Trying this Exhibiting Malarkey

[puffernutter]

Hi guys,

 

I figured this is a slightly separate topic to my quandary about uncoupling in N gauge causing a crisis of confidence in my own little layout - but I do have a bigger general question. Now finally having a car, and if not the burning desire at least the facility to create an exhibition layout - I would like to give it a go before I write it off as one of those things that 'I don't fancy'.

 

With that in mind, I'd like to exhibit a layout I can also use at home - especially if I only ever go to one exhibition with it! Ha!

 

So here are my questions:

 

1/ Does anyone have experience with 'operating from the front' style layouts at exhibitions? I would imagine blocking a section of your own layout would be disadvantageous.

2/ For a one or two person band, is there scope while exhibiting to actually have an operating session, or is it a case of simply running trains on the loop while chatting?

3/ How does one actually get invited to present their layout at an exhibition?

 

Thanks all!

[ColinW]

Hi guys,

 

I figured this is a slightly separate topic to my quandary about uncoupling in N gauge causing a crisis of confidence in my own little layout - but I do have a bigger general question. Now finally having a car, and if not the burning desire at least the facility to create an exhibition layout - I would like to give it a go before I write it off as one of those things that 'I don't fancy'.

 

With that in mind, I'd like to exhibit a layout I can also use at home - especially if I only ever go to one exhibition with it! Ha!

 

So here are my questions:

 

1/ Does anyone have experience with 'operating from the front' style layouts at exhibitions? I would imagine blocking a section of your own layout would be disadvantageous.

2/ For a one or two person band, is there scope while exhibiting to actually have an operating session, or is it a case of simply running trains on the loop while chatting?

3/ How does one actually get invited to present their layout at an exhibition?

 

Thanks all!

Hi in response to your questions here are some of my thoughts,

 

1. If operating from front, why not use hand held controllers on wandering cables and operate from the sides. This will allow people to continue to view your layout without interupption.

 

2. It would be better to have had several running sessions in private so that you know what you are going to run, especially if developing a sequence for your layout. I find it can be rather annoying to see a well built layout being operated like a trainset, as in just having trains running round without stopping or being changed.

 

3. Do you belong to a local club or know of someone in a local club that hold their own exhibition, you may be able to display it there to begin with. I know some clubs may be happy to accept layouts without viewing it first, but it is not always the norm.

 

Hope this helps

 

Colin

[Kenton]

1. This type of layout operation requires a bit of showmanship (a bit more than the hiding operator type of layout). You are very accessible to the public and they will take advantage of that (IMO a good thing) You will get more questions and have more chance to get involved. If you are a shrinking violet don't do it.

It can be done with all types of layout, not just the short plank. But beware your concentration on things operational (time tables, difficult shunting, problem solving) will get in the way. You will probably only be obscuring the fiddle yard so don't worry about getting in the way.

Of course there are some layouts where an air of mystery is part of the scene - so it possibly does not suit every layout.

 

2. You will never manage a whole show on your own - you need breaks. As the amount of interaction with the public increases the chances of operating a specific sequence of running will decrease. Of course the more operators you have the better. But from the perspective of a punter the worst thing is to see an operator "avoiding" the public questions.

 

3. There is still only one way (sadly) join a club.

You could of course take many photos and post them on RMWeb. Quite a few show "talent" spotters are members. If the layout is really outstanding it may just pick up an invite based on images alone. You could seek out the organiser of your local show but they are unlikely to give time or any interest without you joining their club. It is partly understandable - for a first time show you are a big risk to them - the whole point of a MRS is to entertain the public, to get the public to spend money with the trade and to get the public to return the following year having enjoyed the previous year thus adding door receipts to the club's funds. Getting to exhibit at a show with a average or above average layout is very difficult. Like so many things getting a foot in the door is the most difficult task - once you have a reputation you will get asked to more shows than you can handle and the association with a specific club is less important.

Unfortunately the way some clubs are run and operate makes them a no-go area for some - and that is if can find one convenient to your time and location in the first place.

[Glorious NSE]

1/ Does anyone have experience with 'operating from the front' style layouts at exhibitions? I would imagine blocking a section of your own layout would be disadvantageous.

 

Depends a lot on how it's done and how it's presented, as Colin says, if it's a smaller layout is the side an option? If it's a larger layout then i'd suggest not a problem (no matter how wide your guest operator is he's not going to obliterate 20' of layout)

 

2/ For a one or two person band, is there scope while exhibiting to actually have an operating session, or is it a case of simply running trains on the loop while chatting?

 

One of the most contentious issues out there I think!

