S7 scratch building

[S.D.L.]

Stunning as always.

[airnimal]

S.D.L  thank you, your comments are always gratefully received. 

 

This is may be a bit oversize and I may try and thin the pin down and make it smaller. 

When I think about things like watches or jewellery made hundreds of years ago without electricity or modern technology or other antiques in similar veins I think my efforts are a poor imitation of of fine workmanship. How did they do it ?

[Simond]

19 hours ago, airnimal said:

How did they do it ?

Slowly. Very slowly…

[apl31]

While mentioning small parts. If  anybody is  looking to fabricate small parts, its always worth examining electronic components.

I was trying to make a fiddly lever from scrap the other day and decided to push out the pins of an IC socket. When unfolded it was very close to what I needed. I think they are nickel plated which solders well but I think needs good ventilation.

I assume these parts are stamped out but they are very intricate shapes with slots which would be difficult to make by hand. Other useful parts may be 0.1" pin headers straight and bent and crimp connections. Its well worth looking if faced with small intricate parts. While the pins are within plastic bases in my experience they easily push out 

Edited January 28 by apl31

[airnimal]

I am getting as near I can go trying to detail these pins and bar fittings.  I have used some thinner material for the bar which I think does look better but if I have to admit it i am not entirely satisfied with it. 

 

 

[Caley Jim]

I would be perfectly happy with that, but then, as I've said before, my standards are nowhere near as high as yours!  ☹️

 

Jim

[airnimal]

After several weeks of inactivity I finally made an effort to add all the nuts and bolts to the remaining end and side. There are still a few bits to complete as well as sorting out the axleboxes and springs before painting commences. 

 

I don't know how I will explain the visitor of a Scottish wagon in the Manchester area but there are worst crimes about in the model world than mine. 

Edited February 14 by airnimal
Predicted text again.

[airnimal]

I will wait until Doncaster show next weekend to buy some paint for the last wagon. 

So with nothing moving on the house front I have decided to make another wagon.  

Another one from a drawing by Len Travender from his Railway  Equipment Drawings book. 

This one is on page 33 and is of an early LSWR 4 plank with a sheet bar. 

What has attracted me is the overlapping sides with the ends set inwards and the unusual brake handle along with the wheels. These wheels have an extra rim like some early Scottish wagons. 

I had a set of wheel rims for a GER wagon from Ragstone models that I have never used. They should have twice as many bolts on them for this wagon. I am not sure I can live with this discrepancy but I can always change them at a later date. I did consider turning them over to the plain side and adding the correct number of bolts before I glued the rims in place but in the end I decided I could probably live with it. Time will tell.

[Tom Burnham]

Interesting. Have you ever made a South Eastern Railway wagon with Mansell wheels?

[airnimal]

Tom, I don't remember ever making a SECR wagon with Mansell wheels. Having built so many over the years my memory isn't as sharp as it was. The problem now is trying to find the correct axleboxes and buffers. So many of the old school traders have retired or are no longer with us, and so many of the new people doing 3D printing don't appear to advertise or have I missed something.  

 

I now have a basic frame using my own W-irons that are a perfect match for this wagon. I found some coach buffers that also match, how lucky was that. 

 

I had an interesting morning today because I was asked by one of my grandsons if I would volunteer to go on his school outing. This was to the Lime kilns at Marple where Samuel Oldknow built a very large complex bringing Lime down from the Buxton area to burn in his kilns. He brought the lime down from Buxworth basin by canal straight into the Lime kilns. 

I learnt quite a bit more about the process and had a thoroughly good time. 

[Caley Jim]

18 hours ago, airnimal said:

What has attracted me is the overlapping sides with the ends set inwards and the unusual brake handle along with the wheels. These wheels have an extra rim like some early Scottish wagons. 

This type of wheel is described in Mike Williams' book on CR Wagons (p35, drawing on p34).  In it this type had welded joints between the spokes and tyre, reinforced by two bolts, one either side of each spoke.  The drawing is from one for a 7T mineral 'bogie' and dates from 1878.  The same wheels are shown on a similar drawing of 1882.

 

Jim

[airnimal]

This wagon is turning out to be a British Leyland friday afternoon car. I am now on the second frame along with 6 new sides and 4 new ends. I don't have any excuses because I have a clear and precise drawing to work to. I think that I have worked it out where I have been going wrong. 

I have left the sides over long to be trimmed back later.  I think my mind hasn't been on this build because i am having a busy week.  Tomorrow i have to take my wife to Buxton hospital which may be fun because the weather forecast is for snow which can be very heavy up there. Friday I have a funeral and Saturday is the Doncaster show with cycling on Sunday. 

 

 

[airnimal]

We have just had a phone call from Buxton Hospital cancelling my wife's appointment because there is heavy snow there. The lady told my wife that the staff are been sent home so that they don't get stuck in work. I must say that I am not surprised after visiting Buxton in winter over the years.

 

This means now I get on with this latest wagon now that I have figured out the over lapping sides. Now that everything is trimmed back it all starting to make sense and I wonder why I struggled to get it right first time. 

[airnimal]

I have drilled the holes and fitted the buffers although they are not glued in yet. There appears to be a small plate behind then which is yet to be made. Does anyone know what colour Brown the LSWR used and is it available from the trade ?  Before I glued the sides on I introduced a outward bend in them so that once assembled the body has a distinct bow in it. How many wagons do you see at exhibitions where just the opposite is apparent. Rant over. 

 

We had a video call this morning from our daughter in Australia who has announced that they are coming home for Christmas. This has already started my wife panicking on where we are going to put them all, and what are we going to do about Christmas dinner. Our daughter wants to show her children some snow because where they lived they have never had snow. They have 300 days a year of sunshine and she said it's 20.45 and it's still 31 degress. 

