Churminster & Stowe Magna, Southern Railway

[thegreenhowards]

Andy

Regret yes, these pictures are copyright, but I think that DLT has provided a link to some others.

 

 

 

 

Dave

 

There is no intention to make a kit available although Arun who produced the etches and castings for me has said that he has a small number of sets of parts which he may be prepared to make available to interested parties.

I agree that the cab does not look right, however, the etches are not from a T9, they were drawn specifically from L12 drawings and so I suspect that as Denbridge has pointed out, the boiler maybe sitting too high. I will work with Andy to check all of the key dimensions before we go any further.

 

Tony

I’d convinced myself from Tony’s photos that the boiler marginally overlapped the cab windows, but this is clearly not right looking at DLT’s pictures. So I’ll do a lot of measuring next time I have a modelling session and will report back on progress.

 

Thanks for the comments

 

Andy

[chris45lsw]

Hi Jack

 

As mentioned in posr #203, "having ... consulted...Locomotives Illustrated...all of the original cab roofs were changed by 1938"; it also says that all 17 of the class were altered between 1935 and 1939, however, it does not give dates for each loco. Perhaps Bradley might help - if I could find it!

 

Tony

According to Bradley the cab of B338 was modified at Eastleigh in Nov 1929 but the chimney and dome were unaltered at the time so were still outside the SR loading gauge.  B343 was done similarly in April 1930.  The first to be made fully compliant, ie new cab top and cut down chimney & dome was 2341 in July 1935 and the last were 2347 and 2349 in July & Aug 1939 respectively.  He doesn't give dates for the rest done between 1935 & 1939.

 

Chris KT

[Javier L]

The E6-X is now on the shop! I've also tweaked the models, so it should be able to print in the smoother plastic now!

 

https://www.shapeways.com/shops/caliper-s-paradise-models

 

Happy Modelling!

 

~Javier

[DLT]

The L12 cab front had the front windows spaced wider so they were clear of the boiler.  They are much nearer the edge of the cab than on the T9. 

The extra height of the L12 cabsides was in the cutout, giving them a slightly odd look.  So the bottom of the cutout still lined up with a standard tender.

Cheers, Dave.

[Tony Teague]

The E6-X is now on the shop! I've also tweaked the models, so it should be able to print in the smoother plastic now!

 

https://www.shapeways.com/shops/caliper-s-paradise-models

 

Happy Modelling!

 

~Javier

Thanks Javier - I shall certainly be ordering.

 

Tony

[Tony Teague]

And so to "N".

 

We start with the ex-SECR Maunsell N class, of which there were 80, and a pretty reasonable model has been produced for some time & in several liveries by Bachmann; No.1404 is in lined olive:

 

 

Whilst No.1847 is in malachite.

 

 

There were only 6 of the three-cylinder ex-SECR Maunsell N1 class; No.1379 is from a South Eastern Finecast kit:

 

 

The LSWR under Urie produced 20 'King Arthur' N15's, whilst the SR under Maunsell then delivered a further 54 of these locos in several batches; the 'Arthurs' rank amongst my favourite Southern locos.

 

Hornby have produced a fine model with several livery and tender variations, whilst it was also one of the earliest products from OO Works; I'm not sure that I yet have all of the detailed variations sorted out correctly (discuss!), but here are a couple of examples:

 

 

No.790 'Sir Villiars' is by OO Works, whilst No.740 'Merlin' is a Hornby model; both have 8-wheel double bogie tenders.

 

 

To complete the letter "N" we come to the Southern Railway Maunsell N15X class; No.2332 'Stroudley' is from a NuCast kit:

 

Tony

 

[Edited to correct Urie's employer!]

