Upcoming O gauge sale - End of the line at Marsh Lane

[Tove]

No problem Rich.

 

I`d completley miss read it in my mind!.

 

A side effect of building too much track in one go...(but more too follow on that)

 

I`ve also noticed elsewhere on here(RM) you`ve been tinkering with over head stuff,does this mean you have plan`s for elecies on the future layout as well.......

 

Brian.

[MarshLane]

No problem Rich.

 

I`d completley miss read it in my mind!.

 

A side effect of building too much track in one go...(but more too follow on that)

 

I`ve also noticed elsewhere on here(RM) you`ve been tinkering with over head stuff,does this mean you have plan`s for elecies on the future layout as well.......

 

Brian.

Hi Brian,

Long term - I wouldn't say no! Although that would move the layout from the North East to the North West, or at least somewhere on the WCML in the 1980s! Certainly if Heljan brought out an 84 or 85 in O I'm definitely interested!

 

Short-term, I'm looking at tinkering around with a Metro style system, based around T&W Metro, the thought being that it would run along the back of Marsh Lane Depot, with one or two units passing each other, and entering into automatic return sidings at each end, with a sprung point. It's all pie in the sky at the moment, but if I can get the OHL to look right, then given the success and enjoyment I've had with the shed, I might just have a bash at building a Metrocar!

 

Rich

[MarshLane]

Evening all,

Well a small amount of progress has been made.  The power rods for the overhead lighting are now in, fitted, and soldered to the lights and supply - it even works!  Soldering isn't my strong point (haven't done enough to become competent and as neat as i'd like to be!) but pleased with how its come out, and the rods make the whole thing neater than having wires all over the place.

 

 

 

The two rods perform the role of positive and negative, and just to make sure everything stays separate, the positives are all soldered on the 'east' side of each roof truss, while the negatives are all on the 'west' side.  I wanted to make use of the electric feeds to add some detail to the shed wall, so each is different.  One rod is connected by a cable on the end wall of the shed, that I think has a look of conduit - its only glued at the top at present, still have the bottom section to do.

 

 

The other, I was a little more ingenious with and although I'm happy with the result, the bottom section hasn't worked quite how I imagined.  A rod runs from the lighting rod down the beam, to meet a second rod which runs down the wall, also covering a join in the brickwork plasticard.  Unfortunately, the bend at the bottom, was a 1mm too long, which doesn't sound much, but has resulted in it bending slightly, revealing the join that it was suppose to hide! But it doesn't look too bad.

 

 

In other news, the doors have also been trial fitted (i.e. propped up!) and look quite good.

 

 

They've been painted yellow (what do you mean, you'd never have guessed? ) and have yet to be masked off for the black - the sides will also be painted black to hide the the overspill from the yellow spread.  I think they've got something of a worn look about them - just not really sure how i've done it!

 

Still a few white spots from the foam board to cover,  but its getting there.  I also had the new baseboards (well two out of the three) out and up in the drive this afternoon with the intention of finishing them, to allow work on the trackwork and scenery to start, unfortunately the weather gods had different ideas and having just got them up, the rain started!  Its only October, what happened to the Indian Summer that was predicted???  Once the woodwork side has been completed, then I can at least put them up indoors to work on things.  Just formalising the track plan at the moment, but its starting to move.

 

 

While having a discussion on another thread related to Netherfield Sidings (a 7mm Woodhead based layout, which if you haven't seen go look - its superb!), the chap behind it said that it doesn't get many exhibition invites and the only one for 2017 is Stevenage in February - that set me thinking that there are probably a few layouts like that, and I know there have been rmWeb Meet Days in the past (West Mids or south i think) I'm not sure anyone has arranged anything up norf' as it were.  I then started wondering whether there is the appetite or demand for such an event for the day (or weekend) ... or are there enough exhibitions about?  My thought was whether it might be possible to arrange a day (or weekend) next year that brings rmWeb layouts and diorama's together (maybe 7mm, maybe a variety of scales), that haven't been seen for a while, or are portable but not normally exhibited, or get few invites?  Any thoughts? Im now thinking I may have talked myself into something here if everyone comes back positive lol!  But feel free to pass comment (for or against) or send me a PM if you wish ... but I reiterate its only a thought at the moment!

 

Rich

Edited October 18, 2016 by MarshLane

[two tone green]

Very nice. The finish is very authentic and with the addition if a loco will ooze atmosphere.

[PjKing1]

Nice work there Rich looking good

 

Cheers

[Tove]

Coming together nicley now Rich.

 

I`d imagine that you`d not notice the join under normal veiwing when the roof is on,plus as you add more detail`s the eye will be distracted enough anyway.

 

 

Brian.

