Chuffnell Regis

[Graham T]

19 minutes ago, Rowsley17D said:

With the rear brake hangers only the bottom of the hanger would be visible so that's why I didn't bother trying to fit any. For me it was the guard irons that got in the way. I did contemplate gluing the lower part of the hangers to the back of the rear steps but it would mean they were too far out of line with the wheels.

 

It's the same with the 4F of course, although the brakes are more visibile from behind the loco.  I considered trying to cut away the NEM socket, but that fell into the "too difficult" category and so, in the finest traditions of Chuffnell Regis, I bodged it instead.

 

 

I threaded brass wire through the lower end of the brake hangers this time, and then tried fitting this to the bottom of the NEM pocket.  A bit of plasticard packing was needed to get the hangers at the right level vertically.  I'm hoping that this bodge won't be quite so obvious once it's had some black paint ladled on!  I then added brass rod along the length of the tender on each side to represent the pull rods (I think that's what they are anyway...)

 

So, I know it's all there, but you can't see much of it once the loco is back on the rails 😀

 

[Tortuga]

Can you not do the same, but use a longer length of brass rod bent to shape around the NEM block? Or alternatively two much shorter sections of brass rod, one on each side of the NEM block?

 

Scratch that. You’d already come up with two alternatives! I didn’t want to suggest removing the NEM block in case you needed it, forgetting you use scale couplings!

 

Looks good by the way and even though it’s barely visible, it’s one of those things that’ll jar if it’s not there and you know it should be.

 

 

Edited September 16, 2023 by Tortuga
Solution already found

[Rowsley17D]

1 hour ago, Graham T said:

 

It's the same with the 4F of course, although the brakes are more visibile from behind the loco.  I considered trying to cut away the NEM socket, but that fell into the "too difficult" category and so, in the finest traditions of Chuffnell Regis, I bodged it instead.

 

 

I threaded brass wire through the lower end of the brake hangers this time, and then tried fitting this to the bottom of the NEM pocket.  A bit of plasticard packing was needed to get the hangers at the right level vertically.  I'm hoping that this bodge won't be quite so obvious once it's had some black paint ladled on!  I then added brass rod along the length of the tender on each side to represent the pull rods (I think that's what they are anyway...)

 

So, I know it's all there, but you can't see much of it once the loco is back on the rails 😀

 

 

Good solution, I might have a go at that myself.

[Graham T]

Perhaps unsurprisingly, black brake gear and rodding underneath a black tender is not the easiest thing to photograph.  But here's a stab at it anyway.  All the gubbins have now been painted.  If you look closely you can make out the rear brake hanger on the right of the tender, and the rods in the second photo.

 

 

 

Looking at the first photo, I'm wondering if I should apply some sort of weathering to the buffer heads?  I've no idea what colour they would have been on the prototype.  Painted black and then worn by impact in the centre?  Plain steel?  Rusty, greasy?

 

 

Edited September 16, 2023 by Graham T

[MrWolf]

Cropped from Railadvent image of the last surviving 4F at Keighley.

It might be in preservation, but it is working for a living.

 

 

 

[Graham T]

10 hours ago, MrWolf said:

Cropped from Railadvent image of the last surviving 4F at Keighley.

It might be in preservation, but it is working for a living.

 

 

 

Thanks Rob, just the ticket!

 

[cctransuk]

11 hours ago, MrWolf said:

Cropped from Railadvent image of the last surviving 4F at Keighley.

It might be in preservation, but it is working for a living.

 

 

 

 

The quartered polishing of the bufferheads would have been confined to the most prestigious trains - even Royal trains.

 

I paint loco bufferheads in track colour, with a splodge of dirty black / metallic steel in the centre.

 

CJI.

[MrWolf]

4 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

The quartered polishing of the bufferheads would have been confined to the most prestigious trains - even Royal trains.

 

I paint loco bufferheads in track colour, with a splodge of dirty black / metallic steel in the centre.

 

CJI.

 

Good point, I was going to add that the outer edges of the buffer would be a darker iron colour, possibly with a bit of rust. LMS goods locos seem to have been the starting point for the BR livery of unrelieved filth.

[Graham T]

I thought I'd dip into the stash of wagon kits for a change.  This is the Cambrian LMS 12 ton van, D1828, and it's a bit of a curate's egg to be honest.  As you can see there's some nice detail on the van body, but there was a lot of flash in places, and some of the mouldings were, frankly, a bit cr@p (a couple of the axleboxes actually had holes in the front of them...)  And it's made out a rather weird, soft, flexible plastic.  Also, why do kit makers insist on having the ring on the buffer shank as a separate piece?  They are a real pain.  Same thing with separate headstocks, it would seem a lot more sensible to me to have them moulded in one piece with the ends of the van.

 

Anyway, here's how it looks so far.  Brakes detailed with brass etches from 51L, metal buffer heads added (a couple of which need straightening), and a large chunk of lead super glued inside, to bring it up to about 30g.  Forgot to mention, wheels are from Alan Gibson, I think.

 

 

 

 

As ever, photos show up the howlers that you didn't spot before.  I can see I will need to apply some filler here and there too, and not just to the axleboxes ...

 

 

 

Edited September 17, 2023 by Graham T

[cctransuk]

49 minutes ago, Graham T said:

i).... why do kit makers insist on having the ring on the buffer shank as a separate piece?

 

ii) Same thing with separate headstocks....

 

 

i) to allow the moulding to come out of the mould;

 

ii) so that the chassis can be used for other models.

 

CJI.

