Wright writes.....

[65179]

On 06/10/2023 at 17:50, rowanj said:

I hope I will be forgiven for posing this here. I have posted the query on my own threads, and have received helpul but also conflicting information. I know son#me very knowledeable folk inhabit here, so here goes.

 

I want to assemble an accurate 3 coach push-pull rake, as seen on the Blyth-Monkseaton service in BR days up to 1958, to go with the TMC G5. I attach 2  of the several photos I have - pls note these are copyrighted- and my questions are.

 

1, What are the diagrams/ origins of the 2 different driving trailers, and does anyone know of a suitable kit?

 

2. Can anyone identify the other 2 pairs of coaches?

 

John

 

I listed the NER driving trailers on one of rowanj's own threads, but the full set looks like (starting at the loco end):

 

First train: LNER D64 BT p&p conversion (D320 as converted), LNER D56 T (p&p modified),  D213 NER 52ft Driving brake third.

 

Second train: all NER, D213 52ft Driving BT, D178 49ft T, D162 52ft DBC.

 

Edit: new evidence suggests what I had as D65 should have been D64, both BT(4)s.

 

Simon

Edited October 8, 2023 by 65179
Wrong diagram number for BT(4) conversion

[Mark Laidlay]

10 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good afternoon Mark,

 

I had no idea that Trix were making another FLYING SCOTSMAN. What scale is it, please? The bogie wheels look like N Gauge. 

 

Though the dome looks to be right, the chimney seems to have come off a battleship! 

 

Looking further at the image, the cabside numbers are too small and too squeezed together, and the tender's BR device is too big. 

 

The eccentric crank is leaning the wrong way - backwards. 

 

How much is it, please?

 

My 40+ year old FLYING SCOTSMAN is still going strong.....

 

 

 

Seen in Bytham's early days. I made it from an old Wills kit, with a K's P2 tender and scratch-built frames/Jamieson valve gear. The painting is all mine.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Well Trix is Marklin's 2 rail brand, a bit deceptive of me, in days past they they used the Hamo name.  I don't do preserved locos, but this is my only exception, I would prefer a apple green version as it visited Australia in 1988.  The only other option in H0 was a nice brass version at 2.5 times the price of the Marklin/Trix.  I had hoped that some Australian company would commission DJH to do a kit, it would have been easier than most as DJH would already have most of the information required, just change the scale.  It sounds like the Trix model is a bit scary, I wonder if someone will do a replacement chimney?  That might help with the most glaring issue.

 

It's costing me about 400 quid plus postage, no VAT for me.

 

Mark in Melbourne

 

Edited October 7, 2023 by Mark Laidlay

[jwealleans]

8 hours ago, 65179 said:

First train: LNER D65 BT p&p conversion

 

Is it the wrong way round, Simon, or was the conversion in the end compartment?

 

 

 

 

[65179]

3 hours ago, jwealleans said:

 

Is it the wrong way round, Simon, or was the conversion in the end compartment?

 

As I've suggested elsewhere Jonathan, driving trailers aren't really my area of expertise, but it appears that in both photos all the driving trailers are facing the same way and that this was normal. This is consistent with a previous discussion here: 

 

This also makes me think that the D65 is in fact a D64  (D320 as converted) and is in fact Fox bogied E86997E referred to in the linked thread. The driving positon is in the brake end as normal (see D320 diagram at page 112 of Harris, LNER Standard Gresley Carriages).

 

Simon

Edited October 7, 2023 by 65179

[Tony Wright]

6 hours ago, Mark Laidlay said:

Well Trix is Marklin's 2 rail brand, a bit deceptive of me, in days past they they used the Hamo name.  I don't do preserved locos, but this is my only exception, I would prefer a apple green version as it visited Australia in 1988.  The only other option in H0 was a nice brass version at 2.5 times the price of the Marklin/Trix.  I had hoped that some Australian company would commission DJH to do a kit, it would have been easier than most as DJH would already have most of the information required, just change the scale.  It sounds like the Trix model is a bit scary, I wonder if someone will do a replacement chimney?  That might help with the most glaring issue.

 

It's costing me about 400 quid plus postage, no VAT for me.