 

Edited November 5, 2022 by Tony Teague

[Jack P]

Tony, 

 

Again, a fantastic line up of locos. As for the KA's AFAIK there are the following variations;

 

Maunsell cab - 8 wheel Urie Tender

Maunsell cab - 6 wheel Maunsell Tender

Urie Cab - 8 wheel Urie Tender

Urie Cab - 8 wheel Drummond Watercart Tender

 

Then there's the ones converted for oil burning.. but it depends how deep down the rabbit hole you want to go!

[Denbridge]

Tony, 

 

Again, a fantastic line up of locos. As for the KA's AFAIK there are the following variations;

 

Maunsell cab - 8 wheel Urie Tender

Maunsell cab - 6 wheel Maunsell Tender

Urie Cab - 8 wheel Urie Tender

Urie Cab - 8 wheel Drummond Watercart Tender

 

Then there's the ones converted for oil burning.. but it depends how deep down the rabbit hole you want to go!

Think uou mean the LSWR under Urie

[Tony Teague]

Think uou mean the LSWR under Urie

Thanks - edited to correct!

[Tony Teague]

That's good news, the K10 looks very much "at home" on Churminster, and I'm relieved to hear that she's running ok.  How is the pulling power?

 

 

I had meant to report on the K10's "pulling power" earlier, but I have now conducted a simple test, on the flat:

K10 12 x Hornby Maunsells

T19 16 x Hornby Maunsells - but the T9 has traction tyres

 

Given that my longest train is currently 11 coaches, and that I will more likely want the K10 to haul about 5 or 6, this is pretty impressive!

 

I will also do a test on the fairly steep incline up to my top fiddle yard, where I find the T9's very poor and report back in due course

 

Tony

[Tony Teague]

A progress update:

 

I hate to see good siding / fiddle yard space wasted, and ever since I installed and tested the top fiddle yard I realised that I had made it far longer than the longest train that was ever likely to make it up the incline and into that yard!

 

Max platform length on the layout will accomodate 6 coaches plus a tender loco, but there are longer roads in the main fiddle yard  beneath, for longer through trains of which the two longest are each currently 11 coaches plus tender loco - so I decided to make better use of the space and split some of the roads in two.

 

So, last week, with help from Giles Walburn of Elite Baseboards, I took the bull by the horns and we split six of the longer roads within the top yard, so that each will now take two trains; this involved a certain amount of re-wiring, addition of diodes and IRDOT boards so that the second train in each case will move up automatically when the front one leaves - as per the main fiddle yard underneath.

 

Here is a shot of the result with 5 of the split roads occupied:

 

 

The three roads nearest the front (and one other in the centre)  are shorter than the rest and so could not sensibly be split, whilst the road at the back is linked to a separate section of the layout and has to perform some other functions. In addition one road (the eighth from the back wall), performs as a 'light engine' road and has already been split into 9 sections each of which can accomodate a loco and tender.

 

At some point I will post a video showing how these move up one at a time when the front loco leaves!

 

Following this work, the layout now has theoretical off-scene / fiddle yard storage for 79 complete trains (of varying length) plus 15 light engines (on two dedicated fiddle yard roads) - which sounds great until you think about the complexity of the operating schedule.....

 

Tony

 

Edited to add: - I should explain that the brwon squares on the ceiling are to prevent false "occupied" readings from the IRDOT detectors via infra-red reflecting off the ceiling!

Edited November 5, 2022 by Tony Teague

[St Enodoc]

A progress update:

 

I hate to see good siding / fiddle yard space wasted, and ever since I installed and tested the top fiddle yard I realised that I had made it far longer than the longest train that was ever likely to make it up the incline and into that yard!

 

Max platform length on the layout will accomodate 6 coaches plus a tender loco, but there are longer roads in the main fiddle yard  beneath, for longer through trains of which the two longest are each currently 11 coaches plus tender loco - so I decided to make better use of the space and split some of the roads in two.

 

So, last week, with help from Giles Walburn of Elite Baseboards, I took the bull by the horns and we split six of the longer roads within the top yard, so that each will now take two trains; this involved a certain amount of re-wiring, addition of diodes and IRDOT boards so that the second train in each case will move up automatically when the front one leaves - as per the main fiddle yard underneath.

