Black Sheep Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 Howdo, My current project (hopefully about to hit reality as I expect to order baseboards soon!) involves a fair amount of sea on display and I'm trying to work out how to model sea spanning baseboard joins and would appreciate any advice on products, techniques and "this is how I did it" The expanse of water goes to the front edge of the board too just to add complication. The layout is in N gauge so nothing too course. Thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter220950 Posted January 8, 2016 Share Posted January 8, 2016 I'm struggling with a similar dilemma with 12ft of canal, the only things I have come up with so far are purely the thoretical ramblings of a disturbed mind, unfortunately I can't offer a 'been there done it' solution for sea. It also depends on how rough the water is to be. :- A separate section (Acrylic?) that slides in under the coastline that spans the joint but can then be treated to give the sea a texture and surface you need, this depends on how big an area you have, it's not practicable with mine. A separate material that will roll out onto the baseboard such as the vinyl materials used on display stands, and will take flexible paints and sprays, this will sit on the board but probably needs something like a harbour wall to butt up to. Application of cling film once layout set up over the ready prepared surface. Application of a strip of the matt sellotape once set up. Because I have a canal, with only a very light ripple it's in some ways easier, I think I'm going down the route of an experimental piece I did which was a clear vinyl type material that I sprayed the back of in a variety of greens and browns, this stuff was obtained from Dunelm and was around 1mm thick. Finally when all else fails cheat, given that you can't hide a crack like that in water can you disguise it? - A Pier perhaps?, Groynes? Breakwater?. Lifeboat Station and slipway? Good luck with this I shall be watching with interest to see if it can be cracked. Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium The White Rabbit Posted January 10, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 10, 2016 My starting point would be to use polycarbonate or thin plastic to dam the 'water'. Is the sea to be calm or rough? A join in a calm sea may be harder to disguise and I'd agree with Peter about hiding the join under a pier etc. For rougher seas, the water is not as clear and there's more scope for patches of seaweed and spray disguising joins. Whatever material you use to edge the baseboard joins, make sure two pieces are clamped together & cut at the same time, so you get matching profiles. Like Peter, I've not tried this myself yet, I've always avoided having joins in water as they are so difficult to disguise. Do you have a rough sketch & dimensions of the area in question? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HLT 0109 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Is there a way you can configure the baseboards so that the join(s) occur at the base of the sea wall or some other natural change in contours of the landscape? It may mean not having all boards the same size or (even) shape. I assume this is a portable layout which makes the planning more difficult. Harold. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runs as required Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 I've just enjoyed clicking through your links at the bottom of your original post, particularly the first headed by that very nostalgic 30s/50s era railway poster done with styalised use of flat blocks of colour (in those days poster paints, these days acrylics). The council minutes about post war reconstruction choices and the impending visit of Mr Atlee to Milliedale-on-Sea made delightful reading. So my suggestion would be for a presentation of the whole layout project as a 1940s/early 1950s 'vision of the future' type of town planning model which you deliver in that styalised railway poster manner. I believe it would make a very striking exhibition layout presented in the clothes of that long lost supremely optimistic era. Getting around eventually to how to represent the sea, it could be 3mm layers of ply wood (not plastic) painted in those greens/blues/mud/sand flat acylic colours. The free form nature of the ply layers could mean that the straight edges of the base boards could be juduciously hidden under the overlapping layers of ply. You might make the land forms in a similar styalised manner representing contours of the land, dunes etc. beloved by architectural modellers of that period. One thing I always liked about such exhibits was the way they used to colour code the existing town buildings in rusty browns and greys - and the new interventions were always tasteful pastel art deco colours beloved of Borough Engineers (i.e. way before Brutalist architects arrived on the scene). The very best seaside Borough models used to have lights that lit up the buildings (pea lamps I seem to remember they were called). dh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglian Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 I think the first idea suggested could work well – have a single piece of sea that slotted into the layout. Ian Rice has many interesting thoughts about layout presentation and how to disguise joins by assembling baseboards that are specially shaped to follow features to disguise joins. Does your layout have a beach? If so you could use a groyne. Peter could you not disguise the canal join with a lock? This would allow one stretch of water to slide just under the lower lock gates going a good way to hiding the join. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter220950 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Peter could you not disguise the canal join with a lock? This would allow one stretch of water to slide just under the lower lock gates going a good way to hiding the join. Unfortunately it's part of the unloading wharf at Cadbury's Bournville, so a lock won't work, though I did consider it. There is a narrowing point on the prototype, and I might put a small swing bridge in if I can't sort the issue, but the vinyl painted on the reverse side seemed to be the way forward. It won't, unfortunately, suit a sea-scape. Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglian Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 It's certainly a tough one. If you put anything over like a narrow boat it it'll draw the eye to it. The swing bridge sounds excellent though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted January 10, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 10, 2016 Will the layout ever move? If not you can mask the join as you build. My sea goes across a baseboard join and comes right out to the edge. The baseboards are 9m particle-board (the hard stuff) and once in place the gap was filled generously with a wood filler. Allowing that to go off and rubbing it down with fine sandpaper I then painted acrylics over the board to represent the colours pf the water. Next step was to check everything was exactly level before fitting a Plasticene border to the open edge of the baseboard in order to retain liquid. I then used Magic Water for the first two thin layers (with a couple of spots of paint mixed into the second pour as that suggests depth) then finished using Woodland Scenics Water Effects which can be sculpted into ripples and waves. It can also be painted to create foaming breakers. Any help? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Sheep Posted January 11, 2016 Author Share Posted January 11, 2016 Hi, thanks for all the replies. While I like the concept of a concept model it's not a route I want to go down at the moment. The layout may never leave the house, however I want to make it exhibitable incase I get the opportunity to do so, that and incase we do move house. There is already a pier planned to be on it, however it sits in the middle of a board, at the deepest point of the bay, however doing the water and beach to lift off in two parts to meet the sea-wall that is on the layout boards, splitting the sea / beach in half under the pier may work, however it wasn't going to go full depth of the sea area, but my mind is at ease that the concept is possible to model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dseagull Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 Just to give you some food for thought, as a huge fan of Iain Rice's writings, I've investigated the Jigsaw concept before; http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/1330/entry-11815-starting-the-jigsaw/ In that picture, the boards were pushed together, not clipped, and laying on slabs outside our back door - this was also straight after they had been cut, before any finishing. I am convinced it would have worked had I not been talked out of it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 Unfortunately it's part of the unloading wharf at Cadbury's Bournville, so a lock won't work, though I did consider it. There is a narrowing point on the prototype, and I might put a small swing bridge in if I can't sort the issue, but the vinyl painted on the reverse side seemed to be the way forward. It won't, unfortunately, suit a sea-scape. Peter If it wouldn't look too contrived it might be worth considering a toll on the canal, these islands on the BCN were reached by planks swung out over each narrow section which could be used to mask a joint. http://blackcountryhistory.org/collections/getrecord/GB145_p_2079/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Sheep Posted April 18, 2016 Author Share Posted April 18, 2016 Found a tutorial for modelling water and waves courtesy of our friends who model plastic ships: http://www.plasticmodelsworld.com/node/1052 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windhawk Posted May 14, 2016 Share Posted May 14, 2016 Don't know if you've progressed any further with this, but have you considered foam? If you attached it along the gap, and then painted it a similar colour, it may not make the join as obvious. I don't know how you would also get it glossy- maybe use PVA glue as it's a bit more flexible than alternatives? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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