Blacker Lane D.P.

[Ruston]

The first draft of a planned new OO layout, based loosely on the National Coal Board Opencast Executive's British Oak Disposal Point at Calder Grove, West Yorkshire.

 

Lorries would bring in coal from local opencast sites and it would be screened and loaded into BR wagons for onward transport. There was also a line to a staithe on the Calder & Hebble Navigation, where barges would be loaded with coal for Ravensthorpe power station.

 

The name of the layout comes from the lane that crossed the NCB line on the level and at the same time passed under the bridge of the former L&Y line between Crigglestone Junction to the south and Horbury Station Junction to the north west.

The exchange sidings will be the FY, which will be reached by a track that goes out of the end of the shed and comes back in under the board under the board with the question mark. The question mark is there because I haven't decided what will be there. A staithe on the Navigation, or a workshop of some sort?

 

 

 

[doilum]

Will it feature Sargent Peppers band of locos?

[Ruston]

It will. I've already got the B4, the Jocko and Pepper's orange and black Austerity that never worked at British Oak, but will work at Blacker Lane. I also have ex-BR 03037 and 08016. The downside is that I ought to have one of those horrible Swindon diesel-hydraulic monstrosities.

 

The layout will also be an excuse to run more colliery engines that don't really suit either of my two existing layouts. I'm sure there will be some weird inter-divisional transfers going on.

[Din]

Workshop and maybe an engine shed? 

 

The one at Cadley Hill in Swadlincote, Derbyshire was a lovely and simple two road affair.

 

Pictures/inspiration here:

 

https://www.28dayslater.co.uk/threads/cadley-hill-colliery-railway-derbyshire-april-1976.66298/

Edited February 8, 2023 by Din

[Ruston]

4 hours ago, Din said:

Workshop and maybe an engine shed? 

The engine shed at BO was near the screens and I am considering having it there, or on the end of that dead end siding to the left of the road. It will be a simple affair, of prefab concrete and corrugated asbestos, or iron as befits an opencast site. I like the idea of a workshop in the question mark area, which would consist of much older brick buildings as if they are the remaining structures on the site of a long since closed deep mine.

 

But if I can make hoppers that discharge, or minerals with working end doors, then I'll have the staithe.

[Barclay]

Looks good but I can't keep up! How many layouts do you have in the pipeline at the moment? By the way my vote would be for a staithe but I appreciate you would want to do it properly, with actual unloading, and that's a big ask...

[Din]

1 hour ago, Barclay said:

Looks good but I can't keep up! How many layouts do you have in the pipeline at the moment? By the way my vote would be for a staithe but I appreciate you would want to do it properly, with actual unloading, and that's a big ask...

 

By my estimates, 5 layouts of various flavour. Sevastapol, Calder Vale, Charlie Stong and Waterylane, Harboro Stone Co, Blacker Lane D.P

 

3 out in the wild with new owners. The little welsh one which I can't pronounce, Bury Thorn and Sons and White Peak Stone and Tarmacadum.

Edited February 9, 2023 by Din

[doilum]

Almost 60 years ago I received a Triang 21 ton hopper wagon that dad had spotted Preloved in the King Charles Model Shop in Leeds. It featured a working bottom door and he quickly had a set of drops built to match. The door might have been a bit out of scale but it worked, the main challenge being to find a load that would flow. Eventually he settled on the black sprue from an Airfix tank wagon kit. This was cut into tiny lumps. I assume that Triang must have sold something similar. 

The challenge lies in finding a product that is heavy enough to flow consistently in 4mm. Older visitors to the Normanton show in the 1980s might recall my attempt at working end door wagons in 7mm. These were loaded with anthracite thàt had been crushed in an industrial roller that could be set up to reduce any type of stone to a predetermined size.( Little brother worked in an industrial laboratory.) Consistency was the key to successful flow. Good luck in the smaller scale, I might still have that wagon!