 

Here is a shot of the result with 5 of the split roads occupied:

 

SJPP625000102180625.jpg

 

The three roads nearest the front (and one other in the centre)  are shorter than the rest and so could not sensibly be split, whilst the road at the back is linked to a separate section of the layout and has to perform some other functions. In addition one road (the eighth from the back wall), performs as a 'light engine' road and has already been split into 9 sections each of which can accomodate a loco and tender.

 

At some point I will post a video showing how these move up one at a time when the front loco leaves!

 

Following this work, the layout now has theoretical off-scene / fiddle yard storage for 79 complete trains (of varying length) plus 15 light engines (on two dedicated fiddle yard roads) - which sounds great until you think about the complexity of the operating schedule.....

 

Tony

 

Edited to add: - I should explain that the brwon squares on the ceiling are to prevent false "occupied" readings from the IRDOT detectors via infra-red reflecting off the ceiling!

Very nice Tony. As I said recently on another thread, I do like seeing how other people have arranged their off-stage storage areas.

[Tony Teague]

Very nice Tony. As I said recently on another thread, I do like seeing how other people have arranged their off-stage storage areas.

 

Thank you!

 

I much prefer trains to be available "on call" than to be in a drawer if possible and so, given the available space, I deliberately chose to fit as much storage as possible. The main yard has up and down sides that feed to main "roundy-roundy" loop, whilst the upper and lower yards face opposite directions on what is a large overlaid figure of eight.

 

Tony

[thegreenhowards]

Thank you!

 

I much prefer trains to be available "on call" than to be in a drawer if possible and so, given the available space, I deliberately chose to fit as much storage as possible. The main yard has up and down sides that feed to main "roundy-roundy" loop, whilst the upper and lower yards face opposite directions on what is a large overlaid figure of eight.

 

Tony

A worthwhile improvement as I think we discussed when I visited. 79 trains - im soooooo jealous! I can manage just over 20 and I’m always looking for more space.

[Tony Teague]

Back to our A-Z, and I'm beginning to feel that the end is in sight as we cover "O", "P" & "Q" !

 

Having got this far I can see all sorts of future possibilities - locos by pre-grouping company, locos by chief engineer, Maunsell, Wainwright, Stirling and so on, locos by running number, locos by wheel arrangement, or simply locos by livery, who knows!

 

Anyway, on to "O" where we have two classes, named imaginatively O1, and O2 - albeit by different engineers and companies; first the ex-SECR Wainwight O1, represented here by No.1370 which was built from a Branchlines kit:

 

 

This is closely followed by a pair of Adams, ex-LSWR O2's, pictured on the Stowe Magna turntable:

 

 

No.207 is from an Alan Gibson kit, whilst No.225 is a ready-to-run example from Kernow / DJM.

 

Moving on, I think we'd all like to have a "P" - and so here to represent the Wainwright, ex-SECR P class is No.1556 from a SE Finecast kit:

 

 

followed by No.1555, one of the recent and exquisite Hattons RTR models:

 

 

Bringing up the rear for today are representatives of the two SR "Q" classes, Q and Q1; first Maunsell's Q represented by No.531 from a Wills kit and built by Dave Taylor (DLT of this parish):

 

 

and this is followed by Bulleid's Q1 represented by No.C1 from a SE Finecast kit (built for me many years ago by somebody called Temple), and by No.C8, a RTR offering from Hornby:

 

 

 

So that's it for O, P & Q - and my apologies of some of the pics were a bit blurred - I shall try to do better!

 

On - and no changes to the "missing" list!

 

Tony

Edited November 5, 2022 by Tony Teague

[Jack P]

 

That Q is amazing, Dave did a really fantastic job. Probably one of my favourite builds of his. I'm guilty of having read that part of his thread multiple times - an excellent addition to your collection!

