Hornby castle arriving?

[cary hill]

I'm not entirely sure if this is the right place, but having read through the thread it, looks like it is a store of some prototype knowledge ......so.....

 

I'm contemplating renaming some of my Castles so that they represent examples with a 1950's-very early '60s West Country association.

 

I've got one each of Earl Cairns(5053), Beverston Castle (5068) and Ince Castle (7034) to play with.

 

For a change I thought I might dabble with some "non-Castle" names.

 

Ince Castle I'm thinking of renaming as Clun Castle 7029 in double chimney condition.

 

The other two I'm thinking of renaming to two of the following three - Earl of Eldon(5055), Earl St Aldwyn (5059) or Earl of Clancarty (5058).

 

I know Earl Cairns is a "west country" loco but fancy a change.

 

I assume "The South Wales Borderers"(4037) is out as a possible namechange as it is a Star rebuild?

 

Are any of the new Hornby models suitable for renaming as "Viscount Portal" (7000) ?

 

I don't have of a copy of, or access to "The Book of the Castles", so I would very much appreciate any opinions or information relating to soundness or otherwise of any of the above, including detail variations.

 

Thanks

[Coach bogie]

 

I assume "The South Wales Borderers"(4037) is out as a possible namechange as it is a Star rebuild?

 

Thanks

 

You are quite lucky with 4037. It was a Star rebuild in 1926 from Queen Phillipa, renamed in 1937. It was built with the early inside cylinder chest, a slightly smaller version as fitted to Hornby's 5011.HOWEVER by BR days it had been fitted with new inside cylinders. It is the same front end as 5068 you list. Unfortunately I do not have an illustration of the firemans side of 4037. As built 4037 did NOT have a fire iron tunnel. As it has been rebuilt with inside cylinders it is highly likely a tunnel was also fitted, as seen on all the Hornby models. Hornby's 5068 also has the later addition of grip plate fitted over inside cylinders as does 4037 in the shot I have. 4037 has the early tappered buffers still fitted as does 5068, which none of the current later Hornby Castles have as far as I am aware. (The prototype shot I have of 5068 in BR has parallel buffers. Not sure when these were fitted or did Hornby miss this one?)

 

In terms of time period 4037 was the longest lived of the rebuilds withdrawn after a 52 year career in 1962.

 

As an alternative you could consider 5017 which was renamed 'The Gloucestershire Regiment 28th 61st' in 1954. This was a later build (1932) in the same style as 5068(1938), also a large plate and crest on the splasher.

 

Good luck

 

Mike Wiltshire

Edited November 25, 2011 by Coach bogie

[The Stationmaster]

4037 always seemed to look a bit different from other 'Castles' went seen approaching at speed more or less head-on. I was never quite sure why but it seemed a touch 'daintier' (I can't think of another word to describe it) and the interesting thing is that whatever it was it was easily distinguished and could be reliably identified at a considerable distance - you knew it was 4037 long before number or name plates came to notice; strange but true.

[lonesome_whistle]

4037 did get a fire iron tunnel at (or before) the time she got her new front end (straight frames, box type inside cylinder casing). Photographic evidence in the already mentioned 'Book of Castles'.

[cary hill]

Thanks for the information and replies relating to 4037. It's very helpful in reaching my final decisions re which locomotive renamings will be most "correct"

[Great Western]

Hello,

 

I was very surprised to get a notification that Hornby have released 7029 Clun Castle as a standard release fitted with sound !

Does anyone have any experince of the sound fitted Castles, they could share?

Ive watched the videos' of Kidwelly Castle I think it was, but does anyone have an views?

 

Thanks

GW.

[The Fatadder]

My fiancée gave me a gwr 5011 for Christmas with the request that I renunbered it to 5029 Nunney Castle, (the place where I proposed)

Naturally I want to get th model accurate, and knowingbthat castles are something of a mine field, what needs changing?

