Dock Green

[Simond]

How?

[81A Oldoak]

How?

Chaz lives close to the LSWR mainline.

[chaz]

How?

 

 

on a big low-loader lorry with a bloke walking behind to make sure it doesn't nudge any of the parked cars.

[Simond]

thanks, I didn't imagine they'd installed the extra conductor rails...

 

best

Simon

[CUTLER2579]

Golly!  "Sarah Siddons" has just trundled passed my bedroom window.

 

Blimey I thought she died on the 8th June 1831 in  London and was interred there in Saint Mary's Cemetery at Paddington Green.      

Edited September 7, 2017 by CUTLER2579

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 3

 

I like scratch-building, but with so much work to do to get Dock Green finished, including the buildings, bridges etc which had to be made from scratch, I thought it best to limit myself to kit built or RTR stock. I do have one scratchbuilt wagon on the layout. M470685 is a model of an LMS Medfit diagram D1927.

 

 

According to Geoff Kent, in “The 4mm Wagon (Part One)”, the LMS built over 10,000 3 plank medium opens, so it’s arguable that every model railway depicting the nineteen thirties through to the seventies ought to have at least one (the Medfits lasted well, being very useful to the engineer’s dept).

 

 

It’s the only wagon on Dock Green that I built from scratch, using the drawing in “Official Drawings of LMS Wagons - No. 1”. I made the underframe from brass channel with white metal fittings from the ABS range, soldered throughout. I did not model all the bracing in the frame - I only model the parts you can see when the wagon is on the track.

 

 

I made the body with HIP. I included the capping strip on the top of the planked sides with its retaining clips, a detail that most wagon kits omit. All the bolts on the model’s body are from plastic rod and pass right though the “planks” and both washer plates (the strapping), inside and out. A touch of madness perhaps, but I wanted to try it - it means a lot of holes to drill.

 

 

The chains which retain the drop-side pegs are from twisted fuse wire - a compromise that is acceptable from a normal viewing distance. I left the brake hoses off this wagon after we had problems with them interfering with the operation of the Dingham couplings. Maybe I could add them but position them further from the centre line. DHYB (again)

 

Chaz

Edited September 8, 2017 by chaz

[Western Star]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 3

 

I made the body with HIP. I included the capping strip on the top of the planked sides with its retaining clips, a detail that most wagon kits omit. All the bolts on the model’s body are from plastic rod and pass right though the “planks” and both washer plates (the strapping), inside and out. A touch of madness perhaps, but I wanted to try it - it means a lot of holes to drill.

 A neat and tidy piece of work, very well worth the effort. 

[chaz]

 A neat and tidy piece of work, very well worth the effort. 

 

 

Thanks for that. Despite it being one of the most "ordinary" wagons on Dock Green I am very proud of it. 

 

Chaz

[The Bigbee Line]

Both the above comments are quite right I think. In practice on a model whether the lever goes on the straight side or the curved side is going to depend to some extent on where there is space. In a tangle of lines it may not be possible to put the lever adjacent to the points and it may have to go on the other side of an adjacent track, with the operating rod passing through between the sleepers - as the rodding would on its way to a signal box.

 

Chaz

Sorry to jump in on this one..  As always there will be exceptions, but often, the point levers are on the side that gives the best sighting for the shunter when handsignalling the driver.  It avoids the shunter crossing in front of the move to pull the points.  Where points are close together and there is a space restriction, the lever can be on an extended rod to take the motion under the adjacent track. 

In some yards where there were two shunters, one shunter would be pulling the points and the other would deal with the wagons as they arrived in the relevant siding.

In the Ferry Sidings at Dover the shunting was done with the air brake in operation, but it was still possible to loose shunt.  The air was trapped in the wagons being detached and the coupling uncoupled.  The wagons would then roll without the brakes applying.  The shunter 'receiving' the wagons would nip behind them as the passed and by 'dropping the tap' could bring the wagons to a stand.....  Worked most times.....

In the nearby yard at Dover Town the wagons were shunted loose.  So trips from the Ferry Yard would get the 'strings pulled' on arrival, then shunted into the relevant roads.  2 shunters making it a less onerous task on the legs.  A shift shunting improved the calf muscles no end...

The lesson is to look at the shunting method and that will tell you where to place the levers.

 

By the way, the levers look very nice.

