this car, but I doubt if any lasted past ww2. Car design went forward with the introduction of a built up steel girder to form the underframe, supporting the body, and taking all the stresses from the end couplers.

 

This shows a car under construction, in this case a reefer. It's just a box built from .060" plastikard, and I put a length of 2"x 1" inside to give some extra weight. There's a strip of straight grained hardwood, gurjun, to represent the central girder, and the bogies are screwed to this, with the kadees mounted on plastikard strip packing outside of this. The outside of the box has a layer of Evergreen sheet styrene cemented on. The vee groove sheet is a far neater job than any scribing I can do, but I have to confess the spacing is usually eyeballed rather than measured, using what I've got in stock.

 

Way back, when I was 12 years old, I was laid up with mumps, and mum brought a magazine to cheer me up back from a shopping trip to town. This was issue no,3 of the Railway Modeller, Feb./ Mar. 1950, and was the first model magazine I had ever seen. Thanks, mum. Inside they had a series running on model railroading by Reg Perrin, this one on boxcars, with the drawing shown here. I've added an inch scale for 1:48, also noted some doubtful items on the data panel. The car shown is one with a steel frame built up from pressings, and a single layer of planks on the inside, referred to as single sheathed, or 'outside braced'.

 

Much, much later in life, I finally got round to using the drawing and built the car. Some of this sort just about got to the 1950s, doing research I think they're more likely on the smaller class 1 lines, the bigger lines had gone on to introduce pressed steel sheets to replace the wood for ends, roofs, and doors, as these cars did take a fearful hammering. I've shown a CNR car like this some way back on this thread, there were a lot of this type about, but the steel pressings such as corrugated ends are much trickier to reproduce.

Edited July 3, 2023 by Northroader

[Northroader]

Having done the post on scratch building boxcars last night, digging round this morning I found an excellent source of references for anyone who's interested in doing this, even if it's on a HO base:http://designbuildop.hansmanns.org/a-guide-to-1920s-era-ho-scale-plastic-freight-cars/ happy hunting!

[Northroader]

And while I'm at it, giving out useful links, I frequently visit the "modelling the SP" site. Here's a boxcar similar to what we've been looking at for the M&StL, (interchanged with the SOO, Jordan!): http://modelingthesp.blogspot.co.uk/2011/12/modeling-project-m-box-car.html. The blog is very good, another article he did was on "signature" freight cars, typical freight cars you'd expect to see turning up on any line. You'll find it in the April, 2013 section. Also if you want to try and do proper operating, rather than bu**er about shoving any old car into any old siding, like me, he gives the full picture on how the paperwork was done.

[jasond]

Are you looking for an 'operating system'?  Each frt (and MoW if wanted) car has a 'holder' with its details and a pocket to hold a waybill with destination and car type on one side and where to send it when loaded/unloaded on the reverse.  There are other options like how long does it stay at an industry, wild cards (like, umm, all available D&H cars to the photo line-up, ...).  The first time I came across this was at the late Bill Lane's layout in London and it was so absorbing it didn't matter it was HO   I'll see if I can find it written down (up?) anywhere.

Jason

ps: nice scratchbuilding!

[Northroader]

TBH, Jason, I CBA. I've seen loads of bits on this, and the site I've just given gives exact replicas for the full size job, with all the ramifications, as well as the usual model systems you mention. As you say, it's the way to go, it's just my line is a bit on the small size, with very few cars. I suppose I'm doing more building than shunting, too, thanks for your appreciation of that and the offer, and for looking in. How's your new line shaping? I haven't spotted any thread starting up? Then there's your planned trip over the bounding waves to the land of the free, that exchange rate- ouch!

[jasond]

TBH, Jason, I CBA....

Yes I always try to do a CBA (Constraints Based Analysi... oh Can't Be Ar... thanks Shei...).  Wife's sorted that out then! 

 

New line?  First big board comes out of storage Tuesday.  It's one of the reasons I've started a Facebook page.  Main reason is that some O-scalers I know are not using RMWeb and there's good stuff to share.  OK if I put a link on it to your good pics above?