 

I have run across folk who would say that if no trains have moved (in front of their nose, the rest of the layout doesn't count) in the three nanoseconds they have been standing there then you're not doing your job right, and they have a RIGHT to see trains moved as they have PAID their £3.50 to get in and you got in for free don't you know!

 

Whilst seeing trains (moving ones too!) is one of the points of an exhibition, personally I go there to get idea's and part of that is to see the layouts and how they operate.

 

Watching a layout where all the operators are doing is furiously moving trains for the sake of it tells me nothing in terms of the "story" of what your bit of the railway exists for? So, personally, how you run is integral to conveying the story of the prototype. In short I reckon you should operate it how you want to operate it.

 

You'll probably get somebody along in a sec telling you "what people want" at an exhibition, but the truth is that the crowd at an exhibition tends to be a mix unless it's a specialist show, and that family coming in for some entertainment wants something totally different to that serious enthusiast, who wants something totally different to the occasional hobbyist - you will not please all these "markets".

 

Do what you enjoy, and it's pretty likely that there will be a few others out there who also enjoy what you enjoy. That's the point of this for me, not an artificially inflated "trains per hour" figure.

 

3/ How does one actually get invited to present their layout at an exhibition?

 

As Colin says, first up, contact your local club.

 

 

[puffernutter]

Right guys, that's some good food for thought - many thanks!

[Glorious NSE]

I think Kenton's being a little on the negative side, my experience is that most clubs would be interested in a good quality local (i.e. cheap!) layout for their show that's never been seen before, and most clubs local shows are happy to include layouts from folk that aren't members of their club.

 

The difficulty is that the normal place for seeing layouts and getting a feel for whether they are popular and whether they work is at a show, so getting that first invite or invites is the hard part. Yes, club layouts do have an advantage here as they are "known" to the club already but it doesn't follow that you will never be invited to anything unless you're "in".

 

So - contact your local club and find out who organises the show. Send them info of the layout (if this thread is all theoretical i'd suggest not doing that till you have something to show for it!) including photo's, if it's do-able offer to give them a dry run (ask if you can take it to them on a club night, or could the exhibition manager come to you?)

 

As Colin says most show managers will not take a layout from an unknown source sight unseen, so that first step is quite a large one and is also an important one.

 

 

 

 

[halfwit]

As has been said above, post some photos of the layout, at all stages of the build, on here. Then you could perhaps offer it as a display at the next members day. This could be a good way of getting onto the circuit and supporting RMWeb at the same time.

[LNERandBR]

Here are my thoughts:

 

1) When operating from the front there's more chance for the operator to chat to the public. You'll be more inviting for conversation. Just try to not let operations stop whylst chatting though (see point 2).

As an Exhibition Manager I find this type of layout often won't require any rear operating space at all. This allows them to be pushed back against walls or gives other layouts that little bit more room at the rear. They are more flexable then those which ask for three or four foot at the rear.

 

2) In my mind the aim of an exhibition layout is to keep something happening. People come to the show to see something running. Therefore you should definatly treat it as a full operating session. I think the design of the layout is the most important. Keeping something happening is easier if you've got alot to do. I understand what Glorious NSE is saying but think of the general public more then fellow modellers. You're more likely to be invited to a small show that's going to rely more on local people attending. They've come to see trains and don't usially understand anything about a story of the layout or such.

 

If you want to keep things prototypical then run a sequence. Ensure the public can see a version of the sequence cards. You might not keep to the timeings dispalyed on the cards but it gives more purpose to what's happening.

 

However as it's been said before it's your layout so run it as you like.

 

Make sure you give the layout a thorough test before the show. You'll have an eaiser weekend if there are no problems. Although sometimes the stresses of travelling can affect a layout. Trust me I've been there.

 

As for the operators, always have one extra operator then what's needed to run the layout. This allows you to have breaks and gives someone the public can easially speak to as they won't be concentrating on anything. However don't bring too many operators either, I know what Kenton means but from a organisers point of view, more operators mean more mouthes to feed and possibly put up in accomidation.

 

3) I'd recommend finding out where your local clubs are and going along to a club night or their show. Get a feel for how it's run and how big it is. The smaller clubs might be more welcoming for the first time exhibitor then the big professional one's. A smaller club might be happier to alow you to attend for the first time without joining.

 

The Boston MRS is small and therefore we have a small show. We struggle for local layouts to attend. This means bringing layouts from further afiled and therefore inccuring extra costs in expcences and accomidation. I'm very happy to invite local layouts to the show. Even if they aren't members.

 

Overall it depends on the size of club and size of the show. The small local club might be more happy to have you exhibit for the first time then the big professional one.

