Colinw62 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I have collected a selection of loco's and stock which is predominantly Burlington Northern. The Loco's are meainly Proto 2000, GP9, GP20, GP38's, MP15 and are all in BN Green, I also have a Bachmann 44 tonner ins AT&SF plus a CF7 (cos I just love the look of a CF7) in LAJ livery. The stock is mainly 50' box cars and gondola's in a mixture or liveries but some BN too....oh yes and a BN Caboose. From what I've found out the BN lasted until 1995 when it merged to become BNSF. I live in the UK so first hand experience of US railways is nil, what I'm trying to do is come up with a plausable layout for this stock. I don't want a huge layout, I don't have an exact size in mind but I guess I'm thinking of something say 4' x 1', it could be on a couple of boards that fold up for transport/storage so it could be bigger (8' x 1') and it could be a little deeper. I've looked at many layouts and plans but as yet don't have anything specific in mind. I guess what I'm drilling down to and what I'm looking for help with is a location, purpose, era etc.. rather than an actual layout plan (but suggestions on both are most welcome). I've thought about a freelance shortline where the stock is S/H and largely carries it's original livery, I've thought about re-branding the BN stock with BNSF so it is more up to date but not been totally repainted post merger (would any of these turned up in LA and run with LAJ?). So to sum up, can anyone help with a suggestion of what I can do with the stock I have collected so far? Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortliner Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Colin - Carls site http://www.carendt.com/ and both the layouts and HO section on here http://www.the-gauge.net/forum/ should point you at some ideas - I'd have pointed you at some on the RMweb3 site but I think it is still down. Make it reasonably generic, and you can run any road you like - and you could always patch a BN loco for your own shortline Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Well the BN covered from Chicago and Texas/Louisiana up to the Pacific Northwest, so there's lots of it that's modelleable. BN had examples of both GP9 and GP20 on the roster right past the BNSF merger so no problem with that group of 4 loco's being the power for a layout together. The Santa Fe ran from Chicago to LA with also a decent coverage down to Texas, so plenty of potential places for connection with BN - but the 44t is problematical as it wasn't in widespread use with the railroad, at least in the era that BN existed (can't find the right book, if they still had one in use I have a feeling it was the plant switcher at a tie creosoting plant or somesuch!) The LAJ CF7s would post-date Santa-Fe dumping the type in the mid 80s, but is a local railroad in Los Angeles which BN doesn't serve. So, credible mixes if you want to model some where/when specifc? The 4 BN loco's, together, anywhere between say 1980 and 1995 should be okay (I think the MP15s were ex Frisco, so BN machines post 1980). The LAJ one would limit you to LA, you might get away with the GP38-2 turning up post BNSF merger (no need to patch it for the first few years after merger either) - but I think the other 3 BN machines are unlikely to be credible in that mix. My suggestion would be: Use the BN 4x machines as your core fleet If it's the looks of the CF7 you like then trade the LAJ CF7 in for a CF7 in a livery that ran in a part of the country that BN also served - off the top of my head maybe Twin Cities & Western (Minneapolis), Illinois Railnet, or Midsouth (Louisiana) - there's others, but you get the idea....creating a reason for them turning up interchanging with BN is much easier! Make the 44t an industrial if you have the use for such a thing - or keep it for special occasions (owned by a local preservation group maybe?) Or alternatively make your layout a generic enough looking industrial park that it could be almost anywhere? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I've got an SD60M branded BNSF but painted in BN colours. They never re- painted all their locos overnight anyway. I can't help you with with a room filler and there are plenty of ideas for smaller shortline/switcher layouts floating around. You can start with the Layout Plan section of USA & Canadian railroads on here. I'm sure that BN had their share a small stub lines. With the UK being the same land area as just one 'State - Wisconsin and 49 other 'States the choice is almost too much! Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortliner Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 8 feet of switching including fiddle yard http://www.the-gauge...&p=90687#p90687 If you have room to extend it further make it a 5:3:3, but remember that the lead track needs to be the length of the shortest spur track+a loco Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave1905 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I really wouldn't worry about the location yet. With that small of a space I would just design the switching I preferred and not worry about locale. Anything you put in that small of a space will be highly compressed. Since the BN covered most of the western US, there are hundreds, if not thousands of places you could locate it. Figure out the track plan, how much switching you want, then pick what type of cars you want to operate, then pick industries that support those car types. The type of industries may point to a locale or you can just pick your favorite area and label the industries accordingly. The locale somewhat determines the industries, but mostly determines the building construction and scenery (backdrop, vegetation, etc.