[MarshLane]

Afternoon all,

 

TTG/Paul/Brian, thanks for your kind comments, it will be nice to do some photographs of locos around the shed, rather than just inside it!  Loads more detail to add to the interior however over the coming weeks - including people!

 

I've also finally settled on the track plan for the boards, as the result of an afternoon spent in Templot!  So that I can erect the full layout indoors, I'm working on a maximum length of 14' - 8' scenic, with a 4' traverser and 2' reversing siding ( see plan).  The aim is to provide an operational depot for the loco fleet, using the shed building that has been under construction for the past five months.  In wanting to maximise the operational potential as well, I'm also toying with the idea that a redundant trackbed is located behind the shed, on a higher level (4" up), that has been revitalised and used for a new light rail system, based on the Tyne & Wear Metro.  If for any reason, I can't scratch build the light rail vehicles or the overhead line equipment, then the track plan remains the same, with the light rail system remaining and an abandoned route, part lifted in places.

 

 

The red lines on the plan show the Light Rail/Abandoned railway route, with the blue track being the depot.  The BR section will have either a home or ground signal controlling the departure of locos, while the Light Rail will be entirely two aspect colour light, with the exception of the ground signal controlling exit from the turnback siding - the theory here is that when being installed, the siding was only expected to be used for 'out of course' or engineering movements, and hence access is controlled by a ground frame, released electronically from the Signalling Centre, with the main line point, catch point, and both ground signals manually worked from the ground frame.  Thereby giving the opportunity to include point rodding as well!

 

In some cases the layout plan is exactly what I wanted, as the blue section only has three points, the red only two, and it therefore is not a huge task for my first attempt at building my own track.  On the other side, I was hoping to get another stabling line on the depot, and possibly a fuel shed in as well - which would have been doable by adding an extra board, but then it would only have been usable outside on good days! So the decision was taken to stay within the 14' length.  I could have added another point to Depot line 1, feeding back along the front edge of the middle board, but decided this would look fussy and cluttered.  The idea is that the depot access and headshunt roads, disappear in a bridge under the light rail system, in reality, both will feed onto the traverser.  Again, my aim was to have at least a 20" headhunt but unfortunately that would have minimised the stabling space outside the shed building,and also split the points over the baseboard joint.

 

As it is, I think the light rail system can run with two vehicles, up to a maximum of four - assuming one is stabled in the relief siding, while the depot should be able to hold four locos (anything 18-26" long) and still allow movements - obviously the only thing 26" long is a pair of 20s, which can be accommodate on the backroad, and still have a 20" space before the point - and should there be a number of 08s stabled over the weekend or the like, then being only 8" in length, opens the opportunities further.

 

The other advantage of the simpler track layout is that it hopefully won't look crowded, and will also give space for scenery to be included.

 

Rich

[Tove]

Time for me to stick my oar in now then Rich....!

 

Look`s like a good workable plan,with lot`s of different things going on.

 

Thinking about the light rail a bit,if you don`t manage to get the vehicles built, (hoping you do though) would it be better to have the line as lead for an industry, with a semi derelict look to it.

Give you some where to run those 08`s and bit of stock,plus a bit more operation...?

 

But of course the T&W light rail comes first.

 

Brian.

[MarshLane]

Time for me to stick my oar in now then Rich....!

 

Look`s like a good workable plan,with lot`s of different things going on.

 

Thinking about the light rail a bit,if you don`t manage to get the vehicles built, (hoping you do though) would it be better to have the line as lead for an industry, with a semi derelict look to it.

Give you some where to run those 08`s and bit of stock,plus a bit more operation...?

 

But of course the T&W light rail comes first.

 

Brian.

 

 

Hi Brian,

Hehe!  Thats a good thought actually, could work well either in the short term, or longer-term if the T&W stuff doesn't work out right. I like the idea of the back scene and the left hand corner behind in the light rail being something of a derelict factory/warehouses area environment - but having said that I do like the idea of the small modern workshop style things in the space the front, akin to the extension on Oulton Road.  Mind you, a light rail system was suppose to breath regeneration into places, so I suppose both could be valid!

 

Rich

[MarshLane]

Afternoon all,

Well, i'm pleased to report that track laying on Marsh Lane Depot has commenced!  Slow steps to star with, but as it was tea break for the trackwork crew, I thought i'd take the opportunity to post a couple of pics - any comments or criticism or pointing out of early errors are welcome!

 

Sleepers are stuck to the template with blu-tack and I've just filed the 'v' down - must admit, it was easier than I expected!

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks go to Jinty, Simon and Paul for their helpful advice and comments, and for giving me the push to try it!

 

Rich

[MarshLane]

Hi guys,

Ok, i'm a little stuck.  The 'vee' has gone into place ok, and soldered up well, but I'm stumbling a bit with the subject of chairs on the outer running rail.

