Canadian passenger train photos

[roundhouse]

Niagra VIA station back in 1992

[dibber25]

Sorry Chris, I don't know how that misquote happened.

 

I suppose BC counts as civilized Just kidding, it's a Canadian regional thing - residents of the various regions (BC, Western Canada**, Ontario, Quebec, Atlantic Canada, and Newfie) do tend to make jokes at the expense of the other regions. **Alberta and Saskatchewan, I'm not sure whether Manitoba is patr of it, a separate region, or just an expanse of prairie and forest to be endured when travelling between Ontario and Western Canada.

 

I'm glad saner heads prevailed on the 142s. They probably wouldn't have got them past the crashworthiness regs anyway, and I seriously doubt that one could have done what one of the Turbos did - continued it's trip with only cosmetic damage after cutting a semi-trailer in half at a level crossing*. Though I'm not sure that a GO cab car or an LRC power car would have done as well as the Turbo either. Also, having seen photos of the freights that have hit landslips, I don't think I'd want to be in a 142 in the BC interior.

 

* this incident produced a dramatic photo, taken by a journalist riding in the upper level lounge of the lead power car, looking back down the train with bits of trailer scattering in its wake.

 

Adrian

 

Careful!! If I have any real Canadian connections, they are with BC. I have family out there and started my Canadian modelling with PGE/BC Railway. I only got seduced by Toronto area and VIA Rail much more recently.....

The 142s aren't really acceptable even in the UK. They were a way of keeping bus builders employed a bit longer. We had a particularly bad accident with one over here when a collision shifted the body clean off the chassis. Luckily it was empty at the time. However, we do now have some really good DMUs and something with the 'genetics' of a Trans-Pennine Class 185 could provide a cost-effective train for VIA's shorter distance services. However, Bombardier's 'Voyagers' should be avoided, even if they could be built in Canada.

CHRIS LEIGH

[Adrian Wintle]

Niagra VIA station back in 1992

 

The third picture is quite interesting. The LRC power cars didn't have steam generators, so the first car behind the loco is a steam generator to provide the heat for the following (older) coaches. The LRC coaches that the power car was designed for are electric heat.

 

Adrian

[pH]

A Class 142 railbus was tried in Canada in 1986 (and even considered for the North Van-Prince George BC Rail service). Thankfully it didn't get beyond a trial!! Can't understand why anyone would have thought they could ever be acceptable in any civilised country.

 

Chris, I don't know how serious a 'trial' that really was. I think it was at least as much a way of providing another 'fairground ride' for Expo86 - remember, that was originally to be Transpo86.

 

I'm glad saner heads prevailed on the 142s. They probably wouldn't have got them past the crashworthiness regs anyway, and I seriously doubt that one could have done what one of the Turbos did - continued it's trip with only cosmetic damage after cutting a semi-trailer in half at a level crossing.

 

The BC Hydro Railway crews that ran the 142 between New Westminster and Abbotsford were very relieved to get through the summer without a crossing incident. There are many uncontrolled crossings on that route, and the railbus was a lot faster and a lot quieter than the usual freights on that line.

[davknigh]

Another short lived experiment was in Calgary. Back in 1996 they trialled a Siemens RegioSprinter along the existing CP line in the far south of the city. Didn't really take off and the city has since extended the LRT beyond the trial's original route. There is a lot of talk around providing something similar to the neighbouring bedroom communities of Airdrie, Strathmore, Cochrane, and High River. Doubt I'll see that in my lifetime though. The same goes for the proposed 300km/h LGV between Calgary and Edmonton. Lots of space, loads of cash to build it, but no real political motivation.

 

The location of the VIA station in Edmonton wouldn't help much being out the back of beyond. Funny to think that CP once had a dedicated service developed with streamlined coaches and the F2 Jubilee locomotives http://www.steamlocomotive.com/jubilee/?page=cp for the run between Calgary & Edmonton. You're right though, it's the politics and nobody wants to talk short term costs v long term gains because it might mean tax money had to be spent.

