Aston On Clun. A forgotten Great Western outpost.

[MrWolf]

On 22/09/2023 at 12:14, Tim Dubya said:

 

It's a fantastic book, whether you model the LSWR or not. Enjoy!

 

I'm quite partial to the LSWR, Drummond locos and the livery of both locos and stock.

In fact, I interested in all of the UK railways.

I know that it's fashionable amongst some followers of other railways to be snarky about the GWR,  in the way that some people bang on about global corporations or "big pharma" (rather than the usual good natured rivalry) but I don't recall hearing it from GWR fans about other railways.

Perhaps it's some kind of "Unconscious Brunswick Green Privilege"? 

Maybe there's some kind of web seminars available to help us "un-learn" it? 🤣 

 

Cue someone uploading videos of the S&D...😉

[MrWolf]

6 hours ago, ChrisN said:

How cheap is cheap?

 

 

The flor is plasticard, the W irons are MJT ones for three axle wagons, the wire is not from that as I thought it was too stiff, so is thin guitar wire, the washers, nuts and bolts came from a pack sold by a DIY store.  Note you need two pieces of plasticard in the middle to Keep the middle axle in place.

 

 

In place, the springs and axle boxes are also MJT.

 

 

Vacuum cylinder and gas tank from a Ratio four wheelers.  The gas tank is shortened to stop fouling the wheels. Home made plasticard brakes.

 

 

From the top, the bolts are screwed into place.  I originally thought you would need some rotation on the end axles but it has proved unnecessary, even on the curves on my layout.

 

Hope this helps, at least, food for thought.

 

Thanks for sharing that Chris, that's exactly the kind thing I'm looking for. The pictures explain everything perfectly.

 

Cheap as in we don't need an entire etched chassis, just the basics. The moving axle is exactly what I was thinking of doing, with a brass tube slipped over the axle.

I've got a bit of aircraft grade .8mm stainless MIG wire that should do the same job as a steel guitar string.

 

I assume that someone produces white metal axleboxes and springs to suit a Dean era six wheeler? 

 

[lezz01]

I think that some of us become so immersed in the lore of our chosen railways that the age old enmity of them sort of rubs off on us. As a Midland guy the other main railways in contention were the GWR and the LNWR. I have nothing against any railway company. The reason I don't model the GWR is mainly because when I was a youngster everything was about the GWR. It was in the press everywhere and exhibitions were full of GW BLTs to the point that anything other than the GW was a welcome breath of fresh air. I was attracted to the MR because of the locos built by Kirtley and Johnson. You have to go a long long way to find a more elegant loco than a slim boilered Johnson 4-4-0 or a more purposeful looking loco than a Kirtley DF goods. That's what attracted me to the MR in the first place. Then there was the routes across some of the most dramatic scenery England and also some truly great architecture. What's not to like!? I am however very fond of the old broad gauge be it GWR or B&E or B&G and if I was 20 years younger and had more time I would love to model the broad gauge. There is a section just outside Gloucester that had both the Midland and GWR running side by side with a junction off the MR running into Gloucester docks and whilst I don't have either the funds or the space never say never.

Regards Lez.    

[ChrisN]

23 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

 

Thanks for sharing that Chris, that's exactly the kind thing I'm looking for. The pictures explain everything perfectly.

 

Cheap as in we don't need an entire etched chassis, just the basics. The moving axle is exactly what I was thinking of doing, with a brass tube slipped over the axle.

I've got a bit of aircraft grade .8mm stainless MIG wire that should do the same job as a steel guitar string.

 

I assume that someone produces white metal axleboxes and springs to suit a Dean era six wheeler? 

 

 

The chassis is from a G20, which I will run as in 1895.  I assume the springs and axleboxes are fine for that.  I got them from Dart Castings.

[MrWolf]

12 hours ago, lezz01 said:

I think that some of us become so immersed in the lore of our chosen railways that the age old enmity of them sort of rubs off on us. As a Midland guy the other main railways in contention were the GWR and the LNWR. I have nothing against any railway company. The reason I don't model the GWR is mainly because when I was a youngster everything was about the GWR. It was in the press everywhere and exhibitions were full of GW BLTs to the point that anything other than the GW was a welcome breath of fresh air. I was attracted to the MR because of the locos built by Kirtley and Johnson. You have to go a long long way to find a more elegant loco than a slim boilered Johnson 4-4-0 or a more purposeful looking loco than a Kirtley DF goods. That's what attracted me to the MR in the first place. Then there was the routes across some of the most dramatic scenery England and also some truly great architecture. What's not to like!? I am however very fond of the old broad gauge be it GWR or B&E or B&G and if I was 20 years younger and had more time I would love to model the broad gauge. There is a section just outside Gloucester that had both the Midland and GWR running side by side with a junction off the MR running into Gloucester docks and whilst I don't have either the funds or the space never say never.

