Tyteford Halte

[MrWolf]

Ahem.

Having studied a) the rubbish drawing and b) some pictures of the real thing, I have come to the unfortunate conclusion that in our keenness to utilise the original Airfix V hanger, we may very well have dropped a bolloc  built in an error by assumption....

 

The Airfix details below the solebars are symmetrical, the real thing and also the Dart Casting kit is not.

 

The two large battery boxes are on one side. The large box nearest the locomotive end is roughly opposite the brake cylinder, near the queen post where Airfix put it.

 

The small battery box is in roughly the original Airfix location on the opposite solebar nearest the driving end.

 

Everything is correct so far.

 

But when you look at the other large battery box at the driving end, the forward end is roughly at the point where the truss rod is attached to the solebar and the inner end is just about exactly where the brake cross shaft comes out of the moulded V hanger.

 

Gosh, that's a bit of a rum do. (Other, similar phrases are available.)

 

The drawing: Note position of box and v hanger.

 

It needs to move left towards the queen post by 15mm (ish).

 

 

The current situation on the model:

 

I've laid the cutoff bit of v hanger where it should be.

 

 

.... and we thought that we were doing SO well.....

The solution:

 

1. I'm going to peel off the brake parts carefully from the floor.

2. Cut away the plastic V hanger.

3. Put a joddle into the cut off brass V hanger to attach to the solebar but put the hanger outside the truss as per the instructions.

4. Re-attach the brake gear in the right spot, ironically almost where Airfix put it but in the correct orientation to the V hanger.

5. Fit the battery boxes in the correct position.

6. Meet the memsahib from work and go to the pub....

 

 

 

 

 

[MrWolf]

Peeled this lot off.

 

 

Fixed it.

 

 

Hopefully that makes sense? Driving end to right of picture.

[MAP66]

Apologies for not replying sooner, I’ve only just finished banging my head against the wall. Good thing is, as soon as you stop you feel so much better 😖

B*gger, I thought using the moulded ‘V’ hangers was going to work, unfortunately I hadn’t contemplated the battery box located drivers end which would be in the way of the bogie. Well I was 50% there as the Loco end is OK.

 

That’s what makes us better modellers, as you have already solved it and removed the offending articles and put them back in their correct locations. All without stamping on it and chucking it in the bin. Your explanation as to what was wrong and how you went about putting it right was crystal clear to me (particularly number 6), I only wish I could say the same about the diagrams in the Dart Castings kit.

 

That’s a fine chisel blade you have there, I have one similar and will need to fetch it and adopt likewise surgery to put mine right. I do remember putting copious amounts of superglue gel when attaching my ‘V’ hangers so I may not be as successful in getting them unstuck – but that’s for tomorrow or when I feel brave enough to take on the task.

[MrWolf]

It matters not, but we both fell foul of assumption:

 

https://youtu.be/bPsg42EKJic

 

The chisel blade is the last of five I bought on eBay, it looks surgically sharp, but is actually made from the foil pouches that posh cat food comes in. 

 

 

[MAP66]

For anyone following this build, I have now corrected my post of 19th March pg17 re. the moulded plastic 'V' hangers to avoid anyone else making the same mistake,

Thank you again @MrWolffor getting us all back on track 🙂

[Neal Ball]

25 minutes ago, MAP66 said:

For anyone following this build, I have now corrected my post of 19th March pg17 re. the moulded plastic 'V' hangers to avoid anyone else making the same mistake,

Thank you again @MrWolffor getting us all back on track 🙂

 

In the next few days, I am going back over the build and make up some notes. Both yours and Robs aka @MrWolf blow-by-blow accounts have been invaluable.

 

Thanks again.

[MAP66]

On 27/03/2023 at 00:14, MrWolf said:

I might add a few passengers and I'm wondering what to do about changing those Didcot destination boards?

This might be a solution for the destination boards http://www.precisionlabels.com/sl12.html 

They can print your choice of destination (only 12 characters though) so ATSON ON CLUN would need to be abbreviated somehow. For me it would be TYTEFORD HT.

There is also some additional info on number of boards and where located on the auto coach.

 

[MrWolf]

8 minutes ago, MAP66 said:

This might be a solution for the destination boards http://www.precisionlabels.com/sl12.html 

They can print your choice of destination (only 12 characters though) so ATSON ON CLUN would need to be abbreviated somehow. For me it would be TYTEFORD HT.

There is also some additional info on number of boards and where located on the auto coach.

 

 

Thanks, I was thinking of destination boards for either CLUN, (The terminus) or CRAVEN ARMS, (The junction with the GW/LNW Joint line.

[MrWolf]

2 hours ago, MAP66 said:

For anyone following this build, I have now corrected my post of 19th March pg17 re. the moulded plastic 'V' hangers to avoid anyone else making the same mistake,

Thank you again @MrWolffor getting us all back on track 🙂

 

Thanks are more due to yourself for starting this build publicly. I'd forgotten that I even had the kit.

