Jinty 52 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Work on the body (engine cover) is just about complete. The hand rails have been prepared from 0.7mm nickel silver rod and will be fitted after painting. That just leaves the head code discs to be fitted. However I couldn't decide what lamp code to display on the finished model and the etch supplied with the kit makes no provision to make them work. Now there is nothing wrong with that or the etches supplied (see below). The solution was found whilst browsing the JLTRT website where I discovered that they provide an etch to make working head code discs. Off went the order and this is what was delivered promptly. There are no written instructions just pictures! As with the instructions with the kit you need to look carefully at each image to be sure you have them the right way around. So here goes...... I had a bit of difficulty with my first attempt. I couldn't get the tabs to bend sufficiently around the 0.7mm nickel silver wire and not come adrift. The solution was to use 0.5mm nickel silver wire. The smaller diameter wire meant that the loops retaining the wire were more substantial. It worked for me and the second disc was made up in half the time! You will note the small hole (0.5mm) drilled into the disc retaining plate. This was done by me so that a pin could be inserted to hold the disc on the body. The following pictures show the sequence followed. The wire was wire was then trimmed to length and a tiny amount of superglue was added to one end to hold the rod in place. The retaining pin was also soldered on. The tiny hole above the upper head code disc is because I drilled the retaining hole for the pin in the wrong place!!! It will be filled in due course. Well that's the first two done. only six more to go! Mick 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I forgot to mention in the previous post - the head code discs are only temporarily in place for the present. They will be painted separately and added in the final stages of completion. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Holt Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Mick, They look very neat indeed. Are the hinges stiff enough for the discs to stay where you put them in the open position. I believe the real things had clips to hold them which would be too small and fiddly to model. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Mick, They look very neat indeed. Are the hinges stiff enough for the discs to stay where you put them in the open position. I believe the real things had clips to hold them which would be too small and fiddly to model. Dave. Hi Dave, They can be made quite stiff but not too stiff or you can't separate them! The paint will also help them stay open or shut as the case may be. I've just finished the remaining two for the front end and will be posting a picture of the completed engine cowling shortly. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Here are a couple of shots of the engine cowling with all the attachments. I intend to drill out the lamps and replace them with small beads my brother uses on his loco builds. He bought them some time ago but neither of us can remember the name of the supplier. Good job we've plenty of them! Next job is the cab. Mick 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAD Posted January 15, 2018 Author Share Posted January 15, 2018 Hi Mick, The 20 looks good. The tiny beads are called Liquid Beadz and I got them from Hobbycraft @ 10 years ago. I have looked a few times since and they don't stock them any more. I just did a quick google search and found them on the below link. https://www.stencilsearch.com/ideas/techniques/liquid-beadz/ Further searching may turn up a stockist. The tiny beads were in a water based gel-like clear adhesive for some sort of crafting application. I put them in a jam jar and rinsed them under a running tap until all the glue was washed away. Then I carefully poured away the water from the jar and ran the beads onto a few layers of kitchen tissue and left them to dry. I've used them on my RB Merchant Navy and the L1 and they look really good. Cheers, Peter 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Father Dougal Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 What amazing timing. I decided to have a go at my kit today and I got the bogies working. I will follow this build with interest. Dougal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 The Cab The next stage of my build is the cab, lights and handrails. The above photo shows the cab with holes drilled out to take the lights. As I intend to use glass beads to represent the lenses (as mentioned previously in this blog), I drilled a 1mm diameter hole into each light casting to a depth of 6mm or so, and the holes are visible in the photo. I then countersunk the holes with a 1.6mm drill as this is the diameter of the beads. The light castings were then inserted into the body and the excess marked and removed. The thickness of the cab and the lights is slightly less than 6mm so you end up with a 1mm hole right through the centre of the casting. The hole is to enable me to easily pop out any of the glass beads if I mess one up when finally fixing them in place! If however, you intend to simply paint the lenses on the casting then most of the above is irrelevant to you. The next stage is the handrails. The cab casting is marked for the later style of hand rails but not the earlier versions so it was necessary to mark and drill them out by reference to the scale drawings I hold. They are only 4mm drawings but using a 4mm to the foot ruler I was able to work it out. Pictures of the real thing show that there is a support bracket on each hand rail but this is not catered for in the kit so I either ignore it or make them myself. Incidentally, the JLTRT kit includes a brass casting for the handrail and bracket (there is a very nice build on "Sandy's Workbench 7mm JLTRT BR Class 20". From memory, I think