rope runner Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Hi all, I have one of these kits next in the workshop queue, as the current project is almost complete... One thing I have noticed is that the frames are pretty chunky, so I'm not sure if I'll keep those. I know there are others available from High level and Agenoria, but I was put off by the price and the sheer build time. However, can anyone comment on the accuracy of the Centre Models kit for the prototype? Thanks very much, Paul A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted February 12, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 12, 2013 Paul when complete it looks OK and with a scratchbuilt chassis (in my case provided by Mike Edge) it works well. Barry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
halfwit Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 A little off topic I know, but Impetus used to make a replacement etched chassis for this kit, and chassis kits for the Centre Models 0-4-0 Avonside and 0-6-0 Kerr Stuart 'Victory' class. Which is of course no help to the OP! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rope runner Posted February 14, 2013 Author Share Posted February 14, 2013 Paul when complete it looks OK and with a scratchbuilt chassis (in my case provided by Mike Edge) it works well. Barry Hi Barry, Yeah, that's kind of what I had in mind in any case - good to know it looks atleast acceptable! Thanks Paul A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondman Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 If you take the cost of the gearbox into account, the High level offering is a good deal. You get full cab detail with a mechanism that fits inside the boiler and a 108:1 gearbox designed specifically for this loco. All the bits are there so there's no need to scratchbuild anything... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rope runner Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 If you take the cost of the gearbox into account, the High level offering is a good deal. You get full cab detail with a mechanism that fits inside the boiler and a 108:1 gearbox designed specifically for this loco. All the bits are there so there's no need to scratchbuild anything... I've got an 0-6-0 version from High level already, and the Centre models one should go together a lot faster - it was also much cheaper. New frames is a ten minute job and a sheet of brass. Paul A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondman Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I like your style. Maybe, if you asked High Level nicely, they may be willing to sell you all the detail bits, plus gearbox, that are missing from the old Centre Models kit. This would be a good way to use all the time and money you've saved on the basic kit!... Good luck scratch-building the brake rods... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rope runner Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 This would be a good way to use all the time and money you've saved on the basic kit!... Good luck scratch-building the brake rods... It's not really a question of basic vs. detailed. There's actually a good level of detailing already in the CM kit - it's just the backhead and a lubricator above the smokebox door which appears to be missing - and I have the spare components from the 0-6-0 version if I care to change the sandboxes, buffers etc. The entire Centre models kit is white metal components - it could probably be entirely assembled in less than 2 hours. I'm sure I'll be fine making my own break rodding - some scrap etch and I'll be away. Paul A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RANGERS Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 One of these was the first steam loco kit I ever built, back in 1978 (come to think of it, I've built very few since!). From memory it was a simple and straightforward kit to put together and finished up as a pretty good rendition of the prototype. The chassis was pretty robust but ultimately led to the demise of the loco. It doubled up as the chassis for a freelance 0-16.5 saddle tank and the dual role wore the axle bearings in the whitemetal chassis out after about 20 years running, leading to excessive play in the axles. I sold the two bodies on, and regretted it, the RSH was a good model of a useful little prototype and I could have used it for a project I have in mind now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
halfwit Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 ABS now own the Centre Models range - although I believe that the kits are at present unavailable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 My RSH 'Geoffrey' was built in the early days of my P4 modelling in the late 70's and did sterling work on several layouts over the years (Preesgwyn, Lower Pandy, Enigma Engineering et al). His first chassis was a scratch built brass one with D13 motor (yes, it did fit - just!) and home-made (not by me!) brass gearbox, Sharman wheels and sprung Studiolith axle boxes and hornguides which eventually wore out and were replaced by a simpler 3 - point system and Gibson wheels. However, the replacements never seemed to perform quite as well as the original, the haulage power with the original chassis was outstanding, possibly due to the springing distributing the weight better. He was never a really finely detailed loco, nowhere near as fine as the HL version, but more than adequate in his day. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted February 19, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 19, 2013 ABS now own the Centre Models range - although I believe that the kits are at present unavailable. yep Adrian has all the Centre Models and steadfastly does nothing with them - which is a shame as they all went together very easily. 