 

Cheers,

 

David

[jjb1970]

And most of OntarioCanada (including areas of the corridor) is less densly populated than Northern England, which is the major issue with train service. The economics and logistics of running sevices becomes problematic. While I would love to be able to take the train to visit my parents (Newmarket, Ontario -> Kingston, Ontario - 275 km one way by car), it is not currently feasible. Neither the logistics or the economics work, even though Newmarket is on the GO system 40 km north of Toronto, while Kingston is on the main corridor, half way between Toronto and Montreal.

 

Adrian

 

 

Population density in Canada certainly doesn't help rail passenger service, but my reference to Northern England wasn't really intended to make a point about Canada so much as a comment on political inconsistency. Northern England has some very significant large urban areas (and lets not ignore other parts of the UK) which are desperate for rail investment and are lurching along with trains that need to be renewed and either lengthened or with greater frequency of service. In the SE of England the UK government does take some sort of wider view of railways and recognises that National Rail services and TfL services are the arteries of the London economy. Not perfect and the SE network is anything but perfect, but it does get investment and the government recognises that its economic value cannot be measured just by looking at rails profit and loss. What I get frustrated by is that the same arguments are true (admittedly to a lesser extent) for Leeds, Manchester, Tyne & Wear, Liverpool and many other places where the government applies a very different standard. Northern Rail which despite the apparent rural nature of much of the area does include some rather busy commuter routes) has a train fleet that is woefully inadequate in so many ways with not much sign of real investment from what I can see. My original home is Cumbria, the government just spent a huge amount of money filling in the A74 hole between the M6 and M74 motorways, they have invested serious money in lots of other highways projects such as the Carlisle by-pass, however Northern Trains is a real Cinderella railway. The government are deferring a fuel duty rise on automotive fuel to help motorists in an age of austerity yet the government is pressing on with many rail ticket prices are going up by inflation + 3%.That is my complaint, that a government applies such different standards to the same issues. And I'm not an anti-car person per se, I'm not against highways development but if governments are willing to invest in highways then why not rail? I realise that in Canada the demographics and geography mean passenger rail is not going to be anything like as intensive as in the UK but I do believe there is a good case for investment in maintaining a viable rail service, more so than is currently being done. And as Chris says, a viable service isn't one train a day or less, no offence intended with any of this.

[jjb1970]

Just pulled the trigger on a True Line Trains MP40 in GO livery, just the base line version without sound (I'm a dinosaur when it comes to DCC I'm afraid), really looking forward to it as it looks to be a wonderful model, the levels of detail look to be up there with the best. I guess I'll need some Bombardier bi-level cars now...... I'm drooling over the Rapido LRC, this may be a silly question, but would it be accurate to use the VIA LRC cars with both the LRC power car or a P42 or F40? Or is there a livery or detail difference that'd make it wrong to use the same cars with both an LRC power car or a P42 depending on what you were doing on a layout? Really, I'd like to run the cars as per current status today, but Rapido seem to have done a good job of the LRC power car too and it is tempting to go for both options if you can get away with it.

[sjgardiner]

I'm drooling over the Rapido LRC, this may be a silly question, but would it be accurate to use the VIA LRC cars with both the LRC power car or a P42 or F40? Or is there a livery or detail difference that'd make it wrong to use the same cars with both an LRC power car or a P42 depending on what you were doing on a layout? Really, I'd like to run the cars as per current status today, but Rapido seem to have done a good job of the LRC power car too and it is tempting to go for both options if you can get away with it.

 

Depends entirely on when you are modelling, there is some overlap there.

 

The 1st Run LRC Cars are accurate with an LRC Locomotive, or an early paint scheme F40PH. THe first run cars had a brown interior which was correct from construction to 1992. The LRC Locomotives were basically never updated and carried the same scheme for their working life. I am not sure, but it wouldn't surprise me if the paint on the one we bought for the Toronto Railway Museum is original.