 

I am also debating changing the gw logo to the post war type o get it o fit in with the rest of my gw stock (even if it is far to big to run on cheddar

[Coach bogie]

My fiancée gave me a gwr 5011 for Christmas with the request that I renunbered it to 5029 Nunney Castle, (the place where I proposed)

Naturally I want to get th model accurate, and knowingbthat castles are something of a mine field, what needs changing?

 

I am also debating changing the gw logo to the post war type o get it o fit in with the rest of my gw stock (even if it is far to big to run on cheddar

Unfortunately Tintagel is from the wrong batch for 5029 with different inside cylinder chest and no fireiron casing. You really need the 5068 Beverston Castle release and can just change the plates. If you are to use 5011, you will need to remove the inside cylinder chest, and source a new one from the 5013 onwards batch and fit. In addition you will need to fabricate a fireiron casing and fit between the rear and middle splasher on the firemans side. Check the buffers against a photographs of your chosen period as there were alterations from taper to parallel during the mid thirties. The image in front of me taken of 5029 in 1958 has parallel buffers and I do not have a Tintagel model to hand to compare.

 

Regards

 

Mike Wiltshire

[The Fatadder]

Thanks for confirming the worst, I had been expecting it

 

Hopefully the post war release in the 2012 range will be more suitable, else will start looking for conversion bits

[gwrrob]

 

 

Hopefully the post war release in the 2012 range will be more suitable, else will start looking for conversion bits

 

Thats an interesting piece of infomation ,roll on the 3rd.

[Dan Hamblin]

Bought 7029 Clun Castle from The Signal Box in their sale - lovely model and a pretty decent set of DCC sounds as well. Had to do a bit of fettling to the tender electrical pick ups as they sometimes stopped the wheels from turning, but other than that there were no problems.

 

Regards,

 

Dan

[Gilwell Park]

Living very near the aforesaid Castle,I can tell you there arent any rivers suitable for Beavers within 10 miles. Its apparently a derivation of the word 'Blue Stone', the fields for which are littered with here abouts. But I digress....

 

Is there anything inaccurate about the configuration for the first build of Beverston castles released last year? If there is can someone point it out, because Id like to make sure mine is as accurate as possible. The only thing I dont like about it is the prominent boiler seam, which I really must try to do something about one day.

 

Hi

 

I gave in and purchased Beverston Castle the other day after waiting to see what was in the 2012 range. Wanting a BR single chimney Collett tender. A beautiful model in appearance and performance. However as it has a low superheat boiler should it have a mechanical lubricator behind the steam pipe? If it should not be there has anyone tried to remove it?

 

Thanks

 

Roger.

[The Stationmaster]

I gave in and purchased Beverston Castle the other day after waiting to see what was in the 2012 range. Wanting a BR single chimney Collett tender. A beautiful model in appearance and performance. However as it has a low superheat boiler should it have a mechanical lubricator behind the steam pipe? If it should not be there has anyone tried to remove it?

Thanks

Roger.

Just a quickie comment (without doing a proper check) but Hornby have been fairly accurate in getting mechanical lubricators on their 'Castles' and usually getting them in the right places. As far as Beverston is concerned I can't remember if it is correct for period but a trip back through this thread will tell you, and provide some interesting reading on the way.

[BR(W)]

Hi

 

I gave in and purchased Beverston Castle the other day after waiting to see what was in the 2012 range. Wanting a BR single chimney Collett tender. A beautiful model in appearance and performance. However as it has a low superheat boiler should it have a mechanical lubricator behind the steam pipe? If it should not be there has anyone tried to remove it?

 

Thanks

 

Roger.

Greetings, GP.

 

No 4073 with low (2 row) superheat had a mechanical lubricator. Nor did they have the handhole covers in front of the top-feed clack housings. Hornby are wrong.

 

They also got the position of the lubricator wrong on 7034, incidentally. She never carried it in front of the steam pipe.

 

Still a cracking model, though. But why still no example with a single chimney, Collett tender and late crest? And why on earth another post-war, double chimney, Collett tender example for 2012, in the shape of 7023, when they've already done 7034?

