My Welshpool based layout and related activity

[russell price]

Hello 

I’ve been reading on here some layout threads and how people help and interact, so I thought I’d add some of mine. I started in the usual way working up through various layouts until a disaster struck. More on that later, however all was packed away in 1983 until recently. I had ideas years ago to build something based on Oswestry however those ambitions were never realised. The introduction of the Bachmann Dukedog and Oxford Dean goods probably got my attention enough to get back to railways, I had decided a model of Welshpool would be good for many reasons on a personal level and it is an interesting junction with both GW and LMS motive power in attendance. 
I will be staying 12v dc control because I have too many locos. There will also be plenty of non prototypical running too but that will be excersise other stock. 
After a recent house move I was able to build a shed to house the railway and construction has started. 

[russell price]

A look at the basic layout with some track temporary in place to see how it all fits . I intend to get all the track placed loosely before cork is added or any wiring done. The view through the railway door is looking from the Oswestry end towards the coast.  The platforms will hold 9 coach trains.

[Paul H Vigor]

1 hour ago, russell price said:

A look at the basic layout with some track temporary in place to see how it all fits . I intend to get all the track placed loosely before cork is added or any wiring done. The view through the railway door is looking from the Oswestry end towards the coast.  The platforms will hold 9 coach trains.

Must say, that's a very fine shed! 🙂

[russell price]

Built to suit the layout! 

[russell price]

Acquired this yesterday, Newark Toyfair loco body a quid!! To make up a worthwhile haul from the junk box, then later off another stall a brand new sealed Bachmann replacement non split type chassis!! Plenty of these through Welshpool under LMR control. Tender is an ancient Airfix job that might upgrade for it. 

[RobinofLoxley]

I came back to the hobby after a long break, like you Russell, and I at first underestimated the impact of DCC in railway operations. With a large area like that, and a lot of rolling stock to fill it to an adequate level, the cost of conversion to DCC will undoubtedly be high. However you seem to have created a large building for the pupose... just saying

[russell price]

I haven’t totally ruled out DCC but I think I need to see if I can reduce to a minimum which locos to authentically run on the layout and maybe dcc those and build a separate test track to run  older stuff on. Lots to think about.

[ChrisN]

Looks like a good start.  I do love your shed.  The Cambrian Coast stations were alll long and thin so my layout ought to be twice the length, if not three times, but do not have the space that you do.

 

It would be worth putting a link in your signature, and occasional updates in 'The Railways of Wales' as you will find lots of local knowledge there.

[corneliuslundie]

I am a dyed in the wool DC man - for simple layouts, not more than two locos at a time. However, I have on several occasions attended a North American modular meet, and these could not be done any other way than DCC. Though they gave up trying to use DCC for the points and signals because of the problems of co-ordinating addresses.

So locos for Welshpool:

Manors

63xx Moguls

BR standard 4s

80xxx tanks

45xx tanks (or were they only further west?)

Dukedogs

Collett 0-6-0s

Dean Goods

Cambrian 15 class 0-6-0?

Cambrian 2-4-0 tanks?

Class 101 DMUs

Diesel parcels units (to Newtown for the Pryce Jones trade)

Class 24s

Later class 37s

Enough as a start?

The W&Ll doesn't need DCC!

Jonathan

 

[russell price]

I think my biggest worry is that the majority of my loco fleet are white metal  kit builds with current return via the chassis and non insulated wheels which I believe DCC needs both motor brushes connected to the chip and insulated return. If that is the case then  that alone rules out DCC as I’ve too many locos. Most of the above list are on the roster, there are 4 M&L manors alone. Then to add to that list is the LNW/ LMS stock which worked the Shrewsbury line. 

[corneliuslundie]

I'll leave others to comment on the DCC.

But I hope that at least one of your Manors is in a suitable state of cleanliness for the CCE. I have just been reading Derek Lowe's volume on the Cambrian main line, and there are some wonderful photos of Manors with white painted buffers and smoke box door handles, also shining clean all over. The complete opposite of how so many of them looked in their last days.