Regards Lez.    

 

I get that, the GWR BLT was hailed as a space saver with plenty of operating potential for readily available locos and stock fifty years ago and they appeared everywhere.

The  2023 equivalent is probably the post 1980 Traction Maintenance Depot, at least one at every exhibition.

I saw the tail end of that GWR BLT fashion as a ten year old that had already tired of the oval and two sidings on a 6'x4' board and to me, here was something more realistic and importantly, achievable with what I already had.

Where I grew up, I was within a stone's throw of the GCR, GNR, MR & LNWR, as well as a good number of quarry railways in assorted gauges. 

The problem was that if I wanted to model those, I'd need space, money and some serious modelling skills. That's a whole lot of things that you are sadly lacking when you have just started middle school.

I'd still like to model the old LNWR terminus at Loughborough though!

 

 

 

Edited September 24, 2023 by MrWolf
Stupid autocorrect

[MrWolf]

I've had various bits of clerestory piled up for a while, (It was beginning to look like the centre pages of Red For Danger tbh..) 

 

This is just tacked together, using the maximum length of the panels between the luggage and passenger compartments because at the time I didn't have the GWR coach books.

I did this to see how it looked in the knowledge that it's a lot easier to saw bits off than it is to put them back on. 

Once I cut it down, I will have a 31'0-1/4" Diagram U29 as per the coach under restoration at Didcot:

 

https://didcotrailwaycentre.org.uk/article.php/155/no-6824-dean-6-wheel-tricomposite

 

Which I'm pretty sure is what inspired the old Keyser kit:

 

https://srmg.org.uk/an-unusual-gwr-6-wheel-clerestory-tri-compo

 

I've bid on a couple of those kits on eBay, but I'm out at £50, you get a white metal shell, no floor, glazing etc and a set of old bacon slicer wheels.

 

I could also put a low roof on it and call it a U16, or shorten it a little more, lose the centre set of wheels and call it U12...

 

 

[Neal Ball]

21 hours ago, MrWolf said:

Hello Neal, generally you can make two carriages from two carriages .

 

The C10 is made up of two brake third passenger compartments. This leaves you with the necessary spares to make a 4 wheeled V5 PBV, which uses parts from a Ratio 4 wheeled coach for roof and underframe.

 

The C4 is made up the same way and gives you yet another V5 PBV, but I suspect that other diagrams can be found.

 

The "Something vaguely Cambrian" is one of the Tri-ang Composites with the roof modified as a three arc type. It will run on Ratio LNWR bogies.

 

The C19 is a pair of Composites and you do end up with three compartments left over from each. If I can figure out a way to make a six wheel chassis cheaply (Don't forget these are budget "close enough" models) there's quite a lot you can do with the leftovers. Even if you just make a grounded body as a shed, they're not scrap.

 

The D15 is one brake third cut and shut with the guard's lookout and door reversed on one side to place the lookout directly behind the passenger compartment.

 

The D7 uses parts from two brake thirds, but the spare passenger compartment is used on the MSWJR brake along with bits leftover from the the brake compartment.

 

So effectively you break up eight coaches and end up with eleven and a few bits left over.

 

I've not carved off the door handles, as if painted carefully and lightly weathered, they stand the three foot test. But I have removed the rails from the ends as they are easily seen from the sides, also the steps but have left the backplate with the rivets in place. These will be replaced by something a little bit more convincing 

 

 

 

 

 

Thats an interesting run down Rob thank you.

 

Now if only I hadn’t thrown out my old Triang carriages ages ago….. 

[MrWolf]

One word.

 

BU66ER.

 

 

That would be a blown wheel cylinder then.

 

But to add insult to injury, the brake fluid has dissolved the almost new asbestos free, ethically sourced, dolphin friendly vegan brake shoes....

 

I had two new wheel cylinders in the parts stash, front calipers, new pads, but no rear shoes. I forgot to top up the stash when I fitted these at the beginning of summer.

 

Upshot was no trip to Stafford (1,000,000,000 boos...) but a trip on the Beeza B33 over to get a set of shoes from a mate in Sedbergh, getting p... wet through* on the way home of course.