 

Mark in Melbourne

 

Thanks Mark,

 

Your FLYING SCOTSMAN clearly looks to be aimed at the collectors' market; a market where, in many (most?) cases, fidelity to prototype hardly matters. Though the Trix/Marklin 60103 does actually represent the loco in one of its many manifestations (current?), it's its 'detail' peculiarities which seem to make it an 'inaccurate' representation. I take it the 400 quid is English pounds, making that around 800 A dollars? If so, wow!

 

Regarding 'collectable' FLYING SCOTSMANS (or should the plural be SCOTSMEN?), has any locomotive had more models made of it? 

 

Models like these...........

 

 

An original Bassett Lowke O Gauge FLYING SCOTSMAN from the '30s. It should be RH-drive. I was told that this was worth a lot of money!

 

 

 

The same model was perpetuated post-War (complete with corridor tender), still as an A1, but with left-hand drive (assuming it has a drive-side). 

 

Believe it or not, I was consulted by Bassett Lowke's representative when the product name and the loco were reintroduced in this century, still in O Gauge.

 

 

This was the first 'proving' model for FLYING SCOTSMAN in BR days from Bassett Lowke. Correct drive-side, an A3, handrails clipped to the smokebox ring, a streamlined dome and a streamlined non-corridor tender. 

 

 

The model was taken further to produce 60103 in her final BR manifestation (though the frame-mounted guard irons should have been removed).

 

Though clearly aimed at the collectors' market, this model (in terms of detail) is far more-accurate than many RTR representations which have gone before. 

 

 

The model was taken even further to represent 4472 in preservation, after she acquired a second tender. Though it can't be seen from this angle, the leading tender even has a cut-down rear!

 

Another FLYING SCOTSMAN in O Gauge aimed at collectors was that produced by ACE......

 

 

 

The detail anomalies with this are legion.

 

 

As they are with this manifestation. 

 

In truth, these are not aimed at the purists (though they're certainly not cheap!). They appeal to the nostalgia of a time gone by, they'll pull anything put behind their tenders, go like stink and they're beautifully-made/finished.

 

Is that the market which the Trix/Marklin model is aimed at, I wonder? 

 

 

ACE also produced an A4 to the same 'standard'.

 

 

And we've had Hatton's FLYING SCOTSMAN RTR in O Gauge. 

 

 

The late Dennis Brownlee (or is it Denys?) got his FS dead right, in 2mm FS!

 

From a personal perspective, I've never been into collecting at any level, but this hobby accommodates all.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

[DenysW]

39 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Is that the market which the Trix/Marklin model is aimed at, I wonder?

Modern Märklin is mostly continental-profile AC using their own special track for HO. It makes the third 'rail' fairly unobtrusive. They do have functioning catenary if you want even more electrickery problems than normal. Trix is now the same thing in DC. Z-scale is Märklin in DC, however.

 

Beautiful detailing, prices say twice British RTR.

[65179]

55 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks Mark,

 

Your FLYING SCOTSMAN clearly looks to be aimed at the collectors' market; a market where, in many (most?) cases, fidelity to prototype hardly matters. Though the Trix/Marklin 60103 does actually represent the loco in one of its many manifestations (current?), it's its 'detail' peculiarities which seem to make it an 'inaccurate' representation. I take it the 400 quid is English pounds, making that around 800 A dollars? If so, wow!

 

Regarding 'collectable' FLYING SCOTSMANS (or should the plural be SCOTSMEN?), has any locomotive had more models made of it? 

 

Models like these...........

 

 

An original Bassett Lowke O Gauge FLYING SCOTSMAN from the '30s. It should be RH-drive. I was told that this was worth a lot of money!

 

 

 

The same model was perpetuated post-War (complete with corridor tender), still as an A1, but with left-hand drive (assuming it has a drive-side). 

 

Believe it or not, I was consulted by Bassett Lowke's representative when the product name and the loco were reintroduced in this century, still in O Gauge.

 

 

This was the first 'proving' model for FLYING SCOTSMAN in BR days from Bassett Lowke. Correct drive-side, an A3, handrails clipped to the smokebox ring, a streamlined dome and a streamlined non-corridor tender. 

 

 

The model was taken further to produce 60103 in her final BR manifestation (though the frame-mounted guard irons should have been removed).

 

Though clearly aimed at the collectors' market, this model (in terms of detail) is far more-accurate than many RTR representations which have gone before. 

