RMweb Gold Corbs Posted February 2, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 2, 2018 (edited) I bet only one of these would've made it into preservation. Steam Highlanders? Nice model, that! Is it worth an attempt in 00? Hmm looking at it again now I kind of hate it, the perspective is off and the proportions are all wrong! The S100 and 15xx based ones are failed attempts, although I do like the final version I did. Edited February 2, 2018 by Corbs Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNWR18901910 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 What's the advantage over a G2A? Won't it have less adhesive weight as the cylinder weight is carried on non-driving wheels? Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't moguls developed to be faster versions of 0-6-0 locos, as the pony truck is able to lead the drivers into corners, and you can add more weight at the front in the form of bigger cylinders like the LMS Crab? Well, I'll soon find out during the conversion project. Mind you, the extra weight at the front would benefit, of course. This would be an experimental mixed-traffic locomotive. I have decided on a running number which is 16591. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted February 3, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 3, 2018 Why would it benefit? Having a driving wheel with weight on it means that the loco has more adhesion and less likelihood of slipping. If you have a carrying wheel with lots of weight on it then it's a dead weight and doesn't contribute to adhesion. As I understand it, this is one of the principle factors in 4-6-0s being better at starting trains than 4-6-2s, as the weight of the firebox is being used to help grip. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir douglas Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 std-7MT-tank-3c.jpg I really like it, whats the donor chassis for the drivers? its quite like my 8mt which i later numbered 50000 from 3 years ago http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/14790-imaginary-locomotives/?p=1827579 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Regularity Posted February 3, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 3, 2018 Why would it benefit? Having a driving wheel with weight on it means that the loco has more adhesion and less likelihood of slipping. If you have a carrying wheel with lots of weight on it then it's a dead weight and doesn't contribute to adhesion. As I understand it, this is one of the principle factors in 4-6-0s being better at starting trains than 4-6-2s, as the weight of the firebox is being used to help grip. It is the reaction to the turning force being applied to the drivers: if, on starting, an engine is “opened up” too much or too quickly, then it “sits back” on the rear wheels. If there are no trailing wheels, then the load on the combined driving wheels is pretty much constant, although unevenly spread which might increase stresses on the Franklin’s. With a Pacific, a gentler touch is required, as the load will be transferred to the pony. Even a momentary loss of adhesion causes the drivers to slip, and once they have slipped, it is not easy to regain control.Properly designed, a 4-6-2 doesn’t lose out on a 4-6-0, but only when it is properly driven! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted February 3, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 3, 2018 I really like it, whats the donor chassis for the drivers? its quite like my 8mt which i later numbered 50000 from 3 years ago http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/14790-imaginary-locomotives/?p=1827579 Same as yours! It's 8F chassis and cylinders, with the valve gear from the 4MT, and the cylinders mounted in the same position. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
73c Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 I really like it, whats the donor chassis for the drivers? its quite like my 8mt which i later numbered 50000 from 3 years ago http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/14790-imaginary-locomotives/?p=1827579 That looks a beast! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 (edited) I've just found this thread, full of all sorts of wonderful stuff. I'm a 'died-in-the-wool' WhatIf model aircraft builder, and I'm extending those thought processes into the railway field now. I have a copy of Robin Barnes' 'Locomotives that never were' which is a veritable cornucopia of ideas, two of which, maybe three, caught my attention. The first one I'm working on is the Bullied Baltic tank, and Robin's drawing looks like this:- Conveniently Mr. Bullied used Q1 Class drivers for his design and as Hornby do quite a nice Q1 chassis I've used one as the basis for my model. Needless to say the body will be made from two Kitmaster/Airfix/Dapol West Countries suitably cut and shut. I looked at doing it in a BR scheme but it looks far to 'blocky' and the Southern scheme with the yellow stripes, as depicted by Robin Barnes looks much sleeker, so that's the way I'm heading with it. My sketch shows it with a scan of the Q1 chassis and the Dapol bogies, but I'll be using Jackson bogie wheels for it. So far the body shell is part built, and with a large number of Albert Goodall's wonderful detail parts added. The second project is if anything even more bizarre.......... Robin shows the well known Riddle 8F proposal in his book, and it's been modelled quite a number of times, and a very handsome loco it looks too, but I aim