A New England shortline in O Scale

[Dava]

This is the first of two little Christmastime excursions into possible models of US industrial or shortline switching locos which could be suitable and interesting for a line such as GLRR. Included as the available O scale models are rather limited in variety, in view of the cornucopia of prototypes which were available to manufacturers. The first one is a Baldwin 0-4-0T, as an alternative to the ‘docksider’ B+O saddle tank,  the second a modern diesel alternative to the Plymouth.

 

About 30 years ago, I bought a trainset for my younger son, but rather than Hornby we chose a Life-Like Ho American set for a bit more play value. the loco was titled a ‘Lil Tugger’ and it has taken till now to discover a possible prototype:   

Bush Terminal Railroad Baldwin locos.

 

I bought a soft back book on the Brooklyn dockyards railways in New York. One of these was called the Bush terminal. these lines served industries and warehouses in Brooklyn and their railroad cars were shipped via car floats to and from New York and other riverine destinations. All the information on the NY dockyard systems can be found on the comprehensive Trainweb website for which thanks and credit for the information and photo below are due, you can spend hours investigating it. 

http://members.trainweb.com/bedt/indloco/btphotos.html#Bush_Terminal_Railroad_Locomotive_Roster

The 6 locos supplied by Baldwin were all similar, of the  Baldwin 04-30 type. 

They had 44” drivers, the wheelbase I don’t yet know but will estimate about 6 feet. 

 

Southern Methodist University hosts the vast Baldwin locomotive catalogs & drawing archives online, so if you have a spare hour or two to investigate the links you may be lucky and find more dimensions and even a GA drawing of this loco type. 

https://guides.smu.edu/c.php?g=1029481

 

https://s3.smu.edu/cdm/cul/extra/degolyer/rwy/BaldwinManuscripts/mss0061_02_index_purchaser.pdf

 

As for a donor chassis, the Dapol B4 0-4-0T could work….?

Edited December 25, 2023 by Dava
New photo inserted

[F-UnitMad]

And the Plymouth alternative...? 

[Dava]

Just now, F-UnitMad said:

And the Plymouth alternative...? 

 

This will follow in a few days, its taken me a few months just to write this one!

 

[F-UnitMad]

8 minutes ago, Dava said:

 

This will follow in a few days, its taken me a few months just to write this one!

 

Ha ha, no probs mate, just keen to see what similar alternative there is to the old Atlas/Roco Plymouth.

I take it that it's not the equally old, but massively overscale, AHM/Rivarossi 4-wheeler?

 

 

Photos by Ian Holmes of this Parish, & Editor of The Dispatch microlayouts e-magazine.

[Dava]

13 hours ago, F-UnitMad said:

Ha ha, no probs mate, just keen to see what similar alternative there is to the old Atlas/Roco Plymouth.

I take it that it's not the equally old, but massively overscale, AHM/Rivarossi 4-wheeler?

 

 

Photos by Ian Holmes of this Parish, & Editor of The Dispatch microlayouts e-magazine.

 

No Plymouth switcher is required. Some bloke called Nev in Australia buys them all to cut them up so they are quite rare & expensive now.  Much better & more modern idea, more soon if you haven't already guessed what it is.

[F-UnitMad]

3 hours ago, Dava said:

Some bloke called Nev in Australia buys them all to cut them up

He was so kind as to send me a load of the wheelsets, at least half of which didn't have split gears 😁😁👍 .... but yes prices have been going up for them recently.

[Dava]

The second seasonal switcher idea is a diesel, aiming to replace the Atlas Plymouth loco with a modern, accurate & DCC friendly loco for your contemporary shortline. The idea goes back to that Christmas stocking filler loco. Remember Triang transcontinental railways? It featured a ‘Road Switcher’ a gawky bo-bo with a resemblance to a RS1 or possibly RS3. To boost sales of this item, someone had the great idea of engineering a short version with a family resemblance, a neat loco sitting on the same power bogie, and the Yard Switcher/Dock Authority Switcher was born! Who remembers one of those for Christmas?

The real thing was created by Tractive Power Corp, a startup which launched the TP56 + TP70 switchers in 2013. They saw the need to replace older switchers such as EMD SW series, the GE 25-70 tonners and others with modern, powerful and low-emission locos. the prototype appeared, sporting a neat cab and hood assembly on a deck, sitting on the ubiquitous EMD SD40 truck bogie! Adoption has been slow but a TP70 is on trial in the UK to replace some the remaining class 08 shunter fleet.

 

All you need is an O scale SD40 or SD45 powered bogie. This is not as easy or cheap as you might think, unless you have a spare SD40/45 you’re prepared to sacrifice. Surely someone makes the bogie frames or could 3D print them?

 

The whole loco is an ideal 3D print project, but best to check whether TPC will agree to release the model design rights before marketing. There is an N scale version on Shapeways, but not currently for sale.

 

The drawing and dimensions are on the data sheet. The Dapol class 66 could be a donor for UK 1/43 scale versions, but too long for 1/48. However the class 52 bogie is the right wheelbase for a 1/48 scaledonor.