 

 

The model was taken even further to represent 4472 in preservation, after she acquired a second tender. Though it can't be seen from this angle, the leading tender even has a cut-down rear!

 

Another FLYING SCOTSMAN in O Gauge aimed at collectors was that produced by ACE......

 

 

 

The detail anomalies with this are legion.

 

 

As they are with this manifestation. 

 

In truth, these are not aimed at the purists (though they're certainly not cheap!). They appeal to the nostalgia of a time gone by, they'll pull anything put behind their tenders, go like stink and they're beautifully-made/finished.

 

Is that the market which the Trix/Marklin model is aimed at, I wonder? 

 

 

ACE also produced an A4 to the same 'standard'.

 

 

And we've had Hatton's FLYING SCOTSMAN RTR in O Gauge. 

 

 

The late Dennis Brownlee (or is it Denys?) got his FS dead right, in 2mm FS!

 

From a personal perspective, I've never been into collecting at any level, but this hobby accommodates all.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

 

It was Denys.

 

Simon

[sandra]

Hello Tony, 

 

The only rival to Flying Scotsman could be Mallard but I suspect it doesn’t come close. There is a Flying Scotsman on Retford but it’s a repainted and reworked Hornby blue model. It has rather limited pulling power which is why it’s on a local stopper.However if you wish to see a poor model of Flying Scotsman how about this:It’s almost magnificent in its awfulness. But it does have the number 4472 and an interesting variation of the LNER livery.

 

Sandra

[St Enodoc]

20 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good afternoon Jesse,

 

This one............. The 'cursed' Ivatt 4MT 2-6-0! Which I'm sure I've mentioned before, but hundreds of pages back. 

 

 

 

 

Scratch-built, it must have been started at least 50 years ago, and down the years the guy who started it died, the guy who inherited it (and did some more on it) died, and the guy who then inherited it (who did some more on it) also died! My mate, who's inherited it so far, asked would I like to complete it. Would I? 

 

Most of the loco bodywork was completed, as was the tender's bodywork, but both had the 'grot' of decades firmly stuck in place. Mike Edge kindly cleaned it all up (thanks again Mike), I then built the chassis for it, finished off the detailing, painted and weathered it. 

 

My friend is still alive, as am I. It would seem that the 'curse' is quite specific. One can own it and work on it, and then die! Or, one can own it, but do nothing to it. Then one can work on it, even complete it, as long as one doesn't own it, with complete impunity - or so it seems so far. Time will tell.

 

Right now it's borrowed for use on Little Bytham. It's definitely not mine!

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Nothing out of the ordinary there, given that we're all going to die one day...

[60027Merlin]

Continuing the A3 model varieties, although not Flying Scotsman, here is an HO model.

 

One of my railway pals visited the layout about 10 years ago and brought with him an A3 model he purchased some years earlier. The difference being it is modelled in HO scale. 

 

The model was produced about 30 years ago by Samhongsa of Korea. 150 were produced of Flying Scotsman in LNER livery plus 25 in BR livery. In addition, a further  5 of each were produced for Knight of Thistle, Robert the Devil, Melton, Galtee More and Papyrus.

 

An interesting comparison with the OO model. Needless to say I much prefer the OO one!

 

 

 

 

[Andy Hayter]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks Mark,

 

Your FLYING SCOTSMAN clearly looks to be aimed at the collectors' market; a market where, in many (most?) cases, fidelity to prototype hardly matters. Though the Trix/Marklin 60103 does actually represent the loco in one of its many manifestations (current?), it's its 'detail' peculiarities which seem to make it an 'inaccurate' representation. I take it the 400 quid is English pounds, making that around 800 A dollars? If so, wow!

 

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

 

Who knows if the model is aimed at collectors or not - probably no one outside of Maerklin's marketing.

 

If your comment is based on price, then I have to advise that continental models have always been significantly above UK rtr prices - despite the screams of "too expensive" every time a new model from Dapmannby arrives.  Maerklin have always been even more expensive than the average and that delivered price to Australia actually sounds cheap compared to prices in Europe but VAT removal accounts for that.

 

To put the price in perspective I am currently fighting off the urge to purchase a REE 2-8-2 at a discounted price of just shy of 500€ (425 GBP).  REE are a bit more expensive than Hornby Jouef but generally cheaper than Maerklin.  Those are European prices for models sold to run and not especially aimed at collectors.