[Ruston]

1 hour ago, Din said:

 

By my estimates, 5 layouts of various flavour. Sevastapol, Calder Vale, Charlie Stong and Waterylane, Harboro Stone Co, Blacker Lane D.P

 

3 out in the wild with new owners. The little welsh one which I can't pronounce, Bury Thorn and Sons and White Peak Stone and Tarmacadum.

Sevastapol Works is still only an idea and it may not get built at all now. Harboro Stone still needs work to finish it. Royd Hall is to be dismantled and taken away this Sunday and will make way for Blacker Lane. All that exists, so far, of Blacker Lane are these here pixels on a screen. Anything could happen yet.

 

Nant-Y-Mynydd was sold to a new owner and has never reappeared, as far as I am aware. Bury, Thorn & Sons Ltd. is on the exhibition circuit with a new owner from the one that I sold it to and WP has been extended under new ownership. You forgot River Don Works. That one is still around under the ownership of someone else since I sold it.

 

55 minutes ago, doilum said:

Almost 60 years ago I received a Triang 21 ton hopper wagon that dad had spotted Preloved in the King Charles Model Shop in Leeds. It featured a working bottom door and he quickly had a set of drops built to match. The door might have been a bit out of scale but it worked, the main challenge being to find a load that would flow. Eventually he settled on the black sprue from an Airfix tank wagon kit. This was cut into tiny lumps. I assume that Triang must have sold something similar. 

The challenge lies in finding a product that is heavy enough to flow consistently in 4mm. Older visitors to the Normanton show in the 1980s might recall my attempt at working end door wagons in 7mm. These were loaded with anthracite thàt had been crushed in an industrial roller that could be set up to reduce any type of stone to a predetermined size.( Little brother worked in an industrial laboratory.) Consistency was the key to successful flow. Good luck in the smaller scale, I might still have that wagon!

It would be easier to convert hopper wagons than it would to build an end-tipper and also have to convert mineral wagons to having a working end door, but I like the idea of an end-tipper.

[doilum]

Life/ memory is strange. I went and looked for the Triang wagon convinced it was one of the handful of OO items I had hung onto when I accepted an offer from a wet fish monger from Hull for the.whole collection in the late 80s. I did however find a pair of its Hornby descendant that must have come via my late father in law. These have the same trap door mechanism although now in a plastic rather than die cast chassis. PM me if they are of any use.

[Ruston]

I seem to remember that Hansons were the haulage company that brought in coal from the opencast sites. I vaguely remember their green and yellow tippers. I have seen a 1:76 diecast model in Hanson's livery, somewhere but I don't know who produced it. I'd like to get a few, if anyone knows more.

 

[Ruston]

No-one knows who produced the diecast lorries?

 

Anyway...The track plan is being reviewed. The line that is external to the shed will more than likely be scrapped. It has been the cause of trouble on the O gauge layout that occupied the shed and I am keen not to repeat previous mistakes. It will mean a shorter overall run and tight curves on the scenic area but it's a price worth paying.

 

Another lesson learned from the removal of the O gauge layout is not to screw the baseboard frames to the shed walls. When you come to move the layout, nine years after building it, you can't remember how it was put together, where the screws are and so on. This time I will screw a framework to the shed walls to support the baseboards but the baseboards themselves will sit on top of the frame. If they are fixed to the frame at all it will be by means of clips.

 

Another thing that I am giving a lot of thought to is the electrics. Now that Peco have got around to producing a medium radius turnout in code 75 bullhead, these are what the majority of points will be. They are what Peco call Unifrog and have a frog that can be wired live but otherwise it is a dead frog. Points can be connected together at both ends with conductive fishplates and the entirety of the 'blades' are live and each is made from one piece, with no hinge. As all of my locomotives are fitted with Stay Alives, I am seriously considering leaving the frogs dead. It will simplify the wiring as there will be neither microswitches (hassle and especially so when fitted under the baseboard) or frog juicers (expensive!) needed.  All that will be needed in terms of wiring are lengths of copper tape to act as the bus, and droppers from each section of rail.