it's page 36 onwards). Fortunately I found a surplus etching from one of my brother's many loco builds (and he's at it again on this site with a recently commenced build of a Martin Finney A3!). Here is the result. The roof vents were then added and handrails constructed from 0.7mm nickel silver wire (rather than brass as it's less flexible and more resistant to careless handling) added to the body along with the brackets. The windscreen wipers were then cleaned up and drilled out to take 0.5mm pins and are temporarily in place on the next photo. That just leaves the hand rails for the cab doors, door handles, and another four head code discs to do and I'm on to the footplate. The castings supplied for the door handles are the same as the castings for the engine covers and they won't do so I'll have to scratch build them! Mick 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAD Posted January 23, 2018 Author Share Posted January 23, 2018 Mick, Looking good. I like the handrail bracket. Take the drawing to Rawdon Copy Shop. They will enlarge it to 7mm and print it off for a couple of quid. It's just past the lights on the left as you head to the airport. Cheers, Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Mick, Looking good. I like the handrail bracket. Take the drawing to Rawdon Copy Shop. They will enlarge it to 7mm and print it off for a couple of quid. It's just past the lights on the left as you head to the airport. Cheers, Peter Thanks Peter, The 4mm drawings are adequate for the present. I'll bear it mind for the future though. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Pulham Posted January 28, 2018 Share Posted January 28, 2018 Hi Mick, It was really good to chat to you today at Ponte show (I am really glad that I recognised you having only briefly met you last year at Doncaster show). I hope that you enjoyed the demo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Hi Mick, It was really good to chat to you today at Ponte show (I am really glad that I recognised you having only briefly met you last year at Doncaster show). I hope that you enjoyed the demo. Hi Rob, I was so engrossed in that "machine" engraving wagon parts on 10 thou plasticard on your stand that I was oblivious to the demonstrator! The wagons on your stand that you are turning out using laminated plasticard components are amazing. I see from your wagon pages that wagons are your main passion rather than engines. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 All the pictures I have show a vent on the engine cover to the right of the fan grill, looking forward. This is not catered for in the JLTRT or Tower Collection kits, nor does it appear on the Heljan versions. I was struggling to find a close up picture of this vent, which I now understand is a safety valve for the cooling system, when I came upon this little gem supplied by Brian Daniels to a fellow builder of a JLTRT Class 20: I have included this picture with Brian's permission. I "turned" down part of a brass casting using a mini drill (maybe it's time for a joint investment in a mini lathe Peter?) and this is the result. The next item I looked at are the AWS guards behind the couplings. I have photos of 20048 taken at Butterley in 2008 and took the dimensions from 4mm drawings in Modern Locomotives Illustrated number 203. I have several 4mm drawings but the MRI ones are the only drawings to show them. Just to confuse matters the drawings give different dimensions for the width at the front and the back - 12 inches at the front, and 9 inches at the rear (cab end). The depth is consistent at 18 inches. I aimed for 12 inches on both but they appear a tad wider I think. Either way they are made now and will be fitted when I complete the footplate. The next job was the door handles. The kit provides the same type as those for the bonnet sides. However, they are incorrect for this purpose so I made my own. I better get rid of those scratches caused by careless use of the wire brush now! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Pulham Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Superb Mick, those door handles are something else! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Pulham Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Hi Rob, I was so engrossed in that "machine" engraving wagon parts on 10 thou plasticard on your stand that I was oblivious to the demonstrator! The wagons on your stand that you are turning out using laminated plasticard components are amazing. I see from your wagon pages that wagons are your main passion rather than engines. Mick Cheers Mick, Yes guilty as charged on the wagon front, although I enjoy building locos and coaches I like building wagon best. So it's a good job really that you need many more wagons than coaches or locos. Hmm I seem to have more locos/loc kits than coaches though so I perhaps need to address that at some point.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Cheers Mick, Yes guilty as charged on the wagon front, although I enjoy building locos and coaches I like building wagon best. So it's a good job really that you need many more wagons than coaches or locos. Hmm I seem to have more locos/loc kits than coaches though so I perhaps need to address that at some point.... Hi Rob, Thanks for those kind words. The door handles still need a bit of burnishing up with the nail buffer to really make them shine (before a bit of light weathering when fitted permanently). I have also built a fair number of wagons, mainly plastic kits and some etched brass, and coaches for my layout, but the way those at wagons at Pontefract start out and the finished product looks is something else. Have you thought about marketing them? The problem I suppose is if they are successful you end up working 24/7 to supply customers! The problem with the door handles I made is that they make the bonnet handles look rubbish! When I originally fitted them I mentioned to Peter that "I wanted to build the kit with the parts supplied.....". He didn't say anything but....! Then I looked at his build of the A3. You and others see it on RM Web whereas I see it as it happens - a superb build, and I thought, get your act together Michael! ] Here is the result: The white metal casting is on the second row extreme right, as if it wasn't obvious! Here are the new one's temporarily fitted to the bonnet I was annoyed with myself for being so slack initially, but it's better to correct things now than look at a completed model later and regret you didn't do something about it at the build stage! On a positive note: (a) After further research I now know that the fan blades mentioned earlier in this thread are correct as constructed. (b) A lovely set of castings for diesel locomotive couplings arrived today from D J Parkins at MMP. