Class 50 prototype freelancing

[LU_fan]

First of all, I admit that I like both of the locomotives in question, as well as the liveries they wear/wore. However, at the same time, I also think locomotives and rolling stock should be preserved in liveries they actually wore.

 

50031 is currently wearing the InterCity swallow livery. This is something which I kinda wish had happened back when they still pulled InterCity trains in regular service.

 

50035 did for a time wear the LoadHaul livery and the fictional number 50135. Up until recently I thought that was a PR stunt as I haven't seen a single picture of it actually hauling any freight. But at least now I understand why that is, seeong as it was repainted 13 years after LoadHaul disappeared.

 

So... Why are/were they repainted like this in, not just one, but two cases of 1:1 scale prototype freelancing? I'm hoping someone can give me at least a little insight into how those decisions were taken.

[009 micro modeller]

I'm not sure. In the early days there were several preserved steam locos painted in liveries created by the heritage lines (Worth Valley), or BR locos in pre-grouping liveries (Lakeside and Haverthwaite). The Epping Ongar line did this with their DMU, originally in 'EOR blue' but this is now in a conventional livery. I get the impression the Worth Valley (and probably Ongar as well) did it to give the line its own identity after preservation, and the Caledonian liveried locos at Lakeside were presumably just what people wanted at the time (again returning to an earlier, more independent part of the railways' history). More recently Lyd and the Talyllyn locos have both worn BR black for a bit as a 'what might have been' type of thing, which is possibly getting closest to the answer you're looking for.

[iands]

I think it was a condition placed on the KVR (and others) in the early days of preservation that they weren't allowed to paint the engines in any of the BR colour schemes - so they had to create their own colour schemes. As for the 50's, sorry I don't have a clue, but I agree, and this is just my personal preference, I prefer to see any preserved loco in a colour scheme it actually wore in revenue earning service.

[E3109]

I too prefer genuine liveries, but many would point out that "it's only paint", and unlike physical mods can easily be rectified.

Also it's up to the owner what they do with their loco, the only issue I sometimes have with that is if something goes for scrap without being offered to the wider preservation circle first and even that can be justified depending on the circumstances (eg exchanging one loco for another in a scrapyard because the 'scrap' engine is in better nick).

 

I recall when 40145 was first painted in Revised Blue (large logo) for a Bury diesel day in 1991. A few purists spat their dummies out when they saw it, and went home.

Many more stayed, and enjoyed the day.

[LU_fan]

I get the impression the Worth Valley (and probably Ongar as well) did it to give the line its own identity after preservation,

While it's one thing wanting to give a heritage line its own identity and its own look, that doesn't really cover the locos in question. 50031 is still in a BR livery, albeit one it never wore in their service, and 50135 wore the colours of another operating company. Although I guess they do fall under the "what might have been" category.

 

And it's true what E3109 says: it's up to the owner what liveries their locomotives wear. I'm just curious about the thought process behind some of the decisions.

[009 micro modeller]

While we're on the subject, apparently the Ongar DMU was initially in a similarly inauthentic red livery. Has anyone seen pictures of this?

[Davexoc]

Aren't some repaints done on a shareholder vote basis?

[E3109]

Aren't some repaints done on a shareholder vote basis?

Think so.

I reckon the pragmatic approach is to see any fictitious paint schemes as undercoat, but undercoat that will probably bring a bit of revenue in pending repaint into authentic livery. I believe that the Loadhaul and Intercity class 50 liveries have been good in that respect.

 

I wouldn't get too precious about paint, as it can easily be corrected. Though I suppose there are exceptions, for instance the Duchess 'City of Birmingham' carries a genuine 1960s BR paint job and I could understand why people would object to any repaint in that engine's case.

 

Personally I'd like to see the class 76 26020 in another livery for a while, but I can't see that ever happening. The black she wears is a cracking job, done by Doncaster Works in 1978-ish.

 

A water-based, washable temporary topcoat could theoretically be an option: but in practice it might not be so easy to remove, they used similar paint on 37093 when it was performing tv 'police car' duties and it wouldn't wash off!

[black and decker boy]

I think I’ve seen mention from one of the groups that it’s a matter of PR. They have other class 50s in authentic liveries but so do many others.

 

By breaking the mould and painting one of their fleet in a unique livery, they get lots of exposure in mags / internet and so in.

 

Good PR = interest = donations & volunteers.

 

CFPS have done similar with the large logo 40 and with commercial sponsorship (Beaversports 40).

