RhB news

[Glorious NSE]

On 28/05/2022 at 06:49, PaulRhB said:

Have you seen this about the record attempt in October for the longest passenger train in the world? ;)

 

https://www.blick.ch/schweiz/laengster-personenzug-der-welt-rhb-hat-hauptprobe-fuer-weltrekordversuch-erfolgreich-bestanden-id17478107.html

 

More on the RhB forum on this and the stock movements. 
https://rhb.boards.net/thread/405/rhb-silly

Yep, picked up some info about it elsewhere and threw a quick post up earlier in the month - bonkers stuff, love it.

 

[PaulRhB]

On 29/10/2020 at 13:53, Glorious NSE said:

From one of the other websites linked it identified it as Alvra set 5705 with matching driving trailer 57805.
 

 

sat here and noticed the Alvra set had a 2nd class driving trailer so looked up the set that hit the rocks near Thusis and sure enough set 5 has a 52 series driving trailer so 5705 (which is 1st class) must be still being repaired or is it permanent?

[icn]

On 08/09/2022 at 18:24, PaulRhB said:

 

sat here and noticed the Alvra set had a 2nd class driving trailer so looked up the set that hit the rocks near Thusis and sure enough set 5 has a 52 series driving trailer so 5705 (which is 1st class) must be still being repaired or is it permanent?

I found this which suggests it's being repaired:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/rickskateboard/52311018377/in/photostream/

 

[Glorious NSE]

There's no spare Alvra rolling stock, so using one of the Universal ones as a stand in is logical to get the rest of the set back in use (suspect they have more Universal ones than they need deliberately to do this, and I suspect if one was ever written off, one of the 52xxx would get converted to be a new 57xxx!)

Quite a rebuild!
 

[PaulRhB]

22 minutes ago, Glorious NSE said:

There's no spare Alvra rolling stock, so using one of the Universal ones as a stand in is logical to get the rest of the set back in use (suspect they have more Universal ones than they need deliberately to do this, and I suspect if one was ever written off, one of the 52xxx would get converted to be a new 57xxx!)

Quite a rebuild!
 

Yes it’s a bit odd as they are using the old EW coaches to strengthen the sets a lot still. Why didn’t they get a batch of matching single coaches to strengthen or replace sets? I don’t know how many coaches of the old type can be used push pull as they are usually only seen as a 5 coach. We did spot one Alvra set being towed from the driving trailer end so I guess that was a electrical control failure. 

[PaulRhB]

 

 

translation

 

and the celebration livery on the 4/4iii

 

 

 

 

[Glorious NSE]

I'm surprised they don't have a whole 7th rake to cover the 6 daily diagrams! They seem fairly conservative in terms of having spares elsewhere. 

When we were over in 2020 odd additional EW coaches were very common, but they were always either locked out of use or reserved for booked parties when we looked at them - might be a "catering for different markets" thing, though it certainly makes the trains look less sleek.

Though it still doesn't look as odd as the scratch rakes to cover the inevitable Alvra maintainence.   🤣

[PaulRhB]

27 minutes ago, Glorious NSE said:

When we were over in 2020 odd additional EW coaches were very common, but they were always either locked out of use or reserved for booked parties when we looked at them -

last week there were one or two in most sets except Thursday when it was raining heavily at first. They were open and in general use too as we used them if the observation was busy. I still prefer them to the observation as you’ve got a proper seat on a longer journey :) 
 

 

 

 

[PaulRhB]

We did see a couple reserved but both when there were two hitched inbetween loco and an Alvra set so I think they had one purely as extra capacity on nice days. 
They also reserved a coach on several Capricorn twin sets

 

[Satan's Goldfish]

I didn't want to start a new thread, but wanted to share the below YouTube video somewhere; it's dated as taken in 2020 (so fairly recent) and as much as I like the Albula it's nice to see a RhB video that focuses on the Landquart - Davos area instead. The range of stock used is very inspiring for the modeller; tail end wagons, short freights, each formation is different. I think near the very end there's even an Allegra on a freight service (I can't see any passengers on it).

 

I assume a lot of the services video'd are now being taken over by Capricorn units?

 

 

[PaulRhB]

1 hour ago, Satan's Goldfish said:

I assume a lot of the services video'd are now being taken over by Capricorn units?

 

The Disentis to Scuol, brown route, is still loco hauled with 4/4ii’s at present and Capricorn’s can’t replace them as they can’t couple to anything but another Capricorn in normal service. 
 

The purple route from Landquart to Davos and Yellow, Davos to Filisur route is all Capricorns now apart from the heritage train and dedicated freight moves usually with a 4/4ii. 
 

Capricorns also run the Thusis to Chur Pink commuter route. There are a few Capricorns on the LQ, Klosters  to St Moritz too. 
 

Three car Allegra’s are mostly on the Chur to St Moritz and Bernina routes and the less powerful four car sets are now on the Samedan to Scuol route along with some 4/4ii hauled services which I guess cater for heavier freight loadings as the four car sets seem to only pull a couple. 
 

4/4ii’s cover those two passenger routes plus dedicated GEX services over the Albula and Chur to Disentis routes. The rest are running in pairs on freight between St Moritz and LQ. 
 