[chaz]

Sorry to jump in on this one..  As always there will be exceptions, but often, the point levers are on the side that gives the best sighting for the shunter when handsignalling the driver.  It avoids the shunter crossing in front of the move to pull the points.  Where points are close together and there is a space restriction, the lever can be on an extended rod to take the motion under the adjacent track. 

In some yards where there were two shunters, one shunter would be pulling the points and the other would deal with the wagons as they arrived in the relevant siding.

In the Ferry Sidings at Dover the shunting was done with the air brake in operation, but it was still possible to loose shunt.  The air was trapped in the wagons being detached and the coupling uncoupled.  The wagons would then roll without the brakes applying.  The shunter 'receiving' the wagons would nip behind them as the passed and by 'dropping the tap' could bring the wagons to a stand.....  Worked most times.....

In the nearby yard at Dover Town the wagons were shunted loose.  So trips from the Ferry Yard would get the 'strings pulled' on arrival, then shunted into the relevant roads.  2 shunters making it a less onerous task on the legs.  A shift shunting improved the calf muscles no end...

The lesson is to look at the shunting method and that will tell you where to place the levers.

 

By the way, the levers look very nice.

 

 

It's always good to hear from those with experience of the real thing.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 4

 

P158040 is another ex-private owner mineral wagon but this one has an end door. It was built from a Slater’s kit (7045) but with pre-printed sides. I wanted to use it to model a faded, battered wagon but still showing parts of its PO lettering.

 

 

I attacked the lettering and painted some of the planks to make them look like replacements. It ran for a time on my old home layout like this but I was never really happy with it and when I started taking Dock Green to shows P158040 was left in a drawer. 

When I decided to model a coal train on Dock Green I looked at my cinderella wagon. What could I do with it to make it more convincing?

 

 

What if BR had painted it in wagon grey, but badly - a quick coat, sloshed on, a token job to obscure the original owner’s lettering?

 

 

I was pleased with that effect - a big improvement on my previous effort. Traces of the PO lettering can just be discerned, the replacement planks show a little and the ironwork continues to rust.

 

 

The six wagons of the coal train sit on the transfer siding waiting for the estate loco to take them down the grade to the coal merchant’s siding on the estate lines. P158040 is the second from the right.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 5

 

Time for another brake van I think. 

 

 

B951459 is an unfitted BR standard 20T van.

 

 

My model was made from a Slater’s plastic kit (7033) which can be built as either the BR or the earlier LNER van. For me this kit has one serious shortcoming; the brackets that support the footboards are very nice lost-wax brass castings but the boards are moulded strips of plastic. It doesn’t seem to matter what glue you use to attach the boards they seem very vulnerable to becoming dislodged. I replaced them with brass ones which I soldered to the brackets. Sorted!

 

 

Please note that Slater’s got their rainstrips wrong, so I have some excuse….

 

 

The unfitted brake van usually runs with the coal train since that traffic was added to the Dock Green schedule. In the photo above 11135 shunts the loaded coal wagons across the yard to the transfer siding. The van will be detached and will go off stage with the train engine, returning much later in the sequence when the empties are sent back to Ferme Park and then on to the north.

 

Chaz

Edited September 10, 2017 by chaz

[chaz]

An interesting and informative series on the Wagons and Vans of Dock Green. Thanks for posting. A particularly like no. 4, the neglected PO wagon. I have (mutter it in hushed tones) a Skytrex coke wagon that I bought really cheaply. The object is to abuse it in the manner you have demonstrated. I need to look at what other work needs doing in order to produce an acceptable model.

 

 

Nothing wrong with starting with a Skytrex wagon. How far you go with it will depend on your own definition of "an acceptable model". I have often said that Dock Green has numerous compromises, far too many to list, but I am happy that seen as a whole it hangs together - nothing looks out of place - and everything contributes to the scene. How far you go with any single wagon is up to you, but may depend on how great a part of the overall scene it will be. Putting it on a shelf with a spotlight on it demands a rather higher standard than running it in a train of several other wagons.