 

I am even considering flicking the points over by hand. Why bother with expensive point motors, or the hassle of rods under the baseboard when you already have the Big Hand coming down to couple and uncouple wagons? No added wiring, no expense and the ability to position points without regard to the terrain or under-baseboard framing. In a way it's more realistic in operation. It's fine to sit there and play the signalman on a main line layout, where you are operating points and signals remotely as would happen with the prototype, but with many industrial systems there were no signals, no block sections, no facing point locks and the person who actually controlled the points was the shunter or loco fireman pulling on, or kicking over, a point lever.

 

The first thing to do is to tidy up the shed, repaint the walls and buy and lay some carpet tiles to make the place a nicer environment to be in.

[Din]

1 hour ago, Ruston said:

No-one knows who produced the diecast lorries?

 

Only trace I could find is likely produced by a company called Base Toys.

 

I also found a single pic of the Hansons lorry similar to one above with a bit of a googling but when I go through to the flickr account it just takes me back to images of actual trucks, not the model.

[Barclay]

Oxford Diecast did an Atkinson Borderer, but a bit of Googling has failed to find one in that livery.

[doilum]

Perhaps it was from a limited run commissioned by Hansons as promotional gifts to customers or employees?

[Ruston]

1 hour ago, doilum said:

Perhaps it was from a limited run commissioned by Hansons as promotional gifts to customers or employees?

Possibly. The only time I saw them was in the local model shop Going Loco.

[Erichill16]

@fodenwaymay be able to help with the Hansons lorries. Im sure Ive seen one on his display at Barnsley Model Railway  Clubs exhibition. May be decals but it might be a lead . 
Used to see loads of them around Barnsley in the day.

 

[Din]

2 hours ago, Ruston said:

Possibly. The only time I saw them was in the local model shop Going Loco.

 

I am surprised you're not going down the same route as the Shelby Group vehicles, which you did such a stunning job on.

[37114]

Layout sounds a nice plan, I think EFE may have done the Hanson lorry Dave.

[Ruston]

Thanks all. I will probably get any old suitable lorry and paint it. Making my own transfers shouldn't be a problem as the text is in black. I had thought about continuing the Shelby theme but I'm not sure.

 

I have been looking the engines that worked at the real British Oak over the years and there was a total of 22 industrials known to have worked there from the 1940s until closure in 1993. There is photographic evidence of at least one BR Class 08 (that is to say one at the time owned by BR, not an ex-BR engine) and a photo of an ex-L&Y 0-6-0, BR No. 52044 at the site on the RCTS site. The photo shows it with a tender full of coal but not appearing to be in steam, so it isn't likely that it worked a train of empties right in beyond the exchange sidings. 52044 was allocated to Wakefield shed and so it's possible that it was on hire from BR. I like the idea of having a main line 0-6-0 on the layout.

 

I'm not so keen on these things. Two of them worked at British Oak. Picture by Keith Long, on Flickr.

 

 

[03060]

I'm looking forward to seeing this develop, Dave, as like others it is a site that has interested me for quite a while and just maybe, one day, I'll actually get around to doing something about it.

 

I'm sure that you've done your homework on the locos that visited the site but I just thought that I'd post this link to the other Class 08 (other than 08016) that I know visited ... just in case you want a 'fancy' named loco to model and hadn't come across it.

 

https://railscot.co.uk/img/28/81/

 

Unlike you I love the Class 14s in this livery and was most impressed with noise that they make having travelled behind one on the Nene Valley a few years ago, up to then I hadn't paid them much attention. There's certainly a good few locos to be modelled to give some variety to operating sessions, anyway good luck with the project.

 

Regards,

Ian.

[Ruston]

On 15/02/2023 at 23:04, 03060 said:

I'm looking forward to seeing this develop, Dave, as like others it is a site that has interested me for quite a while and just maybe, one day, I'll actually get around to doing something about it.

 

I'm sure that you've done your homework on the locos that visited the site but I just thought that I'd post this link to the other Class 08 (other than 08016) that I know visited ... just in case you want a 'fancy' named loco to model and hadn't come across it.