 

Not to worry, another friend's 2004 Land Rover Freelander has been off the road since January, as he can't find a replacement ABS sensor ring for the nearside rear axle. Lots of MOT failing idiot lights refuse to go out. 

39000 from new and it looks and drives like a two year old car, but it's junk unless we can obtain a used rear axle with all the Mickey Mouse bits working.

 

* Particularly, what else?

 

 

 

Edited September 24, 2023 by MrWolf

[Winslow Boy]

Whilst not wishing to go all political and everything your friends failure to get his gas guzzling Chelsea tractor back on the road probably explains why carbon emissions have gone down- wouldn't happen to have anything to do with all the gormless twits spending there deltics on elastic band powered pedal carts would it, (sorry forget to take my intelligence reduction pill today) allowing the PM to grandstand earlier in the week. Just saying. 

[MrWolf]

1 hour ago, Winslow Boy said:

Whilst not wishing to go all political and everything your friends failure to get his gas guzzling Chelsea tractor back on the road probably explains why carbon emissions have gone down- wouldn't happen to have anything to do with all the gormless twits spending there deltics on elastic band powered pedal carts would it, (sorry forget to take my intelligence reduction pill today) allowing the PM to grandstand earlier in the week. Just saying. 

 

It has that twiddly Rover 2 litre diesel fitted which was specially designed to break long before it had made any significant contribution to Co2 or particulate figures.

Add that to the fact it's been out of action all year and it's greener than a go kart made from rafia that's powered by healing crystals and positive thought...

 

As for it being a Chelsea tractor, it actually has its origins in the Austin Maestro van, but less useful.

[lezz01]

The days of vehicle angst are over for me. I have a nice shiny pug 2008 from Motability, anything goes wrong they come and get it and bring me a courtesy car and bring it back when it's fixed happy days! I can have a new one is 14 months as well.

Regards Lez.  

[MrWolf]

45 minutes ago, lezz01 said:

The days of vehicle angst are over for me. I have a nice shiny pug 2008 from Motability, anything goes wrong they come and get it and bring me a courtesy car and bring it back when it's fixed happy days! I can have a new one is 14 months as well.

Regards Lez.  

 

That's very handy and better than being on the new car in finance every three years hamster wheel.

However much of a blessing a Motability car might be, I'd rather be fit, healthy and ineligible, even if I do have to do a bit of tinkering, as I'm sure you would.

I actually enjoy working on pre 1980 cars, most after that date are a real PITA when they break.

Cue someone saying "But modern cars don't break down". Oh, but they do, in the most frustrating and expensive way possible.

For example there's an eight year old Volvo near here that's headed for the scrapyard. There's not a mark on it, but nobody from the main dealer to the local tech geek with a laptop can figure out why it won't run, despite the owner spending a small fortune on parts and diagnostics.

 

[Winslow Boy]

1 hour ago, MrWolf said:

 

It has that twiddly Rover 2 litre diesel fitted which was specially designed to break long before it had made any significant contribution to Co2 or particulate figures.

Add that to the fact it's been out of action all year and it's greener than a go kart made from rafia that's powered by healing crystals and positive thought...

 

As for it being a Chelsea tractor, it actually has its origins in the Austin Maestro van, but less useful.

It does make you wonder just how much thought goes into the purchase of something doesn't it. I would like think that because it's the latest must have I wouldn't be swayed but there have been moments.

Edited September 24, 2023 by Winslow Boy

[Winslow Boy]

4 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

 

That's very handy and better than being on the new car in finance every three years hamster wheel.

However much of a blessing a Motability car might be, I'd rather be fit, healthy and ineligible, even if I do have to do a bit of tinkering, as I'm sure you would.

I actually enjoy working on pre 1980 cars, most after that date are a real PITA when they break.

Cue someone saying "But modern cars don't break down". Oh, but they do, in the most frustrating and expensive way possible.

For example there's an eight year old Volvo near here that's headed for the scrapyard. There's not a mark on it, but nobody from the main dealer to the local tech geek with a laptop can figure out why it won't run, despite the owner spending a small fortune on parts and diagnostics.

 

There is quite a range of vehicles available, or at least there were several years ago. Some quite 'posh ones' like Mercs and BMW'S. Something which I could never get my head round as to me if you needed a mobility car you weren't rich. The Mercs etc needed quite a hefty deposit.

[MrWolf]

If you buy new, there's at least a warranty and if you happen to have been saddled with a Friday afternoon car, they'll fix it. All you have is a bit of frustration and a courtesy car which may or may not smell like McDonalds skip.