[Nick C]

51 minutes ago, airnimal said:

Does anyone know what colour Brown the LSWR used and is it available from the trade ?

LSWR Wagon brown was the same shade subsequently used by the SR.

 

Precision do it, I'm sure there are others: https://www.phoenix-paints.co.uk/products/paint-products/precisionrailway/pregroup/lswrpregroup/14p91

[airnimal]

Thanks Nic, I will try and gets some paint at the Doncaster show on Saturday but I see that Precision Paints are not listed as a trader. I wonder if any of the other traders stock it.

 

Moving on with the ironwork which is quite unusual which clearly shouts LSWR wagon at me.

The tarpaulin bar I was thinking of making it from brass fearing that plastic would be to delicate. I have made one from plastic before but the fixing on that wagon was inside the wagon rather than sat on top like on this wagon. The fixing appears to slot in a small bracket on the ends of the wagon with a chain preventing it from falling off. 

 

[Nick C]

50 minutes ago, airnimal said:

Thanks Nic, I will try and gets some paint at the Doncaster show on Saturday but I see that Precision Paints are not listed as a trader. I wonder if any of the other traders stock it.

H&A models, Cheltenham Model Centre and Digitrains are all listed here: https://www.phoenix-paints.co.uk/store-finder

[Caley Jim]

Squires list it in the Railmatch range http://www.squirestools.com/files/12-18a.pdf .  199-633, near top left on p263.

 

Jim

[airnimal]

Thanks to Nick c and Caley Jim for that information which has been added to the shopping list, because if I don't I will never remember.  

 

There will not been any progress for the next few days because of various commitments,  some pleasant and some less so. Yesterday was spent tidying up because we have a couple of viewings on the house booked for Saturday.  The estate agents tell us that our house is the only one on our estate in our price range which he believes goes in our favour.  We shall see.

[Poggy1165]

On 01/02/2024 at 10:04, airnimal said:

After serving weeks of inactivity I finally made an effort to add all the nuts and bolts to the remaining end and side. There are still a few bits to complete as well as sorting out the axleboxes and springs before painting commences. 

 

I don't know how I will explain the visitor of a Scottish wagon in the Manchester area but there are worst crimes about in the model world than mine. 

 

On this point, I am reminded that I once read an article that mentioned a 'demurrage train' that used to run from Manchester to Carlisle on a daily basis. It had to be in Carlisle by a certain time, so it was important. It took me years to figure out what a 'demurrage train' was, but I think you can safely assume that Scottish wagons appeared in the Manchester area. (Though I suppose Maryport and Carlisle and maybe even North Eastern wagons might also have been returned this way.)

[airnimal]

Thank you Brian for that information, I now have my excuse for my Scottish wagon near Manchester. 

 

It has been an interesting few days. I tried to go to a funeral on Friday of an old work colleague in Eccles.  My wife dropped me at the tram in East Didsbury in plenty of time but the usual reliable service was disrupted because of a broken rail somewhere on the system.  There are a couple of pinch points that act as a bottle neck and when something goes wrong usually leads to chaos. 

So I gave up and went and joined my cycling chums for a beer instead.  If I had tried to go by bus I would never have got there in time to attend.  

On Saturday we went to Doncaster for the show by train. The direct train was halted at Sheffield to be replaced by buses to Donnie because someone had stolen some of the signal wire between the two stations. After waiting for over an hour in the bus station we were informed that the signals had been fixed. A couple of hundred people marched back to the station only to be greeted by a packed platform by hundreds trying to board already full trains. Chaos ensued because trains were being switched about because of the problems,  but we managed to board a very crowded train to Doncaster.  This was similar to a Guinness Book of records attempt to squeeze as many people in a Mini as possible.  

I enjoyed the show which I thought had something for everyone. I did try and buy some Brown paint for this LSWR wagon and ended up with a RailMatch colour that isn't correct. It is to much like a red oxide and not chocolate.  I tried spraying it over a red oxide base as well as a grey base. I also sprayed it direct onto some plain white plasticard but the results were not any different.     

[airnimal]

Although progress is very slow and small details don't show much improvement,  a certain amount has been done. The small reinforcements brackets at the bottom of the ends take a long time to get right as do the coupling plates.  I need to make the tarpaulin bar, which hopefully I will make from brass. 

[airnimal]

I found just the right size brass for the tarpaulin bar in stock that I have had for over 40 years. 

When I started out in 7mm I purchased a few pieces in different lengths of brass and nickel which has proved invaluable over the years. Now that some of the small suppliers have disappeared from the market it has turned out to be a wise decision.  

I have shaped the end of the bar according to the drawing and added the brackets that slot into another bracket on the end of the wagon. Still to do is the single sided brakegear before I start adding all the nuts and bolts.  Looking at photographs in Southern Wagons Vol 1 of similar wagons it appears that they have hexagonal bolts and not the square ones on most private owner wagons. So it looks like it will be out with the Masterclub bolts. 

 

[Nick C]

On 12/02/2024 at 13:16, airnimal said:

I did try and buy some Brown paint for this LSWR wagon and ended up with a RailMatch colour that isn't correct. It is to much like a red oxide and not chocolate.  I tried spraying it over a red oxide base as well as a grey base. I also sprayed it direct onto some plain white plasticard but the results were not any different.     

I've not tried the Railmatch, but that's why I suggested the Precision one, I've used it on several 4mm wagons and know that it looks right (at least to my eye).

[sir douglas]

The guys on another layout in our club have been using a rail brown from Rainbow Railways for their track, its just like Railmatch bit about half the price

https://rainbowrailways.co.uk/product-category/paint-varnish-thinners/rainbow-railways-paint-range/rainbow-railways-enamel/

Edited February 14 by sir douglas