 

https://railscot.co.uk/img/28/81/

 

Unlike you I love the Class 14s in this livery and was most impressed with noise that they make having travelled behind one on the Nene Valley a few years ago, up to then I hadn't paid them much attention. There's certainly a good few locos to be modelled to give some variety to operating sessions, anyway good luck with the project.

 

Regards,

Ian.

Thanks, Ian. I have seen that one before. That's the one I referred to as being hired from BR. When I first visited the site in 1986 there was no rail traffic and everything seemed to be mothballed. 08016 and 03037 seemed to be parked in the same spots whenever I passed. I remember that they disappeared and there were no locomotives on site. The BR loco must have been brought in before the NCBOE's own Hunslet came in for the last year of operation. I saw the Hunslet working (March 93) and, as far as I know, it was the last loco to work there.

 

HE 7410 at the exchange sidings. These were all laid with hefty flatbottom rail on steel sleepers.

 

 

Below: The line to the staithe on the Navigation curves left immediately at the rear of the locomotive, but had been out of use for some time. The line going straight went to the exchange sidings. The former Midland viaduct is in the background. The locomotive is about to cross the haul road and then Blacker Lane. As far as I know, the level crossing was never gated. At least not in NCB days, although it did have two tracks crossing it in the past.

 

 

 

HE 7410 crossing Blacker Lane on its way back to site. The screens themselves were just around the corner, beyond the brick wall. Beyond the screens was the end of the line, but it wasn't always so. The track bed beyond ran, via a zig-zag, in a cutting, to a pit named Victoria. From there it descended by a rope-worked line to Denby Grange colliery and then back up via another rope-worked incline to descend under the main Wakefield - Huddersfield road to Caphouse colliery (now the National Coalmining Museum for England), where locomotives took over again.

With the track plan having to change to keep everything within the shed I may have a much shortened version of the Midland viaduct and embankment run the width of the shed in order to hide the line to the exchange sidings curving around to the other side of the shed. The line to the staithe will also do the same but will probably thread in and out of the Midland line. I am thinking of not having the staithe and instead having an NCB brickworks. This is to provide different traffic and also as an excuse to have restricted clearances on the line that threads under the Midland line, so it has to be worked by those Pecketts that I chopped down. They can work the brickworks traffic and the normal engines can work the coal traffic.

 

Edited March 4, 2023 by Ruston
Reversed slide and description corrected

[03060]

Frustratingly for me I learn't to drive in 1985/6 and used to visit nearby Healey Mills several times a year armed with my Pentax ME Super ... but I never realised that the British Oak system even existed so no photos or information of my own to offer, I'm afraid. By the time I became interested in Industrial railway sites, inspired by where I live close to the defunct Esholt Sewage Works system and Bylines magazine, I'd missed most of them ! I've managed to gather a bit of information about the site since but only from the usual sources of published articles although I enjoyed a good conversation with Paul Lunn on the telephone during lockdown about it, I think that he has a rather good collection of info on the site.

 

I did manage to walk the dogs around the remains of the BO Staithes area and trackbeds a few years ago just to get a feel for the place .... if only I'd known sooner, oh well, as I said, I look forward to seeing how you develop this.

 

Regards,

Ian.

Edited February 16, 2023 by 03060
More waffle added.

[Dzine]

Hi Folks, Lovely to see British Oak getting the exposure it deserves, it was a great place.  I'm currently working on a micro, entry-level, version of the site with the canal loader on one side, screens on the other and a double sided backscene between.  Hopefully it will have a operating canal loader and screens but there's a lot to do yet.  Kind regards Paul  

[Ruston]

Revised track plan.

The NCB line to the FY will go under the Midland viaduct but I can't get it to do that in the planning software. Having the staithes all depends upon whether or not I can make wagons that can actually discharge their loads. I will experiment with that but right now I am still in the middle of sorting the shed interior out and can't even get to my workbench.