13’7” bogie wbase,  3”3/8 or 86mm in US O scale 94mm in UK O scale, 40” wheel 7/8”

https://www.tractivepowercorp.com/our_technology/specification-sheets/

 

 

 

 

I dont know about you, but I’d like one of these!

[stivesnick]

Good to see the prototype following modelling practice and using a fomer diesel bogie for a switching loco. Does anyone know what happened to the loco that was shipped to the UK?

 

Nick 

[Dava]

2 hours ago, stivesnick said:

Good to see the prototype following modelling practice and using a fomer diesel bogie for a switching loco. Does anyone know what happened to the loco that was shipped to the UK?

 

Nick 

There was rail media coverage in Summer 2022, the loco was at Long Marston for trials, quiet since then but the spotters grapevine would probably know if it’s still in UK. No news of an order placed by Rail Support Services.
http://www.tractivepowercorp.com/2022/08/09/rail-media-news-in-the-united-kingdom-with-rrss-tp70/

[F-UnitMad]

4 hours ago, Dava said:

All you need is an O scale SD40 or SD45 powered bogie. This is not as easy or cheap as you might think, unless you have a spare SD40/45 you’re prepared to sacrifice.

Indeed!! Atlas did the SD40, but spares availability for most of their locos is now dire to non-existant. The vertical can motor would need changing to fit in the low hood, too.

I'd seen those prototype photos before, it's an intriguing idea for a model, certainly.

 

Must admit I was thinking when I posted the Atlas-vs-AHM pictures that maybe there was a small diesel switcher available in O that I'd missed! Not including the 3-rail RMT 'Beep', of course....

 

[Nortonville Phil]

This guy on EBay makes a coarse O kit for a Republic Locomotive Works loco.

 

it is very similar and was also built on an SD truck( bogie).

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/115950155585?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=Q0q5x321Rpm&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=cxSaBtx8R5G&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

His kit is made to fit on the Beep chassis. One of my club mates here in Dallas is building a McKeen motor car at the moment from one of the bodies produced by this same seller. Much body smoothing was needed.

 

P. Randall

Dallas Texas

Edited December 28, 2023 by Nortonville Phil
Spelling

[Nortonville Phil]

6 hours ago, Dava said:

All you need is an O scale SD40 or SD45 powered bogie. This is not as easy or cheap as you might think, unless you have a spare SD40/45 you’re prepared to sacrifice. Surely someone makes the bogie frames or could 3D print them?

 

The whole loco is an ideal 3D print project, but best to check whether TPC will agree to release the model design rights before marketing. There is an N scale version on Shapeways, but not currently for sale.

 

The drawing and dimensions are on the data sheet. The Dapol class 66 could be a donor for UK 1/43 scale versions, but too long for 1/48. However the class 52 bogie is the right wheelbase for a 1/48 scaledonor.

13’7” bogie wbase,  3”3/8 or 86mm in US O scale 94mm in UK O scale, 40” wheel 7/8”

Maybe look for a pair of the diecast metal side frames from the 1970s 80s’ Lionel SD40. You might turn up a set on EBay or put in a “Want add” for a pair on the US O Gauge Railroading forum.

 

P. Randall

Edited December 28, 2023 by Nortonville Phil
SIC

[Dava]

26 minutes ago, Nortonville Phil said:

Maybe look for a pair of the diecast metal side frames from the 1970s 80s’ Lionel SD40. You might turn up a set on EBay or put in a “Want add” for a pair on the US O Gauge Railroading forum.

 

P. Randall

Thanks Phil,

useful ideas! The KMM kit & RMT Beep sadly aren't readily available here in UK, import is costly & after converting to 2 rail probably better to build or commission a 2-rail chassis. 

[Nortonville Phil]

6 minutes ago, Dava said:

Thanks Phil,

useful ideas! The KMM kit & RMT Beep sadly aren't readily available here in UK, import is costly & after converting to 2 rail probably better to build or commission a 2-rail chassis. 

Dava,

 

Yes the KMM kit would need a proper three axle chassis built. Perhaps a piece of C section channel would be a starting point. Or perhaps an Atlas Plymouth chassis could be made to work. Also one might scratch build the body for one of these from plasticard. Most surfaces look to be flat..One could even cut a representation of the bogie side frames from card as well. I look forward to hearing more of your plans.

 

Phil

 

 

Edited December 28, 2023 by Nortonville Phil

[F-UnitMad]

7 hours ago, Nortonville Phil said:

This guy on EBay makes a coarse O kit for a Republic Locomotive Works loco.

 

it is very similar and was also built on an SD truck( bogie).

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/115950155585?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=Q0q5x321Rpm&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=cxSaBtx8R5G&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

His kit is made to fit on the Beep chassis. One of my club mates here in Dallas is building a McKeen motor car at the moment from one of the bodies produced by this same seller. Much body smoothing was needed.

 

P. Randall

Dallas Texas

Not only is the RMT Beep not "abundantly available" in the UK, this kit itself also carries the dreaded ebay tag-line that hampers so much of our ability to model American O Scale trains in the UK....