 

USA trip?  My host out there is a trader and I suggested a date that included one of his shows.  I suspect he would rather railfan without business worries so I may have to admit I've got enough projects already without buying more irresistible additions/bargains.  Exchange rate is, er, umm, annoying, but I CBA to waste time on what these damn politicians do 'for' us.

Jason

[Northroader]

God, that Facebook looks complicated, I asked my daughter to show me and she just muddied the water in me brain even more, but link away all you like. Sooo.., back to scratchbuilding wood sheeted boxcars. You can get so far using plastic sheet, but with later types with steel panel ends you have to get out and push, meaning resin casting. I did some of this way back, but never replenished my stocks after the first go. I made one pattern for a simple corrugated end out of plastic sheet, and I did quite a few using the end, roof and door from an Intermountain steel boxcar kit. I just dusted it with talcum powder as a release agent, built a low dam wall around it, lying face up, with the kids Lego blocks, and sploshed some silicon rubber mix over, with a decent thickness over the top of the pattern. I don't know if they use the same catalyst these days, the one I had made me feel like a scientist at Porton Down, definitely not something you could give a kid. Once it had cured, the back needed trimming, as there was a tendency for a meniscus to creep up the dam walls. Then turn the mould over, lying flat, with another dusting of talcum powder, and mix up enough two part resin to just fill the mould, without overfilling, as when it sets it is quite hard to file or sur form down to the proper thickness. Voila! - or you could avoid this malarkey and buy 'em. Looking at eBay there are cast brass jobs, when I go back to the quoted manufacturers it goes quite opaque, but I'm sure in the vastness of the USA there are cheaper plastic versions. Right, some pictures;

This is a double sheathed SPS car, which has corrugated ends in cast resin added.

 

This is a single sheathed version, built to the USRA design for the Ann Arbor, again with cast resin ends. Way back, my American modelling started in N gauge, progressing up through HO to O, and I had an N version of this car, which I really like the look of. I put it in my scanner, and enlarged the image to O for this model, -shocking, I know!

 

Another north west car, double sheathed for the NP, again cast ends. Serving a timber growing region these were a commonplace on the NP. They stood out in a crowd with the distinctive arched lettering, and the monad for the company herald. Seen these days on the Korean flag, it was an oriental symbol for yin and yang, and all that, and the NP liked it to symbolise the flourishing Far East trade out of Seattle, well, least ways, until Pearl Harbour. The other NP item was that the brake staff ended with a ratchet handle instead of a handwheel.

 

The distinctive feature of this car, a standard Harriman UP job, and one of their most numerous, is the roof. This is a special pressed steel job, termed a Viking. It's something I did buy, out of the bits and bobs box of those nice Quince Valley folks a long time ago. ( There, that's good for a link!) One other thing to mention, British freight cars have corners (1,2,3,4), American freight cars have ends, A and B. B is logically, the brake wheel end, and if you stand at B end looking at A end, then the side of the car on your left hand, is the L.H. side. Why this matters is the slogan "Serves all the West" was painted on the LH side, if you nip round the back, you'll find "Route of the Streamliners" is on the RH side. You'll find a lot of cars with different slogans on each side relate this to the brake wheel position.

 

The last car in this batch has the full monty, cast ends, cast roof, and cast double doors, so it can take auto traffic. You'll note the seam opening up along the top this side of the door shows the drawback of resin casting, warping and appreciable thermal expansion can give this problem.

Edited July 3, 2023 by Northroader

[Robatron86]

Very impressive work. I've been curious about doing my own casting, I'm sure it is as simple as you make it sound!

[Northroader]

Like I say, resin can expand and contract appreciably. I first found this out buying some commercially made resin based loads to fit inside a wagon. I trimmed them to just fit, and a few months later I found all the wagon corners cracked open. With this you need the proverbial "t*rd in a sock" fit. Plastikard sheet likes to go its own way as far as warping, and putting the two together... Not that I want to put you off, it might be less hassle to check what's available off a dealers shelf first. It also helps to make the mould perfectly flat, being silicone rubber they are quite floppy, and taking castings out you could find they already have a sag, which might add to the effect or not. Go on, try it!