 

Chaz

Edited September 11, 2017 by chaz

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 6

 

 

W9210W is a GW Fruit D. According to David Larkin, in his useful “BR General Parcels Rolling Stock - a Pictorial Survey”, these long wheelbase vans first appeared in the late 1930’s and building continued until 1957. You will have to forgive my mistake - the number should have five digits in the W92xxxW series - an annoying error which will stand as I have no intention of wrecking the paint job to correct it.  Silly me! I just had a closer look and the van is actually numbered W92101W so the number is OK. Phew. I think that number makes it one of a batch that was built in the fifties by BR to the GW design. They must have been very useful vans for the build to continue until 1957.

 

 

My model was made from a WEP etched brass kit. This is a very well thought out kit which builds into an excellent, well detailed model and includes a compensated chassis - possibly more important with such a long van. 

 

 

When the Fruit D’s weren’t needed for fruit or veg’ they were used as parcels vans and could turn up just about anywhere, even Dock Green.

 

 

I painted mine in the early NPCS crimson, but made it filthy by covering the finished livery (fully dried and hardened off) with a grime mix and then immediately cleaning it off. The amount you take off depends on how much white spirit is on the cotton buds. A van this size gets through both ends of four or five of them.

 

That's a Fruit C coupled to the van, which will feature in a later post.

 

Chaz

Edited September 13, 2017 by chaz

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 7

 

M49995 is a LNWR 15T chemical-pan trolley wagon. There is a good drawing of this wagon, of which there were only two, in “British Goods Wagons” by Essery, Rowland and Steel. The caption to this points out that it is very similar to other four wheel trolley wagons. My wagon was made with a Majestic Models etched-brass kit which was very nice to build despite the large number of small rectangles of brass that went into that open “floor”.

 

 

It ran for a time on Dock Green without a load as seen above, coupled to a rectangular tank wagon. I had a load for it, a large round tank, but had hesitated to fit this as I couldn’t figure out an easy way to make it removable. I decided I wanted to run it at shows for variety so compromised and fixed the load. I made a couple of plates which would allow the load to be roped down.

 

 

A brass strip drilled and a couple of small washers found.

 

 

I soldered the washers in place and blackened the fixing plates.

 

 

I put the load in a timber cradle and mounted the plates on the centre spindle on either side with the retaining ropes secured to the plates by links from 3 link couplings. Of course it's no longer to possible run the wagon "empty". One of my operator team suggested I get a second wagon and use this for the unloaded run.    

 

 

A couple of photos of the wagon on Dock Green. I think that load, painted red-oxide, fits in with my approach that everything should be "ordinary" and not look out of place. 

 

 

Because of the way the cassettes are arranged and the sequence runs the Weltrol is invariably coupled to the always-loaded bogie bolster. It's another compromise that I accept - you would have to stand and watch Dock Green for quite a long time before this would strike you as odd (wrong?).

 

Chaz

Edited October 10, 2017 by chaz

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 8

 

 

I don’t know too much about GW wagons but I think this one might be a goods wagon rather than a mineral. It has fallen on hard times though - it probably won’t be long before it finds itself branded “one trip only - loco coal” which would mean it being broken up at a shed after unloading, with the timber being consumed for fire-lighting in a loco’s firebox.

 

 

I made it with a Coopercraft kit which sold very cheaply at the time, in a polythene bag rather than a box. I discarded the awful buffers and treated it to a set of Peco turned jobs. Also I fitted different brake gear, made from spare bits from Slater's kits (you get lots of spare bits in many of these kits). 

 

 

I wish I had added the washer plates (strapping) to the inside but when it first ran it was loaded. I did have fun painting it, making it look like the last traces of paint are clinging on here and there.

 

 

——————————————————————

 

A word or two about the coal loads might be in order.

 

 

When I decided to include a coal train in the Dock Green schedule I got all the mineral wagons together and checked them over. Some of them needed a little attention but the removable coal loads looked very sad, bits of coal had gone and the Plasticene heaps were showing through in places and the real coal had deteriorated and was dusty looking. I made new "heaps" by carving thick pieces of balsa with a chisel. These were painted black and glued to two blocks of balsa to bring them up to the right height in the wagon. Putting the blocks in from the ends means that downward pressure makes the load tip up and it can then be easily removed. As the loads vary in size to suit the wagons I marked them clearly on the underside with the wagon number.

 

 

I coated the tops in PVA and then sprinkled Woodland Scenics coal on. I left them overnight to dry and then inverted them and shook all the loose excess off. The last job was to work the edges back and forth on a sheet of glasspaper so that there were no lumps protruding that would impede fitting and removing the loads from their wagons.

