The status of a Halt ?

[runs as required]

There is this current thread discussing the length of a Halt's platform  with this post #8 by Zomboid

8 chains seems very long for a "Halt", it would be about long enough for 8 mk1s.

 

I didn't wish to drag the thread well OT, but I realised that I am not really sure of the status of a Halt, particularly on the GWR who opened most of them - and who also opened the more basic 'Platform'.

 

There was an article in June's Backtrack on "the Opening of Railway Halts 1930-35" by one of its regular contributors Jeffrey Wells where he begins by quoting  Jack Simmonds and Gordon Biddle: "The unstaffed halt, a short low platform with perhaps a simple shelter without the expense of a proper station".

Yet one of the first GW halts mentioned was  Box (Mill Lane) opened in March 1930; it had up and down platforms 250 ft long with booking office down at street level, waiting shelters, footpaths, nameboards fencing and drainage  - all for an estimated cost of £80 !

 

Later in the article, other 1930s  "Halts" by the other Big Four in 'suburban' locations were, to my eye, indistinguishable from stations.

 

Actually the GWR coach length "Platform", especially when garnished with 'pagoda' shelter, epitomises my notion of a Halt - and I believe shaped the concept for the Basic Railway evolving from Gerry Fiennes ideas.

 

Lastly - where a train only stops by request at a Halt to pick-up or set down (I used to really enjoy stopping something like a Manor on a rising grade simply by holding out my arm bus stop style) how is this allowed for in the timetable?  There must be quite a variation in overall trip duration between a straight run through on a slack day to a stop at every 'platform' on a popular day.

 

Also some halts were provided with a signal to indicate a need to pick-up, but I can't remember whether the general public were invited to operate the lever.

 

dh

 

dh

[Rivercider]

Weston MIlton Halt opened in 1933 with platforms long enough to accomodate full size trains.

Today London Paddington HSTs call there daily

https://www.flickr.com/photos/46703124@N03/14542845063/in/photolist-oa6TaZ-nmsAjg-otpWTj-9vGFHM-eYQHxJ-eYHfu1-9vGFHz-a663VE-9nTFwL-9ofhqV-odM2jx-otq4VA-eYDk84-eYQG11-9ZDLpz-csG3no-3LT4N6-8TP5ce-adF2Bt-6wmqeE-8U8t1A-aS9gW6-6hmaiC-9vGFGZ-owvbYe-68hK8Y-9vGFJz-9ghBZ4-ouyxQh-owtH1H-adX9qf-eYHfdL-otpYTm-oabJY-dRKHRQ-EZn2Sy-dXJr2Y-nRN3Wn-do5sZ5-eYDjK2-8TSbhA-6vR7Js-6Z6zoX-od5g2g-ouM826-65aW12-od7Ypm-9bEbs8-6Xkmy5-ownjo8

I am not sure how long the platforms actually are, about six Mk3 coaches seem to be platformed here.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/24954888@N07/15154853086/in/photolist-p6bzQs-kUNYea-NemU3-qaszki-6XxeLE-9cM1n6-nd131N-kUNpQe-qvQV6u-a63dEc-kKx77v-kNKD6V-qMMLzE-nDiiaa-6iGPUP-aE1wBd-r5ms3x-qMVxsZ-r562zD-5AfioZ-66uYn8-ietpvH-kUNDxV-66zdmS-ifXqaC-aCVyvR-66uUVr-fdW7dd-nmbdDS-zbPJc-B6fsHb-Netg4-niEHHK-fbgR4D-osBb9C-qhfDya-kUNsoa-kUPY6J-kNLmWM-zbMrb-nWJcmD-kUNB2H-kUPaMR-og3Me2-kUNkFc-z8B3Yo-a63idc-6Xkmxy-at5AJU-aE1vH5

A class 31 hauled service runs into the rather basic platform.