 

The upcoming 2nd Run LRC Cars will have the post 1992 purple/teal interior with the big flag and the "Canada" logo on the carbody which was added in 1998, this slight variation on the paint scheme is accurate with the end of the LRC Locomotives for coaches, though i believe the models will have the "VIA 1" Logo which was introduced in 2002 after the LRC's were retired, making these coaches suitable for use with P42's and original F40PH's and rebuilt F40PH's. The LRC Locos were retired in 2001, so the upcoming coaches are correct, but the club/VIA1 cars won't be with the newer logo on them.

 

As for locomotives, Rapido's LRC Locomotive will get built, if only because Jason Shron needs them for his home layout, and because the tooling is made, even if they haven't sold enough to break even yet. F40PH's, well, there are lots of plastic options out there, none are particularly accurate for VIA, though i can point you to a website to learn what you'd have to do to accuratize them, and the P42's, Athearn did them years ago, George's Trains in Markham has a re-run coming that keeps getting delayed, no idea if there are any not reserved or not.

 

-Stephen

[dibber25]

I've been really pleased with my Athearn P42s. Two of them have Tsunami sound which is a 15-minute job to install. The 'Ren' green one is a Georges Trains limited edition as 905 (but the real 905 is blue not green, I believe). All were originally supplied in blue but any that have suffered accident or fire damage have been repainted green. The VIA blue 907 is a repaint by Dave Lowery with Microscale decals. You can't buy VIA blue in the UK so it is National Power blue, which is as close as we could get. The Athearn model is not quite correct for a VIA loco - there are minor detail differences, mainly VIA has an extra light on the front and duplicate set of horns on the roof. Like the F40PHs, these locos run with LRC cars, stainless steel, and 'ren' stock.

CHRIS LEIGH

[AndrewC]

On the subject of the Athearn P42s. Does anyone make replacement steps? I've got a trio of Amtrak ones, and I'm missing at least 1 set of steps from each.

 

Chris, have you played with adding ditch lights or improving on the existing lighting yet?

[Adrian Wintle]

The 'Ren' green one is a Georges Trains limited edition as 905 (but the real 905 is blue not green, I believe). All were originally supplied in blue but any that have suffered accident or fire damage have been repainted green.

 

905 is in the current (metallic blue) colour, or close to it, which appears to be different than the original greenish-blue, the earlier blue, or the Ren green. The original colour was green as in the Kato N-scale model http://www.katousa.c...42/176-6007.jpg, which errs on the green side. The colours do look very different depending on lighting.

 

A few years ago one of the blue P42s was running with a green skirt panel.

 

901 in greenish-blue http://www.railpictu...229323&nseq=271

918 in bright blue (although the lower panels seem to be still greenish-blue http://www.railpictu...230224&nseq=270

917 in Ren green http://www.railpictu...d=405031&nseq=8

906 in blue, with a Ren green F40PH as comparison http://www.railpictu...d=406528&nseq=0

919 in blue, looking almost like the George's special http://www.railpictu...361500&nseq=120

 

Adrian

[roundhouse]

On the subject of the Athearn P42s. Does anyone make replacement steps? I've got a trio of Amtrak ones, and I'm missing at least 1 set of steps from each.

 

Chris, have you played with adding ditch lights or improving on the existing lighting yet?

 

I cheated by buying a cheap second hand Atheran one to repalce my broken steps but if there are suitable replacements out there then I can get the second hand one working!

 

I have added the details West detailing kit to mine - some nice bits in it.

 

Ian

[AndrewC]

I cheated by buying a cheap second hand Atheran one to repalce my broken steps but if there are suitable replacements out there then I can get the second hand one working!

 

I have added the details West detailing kit to mine - some nice bits in it.

 

Ian

I did the same at Kegworth 2 years ago. However the loco was in such good shape it seemed a shame to scrap it for the sake of a couple of steps. I may try to fabricate some from thick styrene. will have to look into getting the Details West detailing kit. My next trick will be trying to dull down the mirror like finish on the Walthers coaches.

[dibber25]

Pete Harvey has offered to do an etched step for the P42s. It just needs me to remember to send him one of the plastic steps to work from.