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAD Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 Hi Mick, Definitely a big improvement over the ingots supplied in the kit! Cheers, Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 I managed a bit more progress today after polishing up the engine cover handles shown in my previous post. I forgot to mention it at the time but I made them (and the cab door handles ) out of 0.7mm nickel silver wire which I annealed on the gas ring to make it soft, then compressed it in a vice and filed to shape. The mounting plates were made from spare nickel silver etch that contained the etches for radiator and fan grill etc. This is 0.3mm thickness and looks just right in my opinion. The next job was the two grab handles on the front footplate. Brass castings are supplied for these but wanted them to match the hand rails which I made out of nickel silver wire, hopefully to represent what appears to be polished steel on the real thing. I turned down two pins for this purpose and here they are temporarily in place. The next job was the front windscreen wipers (The rear ones appear in a previous post). The instructions suggest that you drill into the cab casting at an angle and bend the location tabs to suit. That didn't appeal so I soldered two small bits of tubing in place and soldered nickel silver rod to the wipers. The following photos show how the results. I still have a couple of little jobs I want to do on the body and then it is on with the bogies. Mick 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 I've not made much progress since my last post! The head code discs have retaining clips top and bottom to keep them open (or closed) on the real thing. I know exactly what they look like, but making accurate replicas in 7mm caused me problems. After a lot of thought and two failed attempts I've finally come up with what you see of the following photos. I am not completely happy with my attempts but when painted up with the head code discs on they should blend in ok (hopefully). I've also temporarily fitted the clear glass beads and red lenses to show how the ends will look when finally finished. I previously drilled right through the lamp units so the lenses can be easily removed before painting by inserting a piece of wire from the rear. One thing I have noticed from looking at one of the JLTRT Class 20 builds on this site, and the Tower kit, is the air reservoir tanks provided with the kit seem to be too small and also mounted too high. A drawing in Modern Locomotives Illustrated number 183 confirms this. As they cannot be seen from any normal viewing angle of the model when running I am not going to move them now. However, I am going to make the bleed valves that peep out from under the battery boxes on the right hand side, looking forward from the cab end. Whilst there are two from the air reservoirs, there may have been others in the period I am modelling (D8036 early 1960's). Photos of preserved examples show between two and five! If anyone can shed any light on this I'd be grateful. Mick 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Pulham Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 but the way those at wagons at Pontefract start out and the finished product looks is something else. Have you thought about marketing them? The problem I suppose is if they are successful you end up working 24/7 to supply customers! Hi Mick, Sadly although the material cost is quite cheap, there is a lot of work that goes into each build and in most cases people are not prepared to pay that much for a van even if it is handbuilt. Especially if that van is made of styrene. The cheap RTR market is only going to make that worse because if you can get a brand new RTR van or open for £40-£60 you are unlikely to want to pay much more for even a kit built example. Which, if built from a Slaters or Parkside kit may have cost around £40 for the kit, then there would be at least a day's work in assembling, painting, adding transfers and possibly weathering it. Who these days would be prepared to work for a day for £20? I suspect that youngsters doing paper rounds earn more than that equates to per hour. Apologies if this sounds like a rant because it's not meant to be it's the reality of life and why I don't plan to try to market them. The truth is I like a bargain as well as the next man, but in this instance I get my pleasure from the build of the wagon/van whereas many get theirs from the running of the stock and will buy them the most economic way to get what they need even if the range is quite limited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Hi Mick, Sadly although the material cost is quite cheap, there is a lot of work that goes into each build and in most cases people are not prepared to pay that much for a van even if it is handbuilt. Especially if that van is made of styrene. The cheap RTR market is only going to make that worse because if you can get a brand new RTR van or open for £40-£60 you are unlikely to want to pay much more for even a kit built example. Which, if built from a Slaters or Parkside kit may have cost around £40 for the kit, then there would