 

The former down platform was dismantled when the line was singled and has since been re-used to build two new stations,

both Lympstone Marine Commando, and Lelant Saltings stations were built from the components,

 

cheers

Edited June 23, 2016 by Rivercider

[Wheatley]

_{I suspect that this may be a modellerism, i.e. trying to tightly define something which the real railway didn't, or which it interpreted loosely as and when it suited.  "Branch line" is another.}

Edited June 23, 2016 by Wheatley

[Nearholmer]

A "Halt" I've always understood to:

 

- be a request stop; or,

 

- have no ticket-selling provision.

 

I'm not sure whether I picked this up as an official definition, or an unofficial one, but notice that it says nothing about platform length or height. As has been pointed out, some Halts had long platforms, an instance being, appropriately, Longcross, near Virginia Water.

 

The designation was done away with when many stations were de-staffed, and lost ticket-selling facilities. So, Denham Golf Club Halt is no longer a halt, despite its profusion of pagoda huts and general haltiness (and quite long platforms),

 

Time tables on routes with request stops seem to allow for whatever experience has shown to be necessary - some halts were very busy indeed, and were included as mandatory stops in the timetable, some seldom used and probably not allowed for in the timings at all. Some I think were really confusing, with a mix of mandatory and request stopping according to the time of day ........ Lots of potential to get left, open-mouthed, in an isolated place!

 

Kevin

[Zomboid]

Similarly, there are a number of stations these days which might be more accurately described as Halts. Some are served by HSTs (Exeter St Thomas & Torre come to mind). From memory, Torre has buildings, but no actual facilities...

[runs as required]

_{I suspect that this may be a modellerism, i.e. trying to tightly define something which the real railway didn't, or which it interpreted loosely as and when it suited.  "Branch line" is another.}

Government Keynesian funding in the 1930s could be attracted by astute Big Four 'General Managers'  to programmes embracing the installation of "halts" - which quite often also included a signal box and Block section as well as Booking Office.

 

As to Branch Lines: "Light Railway" had a statutory meaning - delivering less rigorous BoT requirements.

 

dh

[Fat Controller]

There were  halts with no, or very low, platforms, especially on the GWR. There were several such on the Fishguard line, whilst there were a pair in the S Wales valleys which only had trains in one direction. This was there were a pair of single lines, some distance apart, one handling trains in one direction, one in the other.

Other halts were set up to deal with traffic from a particular source, and were not normally accessible to the general public. There were a pair between Burry Port and Kidwelly; Lando, serving the ROF, and RAF Pembrey. A similar halt served a factory outside Lymington- Wellworthy Ampress, whilst there was one, accessible only to railway staff, within Crewe Works.

[Nearholmer]

For those who are really into halts,there is an Oakwood press book cataloging and describing all the halts of the Southern Railway. Probably OOP, but I think the author was Mr Kidner, founder of Oakwood.

 

Useful for both railway enthusiasts and insomniacs.

 

K

[corneliuslundie]

And remember that the word started out on the GWR as Halte, borrowed I assume from French.

Many halts were served by steam rail motors and later auto trains with movable steps, so didn't need high platforms. But other were served by 'normal' trains.

I suspect that for someone really interested it would be worth going through the correspondence between the GWR and the Board of Trade at the time the first halts were opened.

And in the modern day, some lines have many request stops. It takes ages to get through the announcement about them on the Cambrian Coast line.

The Cambrian also had the oddity of a station (halt?) served in only one direction, between Newtown and Moat Lane. When the line was doubled no second platform was ever built.

And the S&M had passenger operated signals at some stations.

Jonathan

[Oldddudders]

 From memory, Torre has buildings, but no actual facilities...

 

Oh, I don't know about that. After all, there is a Halford's in what might have been the car park......

[Nearholmer]

A quick glimpse at the BoT/MoT "Requirements for passenger lines" yields no definition.

 

The only mention of a halt that leaps out is reproduced below, but it seems that "everyone knew what a halt was, so didn't need to be told".

