Hornby LNER Teaks (Railroad) - any good?

[NittenDormer]

I am thinking of buying the Hornby ‘Flying Scotsman’ train set on a well-known on-line retailer named after a South American river if the price drops below £90-£100. The idea is that, having bought the P2 Cock o the North ‘Master of the Glens’ train set for a similar price last winter, it is an affordable way to get a six-carriage train of teak carriages, plus a choice of locos to haul them, for under £200.

 

(Going by the RRPs on the Hornby website, the same rolling stock bought individually would tally up to around £300, or £350 for the two train sets. Plus I get a couple of loops of track that I’m sure I can find a use for. Even just the FS loco + 3 carriages from Hattons tally up to £88. Without a box.)

 

Knowing pretty much zero about the prototypes, are the Hornby LNER teak coaches any good? Any glaring errors I need to be aware of? (Wrong bogies, wrong length, that kind of thing? I would have 4 composites and 2 brakes – is this a vaguely realistic train composition? Unless the details on said South American river are wrong, the carriage numbers with FS are different to those with COTN, which is nice (disclaimer: I bought the Master of the Glens in January, don’t know whether the current sets have different numbering, or perhaps the current sets are from a different production batch?). Just in case, how difficult is it to renumber these?

 

What would be recommended to improve the appearance? Is there flush glazing available? Detailing kits?

 

Any other thoughts/comments?

 

Note that I have never yet customised any RTR stock before, unless you count dropping them. (Plus I have 2 young children, hence the ambition to stick to less valuable stock items for now.)

 

Thanks all.

[RJS1977]

I have no idea how the Railroad teaks work out in terms of whether they have the wrong bogies/are the wrong length etc. As the prototypes were gone before I was born, I have no memories of them to compare them to (other than photos in books of course) so to my way of thinking provided they look the part I can live with  possible inaccuracies like incorrect bogies if it keeps the price down, or being a compartment short if over a train it means I can get an extra coach in!

 

Again, not an expert on LNER train formations but two brake coaches (at opposite ends of the rake) and four compos sounds like a good start, though a restaurant car would probably be needed too. I'm sure Hornby used to do one, but they're not currently listed.

[teaky]

The old Hornby coaches do not correspond to any known LNER coaches.  They're an example of a once common practice of making rolling stock look similar to something real but compromising it to fit toy-like criteria.  The teak finish is poor too.  The bogies may well be a reasonable approximation of Gresley bogies.  At one point Hornby fitted these coaches with BR Mark 1 bogies but that changed some time ago.

 

The children may swing the argument in favour of the Railroad teaks though as they are robust.

 

GR.King converted several of the old style coaches into approximations of GNR and ECJS coaches.  Some of the conversions required extensive cutting and shutting but some were straightforward.  The resulting train looked excellent I thought.  There should be something on this forum somewhere.  The coaches run on the Grantham exhibition layout.

 

If you haven't customised RTR stock but want to have a go, these coaches would be an inexpensive way to start.  Even simple repaints can produce acceptable models if you're not fussy about dimensions.

[RJS1977]

  The teak finish is poor too. 

 

At least they got it the right way round though, which is better than they managed on the first batch of full-price ones!

[jwealleans]

Graeme King did indeed make some quasi-authentic and some thoroughly authentic diagrams from the old Hornby teak carriages. This involves cutting them into sections and then assembling those sections into authentic arrangements. There was an article on BRM in around 2007.

 

You can get a good looking teak finish on the plastic as well. As the carriages are roughly 18mm short you do end up with fewer than you started with.

 

This is one of Graeme's, alongside Tony Wright's C12 on Grantham. The roof is one of his resin castings.

 

 

Edit: Graeme did say to me that he did the work on these carriages after being told by one authority that they were useless and there was nothing you could do with them. It's up to you whether you feel the time and effort is worth it.

Edited July 11, 2018 by jwealleans

[Markeg]

Basically they are 10mm short.

Can be made to look okay though.  I have recoated one with a cedar wash/stain.  The numbers and letters are still legible.

I also bought from a deceased estate repainted coaches which were painted with teak paint possibly from Railmatch or Precision paints.

These will be sold off when I build the kits I have.  Lining on the raised beading can be difficult.  You need a steady hand. I use a bow pen.

 

I would google LNER coaches, go to LNER forum and LNER coach association website for reference material.

 

HMRS and Modelmaster do transfers with letters, numbers and lining.

 

South Eastern Finecast do flush glazing packs.

 

I have a spare body of a sleeper coach which I use for trying out paints and stains etc.

 

Hornby produce a correct length coach but these are expensive.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Mark in OZ

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

For cheap coaches which will withstand the attentions of children, these look to be a good deal. I would come straight out and say don't bother improving them with the likes of better glazing, unless you are a real enthusiast for doing this kind of thing; because they are such a flawed canvas as a starting point. (There are simple plastic kits - mostly now have to be found s/h but they are regularly available - for Gresley coaches in the Ian Kirk range; these will build into scale models for much the same effort, and can be improved as the owner chooses.)

 

Then, at some future point in time if the model railway interest is still burning bright, these coaches can be either sold on in trade for something better, or given the more or less ambitious rework treatment to taste. Repaint experiments, use of the bodies as carcases to apply new etched sides, massive carve ups as already described to make them into something more accurate. The one I particularly like is that the sleeper from this range is too short for an LNER sleeping car: but this company also built articulated twin sleeping cars with slightly shorter bodies, and relatively little carving makes a relatively accurate artic. twin sleeper from two of these original coaches.