 

 

Im assuming the chairs that I've missed off (on purpose) at the nose end of the point are slide chairs, where the blades slide over them - but how many should there actually be?

 

 

Also where the check rails are concerned opposite the 'v' what kind of chairs go in here, and how to the chairs work with the check rail?

 

 

Im assuming there is half of a normal chair to go under sleepers X5 and X6 - but is it right that there's nothing supporting the 'vee' itself?  I'm not concerned with power at this point, as i'm going to use microswitches off the servos to change polarity.  The outer (long) running rail nearest the camera is only fixed with blue-tack at either end and one chair in the middle at the moment.

 

I note that there a line drawn across the Templot template around half way long the switchblades

 

 

This where the switchblades need to be cut I presume?  They are then reconnected as it were with plastic fishplates on the side of the rail?  Or can the switchblades remain as one complete length of rail from the vee area to the blade?  

 

Final query, I don't currently have any tie bars - any suggestions?  I know JLTRT do some, are they any good, and regardless of which type, does the service connect onto that tie bar?  

 

As they say .... Heeellllpppp!

 

Just a reminder should anyone ever be trying to find anything - that i'm keeping the Index on Post 2 up to date!

 

Thanks guys

 

Rich

Edited October 20, 2016 by MarshLane

[Simond]

Hi Rich,

 

Good start.

 

I suggest you glue the Templot template to some card (corn flakes packet) and glue the sleepers / timbers to that. This will stop things getting more difficult later, and the template will be covered in ballast anyway.

 

Re chairs: the real thing had lots of special purpose chairs that bolted to the rail web, to support and locate it. I have simulated some of these by using strips of 1mm brass, soldered on. Other people use cut-down C&L chairs, made up with plasticard, or even accurate model, 3D printed, special chairs. You pays yer money... Where I have put the bits of brass, and the other places where special chairs are needed cosmetically, I have used cut down parts.

 

Slide chairs, it depends on your model, but it should be obvious* on the Templot, I think. *once you spot the signs...

 

Tie bars, JLTRT are fine and much cheaper than Ambis, but don't look quite as good, IMO.

 

Hth

Simon

Edited October 20, 2016 by Simond

[MarshLane]

Hi Simon,

Thanks - I went for the blu-tack approach, rather than gluing to the template which I did for the shed track layout, as I want to be able to solder the power feeds out of sight under the rails after, so didn't want the template to remain!

 

Rich

[Tove]

Hi Rich,

 

This might help you along;

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=45544

 

A friend of mine gave me a printed copy of the thread,which i used as a guide.

 

It`s a thread about 31.5mm turnout constructon,(for the layout 'Heyside') using C&L components,along with a hand made frog and point blades.

But it uses plastic sleeper`s instead of wooden ones.

 

Brian.

Edited October 20, 2016 by Tove

[Jintyman]

Hi Rich,

 

As Simon says, good start. Track building is set about differently by different people. Just because it's different, does not mean it's incorrect, it just means other people go about things in different ways to achieve the same goals.

 

Below are some pictures and narrative on the very first 7mm O-MF turnout I ever built.

Now being the first, it is not perfect, but it works, and I've got better since!!!

 

Firstly I start with the crossing vee.

I use the Brian Harrap method of folding a piece of Bullhead track, soldering and filing up the actual vee accurately to the Templot plan (But your method is equally good). I then use a shim of between 0.5mm and 1mm brass flat bar (as shown in the picture) sitting on a sleeper to attach the vee with the wing rails.

This has the benefit of making a firm assembly and electrical continuity across the complete crossing vee.

In this first turnout I used brass rod soldered to the front end of the wing rails and the rear too. I now use flat brass bar as it's more firm.

You can just see the brass flat bar with both the crossing vee and the wing rails soldered to it on the sleeper behind the crossing nose!!!

 

 

As for the check rails, I alternate the chairs on the stock rail with chairs fitted to the check rail, then fit cut down chairs of the right orientation to fill the gaps. 

This means that the check rail is held firmly by at least 4 chairs, as is the stock rail next to it.

 

 

The switch rails are added after the stock rails and these are added to the forward end of the wing rails on the vee assembly utilizing plastic fishplate units from C&L.

 

 

 

Right to the front end of the turnout now, the slide chairs need to go as far as the turnout blades do, as shown in the picture below!!!

 

 

I use one piece of solid rail for both the blade and the switch rail. If you decide to do this you must file up the blade first, before trimming to length at the plastic fishplate, this stops any errors.

The line that you mention on the Templot drawing is where the loose heel (joint) between the switch rail and blade goes. As can be seen from the next photo, the slide chairs also go all the way up to this line, and then normal chairs after.

 

 

I use JLTRT tie bars now, and here is a picture of one of my tiebars with a supporting tiebar behind.