 

K

[rockershovel]

I used to reckon Bodmin Road was a pretty remote spot, serving little obvious function, but it always had full length platforms...

 

I see it now serves as one end of the Bodmin and Wenford preserved line, so another question; is this the only station to have both steam, and HST services?

[The Stationmaster]

And remember that the word started out on the GWR as Halte, borrowed I assume from French.

Many halts were served by steam rail motors and later auto trains with movable steps, so didn't need high platforms. But other were served by 'normal' trains.

I suspect that for someone really interested it would be worth going through the correspondence between the GWR and the Board of Trade at the time the first halts were opened.

And in the modern day, some lines have many request stops. It takes ages to get through the announcement about them on the Cambrian Coast line.

The Cambrian also had the oddity of a station (halt?) served in only one direction, between Newtown and Moat Lane. When the line was doubled no second platform was ever built.

And the S&M had passenger operated signals at some stations.

Jonathan

 

I think basically that a halt is a small station with limited (usually) facilities which the owning company decided to call a halt - probably in order to deflect criticism of anyone who said it should have such & such facilities as a 'station'.  One thing halts did not have was a resident Station Master - they were under the wing of the SM at the nearest station while another thing I don't think any GWR/WR ones had was toilet facilities for the use of passengers.

 

Undoubtedly the GWR, and others, must have sought Board of trade approval for their low platform halts.  The main question is whether they did it before such places were constructed or at a later date when the BoT chased them?

[Zomboid]

I used to reckon Bodmin Road was a pretty remote spot, serving little obvious function, but it always had full length platforms...

 

I see it now serves as one end of the Bodmin and Wenford preserved line, so another question; is this the only station to have both steam, and HST services?

Paignton & Aviemore come to mind.

I suppose it would be unlikely for both a steam train and a HST to stop at Cholsey on the same day.

[Gwiwer]

To my mind there are fundamental differences between stations, halts and platforms.  But there are no clear-cut lines of distinction and more like "fifty shades of grey".

 

A station would have (had) at least some staff and passenger facilities such as booking office, toilets, waiting room (however basic) and possibly parcels and goods facilities.  It was almost certainly provided with a signalbox and existed for signalling purposes as a block section.  It served a location of importance and where reasonable or significant traffic might be expected.  Taking Bodmin Road, as mentioned above, as an example this would not have been a halt.  It served the town of Bodmin which although distant and up a long hill by road also had a connecting rail service to General station.  Bodmin Road was thus a junction, had the full range of station facilities and was (and is) quite a busy location.

 

A halt served a minor settlement, outer region of a town or rural location with only modest traffic expectations.  Not all trains - in some places very few trains - stopped.  The platform was typically narrow and shorter than at a full station and while it offered a basic waiting shelter was usually devoid of any other passenger facilities.  In some locations a tiny staff hut was provided; this typically would be attended only during peak hours on routes with commuter traffic to a nearby large town allowing tickets to be sold before boarding the train at the busiest times.  A halt would be unlikely to have any signalbox and almost certainly no signals of its own - any in the area were incidental and belonged to a block encompassing a much longer section of the line.  Most halts lost the suffix in the 1970s and 80s as main stations had facilities reduced in some cases to the same level as a halt.  A few have had the name returned in very recent years such as St Keyne Wishing Well Halt which was for around 25 years plain St Keyne.  

 

A platform was precisely that.  A very basic raised waiting area often in very rural areas at which few trains stopped and which might only have been provided under statutory requirement when the land was purchased for the railway to be built.  Some served remote farms and tiny villages.  Some appeared to serve no purpose whatever.  The last use of the term "Platform" that I can find in BR days was Wootton Wawen Platform on the Birmingham - Stratford-upon-Avon line which lost the suffix some time in the 1970s.

