'Adieu to Anthracite'; an ode to sitting round a coal fire at home.

[TheQ]

11 hours ago, johnofwessex said:

Two interesting takes - I would recommend both publications

 

https://www.thelandmagazine.org.uk/articles/firewood-firing-line

 

https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2019/12/too-much-combustion-too-little-fire.html

 

Again it looks like an attempt to squeeze out small scale local activities.

 

There is all the symbolism of The Hearth which a radiator just doesn't have.

 

I like it when everyone else has gone to bed on a winters night and all I can hear is the rush of air through my log burner.  Also of course the relationship I have with the fuel, first stacking it away in the shed then bringing it in which tells me what the weathers like - if I have to bring two trugs in its a very cold day.  Then there is choosing which bits to put on and how to place them for the best resuts.

 

 

 

 

The second article was incorrect in saying until the 20th century the biomass burning fire was the only energy consuming device in the house..

By the 20th century in 90% of homes in the UK,  that fireplace was burning coal not wood.

Coal was in use in China by 3400 BC, the ancient Greeks burned it, the Aztecs burned it, the Romans fueled many of their UK hypercausts with it, by the 1200s it was being shipped to London from the northeast to heat some of their homes.

 

I'm afraid HMG of any party often make laws assuming everyone, uses outside contractors, have a lot of money, and do no practical work for themselves. MPs have no contact with reality on their huge wages..

 

As for the weather, too many think global warming is the only thing going on, they forget or dismiss milancovitch cycles, we are in a thirty year  cooling cycle for them. Yes global warming will modify the overall result, but global warming does not stop the earths changes in position from the sun, the sun cycles, and the earths angle of tilt alterations.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles

Edited May 2, 2021 by TheQ

[Ruffnut Thorston]

8 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

Could go the other way, of course, in that ‘global warming’ might not necessarily make everywhere warmer.

 

If it significantly alters the Gulf Stream or the Jet Stream, we could find ourselves with a climate rather like that of Labrador which, when it isn’t fetching sticks that you’ve thrown, is mostly sub-Arctic tundra, rather than palm-fringed beaches.

 

 

 

 

This is part of the basic premise of “The Day After Tomorrow”.

 

I read the book before it formed the basis of that film/ movie.

 

It really is the Gulf Stream that maintains the climate of these islands at a somewhat more comfortable level than the latitude and longitude would suggest....

 

The temperature, and salinity of the northern seas is part of the driver of the Gulf Stream cycle. It is basically convection, and needs the temperature difference and the density of the water, due to the salt concentration, to work.

 

Melting land ice dilutes the sea water, reducing salinity, as well as actually raising the mean sea level. A double whammy.

 

It isn’t just the UK that is affected by the Gulf Stream.

 

Parts of the northern American Continent could also face a good amount of climate change...possibly it would rain in Southern California, or more likely snow!

 

Global warming is now acknowledged as a bit of a daft name, most people like the idea of warmth...and can’t, or won’t, see the wider problems.

 

When the places that are just about tolerable from heat get even hotter, and become uninhabitable deserts, all the current populations, both people and any mobile flora and fauna, would have to move North, into cooler areas.

 

Climate Change covers most bases.

 

Global Wierding is a good term, as the current weather systems will only get weirder...more extremes of weather are on the way....

 

It has been said that these islands don’t have a climate, only weather...

 

Being surrounded by seas does mean that weather fronts can steam in rapidly, causing quite rapid changes in the weather.

 

Though we need to look to the future, it must not lead to the needs of the current time to be forgotten.

 

Blanket legislation may gain green points, but what of the people affected by these schemes, especially those for whom changing their entire life styles may not be easily possible...

 

May we all survive the coming changes. You all take good care now. 

[ikcdab]

One website says this...

 

Anthracite, although a natural coal not a manufactured smokeless fuel, does meet the Defra requirements and is therefore considered smokeless. It will still be readily available and may continue to be used after 1st May 2021.

https://www.fredtarry.co.uk/uk-house-coal-and-wet-firewood-ban.html

 

 

 

[ikcdab]

And just to be accurate, the ban is on the supply of the fuels. Not the actual burning of them. So if you can get your hands on the stuff, it's not illegal to use it.