[DLT]

 

That Q is amazing, Dave did a really fantastic job. Probably one of my favourite builds of his. I'm guilty of having read that part of his thread multiple times - an excellent addition to your collection!

 

Thanks very much Jack, but I only did the loco body.  Mind you, as an early Wills kit I added a lot of detail, as it was a bit lacking in that department.

The chassis was already built (by who I'm not sure) and the tender was built by a certain Mr.Bachmann.  I did the paint job, what there is of it!

Cheers, Dave.

[Jack P]

Thanks very much Jack, but I only did the loco body.  Mind you, as an early Wills kit I added a lot of detail, as it was a bit lacking in that department.

The chassis was already built (by who I'm not sure) and the tender was built by a certain Mr.Bachmann.  I did the paint job, what there is of it!

Cheers, Dave.

 

It came with a fully compensated chassis if I remember correctly? The work you did on the body was excellent, it was no small task, dubious use of the word 'only' I think the work you did on the body is the reason it's such a nice model! I especially like the actuator detail on the left hand side of the boiler - well worth the effort!

[Tony Teague]

Back to the A - Z, and to "R" where real confusion reigns!

 

In fact I had to think hard before posting this as I normally don't know my R's from my elbow!

 

During the period modelled there were two R and two R1 classes, all of them originating from within the former SE&CR fleet. First we have the Kirtley designed, ex-LCDR classes R and R1, and of the R class, I do not currently have a representative, however, the R and R1 are so similar - excepting the bogie wheel size, that I am currently trying to build an R from a SE Finecast kit. I will report on progress in due course.

 

Here, however, is No.1710 representing the R1 class and built from a Q Kits kit:

 

 

Turning to the Stirling designed, ex-SER R class, we have No.1124 with a short chimney and rounded cab:

 

 

and then representing the Wainwright modifications that produced this particular R1 class, we have No.1336 having the taller chimney but with the rounded cab:

 

 

and finally No.1047 with the tall chimney and angular cab:

 

 

The last three all from SE  Finecast kits, and one of them, No.1336 being the only loco in the whole fleet built by me personally! (The rough finish gives it away).

 

In fact of these, No.1124 had gone before nationalisation.

 

So, on to "S" and the sole ex-SECR Maunsell S class, No.1685, again from an SE Finecast kit:

 

 

I always think that this along with the SR Crane Tank (No.1302) look very odd against the rest of the SR fleet!

 

Next is the S11 class, another T9 variant and which like the L12, is currently missing from my fleet. I have hopes of achieving a model of this larger-boilered, smaller-wheeled loco from the same castings that are currently in hand for assembly as the L12.

 

Finally under "S" we have the more numerous S15 class, with versions by Urie under the LSWR and then Maunsell for SR:

 

 

No.499 is my sole Urie variant, from a DJH kit, whilst Nos. 826 and 847 are SR / Maunsell versions by Hornby and DJH respectively:

 

 

 

As before, all of the kit-built locos are by Chris Phillips, excepting my dodgy looking one, as above.

 

So, returning to an updated "missing" list, there are updates on both the D3X and E6X, so that it now looks like this:

 

SECR Wainwright B1    (16)
LB&SCR Billinton B4X   (12)
LB&SCR Marsh C3        (8)
LSWR Drummond C14  (3) - potential solution = CSP / Agenoria kit announced years ago but yet to be delivered
LB&SCR Marsh D3X      (1) - potential solution through indication of a forthcoming 3D printed body, chassis to be sourced
LB&SCR Billinton E4X    (4)
LB&SCR Billinton E5X    (4) - 3D printed body + SEF chassis kit held for assembly
LB&SCR Billinton E6X    (2) - 3D printed body + SEF chassis kit held for assembly
SECR Wainwright F1      (9) - solution = Jidenco kit held but not yet in build
SR Maunsell I1X             (18)
LSWR Drummond L12   (20) - solved, 3D printed, etched & cast by Arun Sharma, now in build on Hornby RTR chassis

SECR Kirtey R               (18) - solved, build in hand from SE Finecast R1 kit

LSWR Drummond S11   (10) - potential solution to use cast L12 parts and modified SE Finecast T9 chassis

 

So we are left with the letters "T" to "Z", following which I will cover the small number of numerically classified class such as 0395 and 0458, plus odd diesel shunters etc.