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold lakeview770 Posted January 7, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2012 Hopefully these sites can help with what went where, I know one of the links is down at the moment http://www.calcoastrails.com/cgi/photo_index.php?group=BNRR http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/locolist.aspx?id=BN http://www.hebners.net/caboose/bn.html www.trainpix.com/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I think the OP needs to give us an idea for a grographical location, as the BN covered a large area and to me it's important to be able to place a layout without any trains on. It's sometimes tricky to do without resorting to regional stereotypes (such as pastel coloured buildings for Miami or lots of Pine trees for the Pacific Northwest). Also, is it important to fill the area with track and create a small switching yard, or create the illusion that trains have actually arrived form somewhere...? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave1905 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 If not a geographical location, at least a "density", i.e. urban, industrial park, rural, etc. or basic scenery, i.e. mountains, prairie, river valley, etc. Track plans are purpose driven not necessarily location driven. The same track plan can be plopped down in virtually any part of the country and will work, especially if its a small switching layout. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
signalmaintainer Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Here's one idea for a shelf-switcher layout. I've gone as far with this design from Bryon Henderson to place the locale in south downtown Seattle, Washington, where the BNSF teems with spurs and industrial leads (not like it did 40 years ago, though). http://www.layoutvision.com/gallery/id25.html. Either of the leads on the right-hand side could be used to access a fiddle or staging yard. In one iteration, I have the upper right-hand track going to Stacy Street Yard http://bp0.blogger.com/_IPZX1n_gnIM/SCZoplbutOI/AAAAAAAABSY/Sx--Q7jkVEI/s400/Annotated-Stacy_BLOG.jpg. (BTW, if anyone's interested, one of my work haunts is the tiny white-roofed building below the second "T" in "Lander StreetFoot Bridge. There are numerous Cascade Green and black units on the BNSF with only the initials "BNSF" stenciled under the cab windows. I see them every day. Mostly GP38-2s, GP-39s and rebuilt GP-30s, but here they are in 2012. Although the merger occurred in 1996, there was not a rash of repainting on older units and rolling stock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I think the OP needs to give us an idea for a grographical location, as the BN covered a large area and to me it's important to be able to place a layout without any trains on Not sure if it's just me reading it wrong - my reading was the OP's question was 'I have these 6 loco's, where/when in the US can I use them together' - which is what drove my earlier reply.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Not sure if it's just me reading it wrong - my reading was the OP's question was 'I have these 6 loco's, where/when in the US can I use them together' - which is what drove my earlier reply.... And a concise one it was too, and I might add the Washington Central had a couple of patch painted ex- Santa Fe CF7's on their roster until they were repainted into their own colours and the Railway Museum in Toppenish has a GE 65 tonner that bears more than a passing resemblence to a 44 tonner, so Toppenish in Washington State could also be a contender. One stumbling block for me tho is the loco fleet only makes up a small part of the overall picture, and most people who model the US seem to have a "Eureka" moment when they decide upon a location, road or era to model. Which is why I think it'd be easier to tailor the location to whatever the OP decides upon and run whatever takes his fancy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave1905 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 The problem is that the BN covered a large part of the western US, "where can I model" is kinda broad if you are interested in the BN. Pensacola, Memphis, Springfield, IL, St Louis, Chicago, Minneapolis, Duluth, Omaha, kansas City, Ft Worth, Houston, Lincoln, NE, Denver, Spokane, Seattle, Portland, OR and points in between. The BN was a huge railroad it handled virtually every commodity and every kind of business and the same set of industries could be in literally hundereds of locations. Since the BN never came within a thousand miles of LA, if he wants to include the LAJ, which was a the opposite of the BN, a very small railroad, and he cares anything about being prototypical, then the only way he could include the LAJ is to model after the BNSF merger and the only place he could model is the junction with the LAJ Which really