to change all that. Being quite a fan of the Crosti 9Fs (or 8Fs...) I was equally taken with Robin Barnes' version of a Crosti Black 5, but with Caprotti valve gear, and it occurred to me to mix-and-match the two projects, thus producing a Caprosti........... Robin's pics are here :- I have a Hornby 'Evening Star' which has been stripped to within an inch of its life, and I also have an ancient Crownline Crosti conversion, and these will be mixed and matched with a Britannia trailing truck to produce my hybrid. I produced a few sketches to show the intended result at my local club, and one had the original 9F smoke deflectors in place, notwithstanding that they'd be a trifle superfluous on a Crosti. One of my club members suggested jokingly that I should extend the right hand deflector all the way back to the Crosti chimney, so I drew that in and was quite taken with it, so hopefully it'll end up looking like this. The backstory has it that the long deflector has turning vanes on the inside in order to get that pesky exhaust smoke clear of the cab, a problem that hindered the Crostis in the real world. Right now I'm working on the Baltic tank as it's a lot less work and should be simpler. We'll see how well that plan works! Edited February 7, 2018 by Mr_Tilt 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted February 7, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 7, 2018 Marvellous! I think RedgateModels of this parish was the best interpretation of the 8MT so far, as he used the correct sized driving wheels, which made a big difference. Your spin of doing a Caprosti version sounds excellent. Did you see 92220's Caprosti Std. 5? http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/99006-br-caprotti-crosti-standard-5/ 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Ooooh yes, both of those look really good, most impressive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Regularity Posted February 7, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 7, 2018 Marvellous! I think RedgateModels of this parish was the best interpretation of the 8MT so far, as he used the correct sized driving wheels, which made a big difference. blogentry-6717-0-04524100-1309690254_thumb.jpg A thing of grace and beauty, that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runs as required Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 (edited) I've just found this thread, full of all sorts of wonderful stuff. I'm a 'died-in-the-wool' WhatIf model aircraft builder, and I'm extending those thought processes into the railway field now. I have a copy of Robin Barnes' 'Locomotives that never were' which is a veritable cornucopia of ideas, two of which, maybe three, caught my attention. The first one I'm working on is the Bulleid Baltic tank, and Robin's drawing looks like this:- I'm a huge admirer of Robin Barnes... ...but I've only just noticed that Bulleid number for his 4-6-4T illustration should shurely be 2C2 1 dh Edi: Uh Oh! I'm wrong - the Pacifics were 21C - so how did he differentiate between MNs and BBs/WCs ? Edited February 7, 2018 by runs as required Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNWR18901910 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Marvellous! I think RedgateModels of this parish was the best interpretation of the 8MT so far, as he used the correct sized driving wheels, which made a big difference. blogentry-6717-0-04524100-1309690254_thumb.jpg Your spin of doing a Caprosti version sounds excellent. Did you see 92220's Caprosti Std. 5? http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/99006-br-caprotti-crosti-standard-5/ Nice models! Do they run well on the layout? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Edi: Uh Oh! I'm wrong - the Pacifics were 21C - so how did he differentiate between MNs and BBs/WCs ? MNs we 21C1 onwards, and the WC/BBs started at 21C101. So as long as no more than 100 MNs were built, no problem. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Being quite a fan of the Crosti 9Fs (or 8Fs...) I was equally taken with Robin Barnes' version of a Crosti Black 5, but with Caprotti valve gear, and it occurred to me to mix-and-match the two projects, thus producing a Caprosti........... The backstory has it that the long deflector has turning vanes on the inside in order to get that pesky exhaust smoke clear of the cab, a problem that hindered the Crostis in the real world. We can fix the 'pesky exhaust smoke' with Porta's Gas Producer Combustion firebox for a 'Craprorta'. Still need the deflector to avoid too much of the cylinder oil and ash mixture ending up on the cab windows. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
92220 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 I've just found this thread, full of all sorts of wonderful stuff. I'm a 'died-in-the-wool' WhatIf model aircraft builder, and I'm extending those thought processes into the railway field now. I have a copy of Robin Barnes' 'Locomotives that never were' which is a veritable cornucopia of ideas, two of which, maybe three, caught my attention. The first one I'm working on is the Bullied Baltic tank, and Robin's drawing looks like this:- Conveniently Mr. Bullied used Q1 Class drivers for his design and as Hornby do quite a nice Q1 chassis I've used one as the basis for my model. Needless to say the body will be made from two Kitmaster/Airfix/Dapol West Countries suitably cut and shut. I looked at doing it in a BR scheme but it looks far to 'blocky' and the Southern scheme with the