 

To increase chances of getting invited to shows you should create a small leaflet with all the layout's information: Contact details, Size, Operating space required, and the like. If you can quote an amount for expecnes per mile then that would help the exhibition manager budget. Include some good photographs of the layout, The better it looks the more likely it is to be invited.

 

As a unknown first time attender you'll be less desirable then other layouts. Therefore you could find yourself on the reserve list not the attending list. Therefoe be prepaired to be asked to attend at short notice. Layouts sometimes drop out, often at very short notice. This leaves exhibition managers with a space to fill and not alot of time to fill it. It's not a nice feeling when holes start appearing in your carefully prepaired hall plan with less then a month to go.

[cromptonnut]

Some of the best layouts i've seen have operation from both front and rear.

 

There's the big 'roundy roundy' layout with fiddle yard at back, as normal, with one or two operators at the back keeping things going to either a timetable, a sequence, or "whatever they feel like". At the front is one person with the little hand-held controller, operating a freight yard or something "self contained" and talking to people where it doesn't matter if they stop operating for a few minutes, because there's still "main line stuff" going on to keep the rest of the punters interested.

 

I know that, if there's just one of you, it's not easy to do both - but if you are part of a club, it's something worth thinking about.

 

DCC operation, where you can plug controllers in anywhere, and easily hand over from yard to main, makes this all even easier.

[Glorious NSE]

I understand what Glorious NSE is saying but think of the general public more then fellow modellers. You're more likely to be invited to a small show that's going to rely more on local people attending. They've come to see trains and don't usially understand anything about a story of the layout or such.

 

Don't want to go off at too much of a tangent, but if one of the points of the excercise is to share our hobby then operating it properly (if that's what somebody does) is surely a better (more accurate?) way of presenting their hobby than just driving a train back and forth/round and round because somebody is watching you. I wouldn't encourage anyone to "dumb down" their operation just because the viewers might not understand, it might even spur a question or two or make folk think this hobby is more than a bit of track with a train going round in circles on it!

 

FWIW i'm not at all advocating big enforced gaps, or strict real-time timetables (it's 3.30 and on Saturdays there were no more trains till 6pm so i'm going home ) - but I think being true to what you're trying to model is fairly important.

 

You do raise an important point though that the invites are down to the show organiser, and he is the one who should know what his market is and whether your layout is likely to appeal to that or not.

 

But even at the smallest show I would expect there would be the space to have layouts that appealed to more than one visitor type.

[Kenton]

operating it properly (if that's what somebody does) is surely a better (more accurate?) way of presenting their hobby than just driving a train back and forth/round and round because somebody is watching you. I wouldn't encourage anyone to "dumb down" their operation just because the viewers might not understand, it might even spur a question or two or make folk think this hobby is more than a bit of track with a train going round in circles on it!

I would agree completely a layout having purpose is far better than a trainset but I've seen some pretty ridiculous extremes with nothing running simply because the "timetable" says so - Is anyone going to model a Sunday service on a run-down yard where nothing operated all day ... true the onlooker can admire the stock and its scene, the weathering and the representation of the weeds and peeling paint. Is this just as bad as a endless circling loco + 3 coaches often unmatched and inappropriate.

I have always thought the role of the exhibitor is not only to show off their modelling skills but to be proactive in trying to pass that information to others. Some of the best "value for money" layouts have been those where the operator actively encourages questions and interaction. They are usually the ones I will stand watching the longest as I feel that the effort needs to be put in by both parties. The worst are those where the operator hides away or makes any question appear trivial and unwanted.

[Guest jim s-w]

 

3. There is still only one way (sadly) join a club.

 

Its a way yes but its far from the only one way.

 

Get yourself a little portfolio, go the shows and ask to see the exhibition organiser. Have an idea of how many operators you need and how much the layout will cost (van hire + fuel) and ask them if they would like you to bring your layout to their show. Be perpaired to invite them to your house to see the layout first.

 

I am a member of 2 societies but not a club. I get invites all the time and only a few come through the societies. Get out there, get known and someone will invite you to their show, provided the layout is good enough.

 

Cheers

 

Jim

[Dagworth]

Its a way yes but its far from the only one way.

 

Get yourself a little portfolio, go the shows and ask to see the exhibition organiser. Have an idea of how many operators you need and how much the layout will cost (van hire + fuel) and ask them if they would like you to bring your layout to their show. Be perpaired to invite them to your house to see the layout first.

 

I am a member of 2 societies but not a club. I get invites all the time and only a few come through the societies. Get out there, get known and someone will invite you to their show, provided the layout is good enough.