It's even helpfully highlighted by Ebay in the listing. 🙄🤷‍♂️

"Does not ship to United Kingdom". 

 

🤬🤬🤬🤬 C'mon, guys, there's more potential market out here than just the Lower 48..!!!! 

[Dava]

This is how Grand Lake looks at the moment, 2 x G&H boards on their sides! The cabinetmakers dowels are fitted between the boards and two of the wood dowel rods operating the turnouts, they just need the polarity switches fitted. No point motors required as all four (not five now) are close together. Just one turnout left to assemble now. 
There will be a single-vehicle traverser in the top left section. The ply for this is on the table, free offcut from B&Q yesterday. I could build a microlayout with the offcuts I’ve collected from there, but this isn’t it!

 

This post is a bit descriptive so I’ll add a wintry scene of a small New England (milk churn?) freighthouse, Boston &Maine I think. I’m rounding up buildings for the layout, There are kits to build but some temporary ones will appear at Mickleover.
 

[Keith Addenbrooke]

Must admit that freight house does cry out to be modelled - lovely photo!  Happy new year: looking forwards to seeing how the project develops through 2024, Keith.

[Dava]

This evening I completed the fourth turnout from the rail parts obtained from a stateside modeller, these are seen In the view below, approximately in position. They will be controlled by my dowel rod system which also switches the current via a wafer switch, and I aim to have working switch stand indicators as well, when I find one I can build.

I want to thank Jim Snowdon for his excellent 7mm Scale Society 31.5 mm gauge track gauges, they make accurate pointwork much easier for people like me.

I aim to have the part built layout at the Trent Valley Group Open Day on 27 January, with a section operating and examples of structures and rolling stock. I think Rick is there also to represent the Society. Please call by, it’s the same weekend as the GCR Winter Gala which has a US built loco - a S160 US Army 2-8-0.

 

Edited January 3 by Dava
spelling

[Dava]

Last weekend saw the temporary track on Grand Lake removed so that the baseboards could be separated and the tops glued in place, which i had neglected to do earlier. One top had a 30 x 30 cm section removed to house the traverser. This serves two sidings and the ‘back road’, allowing a loco to run round short trains or to visit the otherwise inaccessible ‘back road’.

 

I also laid cork underlay on the track bed areas, benefiting from icy fresh air whilst the Evil-stick fumes pervaded the workshop. I had planned to use drawer runners for the traverser slides but there is insufficient room. I planned a ply structure with dowel runners instead, and sourced 9mm dowel and ply offcuts on a visit to B&Q last week. The traverser bed and deck were built over the weekend, installed and just require final levelling of the deck, fitting a wire handle [operation is manual], wiring and a vital end wall to prevent overshunts onto the floor! The length will allow 40’ cars and the longest locos I have, the B&O C16As.

 

I can now start to relay the pointwork, then the connected track work and wire these up, with a running section ready, I hope, for the Mickleover event on 27 Jan.

 

 

 

 

[Dava]

I’ve spent time over the weekend an past few evenings working on Grand Lake. The group of four turnouts are in place and aligned. They just need work under the baseboard to fit the wafer switches and complete wiring, then test them for shorts. Some of the track will be laid next weekend to enable demo running at Mickleover on 27 Jan. 

 

The track is hybrid, with Paxolin ties for gauge and the rest in stripwood to fill in will be added later. I even have spikes, but maybe not the patience and eyesight to use them!

 

[Dava]

I have been testing the turnouts on Grand Lake , prior to finally wiring the switches and the starting to lay the plain running lines this weekend.

Here the 45 tonner and mixed stock is on a test train. 
 

[Dava]

I’ve made good  progress on Grand Lake this weekend. The 4 turnouts all have working control rode, wafer switches & wiring. Also there is a complete & operational line of rails from one end to the other. I’m completing the wiring needed for this stage, basically plugs & sockets. That will be it for Mickleover next Saturday. 

Most of the sidings, the traverser, buildings and scenic work won’t be done. There will be a few temporary railroad buildings. No photos for now and my back is sore from working on it!  
 

Here is a rotating switch stand signal, I need to make 4 of these (there were many different types). I think I’ve worked out how to make them operate. 
 

Dava

 

Edited January 21 by Dava
Insert photo

[Dava]

Tracklaying and wiring have continued on Grand Lake Railroad. This evening, a first train paused at the depot with its new nameboard. The layout will be at the Trent Valley 7mm NGA event at Mickleover on Saturday, swing by if you’re in the area.

[Dava]

Yesterday saw a live trial for Grand Lake at the Trent Valley Group event at Mickleover, thanks to the hardworking organiser’s & catering providers for hosting.

 

On the rare occasions I have a new layout, it usually debuts at TVG, so that we can find out what doesn’t work, in a friendly and unstressed setting.

 

So Grand Lake was in bareboard unfinished state. It performed with both DC and DCC during the day, DCC giving slower running but DC allowing the steam locos an outing later on.  I now have a list of tasks to improve running before scenic work starts. Thanks to all who called by for a chat.

 

[Andrew Young]

Thanks for coming David. Was great to see you and your new project. 
 

Cheers

Andrew