means he wants to model the ATSF and the LAJ). That also limits the types of industries to a very small selection found in the area around the LAJ. So the real question becomes, does he want to model the BN and use 95% of what he has or does he want to model the LAJ and change 50% of what he has? Or as I pointed out the location really doesn't matter, on a 1x4 or 1x8 layout he's only going to have one, maybe two engines at a time running, so make it a generic southern US style (Ft Worth, Oklahoma City, Houston, LA) and then run the LAJ engine when he wants and the BN engines when he wants and don't set any location in stone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium BR60103 Posted January 9, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2012 Take advantage of nice flat baseboards and model a prairie town with a grain elevator. or 10. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
F-UnitMad Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I think the OP needs to give us an idea for a geographical location, as the BN covered a large area and to me it's important to be able to place a layout without any trains on. It's sometimes tricky to do without resorting to regional stereotypes (such as pastel coloured buildings for Miami or lots of Pine trees for the Pacific Northwest). .... To some extent, isn't it rather tricky to 'place' a lot of locations in the USA without resorting to regional stereotypes..?? The place is so vast there can be large areas (Mid-West for example) that all look pretty similar? I'm certain that, in my case, for the Soo Line, without seeing a Depot Nameboard I'd be quite stumped as to the location of many photos I have, which cover several States. .... I think it'd be easier to tailor the location to whatever the OP decides upon and run whatever takes his fancy. An excellent proposition!! "Rule #1", I think it's called..? ("It's my Train Set, etc.....") Given the space, I'd be thinking whether I wanted to switch stock, or display locos, as the OP has quite a number of them... a very 'generic' set of spurs would enable the OP to do either as the mood takes:- Interchange Yard or Stabling Tracks.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
long island jack Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Colin Patch the early geeps for your own shortline,which exchanges cars with BN/BNSF How about a lumber/paper industry somewhere in the pacific northwet area Ray Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortliner Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Colin Patch the early geeps for your own shortline,which exchanges cars with BN/BNSF How about a lumber/paper industry somewhere in the pacific northwet area Ray I know it rains a lot over in that part of the USA, but that is the first time I've heard it called that! I know it is a typo, but I love it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctor quinn Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 The problem is that the BN covered a large part of the western US, "where can I model" is kinda broad if you are interested in the BN. Pensacola, Memphis, Springfield, IL, St Louis, Chicago, Minneapolis, Duluth, Omaha, kansas City, Ft Worth, Houston, Lincoln, NE, Denver, Spokane, Seattle, Portland, OR and points in between. Not to mention Manitoba, handy if you like grain elevators and something a little different. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Given the space, I'd be thinking whether I wanted to switch stock, or display locos, as the OP has quite a number of them... a very 'generic' set of spurs would enable the OP to do either as the mood takes:- Interchange Yard or Stabling Tracks.... I think that's for the OP to decide...if we had a list of loco numbers it might be easier to assign a specific area, although it's fortunate most people regard the best compromise as a happy ground midway between the absolute RPM you'd get from a British modeller with an interest in their own country, and the Loco and matching caboose with a random collection of freight cars inbetween that used to pass as US modelling. Come on Colin, there are many on here who want to see this project come to fruition...!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave1905 Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 On a big railroad like the BN, with hundreds of units, especially generic 4 axle units, the chances of having a "random" collection of units that all worked in one area at one time is pretty slim. He would be good just getting locomotives that were all numbered correctly at the same time. Plus since they wheels, locomotives tend to wander unless they have some really unique characteristics (cabsignals, special equipment, etc). At this point the OP needs to provide some feedback and what direction he wants to head. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinw62 Posted January 10, 2012 Author Share Posted January 10, 2012 Well I must say what a fantastic response there has been so far, thanks to all who have contributed, it certainly gives me plenty to think about. I think that's for the OP to decide...if we had a list of loco numbers it might be easier to assign a specific area, although it's fortunate most people regard the best compromise as a happy ground midway between the absolute RPM you'd get from a British modeller with an interest in their own country, and the Loco and matching caboose with a random collection of freight cars inbetween that used to pass as US modelling. Come on Colin, there are many on here who want to see this project come to fruition...!! This kind of hits the nail on the head.....I don't want to end up with the US equavalent of an EWS Class 66 hauling a train made up 4 wheel BR vent vans and pre-grouping PO Wagons just because I like them. I do try to be as accurate as possible in what I do. I'll get a list of Loco's and numbers together and list them in due course. I'd like the model to say "Burlington Northen" in pretty much the same way as a model of "Ashburton" would say GWR (but not quite that sterotype'd ) On a big railroad like the BN, with hundreds of units, especially generic 4 axle units, the chances of having a "random" collection of units that all worked in one area at one time is pretty slim. He would be good just getting locomotives that were all numbered correctly at the same time. Plus since they wheels, locomotives tend to wander unless they have some really unique characteristics (cabsignals, special equipment, etc). At this point the OP needs to provide some feedback and what direction he wants to head. I don't want to fall in to what I see as the trap of lots of industries in a small space - that too me comes across as a stereotype US layout and not realistic (though I will stand corrected if this is representative of the real thing in the US). I don't envisage all locos being on scene at once, more a case of variety in what is running, most likely 2 on at once as most US trains seem to have at least 2 loco's at the head even for switching runs. That said the suggestion of a stabling point is interesting, possibly with a nearby industry to provide freight movements too. As for the LAJ CF7, I'm now thinking that is for another time and place - maybe something like "Yard 6" that appeared in Continetal Modeller a few months back. Off to scratch my head a bit more............... Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortliner Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Colin, the "Lots of industries in a small space" scenario is more common than you may think - an example is the Alaska Railroad CPU spur in Anchorage Ak. - just a mile long - currently being modelled by Chris Gilbert (industry-wise) although with a trackplan from somewhere a long way away - as the CTU spur http://www.the-gauge.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=5147 with several small industries, all in the second half! What does look odd is having an Industry that is supposedly a steelworks and is 6" long. Provided that you set it up with industries that are small and believable, and handle perhaps a carload every couple of days, rather than having a 15 car train arrive in a block you should be fine! And as a further example, look at Lance Mindheims Miami prototypes Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The other way to go is to model just one industry, but a big one that uses lots of car types...something like a steel 'mini-mill' - or a corn processing plant would have lots of different car spots for several different car types - i.e. the equivalent of lots of little industries operationally, but visually it's one, big impressive one... It's the kind of size that might justify it's own plant switcher as well which might be a use for one of the non-BN machines? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshine coast Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Even an industry as simple as a tie treatment plant can produce a lot of traffic...timber and ties in /out ..chemicals in..waste out ..fuel oil ...machinery ,parts etc ...and loads for PWay trains... this example in CT also has the bonus of the factory only needing to be in the background......... http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1296882 Regards Trevor .... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 On a big railroad like the BN, with hundreds of units, especially generic 4 axle units, the chances of having a "random" collection of units that all worked in one area at one time is pretty slim. He would be good just getting locomotives that were all numbered correctly at the same time. Plus since they wheels, locomotives tend to wander unless they have some really unique characteristics (cabsignals, special equipment, etc). At this point the OP needs to provide some feedback and what direction he wants to head. I've shown this topic to someone in the "Pacific Northwet", and the reply actually paints a picture of a company that is similar to one of our new "Big four" companies, where although we're talking of a number of old railway companies under the umbrella of a new one, there were still ingrained rivalries between the constituants that were only broken when a new managment structure was brought in from the Texas oil industry. And although locos could be moved around to where the traffic dictated, there's more of a chance that smaller four axle GP road power and switchers remained on their old roads. Also, the length of existance of the BN before merger is remarkably similar to the Big four.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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