 

Cheers

 

Jim

 

As Jim says, it's not the only route. I've not been a member of a club for about 20 years now. This site (RMWeb) is a pretty good way to get your layout seen by plenty of exhibition managers, if the layout is worthy of being seen then invites will come.

 

Andi

[Penlan]

First thing to remember is a show day can be 7 - 8 hours long, very few people operate their layouts at home more than an hour or two. Any mistakes, derailments, etc., at home, they happen, you move on and then go to the pub or something, at an exhibition there's still a long time before you can stop and attend to faults.......

 

Although there are some layouts that I've seen with only one operator (Wheal Elizabeth springs to mind), they do need breaks - thus 'back in 10 mins' signs.... Two operatives is a minimum. If there's only you, how are you going to have time to look at other layouts, buy essential bits and pieces (you never knew you wanted!!!), go for a pee, chat to mates ....

 

Like jim s-w, I'm not a member of any club, but I get invited because I've asked the organisers if I can exhibit at their shows (and they have seen/heard about the layout), plus a portfolio and past history of exhibiting over 40 years - this has got me the bookings (we are now booked two shows a year to the end of 2014).

 

I would recommend you start with a local, low key show, that will quickly show up both your AND the layout's unknown faults/omissions before you go big-time.

 

Don't forget presentation (front material to cover between the layout and 6" above the floor) and any lighting needed, plus supply cable(s) etc., etc. It might look good at home, out in the middle of a hall is a whole different ball game. If you have a local village hall, try erecting and taking it down in there a couple of times, that may show up some problems with connectors both electrical and baseboards etc., plus putting the layout etc., into and out of the car - It won't cost much to hire the hall for half-a-day.

 

Time to erect/dismantle a single operator layout, 10 - 15 mins, any longer, think/worry about it.

My 31', 9 board layout and ancillaries takes about 45 mins to pack up with three of us, a couple of hours to set up by myself.

 

Edit - Might take longer to erect a single operator layout, let's say < half hour

[Dagworth]

First thing to remember is a show day can be 7 - 8 hours long, very few people operate their layouts at home more than an hour or two. Any mistakes, derailments, etc., at home happen, you move on and then go to the pub or something, at an exhibition there's still a long time before you can stop and attend to faults.......

To me now* that is the wrong way to approach a problem. Better to stop the layout for a few minutes, deal with the problem and then enjoy the rest of the day than to struggle through until closing time and your layout not be seen at its best.

 

*having made that mistake...

 

Andi

[Kenton]

I get invites all the time and only a few come through the societies.

Jim, although I accept the pro-active touting of one's layout at a show is an alternative, I would guess that you recieve invites off the back of having already got yourself past the "first" show. Once on the circuit and you are known in both person and for the standard of your layout then you will get further invites without the "promotion" of a club.

 

I've not been a member of a club for about 20 years now. This site (RMWeb) is a pretty good way to get your layout seen by plenty of exhibition managers, if the layout is worthy of being seen then invites will come.

Just as I said in my post in fact.

But I did forget the open days (not having been to one)

 

The big advantage of a local club and a local show is that even a "not so spectacular" layout can often get a viewing (we all start somewhere) and there are usually plenty of old hands to help/offer to help.

[Penlan]

To me now* that is the wrong way to approach a problem. Better to stop the layout for a few minutes, deal with the problem and then enjoy the rest of the day than to struggle through until closing time and your layout not be seen at its best.

 

*having made that mistake...Andi

Sorry Dagworth, my mistake, I agree with you, bad (very) wording on my part....

When I think of the panics I've had over the years...........

 

Perhaps I should have left as ...

First thing to remember is a show day can be 7 - 8 hours long,

very few people operate their layouts at home more than an hour or two.

[Mike Bellamy]

As has been said above, post some photos of the layout, at all stages of the build, on here. Then you could perhaps offer it as a display at the next members day. This could be a good way of getting onto the circuit and supporting RMWeb at the same time.

 

Lots of good advice has already been given and as I organised the Members' Day at Derby on Saturday, I should just like to pick up on Paul's comment above. I had lots of room and could have fitted in another 4 or 5 small layouts. As it was an informal meeting rather than a proper exhibition we had 3 layouts that were all in various stages of completion. By coincidence they were all different scales/gauges and I had placed them all in the same room but it didn't matter as it gave our (very) few visitors chance to see them properly and ask questions - perhaps more importantly it gave the operators chance to run their layout in public but without any pressure. When ever and where ever the next Members' Day is, come along, bring your layout and most importantly - enjoy yourself

 

Mike