[EddieK]

The 50 in "Inter City Swallow" livery s not as per the text book version of that livery. The swallow livery on a diesel loco had white lower bodysides, the 50 has the creamy colour of the earlier Inter City executive livery.

 

With preserved locos, are the owners of them the owners of a full size train set? Or are they custodians of our transport heritage??

[PatB]

Nobody's yet mentioned the West Somerset's DMUs in the 1970s, which wore a rather fetching crimson and cream variant.

[tamperman36]

As already mentioned the liveries on the 50s is to help make the individual locos stand put from the crowd. They are liveries which can be argued could have been carried on the locos had they stayed in service.

If you want some truly fictitious liveries then look at the liveries carried by the 2 KWVR locos used for the film The railway children.

[amwells]

Also not mentioned is that 50044 Exeter used to carry BR two tone green in preservation, a sort of prequel livery!

 

https://www.englishelectric.org.uk/50044

 

I liked it so much I repainted a Lima 50. Must get the paints out and do the Hornby version one day

[LU_fan]

Honestly, I didn't mention 044 as I had kind of forgotten about that.

 

While it could be argued they might have received the InterCity look while still in regular service, I do find the LoadHaul a bit unlikely. Although, then again, 049/149 did receive Railfreight Distribution livery, and other 50's had pulled freight before, so maybe it's not such a stretch after all.

[TravisM]

The Class 50 in Inter City swallow livery isn’t as far fetched as it might seem as there was a plan in the 80’s to stop the ECML electrification at Newcastle and re refurbish the best of the Class 50’s for services north. They would have been repainted in IC Swallow livery to match the then new Mk IV stock.

[LU_fan]

Huh. 50's and Mk.IV? Now that... That I'd like to see. Luckily I have Train Sim to help.

[russ p]

Loadhaul on a 50 is not as fictitious as most people think.

When 31327 was named Phillips imperial in the 80s the name was to be transferred to a 50/1 when they became available.

Obviously the program was scrapped and no 50s saw service with the petroleum sector.

If it had have happened there is every chance they would have carried loadhaul livery later

[LU_fan]

Really? Huh. I must admit, that came as a surprise.

[russ p]

Really? Huh. I must admit, that came as a surprise.

That's what we were told back in the day

[009 micro modeller]

The Class 50 in Inter City swallow livery isn’t as far fetched as it might seem as there was a plan in the 80’s to stop the ECML electrification at Newcastle and re refurbish the best of the Class 50’s for services north. They would have been repainted in IC Swallow livery to match the then new Mk IV stock.

Sounds interesting. How would they have fitted in on a 125mph railway? (Or was the plan to swap the loco at Newcastle?) Another example that I've just thought of is a Simplex at Amberley which was initially repainted in a non-authentic Redland Brick livery (it might have come from a site they took over but it hadn't carried that livery in service). Redland had sponsored the loco's restoration. I seem to remember a standard gauge example where sponsorship was also the reason but can't think what it was.

[LU_fan]

The Class 50 in Inter City swallow livery isn’t as far fetched as it might seem as there was a plan in the 80’s to stop the ECML electrification at Newcastle and re refurbish the best of the Class 50’s for services north. They would have been repainted in IC Swallow livery to match the then new Mk IV stock.

 

Thanks to the magic of Train Simulator, this is what it might have looked like. I know the locomotive is wearing a mix of Exec and Swallow, but it's the best version I've found.

[GordonC]

There was also 50017 temporarily renumbered to 50117 and carrying the railfreight general livery like 50149 did. Is that inauthentic too?

 

Class 50s seem to have attracted unusual livery repaints. It's probably to help stand out from the crowd as there are quite a few preserved. I like the intercity mainline livery on 50031

[E3109]

I know this is massively off topic, but what about the Intercity-liveried Reliant Robin?!

I think it was owned by a signalman on the ECML and there was at least one other in a different BR garb.

 

Tried to find pics, to no avail.

[LU_fan]

Not a picture, but found a YouTube video:

 

[amwells]

There was also 50017 temporarily renumbered to 50117 and carrying the railfreight general livery like 50149 did. Is that inauthentic too?

 

Class 50s seem to have attracted unusual livery repaints. It's probably to help stand out from the crowd as there are quite a few preserved. I like the intercity mainline livery on 50031

Yes 50117 was preservation only. Now you mention it... 50017 in LMS crimson lake was another