 

The lubricator can be easily removed (and saved for later use) by slipping a scalpel blade under it. It is pegged and glued in place, so a little touch up black paint will probably be in order.

 

Regards,

 

BR(W).

[Neal Ball]

I emailed Hornby last weekend to see if the Great Western Castle will appear with a Collett tnder, rather then the Hawksworth one. At the time of writing, I have not had a reply.

 

Be nice if we knew a Great Western version is going to make it into the 2013 catalogue. Otherwise, I might have to buy Wellington, get a Collett Castle and back-date it to Devizes Castle.

[gwrrob]

I emailed Hornby last weekend to see if the Great Western Castle will appear with a Collett tnder, rather then the Hawksworth one. At the time of writing, I have not had a reply.

 

Simon Kohler has quoted a photo shewing a Hawksworth tender behind 'Wellington' in May 1948 so I'm not expecting Hornby to change their mind on this mores the pity.Its a shame you can't buy a Collett tender seperately Neal.Its been released for all those who bought choc/cream Hawksworth coaches to pull.

[Guest dilbert]

Simon Kohler has quoted a photo shewing a Hawksworth tender behind 'Wellington' in May 1948 so I'm not expecting Hornby to change their mind on this mores the pity.Its a shame you can't buy a Collett tender seperately Neal.Its been released for all those who bought choc/cream Hawksworth coaches to pull.

 

I am one of those people that bought several of these choc/cream coaches - it's for those alternative historical occasions when nothing changed 1.1.48. I also have some of the teak coaches patiently awaiting a Class EE1 (another historical anomaly awaiting to be righted).

 

On a more serious note, many moons ago I did send an email to Bachmann about the possibility of issuing loco tenders as separate items. Merl Evans kindly replied stating amongst other things that getting a consitent paint finish between batches was problematic. This could still be the case today, but even if the paint matching aspects have been technically fixed, the commercial aspects would probably become very difficult with the availability of all tender livery variants across eras and different companies.

 

Undecorated tenders would be interesting, but in reality I don't believe this is going to happen... dilbert

[Neal Ball]

Simon Kohler has quoted a photo shewing a Hawksworth tender behind 'Wellington' in May 1948 so I'm not expecting Hornby to change their mind on this mores the pity.Its a shame you can't buy a Collett tender seperately Neal.Its been released for all those who bought choc/cream Hawksworth coaches to pull.

 

Last year I chose not to buy the Hawksworth coaches and have now caught a cold! I decided against as they are too late in the period I model, preferring to stick to the mid-thirties. I am surprised the coaches only stayed in the catalogue for 1 year though in the GWR livery.

 

....On a more serious note, many moons ago I did send an email to Bachmann about the possibility of issuing loco tenders as separate items. Merl Evans kindly replied stating amongst other things that getting a consitent paint finish between batches was problematic. This could still be the case today, but even if the paint matching aspects have been technically fixed, the commercial aspects would probably become very difficult with the availability of all tender livery variants across eras and different companies.

 

Undecorated tenders would be interesting, but in reality I don't believe this is going to happen... dilbert

 

It's a good idea, but it's like the guys in the Dapol Western thread calling for un-numbered locos - that could limit the sales of that loco..... If tenders were available separately, again it could limit the sales of locos as it would be so easier to swap around. But I take the point about colour differences, which would show up very clearly and we would all be up in arms about that one!

 

Clearly, I have a choice:

1. Wait until 2013 in the hope the Castle gets released as a GWR loco with a Collett tender.

2. Find another Tintagel Castle on Ebay and renumber.

3. Buy Wellington and put up with the Tender.

4. Find a Kit manufactorer who has a Collett tender.

 

I have just found that the Hornby website still has quantities of Tintagel in stock, so option 2 it is then.... now which number will the new one adopt???

 

I guess the point though is that I would have expected a reply from Hornby. I received the auto reply, but nothing from a human. Maybe Dilbert could slip it into the conversation next time someone in the office talks to Simon!