 

 

I had originally intended the coal train to include seven wagons but had to reduce it to six to make it fit the length of the transfer siding.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 9

 

Three more minerals…

 

The all-steel 16T mineral wagon appeared before World War II and eventually became the sole type of wagon of this type, with all of the timber-built wagons disappearing from the tracks. This post deals with three sixteen tonners.

 

 

B257598 is from a Parkside Dundas kit and B31950 is a Peco one. Apart from a few differences in kit “style” the obvious detail difference is the arrangement of the side doors.

 

 

B246199 is another Parkside Dundas kit build. I painted this to look grubby, rather than heavily corroded for variety.

 

 

My coal train may well have too many timber-built minerals - as you can see they are 50/50 with the steel sixteen tonners. By the late fifties I suspect that the steel wagons would predominate and by the time the diesels took over a wooden wagon would have been a rarity. I hereby invoke Rule One. 

 

 

B257598 is my favourite of the three. I am very pleased with how the weathering looks. The “scabby” rust effect along the bottom edge was done with talc dropped onto wet paint.

 

 

The inside of a steel mineral had a hard life. Coal is very abrasive and wet coal is corrosive.

 

 

I used a combination of metallic steel (Humbrol 27003) with rusts colours added. The rust paint will not properly “take” on top of the polished metallic finish but if you scrub away it will form patches that look very realistic to my eye. Some coal dust sprinkled on to the wet paint in the corners is an extra touch.

 

 

Chaz

Edited September 14, 2017 by chaz

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 10

 

A look at a few 9’ & 10’ WB vans.

 

 

M291859 is an LMS 9’ WB unfitted van (D1664) from a Parkside Dundas kit. Nothing unusual about this model but when I was weathering it I brushed plastic solvent onto the paint which caused it to blister in a realistic fashion. In places the paint also flaked revealing the grey plastic underneath, looking satisfactorily like bare wood might.

 

 

M155005 is another LMS van (D1832A), also from a Parkside Dundas kit. It differs from the previous van in being ventilated and having steel ends. The shunters’ chalk scribblings were added with a white Caran D’Ache pencil and the self-adhesive traders label, from Hollar Models, was attacked with a fibreglass brush to make it look worn. These labels were supposed to be removed with the load but were often left in place.

 

 

These two LNER vacuum braked vans are also both from Parkside Dundas kits. E151477, on the left is a 9’ WB van so is not branded “XP”. E187043 is a 10’ WB van and is so marked. I like these Parkside kits, they go together well although the underframe parts need careful work. The floating axleboxes may seem rather an odd way to achieve compensation but they work well enough - I can't remember a Parkside wagon ever derailing on Dock Green.

 

 

E161507 is an LNER 10 Ton Perishable Van made from one of Jim McGeown’s excellent Connoisseur etched brass kits. Although the LNER fitted these with vacuum brakes they were on a 9’ WB and so, like E151477 above, could not be branded “XP” by BR. The inscription on the door - “Fruit only - return empty to March or Peterborough” came from a Parkside kit. With ventilator grills on all four faces and no floor you have to do something to stop the van looking “see-through”. I cut two pieces of thin black card so that they will fit into the van diagonally from corner to corner. Cutting half-high slots in each means they can be fitted in an “X” shape and once the roof is on can be forgotten.

 

 

S45914 is another Parkside kit. The SR vans seemed to get everywhere. Look at any photo’ of a longish goods train and there are likely to be two or three, obvious by that distinctive roof profile. Whoever pasted that trader’s label on was a bit careless and tore it.

M116039 is an old MR outside framed van made from a Slater’s kit. Small numbers of pre-grouping wagons survived in dwindling numbers into the fifties. I like this van - it brings some nicely detailed variety to the stud. Chalk numbers were often seen on wagons and usually referred to sidings in marshalling yards.

 

 

Chaz

Edited September 15, 2017 by chaz

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 11

 

This posting is about three tank wagons.

 

 

The two on the right are from Bachmann Brassworks. They are relatively basic models but make a reasonable addition to the variety on Dock Green. However apart from the couplings and the paintwork the only work I did to these was to add the boards which carry the company name - the fictitious “Zenith Oils Ltd”.

