RMweb Gold LH&JC Posted September 24, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 24, 2011 As this is a special event I think that it deserves it's own thread. Seeing 5000, 2500 & Duchess of Hamilton outside is one thing but seeing the Duchess outside with a matching coach is fantastic! The chance to see WCRC locos up close isn't to be ignored either & the chance to see & ride behind 42085 on her former stamping ground is quite something, if only she could go to the NYMR! http://www.flickr.co...157627741359446 I would go to Shildon tomorrow, but family commitments got in the way, besides its mainly GWR stuff there! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 Thanks for the link. Good photos there and a great temptation to go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mow Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 The shots of the D of H were stunning. Thanks for posting a link. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold LH&JC Posted September 24, 2011 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted September 24, 2011 To see her indoors in one thing, but she looks way better outdoors, especially with the brake third. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted September 24, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 24, 2011 Does anybody know if the carriage is going to stay in the fictitious livery or is it just a temporary thing for this event? Although it is a bit of a con, I think it looks smart and is certainly an eye catcher. If it is going to stay paired with the loco for a while, I hope they alter the lining, so that the lining on the carriage is at the same height as that on the tender. If I got the lining that far out on a model I would strip it off and do it again! With the lining, er....... lined up, I think it would look very good indeed. If we are in the realms of liveries not really carried by the items in question, I would even venture to suggest that, although the real loco never actually carried the livery (as far as I am aware) both the carriage and the loco would look even better in the wonderful blue and silver livery....... discuss! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 In your photo galley, your comments on IMG_2482 say that 5000 has an additional feature that is out-of-gauge. What is it? Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold LH&JC Posted September 24, 2011 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted September 24, 2011 Does anybody know if the carriage is going to stay in the fictitious livery or is it just a temporary thing for this event? Although it is a bit of a con, I think it looks smart and is certainly an eye catcher. If it is going to stay paired with the loco for a while, I hope they alter the lining, so that the lining on the carriage is at the same height as that on the tender. If I got the lining that far out on a model I would strip it off and do it again! With the lining, er....... lined up, I think it would look very good indeed. If we are in the realms of liveries not really carried by the items in question, I would even venture to suggest that, although the real loco never actually carried the livery (as far as I am aware) both the carriage and the loco would look even better in the wonderful blue and silver livery....... discuss! I'm not too sure where I stand with the livery of the brake third, but I do know that they'd look great in blue and silver! In your photo galley, your comments on IMG_2482 say that 5000 has an additional feature that is out-of-gauge. What is it? Regards That was just a dumb joke about the lamp post that looks like it's on the cab roof, in retrospect I should have said cab roof rather than cab side. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Hadyn Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 Does anybody know if the carriage is going to stay in the fictitious livery or is it just a temporary thing for this event? Although it is a bit of a con, I think it looks smart and is certainly an eye catcher. If it is going to stay paired with the loco for a while, I hope they alter the lining, so that the lining on the carriage is at the same height as that on the tender. If I got the lining that far out on a model I would strip it off and do it again! With the lining, er....... lined up, I think it would look very good indeed. If we are in the realms of liveries not really carried by the items in question, I would even venture to suggest that, although the real loco never actually carried the livery (as far as I am aware) both the carriage and the loco would look even better in the wonderful blue and silver livery....... discuss! 6229 WAS maroon in this condition - can't tell you the dates completely off the top of my head, but the record cards show she was... As for the height of the lining, do bear in mind that the tender and loco will sit lower on the springs if they were full of coal and water. And the coach is going to stay in this livery for the forseeable future - loco and coach will go into the Great Hall this week. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted September 26, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 26, 2011 6229 WAS maroon in this condition - can't tell you the dates completely off the top of my head, but the record cards show she was... As for the height of the lining, do bear in mind that the tender and loco will sit lower on the springs if they were full of coal and water. And the coach is going to stay in this livery for the forseeable future - loco and coach will go into the Great Hall this week. That is what I said! I said I would prefer it in blue even though I don't think it ever carried it in service! It is the spacing of the lining rather than the actual height. The bottom line pretty much matches but the top one doesn't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Come on t-b-g, I and I suspect many others despair when they read things like this. The object of the exercise is to show visitors to the NRM how things looked. To suggest the coach is wrong or should be painted blue and silver to suit you defies logic. As for the lining on the coach, it looks spot on judging by historial photos. ENJOY! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted September 26, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 26, 2011 Come on t-b-g, I and I suspect many others despair when they read things like this. The object of the exercise is to show visitors to the NRM how things looked. To suggest the coach is wrong or should be painted blue and silver to suit you defies logic. As for the lining on the coach, it looks spot on judging by historial photos. ENJOY! I do enjoy, very much so! If my remarks gave a different impression they were not intended to. I said it looked smart and I hope it stayed like that. The lining cannot be correct as per historical references. No such carriages were ever painted in that livery. The red streamline carriages were totally different designs. The ones that were in the blue livery had the lining on the carriages matching the lining on the tenders. The way the line went all the way from the front of the loco to the back of the train was, to me, a big part of the impact of the livery. It brought the train together visually as a "whole". If the lining on the carriage is correct (as per blue livery) then the lining on the loco is wrong! They should line up but the spacing on the loco and carriage are quite different. My view is that, if I got the lining that far out on a model, somebody would pick me up on it and I would be very happy do it again to correct my error. So why not the NRM? I don't see how saying that the loco and carriage would look good in blue defies logic. It is just a statement of personal choice. My friend's dad was a driver on the streamliners pre war and we built a model of a blue one for him, plus my dad was photographed in front of a blue one in 1938. So I have a very personal affinity with the blue, which to me is quite logical! All I said was that painting the loco in a fictional (for that loco) blue livery is just as valid an exercise as painting the carriage in a fictional red streamline livery. If one is acceptable why not the other? I certainly don't allow such minor niggles to spoil my enjoyment of what the NRM have tried to acheive with this project as I think it looks very impressive and will be a real crowd pleaser. Historically accurate it ain't! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted September 26, 2011 Share Posted September 26, 2011 Repainting the loco blue & silver when the coach was never in this livery or lake & gold would be a needless expence. Working with what it had (a D1968 brake third), I am sure the NRM was doing its best to convey to visitors the image of a streamlined train of the LMS. So does it matter if this coach was never in streamlined livery? No. My view is that, if I got the lining that far out on a model, somebody would pick me up on it and I would be very happy do it again to correct my error. So why not the NRM? Oh dear.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted September 26, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 26, 2011 I don't have the books to hand but from memory 6221 was a blue loco and I presume that to be a blue set. Perhaps the tender is quite empty and is riding a little high on the springs but the centres and widths of the lining match up nicely. So thanks for illustrating what I was saying but I don't quite see what the "Oh dear" is about. http://www.flickr.com/photos/williamfj2/6178106320/in/set-72157627741359446 Look at the top line and the thickness of the twin pairs of centre lines. Would you have turned out models for customers with that sort of discrepancy? I honestly think you would have done better! A red streamline train never (as far as I can tell) ran in LMS service. The red carrriages that were built had a funny round cornered, square looking brake end, with no corridor connection (and from memory they were articulated too). I have been looking through all the books published for details of these trains as I am helping my friend build a full rake in 4mm scale. He has red and blue streamliners and initially we wanted to do a red carriage set. We were quite disappointed to find no record of the red engines ever hauling a matching set in service and now we are building a blue set. The blue sets were conventional carriage designs, revamped and the preserved carriage is (again from memory) one of the actual diagrams used in the blue sets. I am quite prepared to look like a total plonker (I often do!) when somebody confirms that red sets did run. In fact I would be pleased as we could paint ours red! From published information it looks as if blue sets did run, red ones didn't. Repainting both blue would, to me, more accurately show what an LMS streamline train looked like. And I like blue better than red! Anyway, for a GCR enthusiast I have said more than enough on LMS matters, of which I accept that I know little! I don't think Coachmann and I are going to agree! So I shall agree to disagree and will bow out of the discussion gracefully and perhaps others can make their own minds up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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