Plus it's much better to make a mistake and show where we went wrong,

1.as a reminder to ourselves to assume nothing,

2. as a reminder to ourselves that we are capable of fixing our mistakes, 

3. as a warning of pitfalls to those who follow our ramblings.

4. Too many slick "how to" articles don't show mistakes and a lot of us tend to think that we couldn't perform as well.

 

Newsflash. Neither do they.

 

I have also noticed that whilst it's understandable to not model full brake and power controls due to the tolerances necessary even in finescale 4mm, I've seen a lot of models in articles and videos where stuff is severely compromised or left off altogether as too fiddly, but because it's published, we assume that it's gospel.

 

I have pared away a little plastic from the driving end bogie from crossmember, just to clear the brass plates, fixed a piece of wood atop the chassis as a weight and run the coach at speed in both directions through the loop on my layout.

 

It survived.

 

[MAP66]

2 hours ago, MrWolf said:

I have pared away a little plastic from the driving end bogie from crossmember, just to clear the brass plates, fixed a piece of wood atop the chassis as a weight and run the coach at speed in both directions through the loop on my layout.

 

It survived.

You must have experienced a sense of pride and achievement after that successful test run, nice job 👍

I have also experienced success today, after managing to unstick all the offending parts and re-attach them in their correct places without suffering any casualties.

 

I'm thinking its grey primer time next, as you previously suggested, for all the underframe detailing and the bogies. I will need to mask of the carriage wheels first as I don't fancy trying to prize them out of the bogies again, chances are I will break something and I've been lucky so far. Then its rodding time!!!

[Neal Ball]

2 hours ago, MrWolf said:

 

Thanks are more due to yourself for starting this build publicly. I'd forgotten that I even had the kit.

Plus it's much better to make a mistake and show where we went wrong,

1.as a reminder to ourselves to assume nothing,

2. as a reminder to ourselves that we are capable of fixing our mistakes, 

3. as a warning of pitfalls to those who follow our ramblings.

4. Too many slick "how to" articles don't show mistakes and a lot of us tend to think that we couldn't perform as well.

 

Newsflash. Neither do they.

 

I have also noticed that whilst it's understandable to not model full brake and power controls due to the tolerances necessary even in finescale 4mm, I've seen a lot of models in articles and videos where stuff is severely compromised or left off altogether as too fiddly, but because it's published, we assume that it's gospel.

 

I have pared away a little plastic from the driving end bogie from crossmember, just to clear the brass plates, fixed a piece of wood atop the chassis as a weight and run the coach at speed in both directions through the loop on my layout.

 

It survived.

 

 

4 minutes ago, MAP66 said:

You must have experienced a sense of pride and achievement after that successful test run, nice job 👍

I have also experienced success today, after managing to unstick all the offending parts and re-attach them in their correct places without suffering any casualties.

 

I'm thinking its grey primer time next, as you previously suggested, for all the underframe detailing and the bogies. I will need to mask of the carriage wheels first as I don't fancy trying to prize them out of the bogies again, chances are I will break something and I've been lucky so far. Then its rodding time!!!

Well done to you both for your perseverance. 
 

So much better to show actual progress, even if at times that can be frustrating.

[MrWolf]

2 hours ago, MAP66 said:

You must have experienced a sense of pride and achievement after that successful test run, nice job 👍

I have also experienced success today, after managing to unstick all the offending parts and re-attach them in their correct places without suffering any casualties.

 

I'm thinking its grey primer time next, as you previously suggested, for all the underframe detailing and the bogies. I will need to mask of the carriage wheels first as I don't fancy trying to prize them out of the bogies again, chances are I will break something and I've been lucky so far. Then its rodding time!!!

 

I did actually. I pushed it through the points initially to see if I could feel anything binding and having found how free running the metal wheels are (Current Hornby 14.1mm coach wheels, designed to run in plastic bogies.) I gave it a shove to try and derail it.

 

Had Miss Riding Hood at the other end of the layout stopping it and sending it back.

(Although she said that the devil on her shoulder suggested stepping back and watching it smash into the wall....)

 

It's probably done a scale 100mph, far more than will ever be asked of it.

 

As they're 00, I'll remove the wheels and bogies before fitting the belt tensioner and wiring harness to the dynamo and give the whole thing a squirt of primer.

[MAP66]

2 hours ago, MrWolf said:

As they're 00, I'll remove the wheels and bogies before fitting the belt tensioner and wiring harness to the dynamo and give the whole thing a squirt of primer.

When you have the dynamo and what goes with it fitted, would you mind posting a picture of it. I can't work out what I have in terms of the cast bits as they're a bit blobby. The actual dynamo looks OK but not sure which bits are meant to go with it, or maybe I have something missing? 

Thanks

Mark

[Neal Ball]

3 hours ago, MrWolf said:

 

......a shove to try and derail it.

 

Had Miss Riding Hood at the other end of the layout stopping it and sending it back.

(Although she said that the devil on her shoulder suggested stepping back and watching it smash into the wall....)