Buy secondhand from a dealer and you might get three months warranty, after that, you're pretty much on your own, particularly as many people now don't so much as check the oil between services and if I had a pound for every car I hear humming along with a virtually flat tyre....

[lezz01]

57 minutes ago, Winslow Boy said:

There is quite a range of vehicles available, or at least there were several years ago. Some quite 'posh ones' like Mercs and BMW'S. Something which I could never get my head round as to me if you needed a mobility car you weren't rich. The Mercs etc needed quite a hefty deposit.

PIP isn't means tested, if you meet the criteria you are entitled to PIP. You only get a Motability vehicle if you are on enhanced PIP. There are some real swanky cars available but I will only say that we had to save real hard for the down payment to get the Pug and although we couldn't stretch to the GT I'm more than happy with her. There are many cars on the scheme that don't require a down payment and quite a few that don't take all of the mobility allowance part of PIP. On the plus side the GT is now available for the same up front cost that we paid for the Allure Plus so next time around we will get the GT. It has a few more bells and whistles and more colour options. The last car I owned was the Pug 207 so going up to the 2008 isn't much of an extravagance. We could have gone with the standard 208 rather than the SUV indeed we test drove both but I found it easier to get in and out of the 2008 so we went with that.

I will admit that I wouldn't turn my nose up at a MK 1 or 2 Landy or a MGB GT but my days of crawling around under vehicles of any sort are well and truly over.

Regards Lez    

[Winslow Boy]

7 hours ago, lezz01 said:

PIP isn't means tested, if you meet the criteria you are entitled to PIP. You only get a Motability vehicle if you are on enhanced PIP. There are some real swanky cars available but I will only say that we had to save real hard for the down payment to get the Pug and although we couldn't stretch to the GT I'm more than happy with her. There are many cars on the scheme that don't require a down payment and quite a few that don't take all of the mobility allowance part of PIP. On the plus side the GT is now available for the same up front cost that we paid for the Allure Plus so next time around we will get the GT. It has a few more bells and whistles and more colour options. The last car I owned was the Pug 207 so going up to the 2008 isn't much of an extravagance. We could have gone with the standard 208 rather than the SUV indeed we test drove both but I found it easier to get in and out of the 2008 so we went with that.

I will admit that I wouldn't turn my nose up at a MK 1 or 2 Landy or a MGB GT but my days of crawling around under vehicles of any sort are well and truly over.

Regards Lez    

 

It was my mum who had the motability car and for years she opted for  Renault's, as she found them the easiest to access and with good visibility. She did go with a Peugeot once and it probably saved her life as she had an accident on the A1- I saw the car afterwards and it was like a quashed can. The fire brigade just took the roof off as she had a broken spine. She'd had spinal problems before. So when the doctors asked she said matter of factorially 'been there done that' which rather took them back but of course they didn't know her. That I think really sums up the problem to me with old cars ie. an old car would not have protected her as well. The issue I have is that because there's very little more that can be done physically to improve safety it's now all electrical gubbins which you have to pay extra for. To me if it improves safety then it should come as standard and not as an extra.

[MrWolf]

A little bit of post work butchery has the U29 cut down to size.

 

[MrWolf]

I'll get the bits of U29 fettled and fixed together, once that's done I can measure up accurately for the clerestory roof.

 

I've ordered the necessary bits and pieces from MJT / Dart Castings, so there's no going back now. Thanks to @ChrisN for the tip about the chassis parts. Without your post I'd probably have put this coach back in the junk box.

 

In the meantime, I've decided to get organised and start making all that wire fencing that I wasn't looking forward to.

 

This is the beginning of a simple jig to wire up ten posts at a time, shown here with posts at 20mm centres, but the wire positions as yet unmarked.

 

 

With that in and painted, I can really push on with the layout itself. It's going to be nigh impossible to install if I leave it much longer.

 

I'm also confident that it will give me the necessary boost of enthusiasm to get on with the layout itself.

 

Those coaches won't be neglected though!

 

 

[Winslow Boy]

Onwards and upwards Rob or is that windage and elevation. I always get those two mixed up.

[MrWolf]

21 minutes ago, Winslow Boy said:

Onwards and upwards Rob or is that windage and elevation. I always get those two mixed up.

 

What up Winners. The answer is C. All of the above.

 

I'd better get on with it.