Jonathan

[russell price]

I was intending to doll up a manor to Aber standards, maybe need to check on the allocation history for Barcote Manor as  she might be a suitable candidate

[russell price]

A couple of photos from a test running session. First up is 7806 Cockington Manor , a loco which wasn’t shedded on the Cambrian much, but was apparently the first Manor to reach the Coast in 1943. 
seen here at the head of an Oswestry bound train. 

[russell price]

Just as likely to be seen in Welshpool is LMS 3f arriving with a local from Shrewsbury.

[russell price]

The Metcalfe LNWR signal box is very similar to the original LNWR box that was stood at the North End of the station.

[SteamingWales]

Really looking forward to seeing this project progress. I'll second that the D.J. Lowe Cambrian Mainline book is extremely useful reference material and I have used mine multiple times whilst building my "Aberystwyth Shed" layout.

 

May I ask what time period the layout is set in? From the photos the stock all looks very GWR!

[ChrisN]

It is interesting that you say that Cockington Manor was the first to reach the Coast in 1943.  I had hoped one had reached there in 1940.  Still, I know very little about such modern times.

[The Johnster]

On 03/01/2023 at 09:55, russell price said:

I haven’t totally ruled out DCC but I think I need to see if I can reduce to a minimum which locos to authentically run on the layout and maybe dcc those and build a separate test track to run  older stuff on. Lots to think about.

 

I'd suggest that this is a decision to be made as early as possible in the layout-building process, as if you leave it too long, you will have acquired a large number of locomotives that will need to be chipped (and possibly speakered) at once, which will be a big hit to your wallet.  My own layout is DC, and I haven't seriously regretted not going digital.  I do, however, make chuff-chuff noises...

[The Johnster]

On 04/01/2023 at 09:04, corneliuslundie said:

I am a dyed in the wool DC man - for simple layouts, not more than two locos at a time. However, I have on several occasions attended a North American modular meet, and these could not be done any other way than DCC. Though they gave up trying to use DCC for the points and signals because of the problems of co-ordinating addresses.

So locos for Welshpool:

Manors

63xx Moguls

BR standard 4s

80xxx tanks

45xx tanks (or were they only further west?)

Dukedogs

Collett 0-6-0s

Dean Goods

Cambrian 15 class 0-6-0?

Cambrian 2-4-0 tanks?

Class 101 DMUs

Diesel parcels units (to Newtown for the Pryce Jones trade)

Class 24s

Later class 37s

Enough as a start?

The W&Ll doesn't need DCC!

Jonathan

 

 

Ivatt and BR 2MT 'mickey mouse' moguls and BR 3MT tanks as well.  Also add 108 and IIRC Cravens dmus.

[corneliuslundie]

More about Manors. I have just been through Derek Lowe's book on the  Cambrian main line and the following are to be seen in dated photos:

7800 1959, 1961

7801 early 1960s

7802 1953, 1960 white decoration, 1962, 1964 white decoration, 1965 white decoration, 1965 no nameplates

7803 1958, 1961, 1961 white decoration, 1962 white decoration, probably 1964 white decoration

7806 1956

7807 1959, 1960

7808 1946, 1964

7809 1962

7810 1961, 1962, 1963, 1964

7812 1962, 1964, 1965

7815 1961

7816 1961

7818 1962 white decoration

7819 1954, 1963, 1964, 1965 no nameplates

7820 1951, 1963, 1964

7821 1964, 1965

7822 1961, 1963, 1964

7823 1962

7825 1958

7827 1963, 1964

7828 1963, 1963 white decoration, 1964, 1965

So plenty of choice depending on date, though only a few seem to have got the CCE treatment at Aber shed.

Of course, you really need them all! Only about £4k at current prices.

I realised that other classes snuck in from Salop but as I didn't know what classes it thought it best to ignore them, though obviously needed for the Welshpool layout though not for our friend;s model or Aber shed.

And I am not very good on diesel classes other than the Cravens (travelled on many) and 101s.

Jonathan

[SteamingWales]

11 hours ago, russell price said:

A couple of photos from a test running session. First up is 7806 Cockington Manor , a loco which wasn’t shedded on the Cambrian much, but was apparently the first Manor to reach the Coast in 1943. 
seen here at the head of an Oswestry bound train. 