 

 

We are currently watching "Allo Allo" with Helga and Herr Flick........ while I was reading your comments 😄

[Neal Ball]

3 hours ago, MrWolf said:

 

.... the belt tensioner and wiring harness to the dynamo and give the whole thing a squirt of primer.

 

1 hour ago, MAP66 said:

When you have the dynamo and what goes with it fitted, would you mind posting a picture of it. I can't work out what I have in terms of the cast bits as they're a bit blobby. The actual dynamo looks OK but not sure which bits are meant to go with it, or maybe I have something missing? 

Thanks

Mark

 

Leaving Allo Allo aside for a moment, could you post a photo of the dynamo etc. please. I am trying to picture it, along the lines of what you get with a Comet kit.

 

There is a very nice photo of the front of an Autotrailer at Maidenhead in GWRJ Vol 36 Autumn 2000 Pg206. if you don't have the magazine, let me know and I will PM you both.

[MrWolf]

10 minutes ago, Neal Ball said:

 

We are currently watching "Allo Allo" with Helga and Herr Flick........ while I was reading your comments 😄

 

Whatever can you mean! 😳😇

[MAP66]

6 minutes ago, Neal Ball said:

 

 

Leaving Allo Allo aside for a moment, could you post a photo of the dynamo etc. please. I am trying to picture it, along the lines of what you get with a Comet kit.

 

There is a very nice photo of the front of an Autotrailer at Maidenhead in GWRJ Vol 36 Autumn 2000 Pg206. if you don't have the magazine, let me know and I will PM you both.

Thanks Neal, I would certainly benefit from seeing that photo. 

[Neal Ball]

1 minute ago, MAP66 said:

Thanks Neal, I would certainly benefit from seeing that photo. 

 

Rob - @MrWolf can you oblige with a photo.

 

It sounds very different to a Comet dynamo.

[MrWolf]

This is a cruel close up of the whitemetal dynamo. There's a representation of the strap, belt pulley and hanger brackets. Paint, muck and under the coach it's going to look plenty good enough I think.

 

 

These two parts below are: Left, drive belt tensioner. Right, wiring harness to dynamo brushes.

 

 

There's a sort of lug on the wiring harness section that must engage with something? 

Both have a bit of floor bracing moulded on

 

Looking at the drawing, the are presumably aligned on the same bit of floor bracing. An additional plan drawing or 3rd angle projection would be a big help because there's no indication of where they actually go.

 

 

Usually the belt tensioner on a dynamo is near the drive pulley to prevent twisting, but I think that I need to trawl the internet for some carriage dynamo images just in case.

 

 

Edited March 29, 2023 by MrWolf
Stupid autocorrect

[MAP66]

Thanks Rob for putting that up, I just couldn't work out what was going on from looking at fig.15.

I had lots of flash on my bits (Oh Matron) and couldn't see the wheat from the chaff so to speak.

[MrWolf]

The picture I took of the dynamo shewed a little notch in the crossmember, a little cleaning up and we have this:

 

 

So that the other two pieces (left off in the article I PM'd you initially)  do now fit as per the drawing.

 

 

The driving end bogie is to the right in This picture and the wiring harness just about curls underneath it.

 

Below is the dynamo arrangement from the other side.

 

 

This graveyard shift post has been brought to you by our sponsor, CPTSD. Of course the one who woke up first is now asleep again, she's curled up like a cat, whilst I am messing with trains and posting on here....

 

Rob W.

 

 

 

Edited March 29, 2023 by MrWolf
General illiteracy

[Neal Ball]

Interesting thanks for posting Rob.

 

With the Comet kits you only get the dynamo itself, none of the other gubbins! To be honest, the only thing I recall seeing on the real thing is the belt coming off the nearest axle.

 

I have found this on-line and although its a BR Mk1, the principal should be the same... but it doesn't show your extra bits:

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=627963742669780&set=pcb.627964442669710

 

I can't see that I have photographed any under frames at the GWS etc. If I find anything, I will give you both a shout.

[Neal Ball]

Authentic Great Western dynamo :-)

 

https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=509047501349230&set=a.413314100922571

 

Sorry its also not very helpful.

[MrWolf]

At least I was right about where the wiring comes in on the GWR dynamo, so it's a little more helpful!

 

You'll notice that the BR dynamo has a square box on the side with the wiring going into it. This is a mechanical current regulator of a similar type to those used in road vehicles of the time, which keeps the current at the required voltage to maintain optimal battery conditions without frying them.

 

Pre WWII, there were various systems and unsurprisingly, the GWR went it's own way. (Hence no external box in the model. This is a similar system to many motorcycles of the period, with internal regulation.

You have to fast forward to the late sixties and alternators with solid state regulators before this idea is obsolete.

 

https://www.gotopcs.net/deanrotax.html

[MAP66]

Rob, you should be asleep now after posting all that very, very useful info and great images during the nightshift. I was completely stumped on the dynamo but all is now clear, although I do have several hours of filing ahead of me.