be at least a day's work in assembling, painting, adding transfers and possibly weathering it. Who these days would be prepared to work for a day for £20? I suspect that youngsters doing paper rounds earn more than that equates to per hour. Apologies if this sounds like a rant because it's not meant to be it's the reality of life and why I don't plan to try to market them. The truth is I like a bargain as well as the next man, but in this instance I get my pleasure from the build of the wagon/van whereas many get theirs from the running of the stock and will buy them the most economic way to get what they need even if the range is quite limited. Hi Rob, You are right unfortunately in respect of hand built wagons. What I was thinking along the lines of was a you supplying to order, the sheets marked out by that "machine" (I can't remember what it is called) if that is possible, for a particular wagon requested by, and to be assembled by the purchaser. I was thinking of the more unusual wagons that the ready to run market wouldn't touch with a barge pole, especially pre grouping wagons, even broad gauge if there is enough information available. You know more about the ins and out of producing them than I do, and again that may not be practical either. Even if it was at the end of the day there is no law that says you have to do so. As you say, you produce them for your own enjoyment, and that's fair enough. Regards, Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Pulham Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Ahh sorry Mick, I misunderstood your question and thought that you were referring to the finished models that I had on display. I would be happy to supply parts to make models, indeed I have supplied a few sets of body parts to make the NBR beaded Jubilee vans to people who asked after them. I did have an enquiry about producing some parts for a GWR coach while I was demoing at Pontefract which may come to something. I have also had it suggested that I should make some up and cast them in resin which I may look at when I retire. If I do go down that route I will need to chose my candidates carefully and be prepared to use them myself if they fail to sell. In my experience of building a few models to sell to keep the modelling funds going in order for them to sell, they really to be BR liveried and ideally western region (although I am unlikely to build any of the latter with the Silhouette cutter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Ahh sorry Mick, I misunderstood your question and thought that you were referring to the finished models that I had on display. I would be happy to supply parts to make models, indeed I have supplied a few sets of body parts to make the NBR beaded Jubilee vans to people who asked after them. I did have an enquiry about producing some parts for a GWR coach while I was demoing at Pontefract which may come to something. I have also had it suggested that I should make some up and cast them in resin which I may look at when I retire. If I do go down that route I will need to chose my candidates carefully and be prepared to use them myself if they fail to sell. In my experience of building a few models to sell to keep the modelling funds going in order for them to sell, they really to be BR liveried and ideally western region (although I am unlikely to build any of the latter with the Silhouette cutter. Hi Rob, My original post didn't make it clear what my thoughts were but it seems you have already gone down the path I was thinking of. I never considered resin casting but logically that could be the next step. It's a silhouette cutter - thanks for that! Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted March 1, 2018 Share Posted March 1, 2018 Further progress...... I've been making the bleed valves for the air reservoirs and decided to fit four of them. They are very tiny but I managed to make them using nickel silver wire and 4mm brass hand rail knobs - a bit of a strain on the eyes! That got me looking at the position of the air tanks themselves. I know I said I was going to leave them where they were but the more I looked at them the more I thought they have to be moved. When I found a suitable piece of nickel silver in my scrap box that was it! Looking at what you can see below the battery boxes in the last picture I expect many of you are wondering "why did he bother?" but that's me. The Bogies At last I've finally arrived at the moving bits! The inner chassis went together very well but you need to study the diagrams very carefully as the motor mounts are not identical. The position of the horizontal tabs marked blue and red on the next photo are different. I didn't realise this at first but fortunately I "wised up" before I did any damage. Here they both are running in. At first they were quite noisy but after several hours gently running in they have quietened down a lot and run smoothly. The pick-ups have yet to be fitted though. The gearing is a bit low as has been pointed out in the model railway press. I'll be able to judge this better when I am able to run it on the track. Now for the bogie side frames. A lot of work still to be done here. The sanding pipes on the right do not come with the kit. In fact no mention of sanding pipes are mentioned in the instructions. They are in fact from Modern Motive Power and are for Classes 26/27/33. However, they look similar to those on a Class 20 and I'm hoping they will fit. I had thought about a call to JLTRT to see if they could help. In view of the recent sad news that is no longer an option. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinty 52 Posted March 4, 2018 Share Posted March 4, 2018 I've made a little more progress today and have constructed the bogie side frames. There are still a lot of parts to be added to the bogies and they have been fettled as necessary and will be added in due course. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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