yellow stripes, as depicted by Robin Barnes looks much sleeker, so that's the way I'm heading with it. My sketch shows it with a scan of the Q1 chassis and the Dapol bogies, but I'll be using Jackson bogie wheels for it. So far the body shell is part built, and with a large number of Albert Goodall's wonderful detail parts added. The second project is if anything even more bizarre.......... Robin shows the well known Riddle 8F proposal in his book, and it's been modelled quite a number of times, and a very handsome loco it looks too, but I aim to change all that. Being quite a fan of the Crosti 9Fs (or 8Fs...) I was equally taken with Robin Barnes' version of a Crosti Black 5, but with Caprotti valve gear, and it occurred to me to mix-and-match the two projects, thus producing a Caprosti........... Robin's pics are here :- I have a Hornby 'Evening Star' which has been stripped to within an inch of its life, and I also have an ancient Crownline Crosti conversion, and these will be mixed and matched with a Britannia trailing truck to produce my hybrid. I produced a few sketches to show the intended result at my local club, and one had the original 9F smoke deflectors in place, notwithstanding that they'd be a trifle superfluous on a Crosti. One of my club members suggested jokingly that I should extend the right hand deflector all the way back to the Crosti chimney, so I drew that in and was quite taken with it, so hopefully it'll end up looking like this. The backstory has it that the long deflector has turning vanes on the inside in order to get that pesky exhaust smoke clear of the cab, a problem that hindered the Crostis in the real world. Right now I'm working on the Baltic tank as it's a lot less work and should be simpler. We'll see how well that plan works! Marvellous! I think RedgateModels of this parish was the best interpretation of the 8MT so far, as he used the correct sized driving wheels, which made a big difference. blogentry-6717-0-04524100-1309690254_thumb.jpg Your spin of doing a Caprosti version sounds excellent. Did you see 92220's Caprosti Std. 5? http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/99006-br-caprotti-crosti-standard-5/ Quite pleased that mine looks quite like Robin Barnes’ interpretation of the BR drawing. Or it will when it’s filthy. Nice models! Do they run well on the layout?Mine does, after a slight filing of the front frames to clear the bogie wheels. However, it is packed up at present, awaiting the big move.I think Redgate’s was wonderful. I’m sure he had a video of it somewhere. Iain 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNWR18901910 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 (edited) And while we're on the subject of BR Standards, how about a 5MT 2-6-0 like the Stanier 5MT 2-6-0? Edited February 9, 2018 by LNWR18901910 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNWR18901910 Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 And speaking of Great Western, suppose somebody took the Hawksworth GWR 47xx and made it into a Hawskworth Mogul? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted February 10, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 10, 2018 Sir, I believe you have a mogul addiction. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimC Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 (edited) And speaking of Great Western, suppose somebody took the Hawksworth GWR 47xx and made it into a Hawskworth Mogul? Hawksworth 15xx do you mean? It would probably be better to have a longer boiler and give the pony truck something useful to do. A standard 2 boiler instead of the Standard 10, or even a Standard 4. Edited February 10, 2018 by JimC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted February 10, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 10, 2018 Here's a proper mogul in a proper livery. Not imaginary, though the Locomotive Manufacturers Association would rather it had been. They should have got their labour relations sorted. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimC Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 (edited) And here's the 1500 Chassis Mogul with a Std 4 boiler... [5 mins later] falling off the rails, I now notice. Never mind... Edited February 10, 2018 by JimC 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNWR18901910 Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 And here's the 1500 Chassis Mogul with a Std 4 boiler... hawksworth mogul-std2-col.jpg [5 mins later] falling off the rails, I now notice. Never mind... That looks amazing! It's also a perfect candidate for a 00-gauge model, too! Job well done, Sir! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 And while we're on the subject of BR Standards, how about a 5MT 2-6-0 like the Stanier 5MT 2-6-0? Then again, general opinion of the BR std 4MT 2-6-0 was that it was worth a '5' rating. The ultimate beast in UK 2-6-0s was the GNR H4 (LNE/BR K3), more grunt than all your Halls, Black 5s, Bongos, et al, a 1920 design with a 6MT rating. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimC Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 That looks amazing! It's also a perfect candidate for a 00-gauge model, too! Job well done, Sir! If only there were a nice r-t-r 1500 to act as a chassis donor. Boiler and cab are 9300, albeit with the Holcroft curve removed, and the tender is a standard Hawksworth reduced in height. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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