Restaurant car servicing

[smyles1]

Please can anyone tell me how restaurant cars were cleaned and restocked at the end of a journey. Were they shunted to a special place or what? Suppose a restaurant car has arrived at the terminus in an excursion train in the late 50s. It will not be used again until the following day. The train can't stay at the platforms. Where does a restaurant car go to be sorted out ready for use in another train? Were restaurant cars left permanently in a set of coaches or were they attached to trains as required?

Thanks for your help,

Mike

[Coombe Barton]

In Great Western Journal no 12 (Oct 94) there was an article detailing how Kitchen Cars were marshalled, staffed and serviced. 300 miles away from my copy at the moment so can't give any more detail

[davep101]

how long ago are you talking?

[Coombe Barton]

how long ago are you talking?

OP says late 50s in original post

[davep101]

i think its bed time lol

[The Stationmaster]

Please can anyone tell me how restaurant cars were cleaned and restocked at the end of a journey. Were they shunted to a special place or what? Suppose a restaurant car has arrived at the terminus in an excursion train in the late 50s. It will not be used again until the following day. The train can't stay at the platforms. Where does a restaurant car go to be sorted out ready for use in another train? Were restaurant cars left permanently in a set of coaches or were they attached to trains as required?

Thanks for your help,

Mike

 

As far as the Western was concerned the cars for the Summer Saturday services from Paddington tended to be stable all over the place as there was no space for them in the London area. Putting it very simply they were 'collected' by a variety of ecs workings on Thursday/early Friday and worked up to Old Oak Common where they were formed into a single train which was then worked to Platform 1A at Paddington and the cars were stocked there before going back to Old Oak to be marshalled into their train. They were usually destocked in either the platform, if there was time, or in a reverse of the stocking process. The practice of bringing diners up 1A for stocking or de-stocking continued in the mid 1960s and was going on regularly, but not in such large numbers, when I worked at Paddington in 1965.

 

Western heavy cleaning of cars was done at Old Oak (not sure if anywhere else had suitable facilities?) and in this case unless the set they were in was stopped for a big exam the car was shunted out and ideally put on the blocks on a road in the 'old' section of the carriage shed (the bit nearest the mainlines). The car was then totally stripped of any removable metalwork (note 'removable', not 'dismantable'!) in the cooking and preparation areas and this stuff was then cleaned in hot 'baths' in a solution of caustic soda before being hot rinsed clean of chemicals and restored to the car, which in the meanwhile had undergone a heavy interior clean and a heavy exterior hand cleaning which included the backs (backs = coach ends in Old Oak cleaning parlance). I might somewhere have a copy of the times allowed for at least some of the cleaning but I think it meant a car being out of service for at least two days, possibly three, and in some cases I'm fairly sure that some of the removable stuff was exchanged via a pool of equipment.

 

Linen could be dealt with at either Old Oak or Paddington but latterly I think was only handled at Old Oak - by the 1950s I would think it might possibly be going to Willesden laundry although that might not have come in until later?

[great central]

As far as the Western was concerned the cars for the Summer Saturday services from Paddington tended to be stable all over the place as there was no space for them in the London area. Putting it very simply they were 'collected' by a variety of ecs workings on Thursday/early Friday and worked up to Old Oak Common where they were formed into a single train which was then worked to Platform 1A at Paddington and the cars were stocked there before going back to Old Oak to be marshalled into their train. They were usually destocked in either the platform, if there was time, or in a reverse of the stocking process. The practice of bringing diners up 1A for stocking or de-stocking continued in the mid 1960s and was going on regularly, but not in such large numbers, when I worked at Paddington in 1965.

 

Western heavy cleaning of cars was done at Old Oak (not sure if anywhere else had suitable facilities?) and in this case unless the set they were in was stopped for a big exam the car was shunted out and ideally put on the blocks on a road in the 'old' section of the carriage shed (the bit nearest the mainlines). The car was then totally stripped of any removable metalwork (note 'removable', not 'dismantable'!) in the cooking and preparation areas and this stuff was then cleaned in hot 'baths' in a solution of caustic soda before being hot rinsed clean of chemicals and restored to the car, which in the meanwhile had undergone a heavy interior clean and a heavy exterior hand cleaning which included the backs (backs = coach ends in Old Oak cleaning parlance). I might somewhere have a copy of the times allowed for at least some of the cleaning but I think it meant a car being out of service for at least two days, possibly three, and in some cases I'm fairly sure that some of the removable stuff was exchanged via a pool of equipment.

 

Linen could be dealt with at either Old Oak or Paddington but latterly I think was only handled at Old Oak - by the 1950s I would think it might possibly be going to Willesden laundry although that might not have come in until later?

 

 

Given the present day obsession with hygiene and cleanliness, perfectly correct of course, the above seems incredible.

Not surprising we have trains infessted with fleas at times, I even heard about cockroaches in a buffet some time ago

Today a quick wipe and spray with some magic potion seems to be deemed enough

[coachmann]

Please can anyone tell me how restaurant cars were cleaned and restocked at the end of a journey.

Eight years ago one could have put this question to David Jenkinson and before long he would have published his researches in 'Backtrack'. Such diligent people in this hobby are a dying breed unfortunately.

 

There is no shortage of information on Diagram, Lot numbers, designs and construction procedures covering the Big Four and BR dining vehicles, but an article on how such coaches were prepared for use and how they were dealt with afterwards would make for interesting reading. I wonder if this has been dealt with in an LMS Society magazine?

 

Larry

[The Stationmaster]

Given the present day obsession with hygiene and cleanliness, perfectly correct of course, the above seems incredible.

Not surprising we have trains infessted with fleas at times, I even heard about cockroaches in a buffet some time ago

Today a quick wipe and spray with some magic potion seems to be deemed enough

 

 

A big change has come about through the obsession with 'safety' (which in many respects nowadays seems to mean for many employers etc 'safety from prosecution because some idiot fell over their own feet'). Thus lots of materials and processes which were once used quite cheerfully and with good effect are now banned or so 'toned-down' their effectiveness is limited.

 

Example hand-applied BR Exmover (a soluble compound based mainly on oxalic acid) was superb for cleaning coaches if properly applied and quickly rinsed. Once it was available BR GIC (General interior Cleaner, more or less chemically a stronger version of Fairy Liquid) was superb for cleaning down Exmover and - again subject to proper rinsing - left a super finish adding a nice shine to a coach body (although GIC was not meant to be used for exterior cleaning).

 

But Exmover was quite nasty if it came into contact with human skin so the solution was officially made ever more dilute while GIC was probably toned-down a bit as it could leave bare hands rather on the red side. Once privatised cleaning came along they used less effective but safer (and cheaper)chemicals and all strictly in accordance with the data sheets to avoid being taken to court by some fool who spilt stuff over themselves.

 

It's the way of our modern world I'm afraid.

[robertcwp]

Here is the Summer 1961 dining car train from the WR carriage workings:

 

 

Z indicates BR Standard Stock. B is brake end leading. A is brake end trailing. § indicates gangway adapter fitted.