 

Tony

Edited November 5, 2022 by Tony Teague

[Mick Bonwick]

 

In fact I had to think hard before posting this as I normally don't know my R's from my elbow!

 

Open your I's and C what you're looking at. 

[St Enodoc]

Open your I's and C what you're looking at. 

YYUR

YYUB

ICUR

YY4me.

[Tony Teague]

Open your I's and C what you're looking at. 

Ho, Ho, Ho!

[chris45lsw]

Back to the A - Z, and to "R" where real confusion reigns!

 

In fact I had to think hard before posting this as I normally don't know my R's from my elbow!

 

During the period modelled there were two R and two R1 classes, all of them originating from within the former SE&CR fleet. First we have the Kirtley designed, ex-LCDR classes R and R1, and of the R class, I do not currently have a representative, however, the R and R1 are so similar - excepting the bogie wheel size, that I am currently trying to build an R from a SE Finecast kit. I will report on progress in due course.

 

Here, however, is No.1710 representing the R1 class and built from a Q Kits kit:

 

SJPP627002202180627.jpg

 

Turning to the Stirling designed, ex-SER R class, we have No.1124 with a short chimney and rounded cab:

 

SJPP627001302180627.jpg

 

and then representing the Wainwright modifications that produced this particular R1 class, we have No.1336 having the taller chimney but with the rounded cab:

 

SJPP627001702180627.jpg

 

and finally No.1047 with the tall chimney and angular cab:

 

SJPP627001502180627.jpg

 

The last three all from SE  Finecast kits, and one of them, No.1336 being the only loco in the whole fleet built by me personally! (The rough finish gives it away).

 

In fact of these, No.1124 had gone before nationalisation.

 

So, on to "S" and the sole ex-SECR Maunsell S class, No.1685, again from an SE Finecast kit:

 

SJPP627002402180627.jpg

 

I always think that this along with the SR Crane Tank (No.1302) look very odd against the rest of the SR fleet!

 

Next is the S11 class, another T9 variant and which like the L12, is currently missing from my fleet. I have hopes of achieving a model of this larger-boilered, smaller-wheeled loco from the same castings that are currently in hand for assembly as the L12.

 

Finally under "S" we have the more numerous S15 class, with versions by Urie under the LSWR and then Maunsell for SR:

 

SJPP627003802180627.jpg

 

No.499 is my sole Urie variant, from a DJH kit, whilst Nos. 826 and 847 are SR / Maunsell versions by Hornby and DJH respectively:

 

SJPP627003202180627.jpg

 

SJPP627003402180627.jpg

 

As before, all of the kit-built locos are by Chris Phillips, excepting my dodgy looking one, as above.

 

So, returning to an updated "missing" list, there are updates on both the D3X and E6X, so that it now looks like this:

 

SECR Wainwright B1    (16)

LB&SCR Billinton B4X   (12)

LB&SCR Marsh C3        (8)

LSWR Drummond C14  (3) - potential solution = CSP / Agenoria kit announced years ago but yet to be delivered

LB&SCR Marsh D3X      (1) - potential solution through indication of a forthcoming 3D printed body, chassis to be sourced

LB&SCR Billinton E4X    (4)

LB&SCR Billinton E5X    (4) - 3D printed body + SEF chassis kit held for assembly

LB&SCR Billinton E6X    (2) - 3D printed body + SEF chassis kit held for assembly

SECR Wainwright F1      (9) - solution = Jidenco kit held but not yet in build

SR Maunsell I1X             (18)

LSWR Drummond L12   (20) - solved, 3D printed, etched & cast by Arun Sharma, now in build on Hornby RTR chassis

SECR Kirtey R               (18) - solved, build in hand from SE Finecast R1 kit

LSWR Drummond S11   (10) - potential solution to use cast L12 parts and modified SE Finecast T9 chassis

 

So we are left with the letters "T" to "Z", following which I will cover the small number of numerically classified class such as 0395 and 0458, plus odd diesel shunters etc.