It will be interesting to see how the retirement of the 4/4ii 1973 batch affects things as they have more Capricorns on order. Will they take over Scuol to Disentis and freight become all loco hauled on that route as you need probably just four 4/4ii’s to cover it? Presently I see changing over to more Capricorns leaving a shortage of locos to shift freight as there aren’t enough Allegra’s to release more 4/4iii’s. I’m a little surprised they ordered more Capricorns over another batch of 35xx series Allegra’s or an up powered Capricorn style equivalent but time will tell. 

Edited October 14, 2022 by PaulRhB

[Satan's Goldfish]

15 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

 

The Disentis to Scuol, brown route, is still loco hauled with 4/4ii’s at present and Capricorn’s can’t replace them as they can’t couple to anything but another Capricorn in normal service. 
 

The purple route from Landquart to Davos and Yellow, Davos to Filisur route is all Capricorns now apart from the heritage train and dedicated freight moves usually with a 4/4ii. 
 

Capricorns also run the Thusis to Chur Pink commuter route. There are a few Capricorns on the LQ, Klosters  to St Moritz too. 
 

Three car Allegra’s are mostly on the Chur to St Moritz and Bernina routes and the less powerful four car sets are now on the Samedan to Scuol route along with some 4/4ii hauled services which I guess cater for heavier freight loadings as the four car sets seem to only pull a couple. 
 

4/4ii’s cover those two passenger routes plus dedicated GEX services over the Albula and Chur to Disentis routes. The rest are running in pairs on freight between St Moritz and LQ. 
 

It will be interesting to see how the retirement of the 4/4ii 1973 batch affects things as they have more Capricorns on order. Will they take over Scuol to Disentis and freight become all loco hauled on that route as you need probably just four 4/4ii’s to cover it? Presently I see changing over to more Capricorns leaving a shortage of locos to shift freight as there aren’t enough Allegra’s to release more 4/4iii’s. I’m a little surprised they ordered more Capricorns over another batch of 35xx series Allegra’s or an up powered Capricorn style equivalent but time will tell. 

 

Are the 6/6ii still in play too?

[PaulRhB]

57 minutes ago, Satan's Goldfish said:

 

Are the 6/6ii still in play too?

No all gone now from normal operation apart from 707 which is going to the heritage fleet plus the 4/4i’s are also on the way out with only two being preserved. 

Edited October 14, 2022 by PaulRhB

[PaulRhB]

I suppose the big D series Gm4/4’s can cover holes in rosters to some extent but they aren’t going to want to use them too much due to fuel costs. 
There just seems to be a hole in the big power as you need two 4/4ii’s to drag a freight up the Albula compared to one 4/4iii and there aren’t any opportunities to use the three car 35xx Allegra’s as they are fundamental to hauling freight on the Arosa and Bernina. There’s nothing to replace them on the Alvra sets except 4/4iii’s which doesn’t solve the problem. They are keeping the 80’s built 4/4ii’s but 628 has already been scrapped due to the landslide damage and with 611-620 slated to go as they need the next major overhaul what will replace them on the Disentis to Scuol route? It needs to be capable of hauling freight or they need some dedicated freight locos as far as I can see if they wish to use Capricorns on that.
The simplest fix would be a separate batch of Capricorns with two power cars, instead of one, and conventional or dual couplers? No info on any differences or additional orders though so it will interesting to see how they juggle this. Currently the only way I can see to free up more power is to use the new batch of Capricorns is to replace the ge4/4iii’s and their Alvra sets with 8 car units but then what do you do with 3-4 spare sets of coaches which are virtually brand new?

Edited October 14, 2022 by PaulRhB

[Satan's Goldfish]

1 hour ago, PaulRhB said:

No all gone now from normal operation apart from 707 which is going to the heritage fleet plus the 4/4i’s are also on the way out with only two being preserved. 

 

............. 'sadface'

[PaulRhB]

7 minutes ago, Satan's Goldfish said:

 

............. 'sadface'

Yes I agree but at 60 years old I guess they are pretty worn out as they were intensively used on the heaviest trains. 
I just find it a bit strange that there’s not something in the works with the 6/6ii, 4/4i gone or about to go and in the next few years half the 4/4ii’s retiring. A hybrid or electric version of the D series Gmf 4/4 would seem a quick route to a small class of new power. 

[Gordonwis]

8 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

 you need two 4/4ii’s to drag a freight up the Albula compared to one 4/4iii 

 

That's not true.

 

I've seen the heaviest freight on the Albula (normally the 'teatime' Samedan - Chur - Landquart) working with a single Ge4/4II

 

.

[Gordonwis]

11 hours ago, Satan's Goldfish said:

The range of stock used is very inspiring for the modeller; tail end wagons, short freights, each formation is different. I think near the very end there's even an Allegra on a freight service (I can't see any passengers on it).

 

11 hours ago, Satan's Goldfish said:

 

 

 

A bit like this - my shot at Kublis in Feb 2020 immediately pre lockdowns

 

All six vehicles in this train were different...