 

Even lesser in status that a platform was the Stopping Place.  These were fewer in the UK but more common in other countries where raised platforms were not necessarily provided at any station.  A stopping place was simply that; an agreed location, possibly at a road or footpath crossing, at which trains would stop for passenger or goods traffic but which had no platform, no facilities of any kind, possibly not even a lamp or a name-board.  Passengers would usually be required to board or alight from trains via steps.  One survived near me in Australia until 1997 when "Stopping Place No. 15" was renamed Morradoo after gaining a platform.  

[The Stationmaster]

The provision, or not, of signalling really has very little to do with a station or halt unless there is a need for connections and sidings (and not always then of course) or there is a need to specifically provide a signalbox to split the block.  Thus (back in the semaphore era) there have been stations without signalboxes and even halts at the same site as a signalbox plus plenty of signalboxes nowhere near either.

[edcayton]

I used to reckon Bodmin Road was a pretty remote spot, serving little obvious function, but it always had full length platforms...

 

I see it now serves as one end of the Bodmin and Wenford preserved line, so another question; is this the only station to have both steam, and HST services?

 

It was always a junction, and they were often in out-of-the-way places, sometimes with no public access. Steam and HST? Paignton comes to mind.

 

Ed

[Coryton]

 

A halt served a minor settlement, outer region of a town or rural location with only modest traffic expectations.  Not all trains - in some places very few trains - stopped. 

 

I'm not so sure about that. Surely there were halts on branch lines, few if any of which would have separate "express" and stopping services?

 

In fact I can think of one "halt" which I think was the terminus of a branch line for a while.

 

 

Even lesser in status that a platform was the Stopping Place.  These were fewer in the UK but more common in other countries where raised platforms were not necessarily provided at any station.  A stopping place was simply that; an agreed location, possibly at a road or footpath crossing, at which trains would stop for passenger or goods traffic but which had no platform, no facilities of any kind, possibly not even a lamp or a name-board.  Passengers would usually be required to board or alight from trains via steps.  One survived near me in Australia until 1997 when "Stopping Place No. 15" was renamed Morradoo after gaining a platform.  

 

And in some cases a "stopping place" was whatever someone wanted.

 

I don't know if it's still the case, but in the late 90's it was possible to request long distance VIA services in Canada to stop wherever you liked.

 

I encountered a similar principle on the Alaska Railroad route from Anchorage to Fairbanks - the guard came through the carriage (it was a short train) asking people what milepost they wanted to get off at, and it then stopped here and there, at places without even an obvious path into the woods. The guard helped people lower their luggage down onto the ground from the baggage car, and off they went. into the wilderness. One couple  with a rubber dingy got off just before a bridge over a big river A very unusual experience.

 

Quite time consuming though. I think it took 12 hours - and we met ONE train going the other way in all that time.

 

I got the plane back and it was quite a bit faster.

[Northroader]

On the GWR Wellington- Much Wenlock line in Shropshire, there were a string of 'halts', Ketley town, Springbank, Doseley, Greenbank, and Farley, mixed in with 'stations', Ketley, Lawley Bank, Horsehay & Dawley, Coalbrookdale, together with a solitary 'platform' Lightmoor., and a 'junction' Buildwas. The halts were introduced with the steam rail motors, I think, all being short wooden platforms with a shelter, the stations and junction were the original stops, staffed with slightly longer platforms and brick buildings and signalling, and the platform, which was two platforms and shelters on a double track stretch with a signalled junction, was probably due to an earlier service coming in halfway along the line. 13 stops in around 10 miles must be close to the station density of a London tube line, but there the resemblance ended. The branch continued to Craven Arms with less trains and longer spaces between stops.

[The Stationmaster]

 

 

 

 

I'm not so sure about that. Surely there were halts on branch lines, few if any of which would have separate "express" and stopping services?

 

In fact I can think of one "halt" which I think was the terminus of a branch line for a while.

 

 

 

And in some cases a "stopping place" was whatever someone wanted.

 

I don't know if it's still the case, but in the late 90's it was possible to request long distance VIA services in Canada to stop wherever you liked.