[Tony Wright]

6 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

Nothing out of the ordinary there, given that we're all going to die one day...

Good afternoon, John,

 

Nothing out of the ordinary?

 

How many other models do you know of where someone started it, then died. Someone else did a bit more to it, then died. Then a third person did a bit more, then he died (in between getting knocked off his moped, meaning he couldn't do much more modelling afterwards)? 

 

Granted, I've finished off models started by friends who've died (but they were the only previous builders), and also finished off those from the collections of deceased modellers (again, their being the sole starters), but never before finished off something which needed three builders beforehand. 

 

Your right; everyone dies, though usually a loco doesn't need three builders to do so before it's even finished. When I go, it'll be four who've worked on it before it's completed! 

 

Nothing out of the ordinary or not, I'm certainly never going to own it, and my friend, who does own it, doesn't need to do any more work on it. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited October 7, 2023 by Tony Wright
clumsy grammar

[Tony Wright]

28 minutes ago, Andy Hayter said:

 

Who knows if the model is aimed at collectors or not - probably no one outside of Maerklin's marketing.

 

If your comment is based on price, then I have to advise that continental models have always been significantly above UK rtr prices - despite the screams of "too expensive" every time a new model from Dapmannby arrives.  Maerklin have always been even more expensive than the average and that delivered price to Australia actually sounds cheap compared to prices in Europe but VAT removal accounts for that.

 

To put the price in perspective I am currently fighting off the urge to purchase a REE 2-8-2 at a discounted price of just shy of 500€ (425 GBP).  REE are a bit more expensive than Hornby Jouef but generally cheaper than Maerklin.  Those are European prices for models sold to run and not especially aimed at collectors.

Thanks Andy,

 

I suppose my comments referred to the fact that the Marklin (Maerklin) 60103 does not seem to be a very accurate model (accuracy is usually irrelevant to the collector).

 

Compared with Hornby's 'equivalent' (in both OO and TT), things like the odd chimney and strange branding make it look 'unrealistic'. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

 

[Mark Laidlay]

4 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks Mark,

 

Your FLYING SCOTSMAN clearly looks to be aimed at the collectors' market; a market where, in many (most?) cases, fidelity to prototype hardly matters. Though the Trix/Marklin 60103 does actually represent the loco in one of its many manifestations (current?), it's its 'detail' peculiarities which seem to make it an 'inaccurate' representation. I take it the 400 quid is English pounds, making that around 800 A dollars? If so, wow!

 

Regarding 'collectable' FLYING SCOTSMANS (or should the plural be SCOTSMEN?), has any locomotive had more models made of it? 

 

Models like these...........

 

 

An original Bassett Lowke O Gauge FLYING SCOTSMAN from the '30s. It should be RH-drive. I was told that this was worth a lot of money!

 

 

 

The same model was perpetuated post-War (complete with corridor tender), still as an A1, but with left-hand drive (assuming it has a drive-side). 

 

Believe it or not, I was consulted by Bassett Lowke's representative when the product name and the loco were reintroduced in this century, still in O Gauge.

 

 

This was the first 'proving' model for FLYING SCOTSMAN in BR days from Bassett Lowke. Correct drive-side, an A3, handrails clipped to the smokebox ring, a streamlined dome and a streamlined non-corridor tender. 

 

 

The model was taken further to produce 60103 in her final BR manifestation (though the frame-mounted guard irons should have been removed).

 

Though clearly aimed at the collectors' market, this model (in terms of detail) is far more-accurate than many RTR representations which have gone before. 

 

 

The model was taken even further to represent 4472 in preservation, after she acquired a second tender. Though it can't be seen from this angle, the leading tender even has a cut-down rear!

 

Another FLYING SCOTSMAN in O Gauge aimed at collectors was that produced by ACE......

 

 

 

The detail anomalies with this are legion.

 

 

As they are with this manifestation. 

 

In truth, these are not aimed at the purists (though they're certainly not cheap!). They appeal to the nostalgia of a time gone by, they'll pull anything put behind their tenders, go like stink and they're beautifully-made/finished.

 

Is that the market which the Trix/Marklin model is aimed at, I wonder? 