The wagon on the left was a resin kit from Powsides. The underframe was curved like a banana and the tank was such an awful piece of junk that I binned it and rolled a new one in brass. One of the worst wagon kits I have ever seen. I used 10BA nuts running on screws soldered into the brass tank to pull the underframe flat.

 

 

The tank wagons run to and from the estate, where there must be an oil facility and maybe a storage tank. In the picture above an Ixion Hudswell Clarke, “Christine”, brings the empty tanks up the grade from the estate lines. 

 

 

In this picture the Peckett, “Susan” is just tucking the tankers out of the way. Later they will be added to a departing goods train.

 

 

The B1 is about to depart with trip freight for Ferme Park. A running in turn, or was Hornsey a bit stuck for motive power and so “borrowed” Hitchin's 4-6-0 to fill a need?

No barrier wagon is needed between the loco and the wagons as they are used for heavy heating oil, not petrol.

 

 

That Powsides kit does include some nice details so the model will bear closer examination than the Bachmann ones.

 

Chaz

Edited September 16, 2017 by chaz

[keefr2]

Really enjoying seeing all these again Chaz - much more interesting than the repeats on TV...!

 

Keith

[Northroader]

In connection with TV repeats, if you go to Ironbridge in Shropshire, in one corner of the square there's a shop belonging to a Mr. Doxon. A friend who was with me, who happened to be a Stratford apprentice, remarked "Ooh look, Doxon of Dick Green!"

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 12

 

Trawling through the 4,000 odd photos I have of Dock Green can be a frustrating business. Looking for photos of some of the stock can be a challenge - I never set out to photograph everything so some wagons are elusive - camera shy. 

 

Four open wagons with tarpaulins run on Dock Green.

 

 

W86232 is an interesting model. The kit (De Camin?) has the body and the tarpaulin moulded in one piece as a hollow block of resin with the remaining details in white metal. The only change I made was to fit a tinplate floor between the solebars so that I would have something on which to mount the WEP compensators.

 

 

The tarpaulin is nicely moulded with joins and creases.

 

 

W32863 is a Coopercraft GW 5 plank open which I treated to a set of Peco turned buffers and brake parts spare from a Slater’s kit. The tarpaulin is black paper, repeatedly crumpled into a tight ball and flattened out. I made a miniature punch which was rotated rather than struck to cut the grommets from card through which the ropes run. Over several years the black paper has faded - does it needed painting? Or does it suit well as it is? Undecided! In the picture it is coupled to the resin wagon - W86232 - an interesting comparison.

 

 

W31295 is a Coopercraft GW 4 plank open and W28325 is another 5 plank both with the tarpaulin modelled as W32863 is. The 4 plank shows a weakness in the Dean-Churchward brake gear as modelled in the kit. The plastic handle that applied the brakes is very fragile and easily broken - a small white dot is the evidence! I ought to replace this - a brass one would be more robust but DHYB!

 

Chaz

[Tove]

I`m really lov`in your series of photo`s and descripitions Chaz.

It give`s us a nice insight into your methods and the way that you`ve gone about detailing the layout.

 

Thanks for taking the time to post these....Super stuff.....

 

Brian.

[gismorail]

Excellent photographs of the stock for your layout Chaz all of which really make this layout a joy to follow ...

[chaz]

Wagons and Vans on Dock Green 13

 

Time for another brake van I think. 

 

 

E11920 is a NER 10T van. It’s a bit shorter than the later LNER versions but it is obviously the type of van on which these were based. It runs on 3’ 7” wheels rather than the 3’ 2” common to all the later LNER vans. I can’t imagine why it turned up in Dock Green yard but when Jim McGeown added the kit to his Connoisseur range of etched brass I just had to have one. 

 

 

There is something very appealing about brake vans and this one is a charmer! I built mine as per the instructions. With those larger wheels there is no room for compensators so the wheelbase is rigid, with the axles running in brass bushes glued into the white-metal axleboxes. I have come round to the view that unless your track is very bad there is no real need for 7mm finescale wagons to be compensated - I have a few wagons which have neither compensation or springing and they track just as well as those that do.

 

 

I really like the wooden ducket with those small handrails either side - to aid cleaning the lookout glass? In this photo the van is coupled to my Fruit C - which had better feature in the next post…

 

Chaz

Edited September 18, 2017 by chaz