RMweb Premium Ian J. Posted November 21, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 21, 2011 Specifically, in a photograph in the book 'Decline of Southern Steam' (Michael Welch, Capital Transport), page 95. The photo is of a U class (31809) on it's way from Eastleigh to Bournemouth in August 1962. It's hauling what appears to be a train made up entirely of Western Region stock. The first carriage is clearly a Hawksworth, not sure what type though. Can anyone else who has access to the book and image, give any clues as to the carriages in the train, particularly the designer and design (e.g., something along the lines of 'Hawksworth, FK')? TIA Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Ian J. Posted December 11, 2011 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 11, 2011 Looking at the photograph again it appears that, as best I can tell, the carriages are as follows (numbered from locomotive to back of train): 1. Hawksworth corridor third 2. Hawksworth brake third 3. Collett Sunshine corridor third 4. Collett Sunshine corridor composite 5. Collett Sunshine corridor composite 6. Hawksworth brake composite Good for a bit of unusual variety on a Southern Region based layout, especially with the U class hauling them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 I can't confirm your (reasonable) suggestions Ian, but it does seem curious how few instances there seemed to be of WR passenger stock appearing on SR metals, at least away from the south west, S&D, and ?Reading-Redhill. WR locos were frequently out of gauge on many SR lines, so whereas you often saw Stanier, Gresley and Thompson stock with Black 5s, B1s etc on (say) the Brighton main line on excursions from the north, I don't recall ever seeing photos of WR stock even with SR locos. So if you lived in Worcester, or Bristol, and you wanted an excursion train to Eastbourne, what happened? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted December 11, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 11, 2011 I can't confirm your (reasonable) suggestions Ian, but it does seem curious how few instances there seemed to be of WR passenger stock appearing on SR metals, at least away from the south west, S&D, and ?Reading-Redhill. WR locos were frequently out of gauge on many SR lines, so whereas you often saw Stanier, Gresley and Thompson stock with Black 5s, B1s etc on (say) the Brighton main line on excursions from the north, I don't recall ever seeing photos of WR stock even with SR locos. So if you lived in Worcester, or Bristol, and you wanted an excursion train to Eastbourne, what happened? You went in the correct (i.e. in gauge on the Southern) GW/ex GW stock as I did on a school excursion to Chichester. We had a 'Castle', tender first, on our branch then it ran-round and worked chimney leading to Basingstoke where it came off and a 'Schools' came on and took us all the way through to Chichester, and subsequently back to Basingstoke where the 'Castle replaced it. Being of relatively tender age I couldn't tell you much about the coaching stock except that it was mainly (?) Open Seconds of very definite GWR origin because that could be found all over the place inside the vehicles including in roundel form on low glass dividing screens between seating bays (or some of the seating bays?). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePipersSon Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 Could I also mention the M&SWJR - I know 1962 is a bit late, but most of the shots I have seen of passenger trains seem to be ex GW stock (I await being told of exceptions). These ran on Southern lines from Andover to Southampton, pulled by Southern moguls a lot of the time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Ian J. Posted December 11, 2011 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 11, 2011 Could I also mention the M&SWJR - I know 1962 is a bit late, but most of the shots I have seen of passenger trains seem to be ex GW stock (I await being told of exceptions). These ran on Southern lines from Andover to Southampton, pulled by Southern moguls a lot of the time. It wouldn't surprise me then if the loco and set in the picture I have mentioned was commandeered onto a Bournemouth service after having come down via the M&SWJR. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 Also, didn't the GW also use a slightly different vacuum brake pressure to what was usual on the SR, LMS and LNER? Regards, Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted December 11, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 11, 2011 Also, didn't the GW also use a slightly different vacuum brake pressure to what was usual on the SR, LMS and LNER? Regards, Peter They used a different level of vacuum but that was irrelevant to cross-border operation because all that needed to be done when going off a Western loco was to pull the release strings on the cylinders and then recreate the brake - which would then be at the lesser Railway's level of mercury. Going the other way all that needed to be done was give the stock a short boost with the large ejector (if you wanted to do it quickly) and the brake would be evacuated to the higher level of mercury. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 Thanks Mike. Was never very good with the technical side of things. Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbishop Posted December 11, 2011 Share Posted December 11, 2011 How on earth did they get past border control? Couldn't happen on any layout I'm involved with! Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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