 

I encountered a similar principle on the Alaska Railroad route from Anchorage to Fairbanks - the guard came through the carriage (it was a short train) asking people what milepost they wanted to get off at, and it then stopped here and there, at places without even an obvious path into the woods. The guard helped people lower their luggage down onto the ground from the baggage car, and off they went. into the wilderness. One couple  with a rubber dingy got off just before a bridge over a big river A very unusual experience.

 

Quite time consuming though. I think it took 12 hours - and we met ONE train going the other way in all that time.

 

I got the plane back and it was quite a bit faster.

 

 

The idea of a 'stopping place' doesn't seem to have existed officially in Britain but it certainly existed unofficially on the Bridport branch in its later years where 'Loders' was probably the busiest intermediate boarding point on the branch but had no facilities at all, including a platform - it was simply a foot crossing.

[Rivercider]

In Exeter the former name of St James' Park Station has always fascinated me.

As one of the Railmotor stations in Exeter it was opened in 1906 as Lions Holt Halt.

It is unstaffed, and both platforms are very short.

On match days it is interesting, to say the least, when both Exeter City and Exeter Chiefs are playing at home,

that only the first door of a 2/3/4 car train is opened due to the short Up platform,

 

cheers

[Pacific231G]

And remember that the word started out on the GWR as Halte, borrowed I assume from French.

After Thursday I'm not sure if it's still legal to quote French but my Hachette dictionary defines halte as "Point d'Arret entre deux gares reserve aux seuls trains de voyageurs" (stopping place between two stations * for passenger trains only) .They weren't always completely unstaffed as many were associated with level crossings and sometimes had a ticket window in the crossinhg keeper's cottage for limited sales but they wouldn't handle goods or parcels. .

(* Gare in French has a subtly different meaning from station in English relating to its operational role in handling traffic but it's as hard to pin down as the diference between a rapide and an express)

[Banger Blue]

A fine picture of a Halt from Martin Loader's excellent website on the Fairford Branch:

 

Cassington Halt (http://www.fairfordbranch.co.uk/Cassington.htm)

 

[runs as required]

Some very enjoyable reading here, thank you so much for posting.

1

From my time working for Salop County Council in the 1950s, I do recall the passenger set signals on the the S&M but can't remember whether such existed on the  Cambrian.

2

I used often to go home on the Much Wenlock - Wellington line (to Coalbrookdale for Ironbridge) and that is where my delight in these distinctions first arose. Mind, it was a fairly short journey, and the pannier always dealt with its single coach very smartly, so timetable elasticity caused by variations in the number of stops appeared not to be an issue.

3

...And in some cases a "stopping place" was whatever someone wanted.

I don't know if it's still the case, but in the late 90's it was possible to request long distance VIA services in Canada to stop wherever you liked.

 

I encountered a similar principle on the Alaska Railroad route from Anchorage to Fairbanks - the guard came through the carriage (it was a short train) asking people what milepost they wanted to get off at, and it then stopped here and there, at places without even an obvious path into the woods. The guard helped people lower their luggage down onto the ground from the baggage car, and off they went. into the wilderness. One couple  with a rubber dingy got off just before a bridge over a big river A very unusual experience ...

And (before the days of a mobile cell phone) how might you go about getting a train to stop in the wilderness to pick you back up again?

dh

[rockershovel]

The relationship between the names of rural stations, and the actual locations of the places nominally served, has been a running joke for as long as railways have existed!

 

I know someone who did an "adventure trip" involving whitewater rafting, they were dropped at a predetermined location and were responsible for presenting themselves at a predetermined location at a specified time for pick-up. I believe these usually involve trackside phones, where possible, failing that, I would imagine that a satellite phone would be a necessary part of their equipment to notify some predetermined contact at the railway company, who notified the train crew by radio.

 

I've also been told that US trains usually cross bridges at very slow speeds, so signalling to the train is fairly simple, particularly if the driver already expects a possible stop - can anyone confirm this?