Il Grifone Posted December 19, 2011 Author Share Posted December 19, 2011 These would be the later chassis with the thicker crankpins, which suffer less from the problem, though not immune - the coupling rods are only plated brass. Some of these have the pins peened over on the inside of the wheel however and are pigs to sort out - the wheels have to come off. The early ones have a very thin crankpin* and thinner rods. This method would undoubtedly still work, but there is very little metal to work with. I did do one with washers soldered on top of the rods, which worked well but looked messy. * These are just a plain pin, not splined, and around half the diameter of the later version. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted January 8, 2012 Author Share Posted January 8, 2012 I found a few more photos from just before the layout was dismantled. It never got beyond the stage of just trying things in place. Some of the buildings never got their windows fitted and the dip in the boards visible in the photo (next to the yellow lorry at a strange angle) never got repaired. (Damage caused by a box falling on the layout. ) The 'West Country' Station (the other was 'London') Part of the village. (Built in the cupboard that hid the main line return.) The junction between the station road and village road. The other end of the station. Sorry about the picture quality (I've since upgraded camera). There are a few more, but I won't inflict these unless asked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted January 9, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2012 More please - photo quality doesn't matter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted January 9, 2012 Author Share Posted January 9, 2012 As requested... The level crossing and the other side Waiting for the train. The road junction from above The station entrance. Station Road. Filling the corner (the buildings on the back scene had slipped, but hadn't come out as well as expected). A visitor from abroad (Jouef and Lima). Across the yard to the branch station. SWMBO insisted on this one (and gave me the Preiser figures. My daughter gave me the church) The 'London' yard and Castle Hill. (I never did manage to get the castle to stay straight). The idea was a sort of 'Preservation Society' using 50s and 60s products (mainly Meccano Ltd), but there are some Cararama vehicles amonst the Dinkies, Huskies and Matchbox (there are some others). The buildings vary in age - I couldn't keep to plan here (they would all have been Airfix otherwise). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted January 9, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2012 Thanks. Is your girder bridge made from turntable girders, or was there a Dublo Girder bridge that cunningly used the same parts as turntable girders? (Like the current Hornby turntable rials which double as car transporter side rails IIRC) (The girder bridge section above the VW single cab pick up and the Bedford CA milk float) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted January 10, 2012 Author Share Posted January 10, 2012 Cararama and Matchbox of course. The girder bridge is a survival from a Danish layout I started in the eighties. (I just couldn't resist a Lima class MZ* and then she needed coaches and wagons and another MZ and an MY and an MR DMU and.....) I had problems with Lima stock not liking Lima curves (360mm radius - probably something to do with the rigid bogie mounted couplings). The refreshment kiosk near the bridge is another relic from this layout *Like this http://www.ebay.com/...8-/160665970330 I didn't pay that sort of money for mine. They were quite cheap in Italy (one was 15,000 £ IIRC in the early eighties). Anyway the bridge girders are scratch built from cardboard (note the lack of rivets - Grifone laziness - well there would have been a lot of them). I did intend to replace them with Peco girders, but that's another thing that never got done, though I did acquire the girders. Dublo did the orange bridges of which I have two (visible in the photos), one complete and one consisting of the girders with scratch built floor and central brace (cheap on eBay ). There is reputedly a rare plastic version. And of course people have used turntable girders as bridges (I had enough trouble getting a turntable, let alone destroying one). The rest of the viaduct consists of Tri-ang arched bridges/viaducts and Lego piers (again I intended to replace....) This was going to be a short end to end branch (in 2 rail), but ended up as a repository for spare stock as can be seen in the photos (mainly Trix and Tri-ang at the time - Trix won't run on Dublo track without changing or modifying the wheels* and Tri-ang is too light to satisfactorily mix with Dublo, so relegated to sidings). *The lights drain the current too - Trix transformers will supply 3A or would if they were still safe to plug in, which they aren't. Of fifties electrics, I only trust the later Marshall controllers and even one of these had rubber insulation requiring replacement - low voltage luckily. (Probably I shouldn't use even these, but at least the mains insulation is PVC. The cotton covered rubber stuff is museum only. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagaguy Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Cararama and Matchbox of course. The girder bridge is a survival from a Danish layout I started in the eighties. (I just couldn't resist a Lima class MZ* and then she needed coaches and wagons and another MZ and an MY and an MR DMU and.....) I had problems with Lima stock not liking Lima curves (360mm radius - probably something to do with the rigid bogie mounted couplings). The refreshment kiosk near the bridge is another relic from this layout *Like this http://www.ebay.com/...8-/160665970330 I didn't pay that sort of money for mine. They were quite cheap in Italy (one was 15,000 £ IIRC in the early eighties). Anyway the bridge girders are scratch built from cardboard (note the lack of rivets - Grifone laziness - well there would have been a lot of them). I did intend to replace them with Peco girders, but that's another thing that never got done, though I did acquire the girders. Dublo did the orange bridges of which I have two (visible in the photos), one complete and one consisting of the girders with scratch built floor and central brace (cheap on eBay ). There is reputedly a rare plastic version. And of course people have used turntable girders as bridges (I had enough trouble getting a turntable, let alone destroying one). The rest of the viaduct consists of Tri-ang arched bridges/viaducts and Lego piers (again I intended to replace....) This was going to be a short end to end branch (in 2 rail), but ended up as a repository for spare stock as can be seen in the photos (mainly Trix and Tri-ang at the time - Trix won't run on Dublo track without changing or modifying the wheels* and Tri-ang is too light to satisfactorily mix with Dublo, so relegated to sidings). *The lights drain the current too - Trix transformers will supply 3A or would if they were still safe to plug in, which they aren't. Of fifties electrics, I only trust the later Marshall controllers and even one of these had rubber insulation requiring replacement - low voltage luckily. (Probably I shouldn,t use even these, but at least the mains insulation is PVC. The cotton covered rubber stuff is museum only. Interesting that you mention Trix not operating on Dublo 3rail track.Many years ago,in the early 1960s,i bought a Trix EM1 from a local shop.It took quite awhile for it to dawn on me that it was a convertible model,by cutting off the plastic wheel flanges,it would run on HD track & also under some homemade 1500v catenary.Wish i still had it though,I can`t justify a replacement . Ray. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hayfield Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Not the best photo in the world (phone camera) but I wounder how long it took to build ? Ali Paly last year Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 Perhaps I should have specified that I intended the Trix Twin coaches in the photos*, as of course Trix produced their convertible locos at the end of the fifties. (I puchased a 56xx tank for 3 guineas back then, but was rather disappointed with her. She always started with a jerk and having the chassis live to the centre rail caused shorts through the couplings with Dublo stock.**) Easy enough to solve now, but beyond me at the time. She's in there somewhere). The later Trix stock came with Dublo type wheels, but didn't run all that well until they produced the pinpoint underframe, which would almost run away on the level. The exhibition layout was probably set up in a day at most It all depends how many hands to put the track together and it had to be all planned beforehand. Collecting all the equipment took rather longer and a deep pocket (there's around £1000 worth of Dublo station on display alone). *Trix Twin wheels will run through Dublo pointwork if the back to back is eased out a bit, though with a bit of a bump (not the locos as the drive gear is part of the flange). I have one item which has turned down flanges, but this is perhaps going too far. ** It wasn't until later I realised she was also a different scale, but goes well with the Dublo N2s which are also dimensionally challenged (and Rivarossi which is the same 1/80th scale - neither is H0, though usually described as such)(The N2 wheelbase and wheel diameter is H0 - like the Lima Deltic). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted January 31, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 31, 2012 Their service seems quite reasonable. I've wondered about the effects of lap winding and would be interested to hear the results. Very fast service from Scalespeed. Can't compare lap winding as it is at least 30 years since Sir Nigel and the tank saw regular service, but I can say that they now run very well. 6 coaches without any effort. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted January 31, 2012 Author Share Posted January 31, 2012 The Dublo specification for later models is to take at most 25 seconds for 5 laps of a standard oval* with 4 SD coaches, when new. (The 1/2" motors and smaller wheels were allowed more.) The earlier pre 4MT tank (around 1954) would probably be faster, as they had a lower gear ratio (The coarse gears have a ratio 15:1 against the finer 18:1). This also applies to the R1 tanks, which struggle with more than 3 coaches!? I have always found adhesion is the limit to Dublo traction - 5/6 coaches should be no problem, with any of them (R1 excepted).The 2-6-4T and 0-6-2T can manage 8 (I'm not really sure why - they weigh much the same as the others. I find the nickel tyres to have less grip than the mazak. I used to run my Bristol Castle (which has been fitted with nickel tyres - not by me she came like that) with seven WR SD coaches, but she would only manage 6 of my BR crimson ones. (One of these (a BG) was so stiff it needed fitting with metal wheels before it would run freely enough. I'm not sure it would pass the 1 in 30 start to roll test even now.) The later models WC Deltic etc are considerably more powerful. 10 is no problem for my WC and the Deltic is unstoppable, so much so that I removed the traction tyres (they only made her wobble anyway). *8 standard curves and 2 full straights (3 rail) or 12 standard curves and 2x 11/2 straights (2 rail) - about 10 feet. I used to time them around one lap of my layout which was about 30 feet. The specified speed is just over 100mph scale. Tri-ang are much faster, but in compensation won't pull anything. My Lima 'Western' would tear around in about 10 seconds with almost any load (traction tyres). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted January 31, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 31, 2012 Very interesting David. What is the spec for post war models? My Sir Nigel is from 1949 and the 0-6-2 is a few years older. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted February 2, 2012 Author Share Posted February 2, 2012 I am not aware of any earlier spec. It would follow that earlier models with the 15:1 gear ratio should be faster than the 18:1 ratio quoted - of the order of 15-20%, I would estimate. I seem to recall reading somewhere that the design team were happy that their model was as fast as the prototype (presumably 126 mph). This must have been the original 'horseshoe' motor, which would be different again due to the changes in magnet and armature windings. Certainly my fastest models are a horseshoe Duchess (1948 series I think) and a Southern tank 1950/1 probably, as she has the wax suppressor capacitor. My experience is that Duchesses are faster than A4s, but that might be just chance (and old age/wear). Motors date as follows:- Horseshoe 1938 - 40, & 47 - 49 (Pre and post war production differs in couplings and valve gear AlNiCo 49 onwards - fitted with wax capacitor from about 1950. Change of gear ratio from about 1954 (starting with the 2-6-4T). Can be recognised by the finer gears. Smaller diameter commutators and five pole armatures date from the Wrenn era. Useful information can be obtained here (straight from the horse's mouth!). http://www.meccanoindex.co.uk/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagaguy Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Hi,To keep the ball rolling,I found these pics in the cupboard i was clearing out today looking for something else as you do.These were from my HD layout in about 1987 & was collected from toy fairs when it was all at reasonable prices.When we moved house, it was stored away & then rebuilt in the new house.I still have it all packed away because my wife could hear the clatter of the trains downstairs so i moved into N gauge,peace restored!!.The only item i still don`t have is the city station,I built this from the drawings in Micheal Fosters book,Hornby Dublo history,New Cavendish books. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted March 16, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 16, 2012 Fantastic. Many thanks for sharing that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted March 16, 2012 Author Share Posted March 16, 2012 Very impressive!. Mine ran on bubble pack sheeting to keep the noise down. I didn't manage as many Dinky buses - I'm still after a few of the 29 series, but refuse to pay collector's prices. I do have some of their competitors eg Budgie and Corgi Routemasters. What did you use for the roofs of the station canopies? I have a Trix Manyways one which needs a roof Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagaguy Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I had to buy cork sheet to cut to size to go under the track using cardboard templates for the curved sections,that cut the noise down considerably.The station roof was clear plasticard with self adhesive lining tape bought from a model aircraft shop.The buses were bought as basic scrap with mudguards,tyres & paint