Wright writes.....

[asmay2002]

I suppose a nation being founded on a persecuted religious group sounds better than one founded on the sale of an addictive drug.

They were not a persecuted religious group.  They were not prepared to tolerate anybody who didn't share their narrow views (i.e they wanted the freedom to persecute others).

[Clive Mortimore]

They were not a persecuted religious group.  They were not prepared to tolerate anybody who didn't share their narrow views (i.e they wanted the freedom to persecute others).

You know that and I know that but again you cannot go around saying these poor God fearing people wanted to do harm to anyone but were themselves victims that is why they had to flee their home land and start a new nation that allowed them to have the freedom to persecute others.

[Tony Wright]

Some early morning questions, if I may, please? 

 

It's fallen my way again to write some captions for some stonking pictures taken at Lincoln and Doncaster for BRILL. 

 

 

This view shows BRITANNIA on what (I assume) is the Liverpool-Harwich boat train. The leading vehicle is E9152E. It's either steel or ply by the lack of beading. I'm going to go through my lists later, but does anyone know exactly what type of car it is? 

 

 

Another Brit at Lincoln. Anyone know what the goods working might be, please? 

 

 

This is interesting, and it's dated 3 6 '62, showing a Mk.1 on its side. The incident must have made the local press at least. Anyone know any details? 

 

On to Doncaster. 

 

 

I'm fairly sure this is the most westerly part of Donny Station. Am I right?

 

 

Brit 70005 on what could well be a York-Colchester working (or Glasgow-Colchester?). The leading car is one of the ex-Tourist Buffet Cars, running on standard bogies. My question is; is the church in the background dedicated to St. John? And, was it built by the railway? Out of possible interest, for those who can't build their cabs straight, don't worry!

 

 

What's the origin of the second carriage in this set, please?

 

 

And the first one in this, please?

 

 

Does the 'Grand' in the background here denote an hotel, a theatre or cinema, please?

 

 

Finally, a V2 on the drum cement cars, shortly before the pair of Type 3s appeared on this Scotland-Kent working (at least south of York). 

 

Many thanks in anticipation. 

Edited April 24, 2017 by Tony Wright

[APOLLO]

Tony here's a report on the accident at Lincoln pictured above (which I presume is the photo location - the date matches)

 

http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/docsummary.php?docID=285

 

Brit15

[CoViAnna]

It's a Theatre.

http://www.arthurlloyd.co.uk/DoncasterTheatresSouthYorkshire.htm

[jwealleans]

Yo, Tony!

 

The carriage behind 68813 is North Eastern - I don't have the diagram books for those, but someone will know. I think the one above is an early Great Northern Gresley, but I'm not sure. I'll ask John Smart to have a look, he's got the eye for this kind of thing.

Edited April 24, 2017 by jwealleans

[LNER4479]

Is the first Donny picture not in fact the north east corner of the station, is the train is running in from the north into what is now platform 1 (was it so numbered then)? In which case the photographer is standing on what is now the recently opened platform 0(!)

[CoViAnna]

I think it is St. James Church.

http://www.heritageinspired.org.uk/partner?partner_ID=34

Edited April 24, 2017 by CoViAnna

[asmay2002]

E9152E Tourist stock Buffet car?

[Tony Wright]

Is the first Donny picture not in fact the north east corner of the station, is the train is running in from the north into what is now platform 1 (was it so numbered then)? In which case the photographer is standing on what is now the recently opened platform 0(!)

Thanks Graham,

 

The loco (in full forward gear) appears to be in siding.

[Tony Wright]

E9152E Tourist stock Buffet car?

Thanks Andy,

 

I've checked, and it is. 

 

The working could well be the boat train. In B17-haulage days, the catering car was an ex-GER type. 

[DougN]

Tony those photos are fantastic. I must admit that I enjoy BRILL but bearly ever purchase a copy as they are hard to come by here in my part of melbourne... but I would only be buying them for the photos... My fav from years and years ago (OK i was at Uni and I finished in 1997!) was a V2 running in reverse with 2 coachs.... it was the only photo that really interested me. The other problem is most if not all of these types of photos are of the BR period which is good for the scenes as the buildings and track change very very slowly compared to the trains that ran from place to place... but I do enjoy good LNER period photos! 

[Mallard60022]

Is the first Donny picture not in fact the north east corner of the station, is the train is running in from the north into what is now platform 1 (was it so numbered then)? In which case the photographer is standing on what is now the recently opened platform 0(!)

The picture of 61454 is a bit of a mystery but I would tend to agree that it is the NE end of Donny. Almost all this area has vanished under the Frenchgate and Bus Station I would surmise, however the buildings background left are a puzzle. The building in front right of the loco looks like part of the existing old Platform 1, north end?  We need a Donny spotter from back then to see this.

Phil

[CoViAnna]

It is the North East end of Doncaster station. From my 80s spotting days this was the area just next to the station car park. Usually had a grotty 08 parked there and an odd flat wagon or two.