 

 

ACE also produced an A4 to the same 'standard'.

 

 

And we've had Hatton's FLYING SCOTSMAN RTR in O Gauge. 

 

 

The late Dennis Brownlee (or is it Denys?) got his FS dead right, in 2mm FS!

 

From a personal perspective, I've never been into collecting at any level, but this hobby accommodates all.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Here's the brass version, there's one for sale in Melbourne currently - the seller seems to be looking for $6,000AUD.  It's not selling, yet.  I won't be buying it.  At least the tender wheels aren't green...

Edited October 7, 2023 by Mark Laidlay

[Barry Ten]

2 hours ago, sandra said:

Hello Tony, 

 

The only rival to Flying Scotsman could be Mallard but I suspect it doesn’t come close. There is a Flying Scotsman on Retford but it’s a repainted and reworked Hornby blue model. It has rather limited pulling power which is why it’s on a local stopper.However if you wish to see a poor model of Flying Scotsman how about this:It’s almost magnificent in its awfulness. But it does have the number 4472 and an interesting variation of the LNER livery.

 

Sandra

 

The quartering looks to be a little off.

[melmoth]

2 hours ago, sandra said:

It’s almost magnificent in its awfulness. But it does have the number 4472 and an interesting variation of the LNER livery.

 

Sandra

 

Is it edible, and did it melt? Also, interesting use of a PP3 battery connection for the headboard. 

[Woodcock29]

29 minutes ago, Mark Laidlay said:

Here's the brass version, there's one for sale in Melbourne currently - the seller seems to be looking for $6,000AUD.  It's not selling, yet.  I won't be buying it.  At least the tender wheels aren't green...

Ah yes the version produced for Prescision Models if I remember correctly? Clearly a model of the preserved loco as it visited Australia in 1988-89 with an A4 boiler. 4472 must have been painted in haste before leaving the UK as the lettering and numbers were never finished with the full shading and the white edging to the gold. Also the superheater header covers were not the normal shape having sharp fore and aft edges. The model appears to have these. I seem to recall seeing one of these models in a shop at the time.

Andrew

Edited October 7, 2023 by Woodcock29

[maico]

8 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks Mark,

 

Your FLYING SCOTSMAN clearly looks to be aimed at the collectors' market; a market where, in many (most?) cases, fidelity to prototype hardly matters. Though the Trix/Marklin 60103 does actually represent the loco in one of its many manifestations (current?), it's its 'detail' peculiarities which seem to make it an 'inaccurate' representation. I take it the 400 quid is English pounds, making that around 800 A dollars? If so, wow!

 

Regarding 'collectable' FLYING SCOTSMANS (or should the plural be SCOTSMEN?), has any locomotive had more models made of it? 

 

Models like these...........

 

 

An original Bassett Lowke O Gauge FLYING SCOTSMAN from the '30s. It should be RH-drive. I was told that this was worth a lot of money!

 

 

 

The same model was perpetuated post-War (complete with corridor tender), still as an A1, but with left-hand drive (assuming it has a drive-side). 

 

Believe it or not, I was consulted by Bassett Lowke's representative when the product name and the loco were reintroduced in this century, still in O Gauge.

 

 

This was the first 'proving' model for FLYING SCOTSMAN in BR days from Bassett Lowke. Correct drive-side, an A3, handrails clipped to the smokebox ring, a streamlined dome and a streamlined non-corridor tender. 

 

 

The model was taken further to produce 60103 in her final BR manifestation (though the frame-mounted guard irons should have been removed).

 

Though clearly aimed at the collectors' market, this model (in terms of detail) is far more-accurate than many RTR representations which have gone before. 

 

 

The model was taken even further to represent 4472 in preservation, after she acquired a second tender. Though it can't be seen from this angle, the leading tender even has a cut-down rear!

 

Another FLYING SCOTSMAN in O Gauge aimed at collectors was that produced by ACE......

 

 

 

The detail anomalies with this are legion.

 

 

As they are with this manifestation. 

 

In truth, these are not aimed at the purists (though they're certainly not cheap!). They appeal to the nostalgia of a time gone by, they'll pull anything put behind their tenders, go like stink and they're beautifully-made/finished.

 

Is that the market which the Trix/Marklin model is aimed at, I wonder? 

 

 

ACE also produced an A4 to the same 'standard'.