Edited January 21, 2012 by Neal Ball

[The Fatadder]

Is there a list anywhere of which castles had the Hanksworth tender with G crest W branding in '47/48?

 

I've just seen the photo of 5022 in Russell described as 1948 Condition, which got me wondering if there were any other low numbered castles that got one. My thinking being that I want the loco from Wellington Castle to use for my Nunney Castle along with the tender from my Tintagnal Castle, which leaves me a low numbered loco and a Hanksworth tender to find a use for.

[lonesome_whistle]

Is there a list anywhere of which castles had the Hanksworth tender with G crest W branding in '47/48?

 

I've just seen the photo of 5022 in Russell described as 1948 Condition, which got me wondering if there were any other low numbered castles that got one. My thinking being that I want the loco from Wellington Castle to use for my Nunney Castle along with the tender from my Tintagnal Castle, which leaves me a low numbered loco and a Hanksworth tender to find a use for.

 

The Book of the Castles is probably your best bet and although it doesn't give livery details it's a fair bet to say that most Hawksworth tenders attached to Castles in 46 or 47 would have had 'G crest W' branding. Each loco has a page dedicated to shopping dates and tenders (including tender number). 5022, for example, had two different Hawksworth tenders between 2/10/46 and 2/3/48 before reverting to a Collet tender. It again had a Hawksworth tender from 7/5/53 to 17/1/55 according to the book.

 

Pre-5013 Castles that had Hawksworth tenders prior to nationalisation were 4083, 4085, 4092 and 5000 (just for one month!).

[The Fatadder]

Thanks, will keep an eye out for that book

[The Stationmaster]

Last year I chose not to buy the Hawksworth coaches and have now caught a cold! I decided against as they are too late in the period I model, preferring to stick to the mid-thirties. I am surprised the coaches only stayed in the catalogue for 1 year though in the GWR livery.

My local model shop has plenty of Hawksworths on the shelves although I don't know about the livery - but easy enough to ask Graham if I can have a look through the lot. But his prices are pretty close to RRP.

[Guest dilbert]

Last year I chose not to buy the Hawksworth coaches and have now caught a cold! I decided against as they are too late in the period I model, preferring to stick to the mid-thirties. I am surprised the coaches only stayed in the catalogue for 1 year though in the GWR livery.

 

Rails of Sheffield seem to have stocks - they even have a special offer for all five GW variants for £130 - at £26 per coach that is good value.

 

I guess the point though is that I would have expected a reply from Hornby. I received the auto reply, but nothing from a human.

 

I have only received auto replies from Hornby. I get the impression that if you receive a personal reply from any manufacturer it address points/concerns/suggestions originally raised that are not part of the mainstream type of requests of which there must be many. As such, not receiving a personal reply is not an issue for myself... dilbert

[Gilwell Park]

Greetings, GP.

 

No 4073 with low (2 row) superheat had a mechanical lubricator. Nor did they have the handhole covers in front of the top-feed clack housings. Hornby are wrong.

 

They also got the position of the lubricator wrong on 7034, incidentally. She never carried it in front of the steam pipe.

 

Still a cracking model, though. But why still no example with a single chimney, Collett tender and late crest? And why on earth another post-war, double chimney, Collett tender example for 2012, in the shape of 7023, when they've already done 7034?

 

The lubricator can be easily removed (and saved for later use) by slipping a scalpel blade under it. It is pegged and glued in place, so a little touch up black paint will probably be in order.

 

Regards,

 

BR(W).

 

BR/W. Thanks for the information, I will, carefully, apply a scalpel to my castle. Being so impressed with my castle I would be tempted by a double chimney, Hawksworth tender version if Hornby were to produce one.

 

Thank you

 

Roger.

[6959]

My local model shop has plenty of Hawksworths on the shelves although I don't know about the livery - but easy enough to ask Graham if I can have a look through the lot. But his prices are pretty close to RRP.

 

Checked Rails of Sheffield on 21 January for special offer of 5x GWR Hawksworth - web page says sold out.