Bury electric stock

[rue_d_etropal]

Once you do one EMU, you want to do every one. That is my challenge. Finding drawings is the difficult part.

As the Bury line is relatively local to me, I had found that there might be some interest in the pioneering electric stock the L&Y introduce a 100 years ago. I even joined the L&Y society, who have been very helpful. Hopefully they will appreciate my efforts to design one of the Bury units. It is reconned these were the most advance designs of the time,only surpassed by the BR Mk2 coaches!

The trailer cars are different, but at least they are both the same externally. The middle motor coach has a couple of differences with resopct to windows at one end.

Edited April 25, 2017 by rue_d_etropal

[dhjgreen]

I would love a set of those for my Bolton Street layout (set in 1959, so perfect)

[Joseph_Pestell]

Were these not based on contemporary US designs? Or did the US copy the L&Y?

[rue_d_etropal]

The earlier Westinghouse stock(Mersey Railway) almost certainly was based on USA designs, so the Southport stock might have ben influenced. The Bury stock shares some same features, but it was the first all metal stock in UK. Not sure about the USA though. They were big as well, 63ft long and over 9ft wide. They wre designe sopassengers could get on and off quickly and safely.

The models should be ready soon, just want to get a test print of the motor car first. Luckily it is not necessary to run whole 5 car train, as it split into a 2 car and 3 car off peak. In theory a motor car could run as a single, but I think the intended minimum was 2 car, with a motor car and a first class trailer.

I tend to only offer models as WSF, but some seem to have a grudge against it, but if they are happy to pay a LOT more for FUD plastic I can offer that. Personally don't think it is worth the extra, especially as FUD can be affected by UV over time, and is not as easy to paint. Simple brush on acrylic or emulson works superbly on WSF.

As the sides on these coaches is smooth, rubbing it down will not kill detail.

 

I had thought about an interior, but it would only be basic , and probably not worth the cost. Easier to either not bother, as in smaller scales it is not that visible, or build oneself.

 

I am at the Blackpool tram exhibition in June, and the KWVR gala exhibition in July. Hopefully will have a model there.

Edited April 27, 2017 by rue_d_etropal

[dhjgreen]

I did find your shop, I will be ordering when they are ready. Do you have a suggestion for bogies?

[Joseph_Pestell]

I had thought about an interior, but it would only be basic , and probably not worth the cost. Easier to either not bother, as in smaller scales it is not that visible, or build oneself.

 

 

I have an idea that they had tramcar-style seats (reversible backs). Might be worth doing those as a set if nothing suitable already somewhere on Shapeways.

[Joseph_Pestell]

They were big as well, 63ft long and over 9ft wide.

 

The LYRS site gives these as being 67'7" long and 9'4" wide. The Southport units were a massive 10' wide and 63' long.

[johnd]

Hi am highly interested can you send me the shop details by pvt message.

Thx in advance. John

[dhjgreen]

Hi am highly interested can you send me the shop details by pvt message.

Thx in advance. John

Link in his signature box. Edited April 27, 2017 by dhjgreen

[rue_d_etropal]

I have an idea that they had tramcar-style seats (reversible backs). Might be worth doing those as a set if nothing suitable already somewhere on Shapeways.

The difficulty with interiors, is that the width is much reduced in the model. These units used every inch possible. In smaller scales the seat types arec not that obvious. not like wooden slatted tram cars. It is something I might consider, but waiting for firsr test sample of motor coach before seeing if it worthwhile.

What surprises me is that only real difference between 3rd class and 1st, was width of seats, 2+2 instead of 2+3, no extra leg room.

[MarshLane]

Hiya Simon,

Nice modelling. If you should go on to do the later Class 504 version in O gauge, I'm interested. Remember riding those from Bessie's into Victoria!

 

Nice 3D modeling of the L&Y versions.

 

Rich

Edited May 2, 2017 by MarshLane

[Joseph_Pestell]

Hiya Simon,

Nice modelling. If you should go on to do the later Class 504 version in O gauge, I'm interested. Remember riding those from Bessie's into Victoria!

 

Nice 3D modeling of the L&Y versions.

 

Rich

3D rather too expensive when expanded to 1::43 - at least to produce complete shells.

 

But a 504 might be built up in a modular style like Ian Kirk's coaches. I think I am right in saying that those same modules would also be appropriate for various 30x series units as well.

[dhjgreen]

Hiya Simon,

Nice modelling. If you should go on to do the later Class 504 version in O gauge, I'm interested. Remember riding those from Bessie's into Victoria!

 

Nice 3D modeling of the L&Y versions.

 

Rich

Rich,

 

Is it some time since you moved away or a typo, no "i" in Besses.  I too rode the 504s from Besses to Victoria.  Lived on Lancaster Avenue.

[MarshLane]

Rich,

 

Is it some time since you moved away or a typo, no "i" in Besses. I too rode the 504s from Besses to Victoria. Lived on Lancaster Avenue.