 

 

And we've had Hatton's FLYING SCOTSMAN RTR in O Gauge. 

 

 

The late Dennis Brownlee (or is it Denys?) got his FS dead right, in 2mm FS!

 

From a personal perspective, I've never been into collecting at any level, but this hobby accommodates all.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

 

The Marklin Trix A3 is part of their museum loco range rather than a regular production model. In 2022 the Slovak Republic Railways Albatros was introduced (dark blue loco on the left in this photo)

In 2020 the Belgium class 1 (light green loco behind the Scotsman decorated sample)

Union Pacific class 800 in 2021.

 

Edited October 7, 2023 by maico

[Pebbles]

On 05/10/2023 at 23:55, St Enodoc said:

Not that I need to but I can't work out from the notes and the sketch what the actual dimensions of this were/are. Could someone in the know please put together a composite sketch with all the key features dimensioned?

It is not my intention to reignite this, but you have posed a question that, in truth, without finding the appropriate specifications is difficult to answer.

Mr Wright's sketch gives the plan view dimensions but not the profile height dimension. Having checked Isinglass drawings - John would not quote dimension down to fractions without supporting  evidence- the following might be of interest. Heights to top of the streamline dome for Gresley A1/3 are quoted as 13' 3/4" whereas Peppercorn A1/A2 are given as 12' 11 13/16". Possibly the almost 1 inch difference was due to Peppercorn engines being post nationalisation.

However the main difference between Gresley and Thompson/Peppercorn is due to their boiler cladding. The Gresley  cladding closely follows the shape of the boiler with the rear conned part of he boiler translating into the parallel front part. Whilst the boilers themselves are basically the same, the Thompson/Peppercorn cladding has a much gentler constant slope from the firebox to the smokebox.

Because of the cladding difference,  In profile the Gresley cladding means the front of the streamline dome is relatively higher to the cladding than is the case with the Thompson/Peppercorn cladding. Photos, and indeed Isinglass drawings 332 and 381, clearly show this. This is not the end of the matter as the cosmetic cover occasionally found on Peppercorn A1s fitted with Thompson boilers gives a third variety. In strictly modelling terms the profile shape of the streamline dome depends on engine being modelled, one size doesn't fit all. I do hope that this makes sense!

 

One final and totally unrelated issue is that the new build A1 "Tornado" has a reduced height streamline dome. I wonder how this effects the new build P2 as the height of the casing on the original was at all but 13'1"?

[Iain.d]

I’m not sure if my latest completions fit the ‘brought back to life’ brief (of a couple of weeks back) or the ‘modelling on a budget’ brief initiated a few pages back. Either way, I’ve refurbished another pair of 30 year old Parkside Dundas wagons – a PC25 13T LNER 5 Plank Open and a PC28 BR 12T Shock Open.

 

When doing this type of modelling, I initially begin by trying to take them back to their individual pieces and then clean up the mouldings, remove any mouldings or detail that I intend to replace with better quality components, drill the required holes for additional detail and so forth. Sometimes I’m fortunate and they disassemble easily, other times the glue bonds remain strong. This was the case with the LNER 5 plank open, only the brake levers were easily removed (along with the wheels) so actions such as drilling out the brake hangers to take the cross rods was done with them still in place, a touch awkward but doable.

 

 

I made up the brake safety loops from left over offcuts of .45mm nickel wire and door bangers from fret waste and vacuum pipes from left over .8mm brass rod and wrapped with a strand of stripped electrical wire.

 

The Shock wagon came apart more easily, and as I wasn’t sure what I would ‘load’ it with, I decided to cut out the sub floor and replace it with about 35g of lead sheet. I replaced the tie bars with left over thin brass strip.

 

 

On both wagons I was able to drill through the buffer shanks with a .5mm drill and then partway through (about 90%) with a .9mm drill so that Alan Gibson spring buffer heads could be fitted.

 

 

And the right way up…

 

 

They’re both finished in Railmatch Freight Stock Bauxite 2235, transfers by CCT and weathered with a light wash and some dry brushing. I have tried to represent the interiors as unpainted using a variety of Vallejo acrylic ‘wood colours’, a brown wash and some dry brushing.

 

 

I decided to load the 5 plank open with a Bachmann container, with some lead glued inside it. Both will have instanter couplings fitted once they arrive from Rumney Models.