missing.the mudgurds were rebuilt by placing a small piece of Plastecene over the wheel & shaped to the inside of the mudguard & car body filler built up on the Plastecene and shaped & cleand up when set.They were resprayed using humbrol paints,getting the green to the right shade took some time.The collecting of HD didnt quite stop at this layout,up till about 1995,items were still being added,like Topsy,the collection is now large & as isaid,still packed away. Perhaps you could answer a question,I converted a Silver King to look like a pre war Sir Nigel Gresley with Valences & cut away valve gear,looks the part runs like a Rolls Royce but backwards when the controller is set to forward,It`s the only loco in the fleet that does this.Could a new Neo magnet cure this by inserting it the correct way round?. If i can find it easily,i`ll post a pic on here if you are interested!!! Ray. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagaguy Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Found a few more pics!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Colin_McLeod Posted March 16, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 16, 2012 Perhaps you could answer a question,I converted a Silver King to look like a pre war Sir Nigel Gresley with Valences & cut away valve gear,looks the part runs like a Rolls Royce but backwards when the controller is set to forward,It`s the only loco in the fleet that does this.Could a new Neo magnet cure this by inserting it the correct way round?. Before buying a new magnet, try turning the one that is already there the right way round. Nice pictures. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roythebus Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I had a Hornby Dublo Deltic in the 1960's. On the MRC test track, it hauled a mixture of stock that went completely round the inner track, then with a Weltrol wagon across to the middle circuit, then almost round again! We ran out of stock after that! The adverts used to say it would pull a 3 stone boy! Mind you the secret here was the old MRC controllers would deliver well in excess of 12 volts and quite a few amps! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted March 16, 2012 Author Share Posted March 16, 2012 Use a metal keeper to avoid opening the magnetic circuit as the slightest disturbance will cause a significant loss in magnetic strength. It will then need remagnetising or replacement with a neo. Reversing the magnet will correct the direction anomaly (I've just done it with an R1 chassis - not sure how it got to be the wrong way round I checked carefully while servicing it. My Deltic was limited by the drag of the train causing the coaches to tip inwards, rather than loading. This occurred with around 15 mixed Dublo coaches IIRC. I removed the traction tyres for three reasons: She'll pull all you need without them. They caused a drunken wobble and a disastrous pileup caused when the loco hit a dead section (don't ask) at speed and stopped dead and her train didn't.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
damndublo Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Love to see your Sir Nigel Ray. Thinking about doing one for myself . The real McCoy price nowadays goes for silly money for real tat and as I run mine, I am not going to spend out on a collectors item. I find more enjoyment from creating an illusion of the past trainsets rather than paying big money, only to put them in a draw as an investment. I've created a few Gresley teak coach overlays to make real scruffy ones presentable. So it would be nice to have the right engine to pull them. Brian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagaguy Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Hi Brian,I`ll see if i can find it tomorrow,sods law says it will be at the bottom of the storage chest!!! Ray. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted March 16, 2012 Author Share Posted March 16, 2012 I doing one myself (my original Sir Nigel, which has suffered many repaints and other indignities, including a replacement 'King' tender when the original fell apart), but I'm undecided how best to do the valances. I tried cardboard many years ago (with a silver livery - completely wrong, but we didn't have today's vast store of info then) without great success. Any suggestions would be welcome. Metal is probably the best thing to use, I think. I did an artic set once using two poor condition coaches, since dismantled (damp victim), but am thinking of doing another (I have acquired a genuine centre bogie) The problem is the straight roofs above the articulation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted March 16, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 16, 2012 I am as enthused by seeing David (El Griff) and Ray's Dublo layouts as I am looking at Peterborough North. And I'm not old enough to remember £sd. Thank you both. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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