 

Tony

By the criterion you've set yourself, Tony, ie classes extant at 31 Dec 1947 you don't actually 'need' any R 0-6-0Ts.   1124 was the last to go in Sep 1943 while 1336 went in May 1941.

 

Looking forward to seeing the T to Zs and the 'numericals'. 

 

Chris KT

[Tony Teague]

Chris

 

Thanks; I probably didn't understand that when I bought the kits - and these are not the only ones that I have that are out of range - but at least they were there during my '38 - '48 era, so I think they can stay!

I have got to take a few more pics before I can finish the alphabet, but it won't be long.

 

Tony

[Tony Teague]

Am I alone in thinking that it is just too hot for modelling?

 

I know we Brits always complain about the weather but really! I have had to switch from DC to DC + AC (air-conditioning) - but it is even too hot for the AC to cope.

 

And so, time for "T" (and probably "U" as well)!

 

First is the ex-SECR Kirtley T class, represented by No.1602 from a Q Kits kit:

 

 

The camera is always cruel, but in this case I really must do something about that awful golden bolt under the front!

 

Next up is the ex-LSWR Adams T1 class; No.6 is from a Craftsman kit:

 

 

The T6 class is out of my time period, but a long time ago, and before I had settled on what I was trying to do, I bought an old, second-hand Jidenco kit for a T6 and sent it to an alleged "professional" kit builder. He will remain nameless, but his work was quite appalling - the lining is wiggly, various parts are not straight, it has no weight in it, the central driving wheels are the only ones it picks up through and they don't touch the track because the front bogie is set too high, etc etc! It taught me a lesson, but I have kept it as a sharp reminder that not everyone who advertises a service is capable of delivering on what they say:

 

 

One day, when I need to let off steam I will perhaps hit it with a sledge hammer!

 

Back to more pleasant things, and to Drummond's elegant ex-LSWR T9 class of which I have more than a few; No.312 has an 8-wheel water-cart tender and is from an SE Finecast kit:

 

 

Once Hornby released their T9 model it became unrealistic to build, or have built, further kits:

 

 

No.708 is a Hornby example in wartime black, whilst No.338 (below) is in olive and hauling the Imperial Airways Empire Flying Boat Train; each of these also has a watercart tender - for some reason I couldn't seem to find one with a 6 wheel tender when I as taking the pictures!

 

 

On to a further Drummond ex-LSWR loco, his massive-looking T14 'Paddlebox' class, represented by No.460 from a Nu-Cast kit:

 

 

Forgive my repeating this shot which was requested by a follower of the thread before we had quite reached "T" - which it now concludes - and so to "U", where we find Maunsell's U class, represented by No.1622 in olive, and No.1624 in wartime black - both from DJH kits:

 

 

 

Next is the 3-cylinder version of the U, the U1; again No.1901 is from a DJH kit:

 

 

and to conclude today's post, we have the wartime USA class, and this is represented by No.68, which is a Model Rail / Bachmann RTR model:

 

 

and by No.72 which is from a SE Finecast kit:

 

 

I hadn't really noticed before but the lettering on No.68 looks a bit small, whilst that on No.72 looks a bit yellow! Feels like some weathering is required - and that will (very neatly) be the subject of my next update!

 

(As before, kit built locos were put together and painted for me by Chris Phillips - except the awful T6!).

 

Tony

Edited November 5, 2022 by Tony Teague