[jwealleans]

Didn't someone post some images of that end of Doncaster taken from a fairly high vantage point and a number of years apart some time ago? That would give a better idea of the track layout and location.

[CoViAnna]

I have just been looking online for the elevated photos you mention but cannot find any. Like you I am sure there were some.

[ArthurK]

The carriage behind 68813 is N ER 5comp brake third Dia. 150. there is a drawing in "Historic Carriage Drawings" Vol 1 by Nick Campling

 

ArthurK

[CoViAnna]

Found a photo online showing the north East end.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/loose_grip_99/8361745384

 

The photo TW posted being taken from the carpark on the left just beyond the stored carriages.

[Tony Wright]

Tony those photos are fantastic. I must admit that I enjoy BRILL but bearly ever purchase a copy as they are hard to come by here in my part of melbourne... but I would only be buying them for the photos... My fav from years and years ago (OK i was at Uni and I finished in 1997!) was a V2 running in reverse with 2 coachs.... it was the only photo that really interested me. The other problem is most if not all of these types of photos are of the BR period which is good for the scenes as the buildings and track change very very slowly compared to the trains that ran from place to place... but I do enjoy good LNER period photos! 

Doug,

 

There are about 30 for me to write comments on - all of them brilliant (the pictures, not the comments). 

 

BRILL's readership is mainly late middle-aged men, who remember those 'black & white' days of their youth in the late-'40s/'50s/-early'60s, hence the preponderance of BR steam shots. 

 

I'm writing about my urchin experiences at Doncaster. Though it wasn't my first visit to that unrivalled railway location, an August day in 1958 stands out in my memory. Within the first few minutes I saw HUNTINGDONSHIRE arrive on a local from Hull, ENTERPRISE depart on an UP express, to be followed by MERLIN on the Up Elizabethan, 61448 on a Down goods, WILLIAM HENTON CARVER on an express from Hull, passing SIR FREDERICK BANBURY stationary on the Down through, light-engine, THE PERCY depart on a northbound local and KINGFISHER arrive light-engine, fresh from the Plant; not to mention JOHN BUNYAN and DWIGHT D EISENHOWER outside the paint shop (spied on our way to the station). All within the first hour! 

 

I can't wait for the first time machine to be invented! 

Edited April 24, 2017 by Tony Wright

[Tony Wright]

The carriage behind 68813 is N ER 5comp brake third Dia. 150. there is a drawing in "Historic Carriage Drawings" Vol 1 by Nick Campling

 

ArthurK

Thanks Arthur,

 

I've got the book. I should be less indolent!

[LNER4479]

Thanks Graham,

 

The loco (in full forward gear) appears to be in siding.

Hello Tony,

 

Others appear to have 'nailed' the location. I'm 99% certain it is a running line though. Based on a combination of the loco and the first vehicle we can reasonably surmise that this is a southbound freight train and is probably being routed through Plat 1 to keep it out of the way of the main station. Note that both of the sidings alongside the loco have trap points and shunt signals protecting them from the running line the train is on - if it (the train) was also in a siding then these would probably not be necessary.

[t-b-g]

Just for once I can tell where a "mystery" photo was taken and others have beaten me to it. The B16 is just pulling out of one of the up sidings (which were more loops than sidings as they were connected both ends) and is about to run along Platform 1. The brick building top right is the station announcer's cabin situated at the North end of platforms 1 and 4. The trainspotter is standing on what has been known as the cattle dock for as long as I recall but it is many years since it was used for that purpose. The sidings were known as the cattle dock sidings but I don't know if that was an official or a local name.

[ArthurK]

The second carriage behind 68813 is almost certainly also NER. The NER built a lot of these semi corridor layout with centre lavatory. Not sure of the diagram No. The third is probably also NER arc roof stock.

 

ArthurK

Edited April 24, 2017 by ArthurK

[great central]

The Britannia at Lincoln is the one we used to know as 'Ruddy Kippers' when it appeared on the Grimsby-Whitland fish train. I reckon the picture was taken when it was an Immingham loco with the smoke box hinge straps, etc picked out in silver or white, something of a trade mark I believe. No idea of the working I'm afraid but a good bet would be it taking the Grimsby line from Lincoln so might even be the back working from the previous evenings fish? Pure conjecture I'm afraid but a great set of pictures

[jwealleans]

The second carriage behind 68813 is almost certainly also NER. The NER built a lot of these semi corridor layout with centre lavatory. Not sure of the diagram No. The third is probably also NER arc roof stock.

I'm going to stick my neck out and disagree with Arthur here - dangerous ground on matters NER - but I think the second carriage is a Gresley D49/50. I've just built the very similar D244. The third one, what can be seen of it, certainly does look arc roof.

 

Edit - looking at the Comet web page to check the diagram number reminded me that I meant to show you this, Tony - a carriage you and Tom Foster built for his layout, which I've just finished painting for him. It will run in what I think is called a B set with a very similar vehicle for which he commissioned the sides from Worsley Works.

 

Edited July 11, 2018 by jwealleans