David Bigcheeseplant Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 I was thinking most of the big four had joint lines with each other LMS/LNER, LNER/GWR even LMS and Southern round Bristol and on the Somerset & Dorset but I can't think of a joint LNER/Southern line anywhere any suggestions? David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Del Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 What's now Thameslink around Farringdon, certainly saw LNER engines (I have a pic of a J50 near Smithfield Sidings) but it's not a Joint line as such. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 There was the East London Joint Committee (including the GER, LB&SC, SE&CR and Metropolitan). This left the GER at Bishopsgate Jn, through Shoreditch and Whitechapel, under the Thames (in Marc Brunel's tunnel) to the LB&SCR at New Cross Gate and the SE&CR at New Cross. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
asmay2002 Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 East London Joint was GER/LBSCR/SECR/Met/District. D'Oh beaten to it.t Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 What's now Thameslink around Farringdon, certainly saw LNER engines (I have a pic of a J50 near Smithfield Sidings) but it's not a Joint line as such. And pre-WWI it was used by SECR services to North London suburban stations. I think the two lines mentioned - the City Widened lines (now Thameslink) and the East London Line, were the only two places where the SR and LNER met. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 At last we have a reason why northerners and southerners don't see eye to eye. In addition to the disagreements over third rail and caternary Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roythebus Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Remember the West London Line, though not joint LNER/SR would have seen both companies stock working through. How about the Dudding Hill line? That I think was LNER but joined the SR at Kew. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lurker Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 I have read of ER excursions departing Liverpool Street and heading down the ELL and thence to the North Kent Coast; Whitstable, Herne Bay etc. I can't think where the references to those are off the top of my head and I am supposed to be working at present! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbishop Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 An ex girlfriend remembered an excursion from Loughton to Eastbourne via Liverpool Street: reckon about 1955. Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 At last we have a reason why northerners and southerners don't see eye to eye. Until the latter were Bulleid into submission... The 'jointness' of London is underexploited. both by modellers and the RTR manufacturers. Here was the place where the most meetings took place. Modelling the KX area I can have loco types off LMR, SR and WR every day as the goods were tripped around the metropolis. Sadly, KX loco request to trial an ex GW 2-8-0T never came off though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidH Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 There were coal depots in south London operated by other companies, e.g. Midland at Brixton or Midland/LNWR at Peckham Rye. Trains over the Widened Lines were operated for a long time by condensing Midland 0-6-0Ts of 2441 class or displaced 2-6-2Ts, and J50s, with N1s (and probably others but I'm going by photos I've seen) banking up to Ludgate Hill. British Railways Illustrated Vol 16( 8 ) (2007) has an article on the Midland workings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoingUnderground Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Remember that the Widened lines through to Moorgate were built and owned by the Metropolitan Railway and were built with connections to the GNR at Kings Cross. It was the GNR that provided locos when the Met fell out with the GWR during 1863. The connection from Farringdon to Ludgate Circus through the Snow Hill tunnel was built by the LCDR in 1865. The Thames, and of course central London itself, with the prohibition on lines through the centre of London was a natural barrier to LNER/SR joint lines. The nearest that could be said to be a Joint line was when Sir Edward Watkin chaired the GC, the Met and through that controlled the East London Line, and the SER. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzie Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 I have seen reference to regular Liverpool St - Croydon services, and I think that the departure indicators at Liverpool Street (before the electric indicators were installed) included East Croydon as a destination (might be on the ones preserved at Mangaps Farm).Might be similarto the 1992 central line tube stock including a destination of Ongar! I just had a look in J.E. Connor's Liverpool Street to Ilford which mentions that the Surrey services had stopped by the time of the grouping in 1923 which precludes LNER and SR. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 I think that a lot of the cross London passenger services (including the ones through the Widened lines) were 'suspended for the duration' during World War I (in about '16/'17) and never reinstated at the end of the war. There's an interesting book by Charles Klapper which includes some details. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roythebus Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Remember too the GW broad gauge service from Paddington to Victoria via the WLL! The Gw also had a coal depot at Clapham Junction on the Brighton side. I'm sure the LNER had a coal depot in Battersea near the Dogs' Home. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagonman Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Remember the West London Line, though not joint LNER/SR would have seen both companies stock working through. How about the Dudding Hill line? That I think was LNER but joined the SR at Kew. The Dudding Hill line was pure Midland, though there was a spur from the GCR at Neasden. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted October 19, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 19, 2012 Remember too the GW broad gauge service from Paddington to Victoria via the WLL! The Gw also had a coal depot at Clapham Junction on the Brighton side. I'm sure the LNER had a coal depot in Battersea near the Dogs' Home. Battersea Coal was Midland as far as I can trace while South Lambeth Goods - to the north of it - was Great Western. Although regular GWR services to Victoria ceased in 1915 (22 March) the GWR remained a joint lessee of the eastern part of Victoria station until nationalisation. The GWR received powers in 1859 to lay broad gauge rails into Victoria but I'm not certain if these were exercised. The oldest service timetable I have for the area is 1892 and it shows the trains as 'Narrow Gauge'; at that time there were 6 trains in each direction daily between Southall and Victoria and in the 1901 service timetable there were nine - no Sunday service. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagonman Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Battersea Coal was Midland as far as I can trace while South Lambeth Goods - to the north of it - was Great Western. Although regular GWR services to Victoria ceased in 1915 (22 March) the GWR remained a joint lessee of the eastern part of Victoria station until nationalisation. The GWR received powers in 1859 to lay broad gauge rails into Victoria but I'm not certain if these were exercised. The oldest service timetable I have for the area is 1892 and it shows the trains as 'Narrow Gauge'; at that time there were 6 trains in each direction daily between Southall and Victoria and in the 1901 service timetable there were nine - no Sunday service. The broad gauge were definitely laid into Victoria and so far as I know were used for a while at least. I think there is a photo of a GW train at Victoria showing BG track in situ, but I can't remember what gauge the train was. A quick question on the BGS Yahoo list might elicit an answer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium keefer Posted October 19, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 19, 2012 Battersea Coal was Midland as far as I can trace while South Lambeth Goods - to the north of it - was Great Western. as shown on RCH junction diagram 017: for the East London Line north end, diagram 045: East London Line south end, diagram 091 finally one showing the KX/farringdon/holborn area, diagram 084 note: all images stated as being public domain as on this page Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord-Claud-Hamilton Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 What about Oxford? Obviously not a joint line, but the LNER and SR both worked to Oxford. I've read reports of V2, B12, D16 & K3's working into Oxford and I've see a photo of a 4-4-2 Atlantic in LNER livery hauling GWR coaches on it's way to Sheffield. In fact, I think Oxford is one of the very few stations that all of 'Big Four' working it. I've always been surpised that it hasnt been modelled before actually. If I could find a decent track plan of it I'd do it Trainz actually. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roythebus Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 One tends to forget places like Oxford as a joint running place! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.