Ah well spotted! Did the response on my phone and the spell checker changed it without me noticing!! Never actually lived in Manchester although one parent grew up there, but had family at the south end of Whitefield, so Besses o'th Barnwas closer! Always wanted to do something modelling that line.

 

Joseph, yes I believe your right. No expert, but I think the body sides were very similar if not the same for 304 and 305 driving cars.

 

Rich

[rue_d_etropal]

The BR standards(whch include the 504s and probably at the end of a long list. Also not so sure about O scale, as they are big and therefore expensive. I also start my designs in O scale, so there can be a few discrepancies, and I would also prefer to add more detail. This is the type of thing I hopefully will do in the future, as my skills improve. Getting curves on roof ends to look OK is difficult enough. Still easier than bending brass to those curves I suspect!

At the momenI prefer to get something designed and out there. It might not suit everyone, but for most it is better to have something than nothing. One reason I only do the body, not the underframe. My aim is to eventually have designs for all British EMUs, and possibly steam railmotors and DMUs(certainly from pre grouping  up to BR MK 1 types).Some drwaings are small, so have to be printed bigger, and there is a lot of educated guesswork.

[dhjgreen]

I am still interested in which donor(s) could be used with this please.

 

Edit to say I am hoping a 2EPB would work as I have one available.

Edited May 3, 2017 by dhjgreen

[Joseph_Pestell]

I am still interested in which donor(s) could be used with this please.

 

Edit to say I am hoping a 2EPB would work as I have one available.

Assuming that you are modelling in 4mm scale, I don't think so. IIRC all the L&Y units had long wheelbase bogies.

[dhjgreen]

Assuming that you are modelling in 4mm scale, I don't think so. IIRC all the L&Y units had long wheelbase bogies.

Sorry about all the ratings, tablet fat fingers!

[rue_d_etropal]

The driving cars had 9ft 6in bogies, but the trailer ones had 10ft ones. It actually makes it easier for me in HO, as I can find suitably lengthed bogies(old Trix/Liliput Pen.nine DMU ones I believe). For 4mm scale, you could probably get away with some of the motor bogies available as 9ft 6in only works out at 38mm.

[rue_d_etropal]

now received first test sample. Only problem is that the corrugations have not shown up on the shutter doors. Not a big problem. Will give it a quick coat of paint , and then take some photos. I will have it with me at MRX(DCC exhibition) in a week's time. Should be no problem resizing up to 4mm/ft, and also hopefully 3mm/ft and N scales.

Did a quick design for a 501 train, so the 504 will evolve out of that.

[dhjgreen]

now received first test sample. Only problem is that the corrugations have not shown up on the shutter doors. Not a big problem. Will give it a quick coat of paint , and then take some photos. I will have it with me at MRX(DCC exhibition) in a week's time. Should be no problem resizing up to 4mm/ft, and also hopefully 3mm/ft and N scales.

Did a quick design for a 501 train, so the 504 will evolve out of that.

Can't find it now but someone on here was looking for a 501. Not sure if his budget will run to 3D though.

[rue_d_etropal]

If Bachmann were to bring out a 501 it would not be cheap. Build a kit you have to add in the cost of your time, or maybe someone else's actual time. My 3D printed models are aimed somewhere in the middle.

It made sense to start on one of the BR standards, asit does not take much work to evolve into other classes.

The Bury unit is almost ready to be photographed(when paint dries). I have not started on building chasis yet, but wanted to get it to this stage, then I can do the other coaches.

[Clive Mortimore]

I am still interested in which donor(s) could be used with this please.

 

Edit to say I am hoping a 2EPB would work as I have one available.

Hi David

 

A 2EPB is one route that could be taken to make a class 504, all the doors are in the right place. New cabs would be required, Southern Pride do cabs for the 304 that could be modified. New bogies would also have to be on the shopping list. I haven't looked at the under gubbins but I think that would need changing as well. 

 

Another route is to use Replica Mk1 bodies and Southern Pride cabs. An alternative to Southern Pride cabs is to make your own out of plastic card. 

[dhjgreen]

Hi David

 

A 2EPB is one route that could be taken to make a class 504, all the doors are in the right place. New cabs would be required, Southern Pride do cabs for the 304 that could be modified. New bogies would also have to be on the shopping list. I haven't looked at the under gubbins but I think that would need changing as well.

 

Another route is to use Replica Mk1 bodies and Southern Pride cabs. An alternative to Southern Pride cabs is to make your own out of plastic card.

 

Clive,

 

Already done that thanks, I used DC Kits parts; Charlie still has some parts left. As it is 1959 on my layout the L&Y unit is pretty much essential.

Edited May 14, 2017 by dhjgreen

[rue_d_etropal]

you can cut and shunt, various kit bodies, but not everyone can or wants to do that. Also it is not unknown for ranges to disappear.

Also I model HO not OO, so I have no other option. Then there is N scale and TT scale.

It did not take me that long to do the design for the 501, and the others will follow. It is all done in the virtual world, no other set up costs for prodution, although I am tempted to put togeher a proper advert.