 

 

 

[andania 213]

I've been speaking to our Coalman at reasonable length over this for some time now, Being his livelihood, he makes sure he's up to date with the latest regulations.

His take is that legislation mainly  affects bagged coal supplies, though he'll have to move over to supply purely smokeless varitiew of fuel in 2023, as the supply of what's commonly called house coal will not be allowed post that date, that said, he's due next Friday, I'll be checking things out with him !

 

2 hours ago, TheQ said:

I'm afraid HMG of any party often make laws assuming everyone, uses outside contractors, have a lot of money, and do no practical work for themselves. MPs have no contact with reality on their huge wages..

 

 

Wonder if there's a way of recycling the hot air from that lot, should heat a fair few homes

 

K

[didcot]

So what are places like Clovelly going to do? I know they get coal deliveries via sledge down the steep hill. Do they have any other form of heating?

[Nearholmer]

Buy fuel that is permitted - the law isn’t setting out to ban open fires, only two particular types of fuel being burned in them.

[rocor]

23 hours ago, pH said:

Did you ever experience a big-city winter smog?

 

Is this a holiday advert you are promoting?. 

[ikcdab]

2 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

Buy fuel that is permitted - the law isn’t setting out to ban open fires, only two particular types of fuel being burned in them.

I see that, but its a racing certainty that the new smokeless manufactured fuel will be more expensive and not as thermally efficient as standard coal...

[APOLLO]

3 hours ago, didcot said:

So what are places like Clovelly going to do? I know they get coal deliveries via sledge down the steep hill. Do they have any other form of heating?

 

Running back up the hill getting a sweat on !!!

 

Brit15

[didcot]

42 minutes ago, ikcdab said:

I see that, but its a racing certainty that the new smokeless manufactured fuel will be more expensive and not as thermally efficient as standard coal

Yes, we find the smokeless stuff doesn't pump the heat out and also creates at least 50% minimum more ash. So not complete combustion. 

[Mark Saunders]

Home made briquettes  90% sea coal and 10% cement as a binder as one of my colleagues used to make!

[Nearholmer]

58 minutes ago, APOLLO said:

Running back up the hill getting a sweat on !!!

In Ireland, turf (hand cut peat blocks) was the normal domestic fuel until recently (still is in a fair few places) and everyone used to say that the cutting, wind-rowing, carting home, stacking, then fetching it in to the fire did a lot more to keep people warm than burning it ever did.

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, ikcdab said:

I see that, but its a racing certainty that the new smokeless manufactured fuel will be more expensive and not as thermally efficient as standard coal...

You think standard coal is thermally efficient?

 

I remember coal (and coke) fires when I was a kid and I can't say I have any longing for them.

They were dirty, smelly and clogged your lungs up. They also didn't warm the house up very well.

The house I grew up in had coal fires in every room except the bathroom (3 downstairs, 3 upstairs)

There was also a coal fired washing boiler. (unused  by then, we'd also stopped cooking on the range and used gas instead for both)

Good riddance as far as I am concerned.

[APOLLO]

The Irish peat bogs had / have their own narrow gauge railway systems - fairly extensive.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bord_na_Móna

 

 

Make a nice model railway !!

 

Brit15

[melmerby]

Peat was so widespread as fuel that O.V. Bulleid did an "Irish" on his Leader and came up with this for CIE:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIÉ_No._CC1

[ikcdab]

18 minutes ago, melmerby said:

You think standard coal is thermally efficient

That's not what I said, I said that the new stuff wouldn't be as good as the old stuff.

We burn our coal in our multifuel log burner. I find that 5kg of standard coal heats our lounge and the bedroom above very nicely. I buy 150kg a year and i normally don't burn it all. We also burn general timber waste.

Some residual ash and clinker, but not excessive.

[Ruffnut Thorston]

There are some smokeless fuel brickettes that when they burn through leave a perfect ash egg. So the same area of ash as the fuel.