CHRIS LEIGH

[dibber25]

On the subject of the Athearn P42s. Does anyone make replacement steps? I've got a trio of Amtrak ones, and I'm missing at least 1 set of steps from each.

 

Chris, have you played with adding ditch lights or improving on the existing lighting yet?

 

No i haven't tried to change the lighting. I have put cab detail into 905 but that means the Tsunami decoder won't fit. If you fit the decoder and no cab detail, you get a bright red light from the decoder shining through the cab. My next plan is to try installing a shortened cab interior to see if I can fit both items in one loco.

CHRIS

[roundhouse]

I fitted mine with a Loksound decoder and bass reflex speaker and i am pretty sure I fitted working ditchlights but its a nearly a year since it last got used so cant remember 100%.

 

The Loksound decoder is smaller than the Tsunami ones but a bit expensive to swap nowthough!!

 

PS - I will be interested in etched steps.

[AndrewC]

Cheers gents. Sorry for hijacking the thread with modelling stuff.

 

I used a Soundbug piggybacked onto an NCE decoder plugged into the 9pin board socket. Hacked out the plastic under the fan grille and the whole body acts as an enclosure. Sounds better than I had hoped for and only cost £35 to do.

 

Chris if you do manage to get etched steps please keep me in the loop as I can use a dozen of them.

[BR60103]

Like the F40PHs, these locos run with LRC cars, stainless steel, and 'ren' stock.

 

I think they also ran with Amtrak cars (Amfleet or Horizon) on the Toronto-Chicago train until that was discontinued.

[jjb1970]

Nice P42 models! Hopefully in a few days I'll be enjoying the somewhat odd sight of a GO Transit MP40 alongside Southern steam and 70's/80's BR diesels......

[dibber25]

Darn! You mean its not authentic?

CHRIS LEIGH

 

(PS British and North American will eventually be separated by a back scene.)

[sjgardiner]

As promised, Rapido Trains today announced the push to the finish on the LRC Locomotive and along with that, new paint schemes and variations and road numbers including odd-ball test schemes and the Bombardier Demonstrator units.

 

http://www.rapidotra...ewscurrent.html

 

If anyone is looking for a display case central LRC Locomotive, as a personal request, i'd ask that you consider buying one of the 6917 Models to support the Toronto Railway Museum where i also volunteer (Jason Shron at Rapido is a Toronto Railway Historical Association Board member, the TRHA is the volunteer support of the TRM, so full disclosure its a biased request on my part to raise funds!!).

 

-Stephen

[jjb1970]

Hi Stephen,

 

Forgive me if this is a stupid question, but is that the museum at the old roundhouse in down town Toronto near the Rogers Center or is there another museum? I visited the roundhouse in August. Thanks for the info on the LRC, I will be ordering one in VIA colours!

[sjgardiner]

Yes, that's us, the CPR John Street Roundhouse, across the street from the Skydome (i don't tend to use corporate names when they replace a real name). The LRC locomotive isn't on site at the roundhouse, it's at the VIA Toronto Maintenance Centre where our volunteer mechanics can work on it and where it's safely stored away from vandals.

[AndrewC]

To add to Stephen's Rapido news, the second batch of "Canadians" has been shipped from Rapido. . Batch 3 (script) just left the factory and batch 4 (VIA) is due to leave China by the end of Oct.

[jjb1970]

Apologies on the Skydome/Rogers Center name, I'm a new comer to Toronto and didn't know about the naming issue, the round house is a great location, although reading the info it seemed the museum is being screwed over by developers who want the whole round house to be given over to retail units? I hope the museum survives as it seems that the round house was supposed to be a museum when the railway no longer needed it. The LRC was a sharp looking train but they look really odd when used with non-LRC cars, its like seeing a HST power car on a set of Mk.1 coaches, it just looks odd to me. I see Rapido are doing the demo livery, this may be a rare occasion where I buy a demo unit as I loved the look of the LRC demonstrator, I remember being really taken by it when I was a boy in the 80's and saw pictures of the demo in one of those coffee table type world of trains books people buy you as Christmas presents when they know you like trains.