 

 

A few hours of quite enjoyable modelling done over a number of weeks.

 

Kind regards,

 

Iain

[manna]

G'Day Folks

 

Collectors or Modellers !! If you've got more than two loco's........................... you're a Collector, even if you run them.

 

 

Terry. Aka manna

[LNER4479]

14 hours ago, Pebbles said:

One final and totally unrelated issue is that the new build A1 "Tornado" has a reduced height streamline dome. I wonder how this effects the new build P2 as the height of the casing on the original was at all but 13'1"?

Subtly redesigned to keep within 13' 0" height (to maximise network compatibility). Inside the clothing is the same boiler as Tornado - they will be interchangeable. Smokebox on No.2007 is longer to accommodate. All hidden under cladding - visually it will look like No.2001 (in original condition)

[Jeepy]

On 07/10/2023 at 08:53, Tony Wright said:

Regarding 'collectable' FLYING SCOTSMANS (or should the plural be SCOTSMEN?), has any locomotive had more models made of it? 

 

Good morning Tony, 

 

That's an interesting question, I personally find words and the way they're used fascinating, and fun!

I think the plural should be Flying Scotsmans......You have far more experience and expertise in these matters than me but, to my mind at least, the subject(s) is/are an object that happens to be identified as Flying Scotsman rather than a person with wings from Scotland if you can understand my explanation! That's the way my mind works I'm afraid! 

 

Best wishes,

 

Jim.

 

[Tony Wright]

6 hours ago, manna said:

G'Day Folks

 

Collectors or Modellers !! If you've got more than two loco's........................... you're a Collector, even if you run them.

 

 

Terry. Aka manna

Good morning Terry,

 

So (tongue in cheek), everyone on here is a 'collector'? I suppose we are, as we end up with a collection of models. 

 

Seriously, it's interesting to try to define the various 'states' of participants in the hobby.

 

The early Bassett Lowke FLYING SCOTSMANS I showed earlier were the property of the late Pete Marshall (a good friend, who sadly died a decade ago and whose various 'collections' will eventually be auctioned). He was an avid collector of 'bits of bent tin', claiming they represented the 'childhood he never had' because his parents weren't rich enough. 

 

His collection of Bassett Lowke items was immense. From the 'ridiculous'...........

 

 

Did the LNER ever own a 4-4-0T?

 

To 'nearer scale' (at the time) models..........

 

 

Though what is the LMS 4-4-2T supposed to be? A Tilbury Tank?

 

The 'Shire' is Hornby. 

 

 

I suppose this is a GWR mogul?

 

 

This was highly-prized.

 

 

As was this.

 

Both were sold at very high-end prices when new, and even higher as collectors' items.

 

Among his collection were some contemporary hand-built locos.......

 

 

Like this.

 

 

And this.

 

 

Even one by (we think) Bernard Miller. 

 

In more recent times, Pete collected high-end 'scale' O Gauge.......

 

 

 

Such as this DJH-built A3 FLYING SCOTSMAN.

 

 

And a complete 'Coronation' train.

 

 

He also had some of Jack Ray's work.

 

I don't think he built a lot himself, but a visit to his 'empire' was always fascinating.

 

As mentioned, on a personal level I've never had the collector's 'mentality'. Tinplate from more than a lifetime ago holds little interest to me (other than as photographic subjects - as above), though the scale models really do. 

 

Can one be a collector and a modeller? Didn't Jim Russell build exquisite GWR rolling stock, yet collect vintage tinplate, often restoring it? 

 

As had been said many times, it's a broad church!

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

 

 

[St Enodoc]

9 minutes ago, Jeepy said:

Good morning Tony, 

 

That's an interesting question, I personally find words and the way they're used fascinating, and fun!

I think the plural should be Flying Scotsmans......You have far more experience and expertise in these matters than me but, to my mind at least, the subject(s) is/are an object that happens to be identified as Flying Scotsman rather than a person with wings from Scotland if you can understand my explanation! That's the way my mind works I'm afraid! 

 

Best wishes,

 

Jim.

 

This is a difficult question to answer. For example, should we write City of Truros or Cities of Truro? Neither feels right. Perhaps a better approach would be "Flying Scotsman" locos, with quotation marks.