I assemble them using some 0.020" plastikard for insulation. And then solder them to the switch blades/rails.

 

 

 

I hope this helps a bit, I'm sorry the pictures are not clear but the Templot design underneath has faded!!!

Simon is also quite right in that sticking the sleepers to a piece of thin card after the Templot plan has been stuck to it will aid your turnout building and it is hidden with ballast afterwards anyway (You can always cut a little hole in the card to make electrical connections!!!).

 

Jinty

Edited October 20, 2016 by Jintyman

[MarshLane]

Hi Jinty,

Many thanks - thats a huge help!  I'll bear the card idea that Simon in mind for next time!  

 

Brian - thanks for that link, i've been trying to find that article for ages!  I came across it a few weeks ago, thought i'd bookmarked it but hadn't and then couldn't find it!  Never thought to look on the old forum.  Cheers mate.

 

Rich

[3 link]

Without wanting to sound like a rivet counter, regarding the C&L fishplates, the square nuts on the fishplate are always on the outside face of the rail. Just makes the P/ways job a bit easier visually.

 

HTH,

 

Martyn.

[Jintyman]

Without wanting to sound like a rivet counter, regarding the C&L fishplates, the square nuts on the fishplate are always on the outside face of the rail. Just makes the P/ways job a bit easier visually.

 

HTH,

 

Martyn.

 

Quite right Martyn, and I did say that the turnout was my first ever attempt with some errors.

Looking at the picture now it seems a glaring mistake and I immediately regretted putting it up, but I was trying to give a picture to an explanation.

 

Jinty

[Stephen Freeman]

Don't forget that the GWR did things a little differently though.

 

I'll deal with matters GWR first.

1) GWR used 2 bolt (OK I know that's not really correct terminology as MW will undoubtedly point out) fixings for their check rail assemblies and common crossings.

2) For loose heeled turnouts there should be one chair after the joint (Heel chair) on the switchblade.

3) At the vee they used  a special chair known as slab and bracket. As far as I know all other Companies used something similar.

 

As you are not doing the GWR thing you can ignore most of the the above.

 

At one time the Exactoscale drawings were available for free download but not free now. (I did have a pdf of them from when it was the old Exactoscale but I think it might have got lost with the last Hard Drive failure - I'll conduct a more thorough search, as I could do with finding it myself).

 

For the chairing in the vicinity of the slide rail chairs, it really depends on which type of switch you are using (A,B,C,D etc). If you can let us know, more definite advice will be forthcoming, but usually something between 6 and 9 slide chairs would be needed depending on switch type. Don't take all the Exactoscale drawings as gospel, nice though they are as they have an unusual configuration at the common crossing area, which isn't quite normal. Somewhere on Templot Club, Martin did a demo of using one of their plans as a shape and overlaying the Templot template, this should give a good indication of what is required.

 

Don't forget the need for 4 bolt chairs on the check rail and common crossing.

 

Managed to find the PDFs for the switches A to D, still not found the others yet though. Basically 5 slide rail chairs for an A, 6 for a B and so on. Quite a lot of special chairs thereafter of course which will need to be fabricated or possibly purchased from Shapeways.

Edited October 21, 2016 by Stephen Freeman

[MarshLane]

Stephen,

Many thanks for the detailed answer. I was trying to work out where the four bolt chairs went! The point is a C6 - trying to balance the realism of a larger size with the space available!

 

Rich

[Stephen Freeman]

Stephen,

Many thanks for the detailed answer. I was trying to work out where the four bolt chairs went! The point is a C6 - trying to balance the realism of a larger size with the space available!

 

Rich

Hi,

I have now found a hard copy of the common crossing pdf, The thing about the exactoscale plans is that the if I remember correctly (there's been enough comment about them on Templot Club) is that the common crossing rails are longer than standard.

[steve fay]

GWR pattern slab and bracket chairs are available from Off the rails on the shapeways web site.

[PjKing1]

Glad your diving into the track building Rich, only thing I'd like to add is I'd stick the sleepers to the templot as it'll make life much easier and safer than bluetac, a lot of people use double sided tape but I find pritt-stick to work great.

 

Keep up the great work.

[Simond]

On the Templot plan you'll find numbers & letters - if the letter is an 'S', I believe it should be a slide chair

 

I'd use good wood glue to stick the sleepers / timbers to the plan! When the plan is glued down you don't want your timbers moving.

 

Best

Simon

[Stephen Freeman]

On the Templot plan you'll find numbers & letters - if the letter is an 'S', I believe it should be a slide chair

 

I'd use good wood glue to stick the sleepers / timbers to the plan! When the plan is glued down you don't want your timbers moving.

 

Best

Simon

No! the S stands for Switch not Slide AFAIK