[PaulRhB]

2 hours ago, Gordonwis said:

 

That's not true.

 

I've seen the heaviest freight on the Albula (normally the 'teatime' Samedan - Chur - Landquart) working with a single Ge4/4II

 

.

That’s downhill though Gordon 😉 

The locos are being paired for heavy uphill workings and stay that way all day so usually downhill too. They are being paired on the workings usually hauled by the 6/6ii’s until they were retired. The week I was there this year 622 / 611 and 614 / 617 stayed paired all week. 
The 4/4ii has 2210hp and 179kN TE vs the 4/4iii 4160hp and 200kn TE, I should think the 4/4ii’s give a significant advantage in poor rail conditions too on the heavy trains with the four extra powered axles much like the 6/6ii had two extra over the 4/4iii. 
 

Uphill at Bergün 

 

 

 

Uphill Filisur

 

Uphill at the top of the Albula but on only 4 wagons in 2019. 

 

Downhill leaving Preda

 

Downhill at Samedan

 

pair at St Moritz

The only single loco freights we saw on the Albula this year were 4/4iii’s

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 15, 2022 by PaulRhB

[Keith Addenbrooke]

23 hours ago, Satan's Goldfish said:

I didn't want to start a new thread, but wanted to share the below YouTube video somewhere; it's dated as taken in 2020 (so fairly recent) and as much as I like the Albula it's nice to see a RhB video that focuses on the Landquart - Davos area instead. The range of stock used is very inspiring for the modeller; tail end wagons, short freights, each formation is different. I think near the very end there's even an Allegra on a freight service (I can't see any passengers on it).

 

I assume a lot of the services video'd are now being taken over by Capricorn units?

 

 

Loved every minute - thank you.  I’m curious what the building hiding behind the trees at 2.00 minutes is?  Seems to have an interesting roof line?  (I don’t recognise the train in that sequence either, it’s a class I’ve not come across before?), Keith.

 

[PS: It is still a bit dangerous for me to watch these videos - I’ve reinvested the proceeds from my H0m sale in a number of exciting alternative projects I’m enjoying, but at the same time I do still wish I’d been able to keep the space for the small FO layout I planned].

[icn]

There's been a long-standing plan to use

22 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

The Disentis to Scuol, brown route, is still loco hauled with 4/4ii’s at present and Capricorn’s can’t replace them as they can’t couple to anything but another Capricorn in normal service.

There's been a long standing plan to use Capricorn's for the Landquart-Scuol section, to allow (half of) the Landquart-Davos and Landquart-Scuol trains to run as one until Klosters. Latest reports suggest this operation will start end of 2023  https://www.suedostschweiz.ch/ereignisse/ab-dezember-wird-bei-der-rhb-gefluegelt

 

In the meantime - starting 2022, they'll be using Capricorns for Landquart-Klosters-St. Moritz and the other half of the Landquart-Klosters-Davos connections (as one train until Klosters).

Edited October 15, 2022 by icn

[PaulRhB]

5 hours ago, icn said:

There's been a long standing plan to use Capricorn's for the Landquart-Scuol section, to allow (half of) the Landquart-Davos and Landquart-Scuol trains to run as one until Klosters. Latest reports suggest this operation will start end of 2023 

So I guess it’ll have to be dedicated freight only services using the 4/4ii’s a couple of times a day with probably just one loco covering it on a Chur - Scuol - Chur double trip or something. 
The main loss will be so many opening windows which you really feel when the only people say in the Capricorn have chosen those seats and don’t use them, hey ho. 

[PaulRhB]

6 hours ago, Keith Addenbrooke said:

Loved every minute - thank you.  I’m curious what the building hiding behind the trees at 2.00 minutes is?  
 

 

AlpenGold luxury hotel just north of Davos platz station. 

 

6 hours ago, Keith Addenbrooke said:

  (I don’t recognise the train in that sequence either, it’s a class I’ve not come across before?), Keith.

It’s one of the recently retired Pendulum railcars. Most have gone for scrap but one driving trailer is preserved at Bergün and moving to the local garden centre, 

 

and one set is entering the heritage collection. 

In happier times at Davos

Filisur

and Samedan

 

 

 

[PaulRhB]

This guy does some really nice drone sequences around the Albula if you look at his channel. 
 

Doppeltraktion (doubleheaders) at Filisur  

 

 

 

[Glorious NSE]

On 14/10/2022 at 13:44, PaulRhB said:

 

 

FWIW, my take is that:

Everything becomes Capricorns on a regular hourly timetable except:

Scuol-Pontresina (4 car allegra push pull sets)
Arosa (Allegra)
Bernina (Allegra/DC cars)
Albula (Allegra/Loco)
(Plus the heritage diagram to Filisur)

A commuter fill-in to Ilanz starts (already running in the peaks)
Landquart-Davos service finishes as a separate route
The Disentis-Scuol will drop 4 cars for Davos at Klosters
The Landquart-St Moritz will drop 4 cars for Davos at Klosters on the opposing half hour, recreating the half hourly service

(Stations between Landquart and Klosters have been extended so those trains can run longer than the normal 8 cars if any of those need to run longer due to events)