 

This fuel has probably been manufactured using a high amount of a cement like binder, that doesn’t burn...hence the “ash”.

 

Other types burn though without so much ash, so probably use less binder.

 

When it comes to a cooking range, then the smokeless fuels we have used do not put out enough heat to heat the oven properly, whereas the bituminous smoky coal burns hotter, with more combustion of the gases given off as it burns. So more heat going around the passages around the oven.

 

Of course, the big downside is soot build up in the passageways, and chimney.

 

The old ranges were designed for bituminous hose coal. And a cheap labour force to clean out the soot...

 

With plans to stop the use of diesel for heating and cooking, and gas, it does look like the plan is to go all electric...

 

And look what happens already when the power goes down...people using barbecue stuff with charcoal indoors...and if they don’t set fire to the place, they run the risk of death from Carbon Monoxide poisoning!

 

There are a lot of people living in circumstances that make going all electric a very difficult thing....but do those who make the decisions even know, or care? 
 

 

[Railpassion]

My local wood supplier cuts up pallets for his main supply. The wood burns well and at £1.50 a bag is snip.

[Nearholmer]

4 hours ago, APOLLO said:

The Irish peat bogs had / have their own narrow gauge railway systems - fairly extensive.

I’ve visited every one of the the Bord na Mona railways, and most of the small lines too. The bad news for narrow gauge railway enthusiasts, and good news for the environment, is that peat-fueled electricity generation is being run-down very quickly now, and the lines are progressively closing. 
 

I think the photo might be the reception sidings at Derrinlough briquetting factory, where milled peat is made into the briquettes that you see being sold on petrol station forecourts all over Ireland.

 

Last time I was there, there was still one railway carrying turf, as opposed to milled peat, at Attymon in Galway.

[phil_sutters]

There is also the connection between solid fuel fires and particulate pollution. A recent newspaper article claims that although only 8% of the population use solid fuels, their particulate output is higher than the total from transport. Add the two together in densely populated areas with a lot of transport and you get a toxic atmosphere.

 

By the way does anyone have any information on the Highbridge Anthracite Fuel Company which took over the former peat processing plant on Highbridge Wharf in 1924?

Edited May 3, 2021 by phil_sutters

[Railpassion]

Many people in the countryside do not have gas but rely on solid fuel to heat using Rayburns and other boilers. Oil systems are £3000 plus to install not including the radiators. The cost is big deterrent to those on low incomes, particularly those in rented homes. 

 

I think we are are on the verge of an enormous crisis if the transition is not skilfully and sensitively managed. 

 

 

[Reorte]

A very sad day indeed, a true pleasure being kicked as a token gesture, nothing more. Pointing out past smog conditions isn't at all relevant - the issues with everyone having coal fires was sorted out years ago, what's left now is too small to have any sort of significance, so it's hardly a valid comparison. Another example of the road to hell being paved with good intentions, or a least with gesture politics.

 

Funny how the environmentalists love to pick on things like this but conveniently ignore some much larger issues like cement and concrete production...

 

Burning unseasoned wood is plain stupid anyway (just asking for a chimney fire), so no-one should be doing that. If the number burning properly seasoned wood is high then perhaps there's a case to remove the smokeless zone exemptions that permit it in smokeless zones.

 

[Reorte]

On 02/05/2021 at 09:06, ikcdab said:

One website says this...

 

Anthracite, although a natural coal not a manufactured smokeless fuel, does meet the Defra requirements and is therefore considered smokeless. It will still be readily available and may continue to be used after 1st May 2021.

https://www.fredtarry.co.uk/uk-house-coal-and-wet-firewood-ban.html

 

The problem with anthracite is that as far as I can tell it would do a better job as an asbestos replacement than as a fuel... Maybe I'm just not good at lighting fires.

[APOLLO]

12 hours ago, Railpassion said:

I think we are are on the verge of an enormous crisis if the transition is not skilfully and sensitively managed. 

 

Indeed we are. Cold and hungry Brits are not a happy thought.

 

Brit15