 

9 hours ago, ChrisN said:

It is interesting that you say that Cockington Manor was the first to reach the Coast in 1943.  I had hoped one had reached there in 1940.  Still, I know very little about such modern times.

 

I have it my head that the first Manors were allocated to Oswestry in 1942 following testing on the route earlier that year. The Derek Lowe book also quotes 1939 as the year the Cambrian was changed to a Blue route so no Manors before then unfortunately.

 

8 minutes ago, corneliuslundie said:

More about Manors. I have just been through Derek Lowe's book on the  Cambrian main line and the following are to be seen in dated photos:

7800 1959, 1961

7801 early 1960s

7802 1953, 1960 white decoration, 1962, 1964 white decoration, 1965 white decoration, 1965 no nameplates

7803 1958, 1961, 1961 white decoration, 1962 white decoration, probably 1964 white decoration

7806 1956

7807 1959, 1960

7808 1946, 1964

7809 1962

7810 1961, 1962, 1963, 1964

7812 1962, 1964, 1965

7815 1961

7816 1961

7818 1962 white decoration

7819 1954, 1963, 1964, 1965 no nameplates

7820 1951, 1963, 1964

7821 1964, 1965

7822 1961, 1963, 1964

7823 1962

7825 1958

7827 1963, 1964

7828 1963, 1963 white decoration, 1964, 1965

So plenty of choice depending on date, though only a few seem to have got the CCE treatment at Aber shed.

Of course, you really need them all! Only about £4k at current prices.

I realised that other classes snuck in from Salop but as I didn't know what classes it thought it best to ignore them, though obviously needed for the Welshpool layout though not for our friend;s model or Aber shed.

And I am not very good on diesel classes other than the Cravens (travelled on many) and 101s.

Jonathan

 

For the white embellishments I would also add 7812, 1962 onwards for dates 

 

7802 and 7803 spent the most time allocated to Machynlleth/Aberystwyth and seem the most consistent in terms of embellishments. I have the earliest date as May 1959 on both locos.

 

The likes of 7819 and 7823 were also kept in quite a clean state for CCE workings

 

I haven't seen any white embellishments on Cambrian Manors pre-1959 and only on locos with BR L/C. 

 

[tanatvalley]

13 hours ago, russell price said:

I was intending to doll up a manor to Aber standards, maybe need to check on the allocation history for Barcote Manor as  she might be a suitable candidate

Barcote Manor had an intermediate tender for a large part of its life instead of the standard Churchward 3500 gallon type. I know of photographs of Bradley and Granville Manors on the CCE having received the Aber treatment.

[russell price]

12 hours ago, SteamingWales said:

Really looking forward to seeing this project progress. I'll second that the D.J. Lowe Cambrian Mainline book is extremely useful reference material and I have used mine multiple times whilst building my "Aberystwyth Shed" layout.

 

May I ask what time period the layout is set in? From the photos the stock all looks very GWR!

Mainly 1950s, was planning to build it in its heyday but could run other eras as long as I can accept some inaccuracies, ie full track layout if running BR blue era as about the most extreme case. 

[russell price]

10 hours ago, ChrisN said:

It is interesting that you say that Cockington Manor was the first to reach the Coast in 1943.  I had hoped one had reached there in 1940.  Still, I know very little about such modern times.

That’s only what I’ve read up on, Hinton I believe was the other early manor in the area, which stayed in the area most of its life, 

[russell price]

8 hours ago, The Johnster said:

 

I'd suggest that this is a decision to be made as early as possible in the layout-building process, as if you leave it too long, you will have acquired a large number of locomotives that will need to be chipped (and possibly speakered) at once, which will be a big hit to your wallet.  My own layout is DC, and I haven't seriously regretted not going digital.  I do, however, make chuff-chuff noises...

I’ve already got the locos, hence my initial decision to stay DC. It is effectively going to be a double track oval with storage sidings, the goods yard and loco siding so not too complex. That I think is a good reason to stay DC .