5050 - that looks good! Mine is resting in a stock box in the loft awaiting an opportunity to have a run on a colliery layout - Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondman Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 One small point: the Centre Models is a Hawthorn Leslie and the HL kit is an RSH. They differed in more than just detail as the RSH was longer by 3 inches... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rope runner Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 One small point: the Centre Models is a Hawthorn Leslie and the HL kit is an RSH. They differed in more than just detail as the RSH was longer by 3 inches... Parts are included in the High Level kit to build both RSH and HL versions I believe - the main parts which differ are the smokebox, chimney, buffers and sand boxes. 5050 - that's rather nice! Paul A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Parts are included in the High Level kit to build both RSH and HL versions I believe - the main parts which differ are the smokebox, chimney, buffers and sand boxes. 5050 - that's rather nice! Paul A. Thank you. I have photos that are a lot better but this is the only one that is currently digital and stored on the computer. I reckon he's well over 30 years old now, probably a child of the late 70's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium ArthurK Posted February 20, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 20, 2013 Here is my effort built many years ago. I kept the cylinders but the rest of the chassis including the valve gear was scratch built. In OO gauge it is pretty tight in there! ArthurK Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 One small point: the Centre Models is a Hawthorn Leslie and the HL kit is an RSH. They differed in more than just detail as the RSH was longer by 3 inches... Really? The sandboxes - and from what I can see, the smokebox - on the two featured here look remarkably like the RSH pattern to me. RSH: http://www.flickr.com/photos/12a_kingmoor_klickr/5769079247/in/set-72157626803582006/lightbox/ HL: http://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/5742310696/in/set-72157626644783289/lightbox/ Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruston Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Really? The sandboxes - and from what I can see, the smokebox - on the two featured here look remarkably like the RSH pattern to me. RSH: http://www.flickr.com/photos/12a_kingmoor_klickr/5769079247/in/set-72157626803582006/lightbox/ HL: http://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/5742310696/in/set-72157626644783289/lightbox/ Adam The sandboxes look to be different to me. The first one looks to have the type of sandbox (angled filler neck and sqared off lid) that I'd associate with RSH locos, but the second one looks to have the flat top boxes that I usually associate with HL locos. One small point: the Centre Models is a Hawthorn Leslie and the HL kit is an RSH. They differed in more than just detail as the RSH was longer by 3 inches... I'm not saying you are wrong but with industrial locos it's not as easy as saying, for example, "Hawthorn Leslie 0-4-0ST" because they built lots of locos that look pretty much the same but the basic dimensions differed according to the cylinder size. So before we say that the RSH is longer by three inches we need to know that we're talking bout the same prototype because it could be that, for example, both RSH and HL's 14 inch locos were of exactly the same dimensions but both 16 inch locos were also the same dimensions but three inches longer. It's no good simply saying that an RSH is longer than a HL unless we know exactly what prototype we're talking about and also what class of engine the models are supposed to portray. You could measure a HL and then an RSH and say the RSH is longer but without knowing (or telling us if you do know) what class of engine you are comparing it ain't neccesarily so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rope runner Posted February 21, 2013 Author Share Posted February 21, 2013 As always when constructing an industrial locomotive kit we're used to seeing "source photographs of the prototype you wish to model" etc Always an essential step - as the locomotive may have detail differences to other class members, either when supplied or modified during industry. Ofcourse, if it's a different class then it could bare almost no similarity in dimensions - the 16" HL are a stockier build all round... and then there's the 12" munition class etc ArthurK - Another nice build, thanks for sharing! Paul A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondman Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Ruston, I'm referring to the RSH 14inch and the Centre Models Hawthorn Leslie which looks like its of the same size and is the subject of this topic. High level provide bits to do both types, but their intructions say that the bits were often mixed-and-matched, and that sometimes engines even had a mixture of both. For 14inch engines, RSHs were 3 inches longer - a noticeable gap between the cylinders and front drivers, possibly to allow the piston rod/crosshead assembly to be removed without having to take the motion brackett off ( that's just a guess!). The HLs had a more squat appreance as a result. I suppose it all boils down to what you want and how far your prepared to go to get it in terms of work and cost to get accuracy and fidelity. The title of this thread is to do with accuracy, and you could argue that this includes levels of detail as well. To my eye, the High Level kit is more detailed (see the one built by John Brighton on thier home page) but without a doubt involves more work and the initial cost is higher. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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