[melmerby]

I am thinking of buying the Hornby ‘Flying Scotsman’ train set on a well-known on-line retailer named after a South American river if the price drops below £90-£100.

 

Thanks all.

There are two versions of the "Flying Scotsman" set:

R1167 which is a Railroad version:

http://assets.Hornby.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/r/1/r1167-flying-scotsman-3d-box_1.jpg

 

R2888M which is main range and included a blue A4 Kingfisher:

http://www.anticsonline.co.uk/l.aspx?k=14964

 

I bought brand new, loose from a dealer, the three teaks which came from R2888M, they were more expensive than the R/R ones (of which I have three, which I bought to experiment? with) but were still half the price some are asking for them.

Worth thinking about?

 

Or R1167 for under a ton: (inc Postage)

http://www.scograil.co.uk/Hornby-r1167-oo-gauge-the-flying-scotsman-train-set-5943-p.asp

 

Keith

Edited December 6, 2016 by melmerby

[Daddyman]

There are two versions of the "Flying Scotsman" set:

R1167 which is a Railroad version:

http://assets.Hornby.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/r/1/r1167-flying-scotsman-3d-box_1.jpg

 

R2888M which is main range and included a blue A4 Kingfisher:

http://www.anticsonline.co.uk/l.aspx?k=14964

 

I bought brand new, loose from a dealer, the three teaks which came from R2888M, they were more expensive than the R/R ones (of which I have three, which I bought to experiment? with) but were still half the price some are asking for them.

Worth thinking about?

 

Or R1167 for under a ton: (inc Postage)

http://www.scograil.co.uk/Hornby-r1167-oo-gauge-the-flying-scotsman-train-set-5943-p.asp

 

Keith

And morally preferable to buy from a model shop rather than Amazon. 

[manna]

G'day Gents

 

I know the Railroad Gresley coaches are short, but they look the part, and if you don't mind hacking one of them about you could end up making one of these.

 

manna

[melmerby]

The Railroad coaches are exactly the same as those in the Flying Scotsman or Master of The Glens sets so using the railroad coaches is quite ok.

Not the R2888M "Flying Scotsman" which are main range teak coaches as I posted above.

 

Keith

[RosiesBoss]

G'day, all,

 

I have a mix of Railroad and super-detailed teaks which I have assembled to run behind my live steam 4472 and 2509. When these are running, most eyes are on the locos, not the coaches. (I've displayed them many times at my club's annual exhibitions.)

 

When compared with the detailed coaches, the unaltered Railroad ones have certain obvious differences which I have corrected:

1. black underframes -  repainted in bauxite
2. ugly wide couplings on bogies - cut off and replaced with slimline tension-locks
3. plastic wheels on bogies -  replaced with modern metal Hornby ones
4. uncoloured moulded interiors - upgraded with approriate coloured paint and a few passengers

My rake of teaks also includes an old BSL all-third, described here: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/82377-lner-61ft-6in-gresley-vestibule-3rd/

 

I am yet to hear any of the people watching the magic of live steamers in action hauling my mixed rake complaining that some of them don't look the part behind the loco.

 

Here is 2509 on my home layout with them in tow:

 

To my eyes, 2001 looks great with them also:

 

What do you think?

 

Regards,

 

Rob

 

[RJS1977]

This programme looks as if it may have some 'Railroad Teak' content....

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/proginfo/2016/52/christmas-reassembler

[EWS60065]

You can improve the teaks with a brown wash followed by a pva varnish. Putting the same wash on the underframe will create a weathered bauxite finish. Also you can paint the wheel rims out in white, as was so on the prototype. The white roof can be streaked with weathering powders and grime build ups can be made by applying black wash to the ventilators. Here is my attempt however it is. Or finished yet.

[HonestTom]

I experimented with the concept of improving Railroad teaks with a paint job a while back - I wanted something to run behind my P2 but wasn't planning on taking the plunge into full-on LNER modelling. My process was:

 

- Paint the end doors in a light brown (Humbrol weathered wood, I believe)

- Paint the underframe brown

- Paint the interior

- Paint the roof grey

- Go over the teak in a wash of brown ink

- Weather

 

I went for a different finish on each coach (different colour roof, different shades of brown, different levels of weathering), as happened on the prototype. I also replaced the wheels and added passengers.

[Chamby]

As others have mentioned, a lick of paint and varnish, and replacing the wheels with metal ones makes a big difference.

 

I have painted mine with a mix of 20% leather brown and 80% satin varnish, then renumbered and the coaches with HMRS transfers.  Painting the sole bar bauxite also makes a difference, as does mucking up the roof.  I have renumbered some of the composite coaches as all 3rds, although a purist will probably moan, they look a lot better than having a full rake of composites!

 

[jwealleans]

That close, the painted corridor handrail really stands out.  .7 brass wire looks much better.

[Chamby]

1 hour ago, jwealleans said:

That close, the painted corridor handrail really stands out.  .7 brass wire looks much better.

 

Indeed.  However much you work on these coaches, they will always be a compromise, and you have to draw the line somewhere.  (Oh dear!)   I might return to them when my layout is built, but for now priorities have moved on.

 

It’s the tinted varnish that makes the biggest difference, as the bare plastic looks nothing like teak... Though not for the serious modeller (unless you are into severe butchery) this is a low cost project, but a big visual improvement is quickly achieved, so it is a great confidence builder.

 

Phil