[MrWolf]

My first ever length of Ratio GWR wire fencing:

 

 

The supplied "wire" has probably been rolled up for the best part of forty years and some of it is having a bad hair day as a result. Also I don't think that there's enough to cover 36 posts the way I'm assembling it. (As in not as per the instructions!) As a result there's a couple of wobbly bits. 

I've got a reel of fishing line that I think I will substitute once the supplied materials run out.

 

The cruel close up shows how it's supposed to look. More or less.

 

[NHY 581]

On 23/09/2023 at 23:32, lezz01 said:

I think that some of us become so immersed in the lore of our chosen railways that the age old enmity of them sort of rubs off on us. As a Midland guy the other main railways in contention were the GWR and the LNWR. I have nothing against any railway company. The reason I don't model the GWR is mainly because when I was a youngster everything was about the GWR. It was in the press everywhere and exhibitions were full of GW BLTs to the point that anything other than the GW was a welcome breath of fresh air. I was attracted to the MR because of the locos built by Kirtley and Johnson. You have to go a long long way to find a more elegant loco than a slim boilered Johnson 4-4-0 or a more purposeful looking loco than a Kirtley DF goods. That's what attracted me to the MR in the first place. Then there was the routes across some of the most dramatic scenery England and also some truly great architecture. What's not to like!? I am however very fond of the old broad gauge be it GWR or B&E or B&G and if I was 20 years younger and had more time I would love to model the broad gauge. There is a section just outside Gloucester that had both the Midland and GWR running side by side with a junction off the MR running into Gloucester docks and whilst I don't have either the funds or the space never say never.

Regards Lez.    

 

As a spotty 15yr old, I used to visit a chap with a large GWR layout. It was fab with most of the locos and stock built from kits at the time. I began plotting to build a Welsh GWR BLT. It was almost expected really. At 16, I started working at Beatties, bought a Hornby open cab pannier and it looked like the BLT was a done deal.............then I had an epiphany and realised the true path led to the S&DJR which in turn led to the L&SWR and the Midland. 

 

Fast forward 40+years ( where on earth has that gone !? ) and whilst still retaining a healthy interest in all things S&D, an interest in the more bucolic railway backwaters has seen much diversity and many, many moments of inspiration. Mainly these revolve around weeds, a general degree of unkeptness and overall ramshacklivity. A likely build of a pre-WW1 SE&CR terminus may well buck the weedy trend but if I panic at the lack of Mother Nature encroaching everywhere, there's always the Mid-Suffolk Light Railway as a plan B.........

 

 

 

On 24/09/2023 at 19:57, MrWolf said:

One word.

 

BU66ER.

 

 

That would be a blown wheel cylinder then.

 

But to add insult to injury, the brake fluid has dissolved the almost new asbestos free, ethically sourced, dolphin friendly vegan brake shoes....

 

I had two new wheel cylinders in the parts stash, front calipers, new pads, but no rear shoes. I forgot to top up the stash when I fitted these at the beginning of summer.

 

Upshot was no trip to Stafford (1,000,000,000 boos...) but a trip on the Beeza B33 over to get a set of shoes from a mate in Sedbergh, getting p... wet through* on the way home of course.

 

 

 

 

Proper bu@@er ! 

 

Would have been lovely to see you and the Memsahib at Stafford, Rob but ensuring the Memsahib remains mobile and safe is an understandable priority. 

 

If however, a couple of tentative enquiries come off, we could see a return to that neck of the woods next year. In fact, such was Stafford that it's now on my list of must visit shows. They did a great job. 

 

Rob

 

 

[wiggoforgold]

I like all railways. My interest is more by period, starting with the 1960's, the decade I grew up in. Interest starts to taper off after 1968, though the blue diesels and blue/grey coaches of the 1970's and 80's bring back memories. No interest in anything post-privatisation. Although my current layout and it's predecessor are ex-GWR, I still see myself as an LNER modeller.

[MrWolf]

7 hours ago, wiggoforgold said:

I like all railways. My interest is more by period, starting with the 1960's, the decade I grew up in. Interest starts to taper off after 1968, though the blue diesels and blue/grey coaches of the 1970's and 80's bring back memories. No interest in anything post-privatisation. Although my current layout and it's predecessor are ex-GWR, I still see myself as an LNER modeller.

 

I'm very much the same, although I grew up in the era of blue diesels then sectorization. 

My interest in things prewar I suspect is from the 1920s and 30s cars and motorcycles that I was surrounded by in my schooldays and the fact that my first train set was an almost twenty year old Tri-ang Lord of the Isles set.

It's the only explanation I can come up with for why I like things from before my time.