[Graham T]

I can understand point one, not so sure about the second though…

 

[cctransuk]

53 minutes ago, Graham T said:

I can understand point one, not so sure about the second though…

 

 

There may have been an intention - in fact, I know that there was - to produce a subject that did not have a body end attached to the bufferbeam.

 

A clue - I added the transfers to my Cambrian Models pack in advance of the kit's release - which never happened after the change of ownership of Cambrian. A rare occasion of the transfers being available, but not the kit!

 

John Isherwood,

Cambridge Custom Transfers.

[Tortuga]

2 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

There may have been an intention - in fact, I know that there was - to produce a subject that did not have a body end attached to the bufferbeam.

 

A clue - I added the transfers to my Cambrian Models pack in advance of the kit's release - which never happened after the change of ownership of Cambrian. A rare occasion of the transfers being available, but not the kit!

 

John Isherwood,

Cambridge Custom Transfers.

That wouldn’t have been the LMS Roadstone Wagon would it? I remember seeing that as a “coming soon” on the website, but next time I visited, Cambrian was under new ownership and there was no sign of it.

[cctransuk]

6 minutes ago, Tortuga said:

That wouldn’t have been the LMS Roadstone Wagon would it? I remember seeing that as a “coming soon” on the website, but next time I visited, Cambrian was under new ownership and there was no sign of it.

 

You may think that - but I could not possibly comment ........

 

CJI.

[Graham T]

I've now finished building the van, but realise I have made an error.  Can you spot it?  I'm not going to try to fix it on this model, but will have to bear it in mind for future kit builds...

 

 

[5BarVT]

No.

[Neal Ball]

49 minutes ago, Graham T said:

I've now finished building the van, but realise I have made an error.  Can you spot it?  I'm not going to try to fix it on this model, but will have to bear it in mind for future kit builds...

 

 

 

Don't tell us - we wont know!

 

I cant spot what the issue is - is it the roof? The overhang looks a bit too much.... but I'm really being picky!

[cctransuk]

54 minutes ago, Graham T said:

I've now finished building the van, but realise I have made an error.  Can you spot it?  I'm not going to try to fix it on this model, but will have to bear it in mind for future kit builds...

 

 

 

Brake lever / axlebox potential clash?

 

CJI.

Edited September 18, 2023 by cctransuk

[Tortuga]

The bend to clear the axlebox on the brake lever is the on wrong side of the lever guard?

 

How do you build up your 51L brake gear @Graham T - solder or superglue? Could you detach the levers, straighten them out and reattach them?

[BWsTrains]

The brake lever is too long.

 

Is it a "one size fits all" component which needs shortening at the connection point (and located above the bottom of the V) or just one for a longer wheelbase wagon?

 

Colin

 

 

Edited September 19, 2023 by BWsTrains

[Fishplate]

First picture : Right hand brake shoe/ connecting rod upside down so not connected to brake lever assembly at V hanger? 

 

Ps. I'm not a brake gear officiando, so have assembled a sentence using words I've heard 😀

 

[Compound2632]

58 minutes ago, Fishplate said:

First picture : Right hand brake shoe/ connecting rod upside down so not connected to brake lever assembly at V hanger? 

 

Ps. I'm not a brake gear officiando, so have assembled a sentence using words I've heard 😀

 

 

Apart from the issue with the brake lever being the wrong length, the brake gear is correct. The van has the Morton brake gear and we're looking at the side with the reversing cam. Depressing the brake lever gives a clockwise rotation at its pivot which is converted to an anticlockwise rotation of the cross-shaft and tumbler by the reversing cam. The pushrods above the cross shaft move to the left and those below, to the right, successfully applying the brake.

 

This means the pushrods are the opposite way round to those on a wagon which only has a normal non-Morton cam brake lever. The LMS C&W Drawing Office liked to put the brakes on the reversing-cam side of the wagon, if there was only one block per axle fitted. This was done with the special intention of spreading confusion amongst 21st century modellers.

[MrWolf]

I suspect that the brake lever is too long because the crank in the lever for clearing the axle boxes is the wrong side of the ratchet. If it was to the inner side of the ratchet, that would take up some of the length of metal earlier in the run and any excess beyond the ratchet could be cut off to make a convincing length lever.

As @BWsTrains states, it's a one size fits all lever and with adjustment would fit 9', 10' and possibly 11'wb vehicles. Not impossible to sort out.

[Graham T]

Well that seemed to stir things up!  Thanks for all the comments.  Honours got to @Tortuga and @Compound2632 for the best answers 🙂

 

I did indeed put the crank in the levers at the wrong place, and, although they have been trimmed, they may well still be a tad too long.  It is indeed supposed to show Morton brakes.  I assembled them with superglue, so am a bit wary of trying to remove and redo them as I think I might well do some damage.  So I'm thinking of leaving them as they are, and trying to remember not to make the same mistake with the next kit...

 

[Tortuga]

33 minutes ago, Graham T said:

Well that seemed to stir things up!  Thanks for all the comments.  Honours got to @Tortuga and @Compound2632 for the best answers 🙂

 

I did indeed put the crank in the levers at the wrong place, and, although they have been trimmed, they may well still be a tad too long.  It is indeed supposed to show Morton brakes.  I assembled them with superglue, so am a bit wary of trying to remove and redo them as I think I might well do some damage.  So I'm thinking of leaving them as they are, and trying to remember not to make the same mistake with the next kit...

 

Bit of careful prising with a scalpel at the glued joints? I‘ve managed to get those levers off once superglued before using this method - don’t use a brand new blade, work around the joint as much as possible and wear eye protection just in case!