N15x info/drawings/photos

[Jack P]

Hello collective Southern mind,

 

I'm looking for some detailed photos of the SR N15x class, specifically (3)2331 'Beattie', and if it was different in any way except buffers to the rest of the class, but any detail photos would be greatly appreciated. I'm particularly interested in the Cab layout, and boiler back-head, would this be most similar to a Lord Nelson, due to the Belpaire firebox arrangement?

 

Also interested to know if there were any major differences in the Urie tenders that were fitted aside from the large air tanks?

 

Thanks guys, 

 

Jack

 

PS: I have scoured the net for as many usable pictures as possible, and have trawled through the book: Urie & Maunsell Cylinder Locos by David Maidment, if anyone has any other book suggestions please let me know!

Edited May 28, 2018 by Jack P

[Nick Holliday]

The Belpaire boiler was, as far as I know, the original LBSC design, so no necessary similarities between it and the Lord Nelson type.

A C Perryman wrote a couple of books that focused on the L class, one of his favourites, which included this drawing showing the boiler backhead (if that's the correct term)

Russell's book on Southern Locos might give you a few more pointers, and Bradley's RCTS work, volume 3, might contain details of any fundamental changes to your chosen loco.

[N15class]

The Urie tenders come in two or three sorts. All slightly different, heights width etc. You'd need to find out which ones where fitted. I probably have GA's of them. The cylinders are a secondary fitting.

Edited May 28, 2018 by N15class

[Jack P]

Nick, thanks for that photo, that gives me plenty to go off. Currently looking for a copy of Russell's book you mentioned.

 

The Urie tenders come in two or three sorts. All slightly different, heights width etc. You'd need to find out which ones where fitted. I probably have GA's of them. The cylinders are a secondary fitting.

 

Thanks Peter! I didn't realise they were different. I knew about the flared and flat sided version, I need to figure out if they were the same as the donor King Arthur tender i'm using. Holding the tender castings up to the Hornby model reveals they look to be the same.

[Wickham Green]

The Belpaire boiler was, as far as I know, the original LBSC design, so no necessary similarities between it and the Lord Nelson type.

A C Perryman wrote a couple of books that focused on the L class, one of his favourites, which included this drawing showing the boiler backhead (if that's the correct term)

image.jpeg

Russell's book on Southern Locos might give you a few more pointers, and Bradley's RCTS work, volume 3, might contain details of any fundamental changes to your chosen loco.

'boiler backhead' or 'boiler front' .... terms seem contradictory though interchangeable ! ( like flammable and inflammable ) ............ try finding a photo of a 'K' class cab - chances are the layout will be similar.

I'm not sure what tender swap detail Bradley goes into in the Brighton Volume 3 but all the ins an' outs ( or offs an' ons ) are listed in his later and larger Wild Swan volume on Urie Locomotives.

[Jack P]

I always thought it was 'Boiler Backhead', but I suppose as long as it's understood, i'm happy! 

 

Finding cab photos of the K class is just as hard as finding N15x cab photos, What is this 'Brighton Volume 3' you're referring to?

[Nick Holliday]

I always thought it was 'Boiler Backhead', but I suppose as long as it's understood, i'm happy!

 

Finding cab photos of the K class is just as hard as finding N15x cab photos, What is this 'Brighton Volume 3' you're referring to?

There is at least one very clear view of a K class cab, and it doesn't look much like the drawing of the L I posted.

The reference to Volume 3 is regarding the trilogy of books published by the RCTS and written by Bradley, covering the locomotives of the London Brighton and South Coast Railway. They also did the LSWR locos, two volumes, LCDR, SER and SECR. Bradley subsequently expanded the LSWR volumes into the four part series published by Wild Swan. Some of the WSP ones are still available, I believe, and the RCTS ones turn up on second hand stalls and websites from time to time.

For what it's worth, V 3 has little to say on the tenders, apart from where they came from, and where some were reallocated after withdrawal of the N15X locos.

Edited May 30, 2018 by Nick Holliday

[Jack P]

     I can't remember which magazine it was in, but I have a copy of an article surrounding the N15x class, including diagrams of the locomotives and tenders, and some information about individual members of the series. When I'm back from Yorkshire I'll scan it in and send it onto you Jack if you'd like?

 

- Alex

 

Absolutely, thanks Alex, that would be really helpful!

[Dunsignalling]

N15x drawings by Ian Beattie in Railway Modeller, October 1998.

 

Photo feature and notes on the class by Eric Youldon in British Railways Illustrated, July 2007. 

 

John

[Michael Edge]

There is also a Roche drawing but these are notoriously unreliable, I did once build an N15x from this drawing and it looked OK to me though.

[Wickham Green]

There is also a Roche drawing but these are notoriously unreliable, I did once build an N15x from this drawing and it looked OK to me though.

Presumably Mr.Roche was working in an era when precise detail was less important even though the prototype was available to see, measure and even ride behind ...... yet the 'trade' could get away with flogging a steamroller-wheeled 'atlantic' and calling it a 'Lord Nelson'. Many yeas later, after most of his subjects had gone to make razor blades, Ian Beattie managed to create a better standard of drawing - though, like the rest of us, he, too, got things wrong at times. As always, work from a contemporary photo of your subject, stir in a little educated guesswork ( for the side that didn't get pictured ), check as many drawings as you can find for the basic dimensions - with a pinch of salt, perhaps ....... and if all else fails, resort to Rule 1. 

[Michael Edge]

The details on the Roche drawings are very good and usually quite accurate, the errors are much more fundamental. 

[Jack P]

Thanks guys.

 

I've been able to determine that 'Beattie' (3)2331 was the only one with round buffers. Some members of the class received straps from the smokebox to the smoke deflectors, although that seemed to be later on in life. I'm fairly sure from studying photos (although more research is always needed) that the buffers were the only difference that 2331 had to other members, does anyone know why?